To be honest it has nothing to do WIM. It's the principle of thinking that I'm going to go out and build whatever I want in the middle of an established dh course. It's the attitude that says I'm going to build whatever I want on a public trail and everyone else can just deal. That's arrogant. The work that others do is appreciated if it's for trail maintenace of new trails but just to change something because they have a shovel in the back of their camero is BS. It isn't the bike riders land to do with as we please. I'm grateful to ride there but I respect that it isn't my land. Your attitude will cost and is costing us the sport. Races, positive exposure, and good publicity will keep the sport above water. Diplomacy from organizations such as WIM have helped keep the riding open. "GET A FRICKIN' LIFE", nice!, especially from someone who isn't even a local.holliswood said:
Beacon DH Course "Modifications"...
- Thread starter Radarr
- Start date
It's public land not private. Local riders have the grace of the city to ride there. To assume that because some rider can work a shovel that everyone else should fall to their knees and kiss their scrubby, unemployed butt is BS. The two DH trails were fine before. They were great race trails with outs at all the right spots. Now theres doubles good riders can barely make and the out is a deep hole on either side of the jump. Don't comment if you haven't seen it. People can build new trails if they want, fine, but to mess up established trails isn't fair to everyone else. I don't care about the WIM races I care about riding. And I'm not going to be one of those arrogant punk dh riders with the F*** it attitude. I'm not talking about tearing something down I'm talking about the attitude that says, "I know better than everyone else so I'm going to just build it".Certified Drunk said:
You make a very good point. What if some rider went up to the Shore and started tearing out ladders in order to make the trail more suited for their riding style? They'd be shot on the spot.SJ10 said:
Beacon is a pretty big place, at least a few hundred acres. That's plenty of room to build a trail with nothing but akward, fast, slow, and any other kind of doubles, ladders, drops, or the combonation of the likes. There's no reason to take something that wasn't broken and fix it.
To grind in a very good point made:
SJ10 said:
Looking at the bigger picture - the 361 days of the year where there aren't races or practice on that trail - is it fair for something to be built on a well-used trail, especially when there's so much land available for use in the immediate surrounding area?Certified Drunk said:
Progression of the sport is one thing. Screwing with an old favorite is like Sir Mix A Lot redoing classic Pink Floyd. It shouldn't ever happen.
If you would of read the last paragraph I wrote you would see I do agree with you in the fact that these people need to build elswhere besides the race courses. Beacon is a large area and I have spent lots of time riding there and there are tons of great places to build stunts, trails, kickers, whatever. They don't need to do it on exsisting trails.SJ10 said:
Don't get all bent out of shape on the "glorified cross country" remark. I think that was misunderstood. What I meant is that the last few years people (mainly racers from this side of the mountain) have come over to pre ride the courses or have heard rumours of course changes on this website and get all fired up over things that have been added or changed and take it upon themselves to have these things removede or cut down without considering the locals or the people who built these things. If they don't want to ride these course the way the are , race cross country. I don't think I was being arrogant, I was simply stating that too many people stake claims to things (or areas) that they do not own. I have raced WIM for a long time and appriciate the races they have held and what they have done for NW racing. I just think it is a bit wrong how they come to an area and make changes and the changes are usually deemed by other racers who are not locals.
I have seen there is a club being formed at Beacon to do trail work and keep the area open for riders. Great! I think organizations that use diplomacy for the good of the riders are terribly needed. But just because I'm not a local doesn't mean I haven't spent alot of time riding or building at Beacon.
I am costing us our sport?
SJ10 said:
to be accurate, there is a mix of ownership up there. Most, but not all of the DH race course is part of the City Park, Camp Sekani. The top is private property, not public. There's a strip of county land in there too. The power lines, and towers are county and utility. With the exception of round and round's work on the race courses, all the building that's been happening is, let just say unsanctioned.
First off, let me just that I've got a lot of respect for you as racer... over the years I've learned a lot about racing by just watching you (and some of the other semi and pro racers) practice.holliswood said:
You other young pups out there might want to heed some of the wisdom and advice of some of us older/more experienced generation on this board.
Granted, I've been out of the scene for a few months, but the jump of which you speak (if you're talking about the second double at the bottom) was not a RACE jump. it was way to steep to be taken at race speeds. My comments at the time were not to take it out but to fix it. I think the idea of a double double was awesome.
People have made comments on here that if you can't do it or have trouble... you're riding above your ability or race class. Bullsh*t! Crap happens. I watched a Pro rider do that jump a couple time and he had trouble with it. I'm not a newbie, I feel I was actually pretty compitent at our sport. but, i ate **** and got jacked up... injuries that I'll have the rest of my life.
It's one thing to ride above your ability, it's an entirely differnt thing to have something built incorrectly. I think the two should be defined before tossing out slams on ones riding ability.
But I stand behind my earlier statement thatsome dillhole punknubs who know NOTHING about build a race course should be modifying them.
That being said, this thread is pretty funny reading. Let the follies continue
I thought those jumps were fine last year. The only problem I had was losing speed for the second one. Coming up short didn't seem to be a problem though.
The second double in that set had been modified some by race day from the time DHRacer hit it.Bullitrider said:
I truly hope you didn't think I had directed any of this towards you. Being at Beacon last year the day you had your accident and jumping the very same jump, I do agree with you it was steep for the upcoming race. What I more or less replied to was the fact that there were several people on this board last season after your accident that had not seen it and were blowing that thread up with no facts except for what they had read.DHRacer said:First off, let me just that I've got a lot of respect for you as racer... over the years I've learned a lot about racing by just watching you (and some of the other semi and pro racers) practice.
You other young pups out there might want to heed some of the wisdom and advice of some of us older/more experienced generation on this board.
Granted, I've been out of the scene for a few months, but the jump of which you speak (if you're talking about the second double at the bottom) was not a RACE jump. it was way to steep to be taken at race speeds. My comments at the time were not to take it out but to fix it. I think the idea of a double double was awesome.
People have made comments on here that if you can't do it or have trouble... you're riding above your ability or race class. Bullsh*t! Crap happens. I watched a Pro rider do that jump a couple time and he had trouble with it. I'm not a newbie, I feel I was actually pretty compitent at our sport. but, i ate **** and got jacked up... injuries that I'll have the rest of my life.
It's one thing to ride above your ability, it's an entirely differnt thing to have something built incorrectly. I think the two should be defined before tossing out slams on ones riding ability.
But I stand behind my earlier statement thatsome dillhole punknubs who know NOTHING about build a race course should be modifying them.
That being said, this thread is pretty funny reading. Let the follies continue
It sucks when someone has an accident. I had the same thing happen to me 4 years ago at 38 that happened to you. Hitting a jump that someone had changed and made the take off super steep on a very fast section of trail. Next thing I know I am waking up a day later with another concussion and a broken ankle.
What is going on at Beacon is the same thing that is going on all over the country and even at our (Western Washington) riding spots. Multiple use, property ownership, insurance liabilities. I think what it may come to are actual mountain bike parks or areas. Places where the building is controlled and it's legal.
I love racing at Beacon and I know you loved going over there as well. I agree with you that the building (race course) should be left to people that know what they are doing.
Sorry to hear that the accident took you away from DH.
Kim
Yeah, i knew you weren't directing any of that at me... I just used your post as a jumping off point to point a few fingers at others for their whinny sniveling.holliswood said:
I'm hoping (fingers crossed) that I'll get the okay to be able to race maybe next season.
You know what's really funny about all this is that ever since I joined this site, and even as far back as when I started racing, one thing hasn't changed... people b*tching about stuff they really don't know too much about.
Yes, I think it's great that the sport has progressed with free riding. Yes, I think the WIM series could use some help in the course developement department. NO, i don't think kids should be building free riding stunts into DH course... that's just sillyness
Yes, it would be nice to have a lot more venues to have races throughout the year. And while I beleive the wide-eyed yet-naive hope is the future of all that is pure and good... the cold hard truth remains that land restrictions, funding, legal issues, etc will always be obstacles that bikers will face. THAT will never change.
to this day it still ceases to amaze me how full of themselves our younger riders are and they think they know everything about everthing... from course design to land use liability laws. The only thing that puts a smirk on my face is knowing that one day, they'll see the world for what it is and realize that it ISN'T here to serve them, nor does life or some ski resort or some state park or some private land owner, owe them one thing as far as their right to bike freely.
on a side note, annyone know the scoop on Nat's at Schweitzer? I thought I heard someone say Team Big Bear was putting it on, is that true?
DING DING DING.....WE HAVE A WINNER!!!!!!!!!holliswood said:
Best two sentences in this entire thread, well put Kim.
I agree comletly. Too many people have control (or access) to build.
You said it much better than I did. I agree with you completely. It makes me feel old but the entitlement attitude really gets me going. I feel just like I did when I started snowboarding; trying to prove the sport is legit and the riders aren't all punks. Popularity and money saved snowboarding but it's different for this sport. I realize the liability issues for both public and private land owners. I am so grateful for the places I have to ride and I don't want to lose it. I know how close most of them are from being closed down. I just don't see the same attitude from the younger riders who have a much nicer place to ride and much nicer bikes than I ever did.DHRacer said:
Yes, it's true. WIM is no longer involved in putting it on.DHRacer said:
are they changing that course too? I heard a rumor of a new course. And I agree to many people on the internet that cant ride for a **** or dont ride, but htey know al the numbers to things and always argue or wine about stupid ****. When we are all in it for the same thing....trails, safe fun trails that will make us better riders. Im sick of reading stuff on the net from people who have no clue of what they are talking about. "I saw some one in Kranked 23 do this once."Snacks said:
Holliswood sucks
I wish that old thread was around. Man I was bent about that.
I wish that old thread was around. Man I was bent about that.
Yea, it made you stop yelling at kids from the chair on your porch....brock said:Holliswood sucks
I wish that old thread was around. Man I was bent about that.
brock said:
I wish that old thread was around. Man I was bent about that.
:love: I remember that....
PS Still think that is a kick arse smilie!