Quantcast

Can Haz Debt Ceilingz?

Silver

find me a tampon
Jul 20, 2002
10,840
1
Orange County, CA
While in DC they are playing whose penis is bigger, meanwhile in A'stan:

We're still getting shot at but are we getting paid?


Every Tea Party jackass better take the flag off their lapel and turn in their I Support Our Troops magnets.
You know, I'd feel bad for le troops, but they tend to vote Republican fairly heavily, no?

How's the old folk saying go? You made the bed...something something?
 

RUFUS

e-douche of the year
Dec 1, 2006
3,480
1
Denver, CO
You know, I'd feel bad for le troops, but they tend to vote Republican fairly heavily, no?

How's the old folk saying go? You made the bed...something something?
First off, kindly go **** yourself.

I am assuming that you have never been in the military or been overseas getting shot at while your family back home is already trying to stay afloat why you are gone. Now to have the idea of not getting paid while doing your job and defending your country lingering over you and your loved ones, is just icing on the cake.

I have been in this situation and it is an amazingly horrible feeling.

So again I ask you to kindly go **** yourself!!!
 
Last edited:

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,551
7,877
First off, kindly go **** yourself.

I am assuming that you have never been in the military or been overseas getting shot at while your family back home is already trying to stay afloat why you are gone. Now to have the idea of not getting paid while doing your job and defending your country lingering over you and your loved ones, is just icing on the cake.

I have been in this situation and it is an amazingly horrible feeling.

So again I ask you to kindly go **** yourself!!!
You should have thought of whether shooting brown people in Iraq is truly "defending your country" before you signed the contract.
 

Pesqueeb

bicycle in airplane hangar
Feb 2, 2007
40,473
17,016
Riding the baggage carousel.
ahem: (Reuters)

when you think about who controls who gets paid & who doesn't, this'll never, ever, no not ever, happen.

ever.
What are you on about? Is Reuters not a legit news agency directly quoting the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs saying he doesn't know if his folks are gonna get paid? If he doesn't know than who does?
 

X3pilot

Texans fan - LOL
Aug 13, 2007
5,860
1
SoMD
You should have thought of whether shooting brown people in Iraq is truly "defending your country" before you signed the contract.
You do understand that individuals don't get to pick which events they participate in, don't you? It's called following orders. Before you snap back with another witty retort, refer to your "poor black urban man" thread and understand that economic and social issues drive a large part of the current force to choose the military. In other words, don't blame the shooters with your "outrage" over who decided to go kill brown people.

(Disclaimer: I am a retired 26 year veteran of Army and Navy. Killing other colors of people is just as hard as "brown" people. All bleed red.)
 

X3pilot

Texans fan - LOL
Aug 13, 2007
5,860
1
SoMD
You know, I'd feel bad for le troops, but they tend to vote Republican fairly heavily, no?

How's the old folk saying go? You made the bed...something something?
Yes, they vote primarily Republican, mainly for the reason that Republicans have traditionally supported increases in military pay and benefits, the same reason (in my mind) that blacks are conditioned to vote Democrat, to ensure the continuation of entitlements to their section of society.
 

ALEXIS_DH

Tirelessly Awesome
Jan 30, 2003
6,148
796
Lima, Peru, Peru
You do understand that individuals don't get to pick which events they participate in, don't you? It's called following orders. Before you snap back with another witty retort, refer to your "poor black urban man" thread and understand that economic and social issues drive a large part of the current force to choose the military. In other words, don't blame the shooters with your "outrage" over who decided to go kill brown people.

(Disclaimer: I am a retired 26 year veteran of Army and Navy. Killing other colors of people is just as hard as "brown" people. All bleed red.)
wait, what??
what happened to the 11th republican commandment "personal responsability"?
 

dante

Unabomber
Feb 13, 2004
8,807
9
looking for classic NE singletrack
First off, kindly go **** yourself.

I am assuming that you have never been in the military or been overseas getting shot at while your family back home is already trying to stay afloat why you are gone. Now to have the idea of not getting paid while doing your job and defending your country lingering over you and your loved ones, is just icing on the cake.

I have been in this situation and it is an amazingly horrible feeling.

So again I ask you to kindly go **** yourself!!!
While Silver could have put it more... delicately, the fact remains that Republican voters have gotten the government that they voted for. I can almost guarantee that my parents are feeling the same way. They are Republican voters who kept saying "we need to cut government spending" last year without realizing that as a SS and Medicare beneficiary (Dad) and a public school worker (Mom), their own incomes were the ones that Republicans wanted to cut.
 

X3pilot

Texans fan - LOL
Aug 13, 2007
5,860
1
SoMD
wait, what??
what happened to the 11th republican commandment "personal responsability"?
Are you remotely familiar with a thing called the UCMJ??

I was talking about military members...political standing doesn't affect what job assignments they get to do.

And for what it's worth, since I am one receiving my share of "entitlement":
Retired members of the uniformed services who are entitled to retirement pay are also subject to the UCMJ, as are retired reservists who are receiving hospital care in the VA system.
 

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
6

Silver

find me a tampon
Jul 20, 2002
10,840
1
Orange County, CA
You do understand that individuals don't get to pick which events they participate in, don't you? It's called following orders. Before you snap back with another witty retort, refer to your "poor black urban man" thread and understand that economic and social issues drive a large part of the current force to choose the military. In other words, don't blame the shooters with your "outrage" over who decided to go kill brown people.

(Disclaimer: I am a retired 26 year veteran of Army and Navy. Killing other colors of people is just as hard as "brown" people. All bleed red.)
You know, this a fair point, and I'm willing to grant it, given a condition:

Stop using military service as a super-duper-citizen chip. Not specifically you, but RUFUS did it upthread and it's pretty damn common.

I'd never join the military because I would not be able to follow those orders. That doesn't make me a morally weak person who shouldn't be allowed to have an opinion.

Honestly, the US Military hasn't exactly been liberating Nazi death camps the last 30 years. If you join that organization, you're going to be sent to some poor country to kill people that have nothing to do with God, Freedom, and Apple Pie, so that the Presidents of the country from both parties make guys who direct the foreign policy of the country (and make no mistake, the right-wing think tank crowd most definitely does) happy.

“Every ten years or so, the United States needs to pick up some small crappy little country and throw it against the wall, just to show the world we mean business.”

http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/205187/baghdad-delenda-est-part-two/jonah-goldberg
 

Silver

find me a tampon
Jul 20, 2002
10,840
1
Orange County, CA
First off, kindly go **** yourself.

I am assuming that you have never been in the military or been overseas getting shot at while your family back home is already trying to stay afloat why you are gone. Now to have the idea of not getting paid while doing your job and defending your country lingering over you and your loved ones, is just icing on the cake.

I have been in this situation and it is an amazingly horrible feeling.

So again I ask you to kindly go **** yourself!!!
Anyways, now that I'm not posting from a phone.

WAAHHHH!

Take it up with this guy:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allen_West_(politician)

He's a Tea Party darling and an honest-to-god admitted war criminal. You should be yelling at him, not me. I can't even vote.
 

Silver

find me a tampon
Jul 20, 2002
10,840
1
Orange County, CA

X3pilot

Texans fan - LOL
Aug 13, 2007
5,860
1
SoMD
You know, this a fair point, and I'm willing to grant it, given a condition:

Stop using military service as a super-duper-citizen chip. Not specifically you, but RUFUS did it upthread and it's pretty damn common.

I'd never join the military because I would not be able to follow those orders. That doesn't make me a morally weak person who shouldn't be allowed to have an opinion.
I agree wholeheartedly. The hero tag is overused, not just for military but for all the "ribbon" clans. (firefighters, police, hell, I even saw one that claims electrical linemen are "heroes".) Speaking for myself, the decision to join the military wasn't an altruistic one but more of a "well, high school is over, I don't have the grades to get into college, what the heck, this looks cool.." Granted, some people join out of a sense of patriotism and a sense of service and that's fine. We made the same decision path to join the military as those who did not. Do we deserve any special treatment for that? No. Do we serve for less than ideal pay and under unique conditions? Yes. The payoff for me is not the public's admiration, but the bond of shared sacrifice and comradeship between me and those that did make the choice. I picked the life, I lived it, wouldn't change a thing. Joe American doesn't owe me sh!t other than my pay and benefits that I earned, just like any other worker, and frankly, I wouldn't take it they did.

On the other hand, if you did make that choice not to join, I'll make you a deal...I won't judge your choice either if you don't pretend to know everything about how and why I made mine...(not you Silver, but a few others who seem to think that all military members run to recruiting offices to kill Muslims)
 

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
6
I agree wholeheartedly. The hero tag is overused, not just for military but for all the "ribbon" clans. (firefighters, police, hell, I even saw one that claims electrical linemen are "heroes".)
when hurricane opal came through montgomery, it knocked down some branches at our dorms, so a few of us picked them up. result? humanitarian ribbon & recognition citation for showing 'initiative' & 'leadership'.

don't ever question my bona fides again
Speaking for myself, the decision to join the military wasn't an altruistic one but more of a "well, high school is over, I don't have the grades to get into college, what the heck, this looks cool.."
same
 

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
54,642
20,460
Sleazattle
Debt deal passed. This bill is kind of like giving a chick a promise ring while trying to get laid and knowing that the condom has holes in it.
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,551
7,877

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,551
7,877
I stand corrected. But this seems like the kind of political bull**** that will pass.
I'm actually much happier with it from the reporters' casual summary of it than I thought I'd be. Perhaps the devil really is in the details, but this pleases me (emphasis added by me):

Under the framework that negotiators were discussing today, half of those cuts would come in defense spending, while the other half would be a combination of other domestic spending, like discretionary programs and farm subsidies. Cuts to Medicare would not make up more than 3 percent of the non-military cuts.
 

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
54,642
20,460
Sleazattle
I'm actually much happier with it from the reporters' casual summary of it than I thought I'd be. Perhaps the devil really is in the details, but this pleases me (emphasis added by me):
I haven't read all of the details yet but I will just say at this point these are all long term promises that can be changed by any single future vote. There are a million minor events that can spur an increase in military. We can see decades of ****ty results in education, environmental and other regulations before seeing any changes. It wouldn't surprise me if all of the military cuts were based on reduced veterans benefits. 30 year old vets do not donate to campaigns. Boeing does.

BTW, long term estimates show that the majority of the cost related to Iraq and A-stan will be for the care of vets.
 

RUFUS

e-douche of the year
Dec 1, 2006
3,480
1
Denver, CO
You should have thought of whether shooting brown people in Iraq is truly "defending your country" before you signed the contract.
I signed the contract well before we went over to "shoot brown people", and I knew full what what being in the military might bring.

I truly feel sorry for people like you who feel they are entitled to everything in the world, yet feel that they don't have to sacrifice anything to get it.

I was doing my job and I still would, (if I wasn't medically discharged) and I would do it proudly even for people like you, as well as every member and ex member of the military on this forum.

But don't worry, we all still like you in the internet world!!!:D
 

RUFUS

e-douche of the year
Dec 1, 2006
3,480
1
Denver, CO
I agree wholeheartedly. The hero tag is overused, not just for military but for all the "ribbon" clans. (firefighters, police, hell, I even saw one that claims electrical linemen are "heroes".) Speaking for myself, the decision to join the military wasn't an altruistic one but more of a "well, high school is over, I don't have the grades to get into college, what the heck, this looks cool.." Granted, some people join out of a sense of patriotism and a sense of service and that's fine. We made the same decision path to join the military as those who did not. Do we deserve any special treatment for that? No. Do we serve for less than ideal pay and under unique conditions? Yes. The payoff for me is not the public's admiration, but the bond of shared sacrifice and comradeship between me and those that did make the choice. I picked the life, I lived it, wouldn't change a thing. Joe American doesn't owe me sh!t other than my pay and benefits that I earned, just like any other worker, and frankly, I wouldn't take it they did.

On the other hand, if you did make that choice not to join, I'll make you a deal...I won't judge your choice either if you don't pretend to know everything about how and why I made mine...(not you Silver, but a few others who seem to think that all military members run to recruiting offices to kill Muslims)
My thoughts exactly. I am not a patriotic person myself and I also joined a little after high school after getting my A&P and not finding a job in the Northwest.
 

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
54,642
20,460
Sleazattle
I signed the contract well before we went over to "shoot brown people", and I knew full what what being in the military might bring.

I truly feel sorry for people like you who feel they are entitled to everything in the world, yet feel that they don't have to sacrifice anything to get it.

I was doing my job and I still would, (if I wasn't medically discharged) and I would do it proudly even for people like you, as well as every member and ex member of the military on this forum.

But don't worry, we all still like you in the internet world!!!:D

[modernwhiteguilt] This is not a direct response to Toshi's statement nor yours. But I feel that both posts bring up a topic that I don't think is discussed enough. During Vietnam people who did not support the war unfairly blamed those who faught it. With Afghanistan and Iraq consensus seemed to swing the other way. Fearing errors of the past people were hesitant to resist or criticize the validity of those wars not wanting to harm those who sacrifice themselves to fight it. As it is the responsibility of the military to execute the policies of the country it is the responsibility of the citizen to judge and comment on the efficacy of the policies that send our people to war.

Whenever I fly there seems to be a flight of soldiers returning from overseas combat. Pretty much everyone applauds them and says "thank you". I always want to say "I am sorry". I am sorry for asking you to sacrifice yourselves and your families for our misguided policies. Sorry that your minds and bodies are subjected to unimaginable torment so that we can de-stabilize the world economy to live in shoddily built McMansions based on risky sub-prime mortgages. [/modernwhiteguilt]
 

Pesqueeb

bicycle in airplane hangar
Feb 2, 2007
40,473
17,016
Riding the baggage carousel.
[modernwhiteguilt] This is not a direct response to Toshi's statement nor yours. But I feel that both posts bring up a topic that I don't think is discussed enough. During Vietnam people who did not support the war unfairly blamed those who faught it. With Afghanistan and Iraq consensus seemed to swing the other way. Fearing errors of the past people were hesitant to resist or criticize the validity of those wars not wanting to harm those who sacrifice themselves to fight it. As it is the responsibility of the military to execute the policies of the country it is the responsibility of the citizen to judge and comment on the efficacy of the policies that send our people to war.

Whenever I fly there seems to be a flight of soldiers returning from overseas combat. Pretty much everyone applauds them and says "thank you". I always want to say "I am sorry". I am sorry for asking you to sacrifice yourselves and your families for our misguided policies. Sorry that your minds and bodies are subjected to unimaginable torment so that we can de-stabilize the world economy to live in shoddily built McMansions based on risky sub-prime mortgages. [/modernwhiteguilt]
:stupid:
 

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
6
Whenever I fly there seems to be a flight of soldiers returning from overseas combat. Pretty much everyone applauds them and says "thank you".
i've always found this off-putting & uncomfortable to witness. i'm sure most of them would rather do their jobs & return to the shadows than have a random spontaneous crowd emotionally circle jerk their vomit of patriotism for all to see.
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,551
7,877
[modernwhiteguilt] This is not a direct response to Toshi's statement nor yours. But I feel that both posts bring up a topic that I don't think is discussed enough. During Vietnam people who did not support the war unfairly blamed those who faught it. With Afghanistan and Iraq consensus seemed to swing the other way. Fearing errors of the past people were hesitant to resist or criticize the validity of those wars not wanting to harm those who sacrifice themselves to fight it. As it is the responsibility of the military to execute the policies of the country it is the responsibility of the citizen to judge and comment on the efficacy of the policies that send our people to war.

Whenever I fly there seems to be a flight of soldiers returning from overseas combat. Pretty much everyone applauds them and says "thank you". I always want to say "I am sorry". I am sorry for asking you to sacrifice yourselves and your families for our misguided policies. Sorry that your minds and bodies are subjected to unimaginable torment so that we can de-stabilize the world economy to live in shoddily built McMansions based on risky sub-prime mortgages. [/modernwhiteguilt]
:thumb:
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,551
7,877
A few more details, noting that it has still yet to be actually be passed and signed: http://www.whitehouse.gov/fact-sheet-victory-bipartisan-compromise-economy-american-people

Enforcement mechanism established to force all parties – Republican and Democrat – to agree to balanced deficit reduction. If Committee fails, enforcement mechanism will trigger spending reductions beginning in 2013 – split 50/50 between domestic and defense spending. Enforcement protects Social Security, Medicare beneficiaries, and low-income programs from any cuts.
Note the distinction between Medicare as a whole and Medicare beneficiaries. That means I and my ilk are going to get squeezed… Later on it's made even more explicit: "Likewise, any cuts to Medicare would be capped and limited to the provider side."

Includes Savings of $350 Billion from the Base Defense Budget – the First Defense Cut Since the 1990s: The deal puts us on track to cut $350 billion from the defense budget over 10 years. These reductions will be implemented based on the outcome of a review of our missions, roles, and capabilities that will reflect the President’s commitment to protecting our national security.
$350B/10 years ==> $35B/year ==> less than 5% reduction per year based on this year's ~$800B budget. Despite this tiny amount it'll surely still provoke cries of outrage and despair from the war hawks within both parties.
 
Last edited:

Silver

find me a tampon
Jul 20, 2002
10,840
1
Orange County, CA
So Jon Stewart just epxlained the debt ceiling deal to me.

Did Obama REALLY completely cave?

I like him and all.......but he lacks a certain testicular fortitude......
Pretty much. So, one of two things (a lot like the healthcare deal):

1-Smart, pragmatic guy is the worst negotiator in the world.
2-This is the outcome he actually desires.

I'm starting to lean toward 2, because I don't think that a guy who is halfway smart can be that terrible a negotiator, and I think that Obama is plenty smart.
 

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
54,642
20,460
Sleazattle
The Democrats could have passed a debt limit bill when they had the house, reaching the debt limit was well known. They chose to wait so that the republicans would have to take part of the blame.