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Carmax

Sandwich

Pig my fish!
Staff member
May 23, 2002
21,031
5,921
borcester rhymes
Anybody buy from Carmax? They have a car I want but haggling is just part of the process. Not sure how it works without it.
 

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
54,241
20,022
Sleazattle
Here let me copy and paste something from their website that explains how it works

THERE’S NO HAGGLING
We don’t play pricing games with our customers. We offer one fair price.

BUY WITH CONFIDENCE
If you decide it's not the car for you, bring it back within 5 days for a full refund.
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,037
7,554
There is always haggling
Not at CarMax. Instead you wait until they drop their price of their own volition.

Data point showing their margins:

- they listed a 2013? RAV4 EV with more miles than mine for $20k. It sold for $19k after they dropped their price.
- they offered $10k even to buy my 2012 RAV4 EV outright (older year but identical over the 2012-2014 run and lower miles on mine).

QED.
 

boogenman

Turbo Monkey
Nov 3, 2004
4,290
973
BUFFALO
I find it hard to believe that they will let someone walk out without offering something up.
Is it true that they start off with stupid high finance rates and pack payments with all types of extras?
 

maxyedor

<b>TOOL PRO</b>
Oct 20, 2005
5,496
3,140
In the bathroom, fighting a battle
I find it hard to believe that they will let someone walk out without offering something up.
Is it true that they start off with stupid high finance rates and pack payments with all types of extras?
No, that's exactly what they do. You can haggle all you want, but they won't haggle back. It's a brilliant strategy, people buy from them because they know they didn't "leave money on the table", doesn't matter what the actual price is as long as they got the best possible price. Carmax is consistently above market value on their cars, but people don't shop around, they go directly to CarMax and buy at whatever price they see.

I know a bunch of people who have bought at Carmax, and none have had any bullshit with their loans. I also know a few people who hav worked as salesmen there, and they all say the same thing, the pricing model is nutty, but it's consistent. They seem to run a pretty straight-up business, but their main and only advantage is that there is no bullshit, not that you're actually going to get a great deal.
 

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
54,241
20,022
Sleazattle
No, that's exactly what they do. You can haggle all you want, but they won't haggle back. It's a brilliant strategy, people buy from them because they know they didn't "leave money on the table", doesn't matter what the actual price is as long as they got the best possible price. Carmax is consistently above market value on their cars, but people don't shop around, they go directly to CarMax and buy at whatever price they see.

I know a bunch of people who have bought at Carmax, and none have had any bullshit with their loans. I also know a few people who hav worked as salesmen there, and they all say the same thing, the pricing model is nutty, but it's consistent. They seem to run a pretty straight-up business, but their main and only advantage is that there is no bullshit, not that you're actually going to get a great deal.
You can charge extra by being a straight shooter in an industry full of bullshitters and con artists.
 

boogenman

Turbo Monkey
Nov 3, 2004
4,290
973
BUFFALO
It's a brilliant strategy, people buy from them because they know they didn't "leave money on the table", doesn't matter what the actual price is as long as they got the best possible price. Carmax is consistently above market value on their cars, but people don't shop around, they go directly to CarMax and buy at whatever price they see.
If they are consistently above market value and you can't negotiate the price to comparable vehicles in the market aren't you "leaving money on the table"?
We do have auto nation here which is very similar. I may have to pay them a visit to see the process.
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,037
7,554
If they are consistently above market value and you can't negotiate the price to comparable vehicles in the market aren't you "leaving money on the table"?
We do have auto nation here which is very similar. I may have to pay them a visit to see the process.
They're not leaving money on the table as compared to Joe Sixpack walking into the same CarMax to buy the same car. There is something to be said about that.

The other thing CarMax is great at is intra-branch transfers. The transfer price is clearly posted. Once one arranges for the transfer (which can be free to $1000 or so depending on the vehicle and the region, usually $200-400) then once it arrives at one's local CarMax one has 72 hours right of first refusal. If one doesn't care for it ultimately then there's no further obligation. I used this system to get a sold-only-in-California car to Colorado on the cheap, sort of a $400 test drive in the worst case since I hadn't driven the vehicle beforehand.
 

maxyedor

<b>TOOL PRO</b>
Oct 20, 2005
5,496
3,140
In the bathroom, fighting a battle
If they are consistently above market value and you can't negotiate the price to comparable vehicles in the market aren't you "leaving money on the table"?
We do have auto nation here which is very similar. I may have to pay them a visit to see the process.
Yeah, you're leaving money on the table, but you're leaving it on a different table. You accept the fact that you're likely not getting the best deal on the planet, but it's easy, easy is worth it to a lot of people. Same reason you'd buy any used car from a dealer instead of private party. PP will be the cheapest, but then you have a bunch of hassle when it comes to financing, dealership is going to cost a little less than Carmax, but it a total PITA, CarMax charges a slight premium but makes life super simple, if they have what you want you can be in&out in a couple hours with a warranty, a return policy, and not feel like Elisabath Shue in the shower scene of Leaving Las Vegas. Pick your poison.
 

jstuhlman

bagpipe wanker
Dec 3, 2009
16,627
12,918
Cackalacka du Nord
i used them. wanted a hard to find vehicle. at dealers you paid a premium for it. finance rates were comparable and they didn’t try any add ons, other than extended warranty, which i didn’t take, as there was some factory remaining. as with anything, do your research and know what your options are.
 

Sandwich

Pig my fish!
Staff member
May 23, 2002
21,031
5,921
borcester rhymes
i used them. wanted a hard to find vehicle. at dealers you paid a premium for it. finance rates were comparable and they didn’t try any add ons, other than extended warranty, which i didn’t take, as there was some factory remaining. as with anything, do your research and know what your options are.
thanks. i know how it works, I want to know whether it works. The vehicle I have my eye on is rare, the price is competitive to what I've seen. Mileage is slightly higher than others but price is similar or lower for higher miles. It sounds like people get lowballed for weird/old vehicles they trade in, but mine is generic and low miles.
 

jstuhlman

bagpipe wanker
Dec 3, 2009
16,627
12,918
Cackalacka du Nord
thanks. i know how it works, I want to know whether it works. The vehicle I have my eye on is rare, the price is competitive to what I've seen. Mileage is slightly higher than others but price is similar or lower for higher miles. It sounds like people get lowballed for weird/old vehicles they trade in, but mine is generic and low miles.
same on trade in. if you want extra security, i’d buy, take to trusted mechanic for detailed review, and return if something’s amiss.
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,037
7,554
thanks. i know how it works, I want to know whether it works. The vehicle I have my eye on is rare, the price is competitive to what I've seen. Mileage is slightly higher than others but price is similar or lower for higher miles. It sounds like people get lowballed for weird/old vehicles they trade in, but mine is generic and low miles.
Re warranty: MaxCare pays out. See the Doug DeMuro video at the beginning of this thread. But if you’re under factory warranty you can often buy the factory extended warranty still, which is cheaper (at least it was in Toyota-Land by about a factor of two when getting a good price on the Toyota product).
 

CBJ

year old fart
Mar 19, 2002
12,863
4,161
Copenhagen, Denmark
Is the warranty really worth it if you buy a car with a good general record? I understand on an RR its a good idea as is a piece of shit but I would not buy that in the first place.
 

Sandwich

Pig my fish!
Staff member
May 23, 2002
21,031
5,921
borcester rhymes
I've never found the warranty to be worth it unless you buy a car with bad reliability, like an Audi or virtually anything German....but you have to make the choice before you buy the car, or you need to consider the price of the warranty in addition to the price of the car. You can score amazing deals on fantastic Audis if you're willing to put up with the maintenance. Like 25k for a 100k S8.
 

Sandwich

Pig my fish!
Staff member
May 23, 2002
21,031
5,921
borcester rhymes
Looks like it is, kind of. Same block and heads, but the ATS is cranked up. Moar boost, titanium conrods, and some other doohickeys. 40 moar HP out of the ATS.

I'm not put off by an auto anymore. Would love a stick but the new transmissions shift when you tell them to, and they're a lot less work. I liked the kia and genesis' boxes a lot.
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,037
7,554
[Doug DeMuro]

How about that 25k S8 with MaxCare and plan to dump it when the warranty is up?

[/DDM]
 

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
54,241
20,022
Sleazattle
I've never found the warranty to be worth it unless you buy a car with bad reliability, like an Audi or virtually anything German....but you have to make the choice before you buy the car, or you need to consider the price of the warranty in addition to the price of the car. You can score amazing deals on fantastic Audis if you're willing to put up with the maintenance. Like 25k for a 100k S8.

You will really save a lot of money with that Cadillac over an Audi.

https://www.yourmechanic.com/article/the-most-and-least-expensive-cars-to-maintain-by-maddy-martin.

Luxury cars are always a lot more expensive to maintain as there is a lot more dumb shit to go wrong. Avoid the pointless complicated options that you do not need like active suspension, dynamic roll bars, AWD.
 

Sandwich

Pig my fish!
Staff member
May 23, 2002
21,031
5,921
borcester rhymes
You will really save a lot of money with that Cadillac over an Audi.

https://www.yourmechanic.com/article/the-most-and-least-expensive-cars-to-maintain-by-maddy-martin.

Luxury cars are always a lot more expensive to maintain as there is a lot more dumb shit to go wrong. Avoid the pointless complicated options that you do not need like active suspension, dynamic roll bars, AWD.
While that may be true, I have my doubts about a webpage that compares Mercury with Cadillac.
 

Sandwich

Pig my fish!
Staff member
May 23, 2002
21,031
5,921
borcester rhymes
mercury don't exist no mo', when they did, cadillac was rebounding from years of mediocrity. Indeed, the 2004 CTS was a pretty dismal car in terms of reliability.

Comparing a 2015 caddy with a mercury sable based on reviews from 2005 is not a good comparison.
 

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
54,241
20,022
Sleazattle
mercury don't exist no mo', when they did, cadillac was rebounding from years of mediocrity. Indeed, the 2004 CTS was a pretty dismal car in terms of reliability.

Comparing a 2015 caddy with a mercury sable based on reviews from 2005 is not a good comparison.
But you need long term data to assemble lifetime costs.