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Commencal Supreme DH V3 photos

Discussion in 'Downhill & Freeride' started by yuroshek, Mar 23, 2011.

  1. yuroshek

    yuroshek Turbo Monkey

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  2. Pslide

    Pslide Turbo Monkey

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    There's a great article in this month's Dirt on this bike. Compares geometries of the stock 2010, Gee's 2010 WC bike, and the 2 protos.

    I don't know if the geo for the mass production bike has been decided yet. Gee's bike got longer, BB is at 13.7" and 62 deg HA if I recall correctly.

    Longer and slacker seems to be the trend this year. Good for WC pros, don't think I need it...
     
  3. stoney

    stoney Part of the unwashed, middle-American horde

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    Longer and slacker... I wonder how an old Yeti DH-9 would compare if they could cut the weight and put a better shock on it. Mine large had a 63* head angle, 13.9" bb, and 48" wheelbase when I had a boxxer installed on it.
     
  4. worship_mud

    worship_mud Turbo Monkey

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    wheelbase is 124cm!!!!!!!!!!! holy cow!!!! my medium 2011 demo has 119cm and that feels super long compared to my previous 2008 giant glory....
     
  5. w00dy

    w00dy In heaven there is no beer

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  6. norbar

    norbar Turbo Monkey

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    I think we've reached a point where mfg's thought we were 5 years ago. WC racer geo with such crazy WB's makes no sense for most of us regular riders. I really hope this wont become a trend where the only bike you can buy is longer than your car.
     
  7. climbingbubba

    climbingbubba Monkey

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    They look interesting but it seems like the shock would get abused. Have seen many different pics/videos of this bike and none have had any kind of fender for the rear shock
     
  8. Santa Maria

    Santa Maria Monkey

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  9. Mo(n)arch

    Mo(n)arch Turbo Monkey

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    Well Fusion was a Host link, right?
    I think they use the floating shock to control the forces better. This way they can build the front triangle way lighter.
    Mondraker did it the same way.
     
  10. xy9ine

    xy9ine Turbo Monkey

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    needs 64* ha & zero reach stem.
     
  11. dropmachine

    dropmachine Turbo Monkey

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    Makes me think of a couple of things.



     
  12. demo 9

    demo 9 Turbo Monkey

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    Loved it except for the arm pump, it was a monster truck. weighed 42 as it sat, if they could get the patent, they could make 1 hell of a bike if they modernized it
     
  13. Santa Maria

    Santa Maria Monkey

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    ya, i think you are right. the fusion uses a horst link.... but the Commencal looks pretty similar to the fusion
     
  14. stoney

    stoney Part of the unwashed, middle-American horde

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    When I got my 303 I was actually looking for a DH-9. I was planning on stripping it and putting on a Pushed shock w/ Ti sprhing. That alone would drop 2# from the frame and give it better suspension. It's unfortunate that the frame weighed 9#.
     
  15. demo 9

    demo 9 Turbo Monkey

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    9lbs isnt so bad? i think my demo 9 was 13, never weighed it, but thats what i was told.
     
  16. stoney

    stoney Part of the unwashed, middle-American horde

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    With XTR cranks, 523/Hope wheels, and a Dorado I was down to 40#. Given current parts it could pretty easily get into the ~39 range.
     
  17. BmxConvert

    BmxConvert Monkey

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    I agree. My Session 10 and Astrix Havoc were both about 13lbs. Those 2 bikes were my favorite DH bikes ever.

    I do agree that this super slack headangle, real long wheelbase production DH bikes is getting a bit nuts. It seems that it makes it harder for riders to transition into DH racing in the Cat 2/3 categories.
     
  18. norbar

    norbar Turbo Monkey

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    Everybody has to remember that 124wb comes from Size Large 61.5HA, longest CS setting. How much usually bikes loose every degree? 1cm?1.5cm? At 64 it would be closer to normal.
     
  19. Slater

    Slater Monkey

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    124 really isn't that long for a size Large frame.

    My large 2007 Demo is about 122 and its stays are an inch shorter than any normal bike. Forget about short wheelbases for Dh, they sucked in the past, and they still do today.
     
  20. norbar

    norbar Turbo Monkey

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    You could get it to 37 and lower on sturdy parts like 823s and saint brakes. 9lbs is normal and reasonable weight. It's still light enough not to behave like a tank yet it doesn't turn into aluminium foil on the first crash.
     
  21. demo 9

    demo 9 Turbo Monkey

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    Food for thought, while all the companies are doing "crazy" geo, spesh just made a super short chainstay, and canfield has for a while. I know i happen to prefer shorter stays.
     
  22. norbar

    norbar Turbo Monkey

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    It's nice with steeper bikes but for really slack ones your weight bias is a bit off. Because you move your front wheel away from you with a slacker ha, shortening the cs at the same time would increase that feel.
     
  23. Slater

    Slater Monkey

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    This is 100% true. Honestly, it sucks IMO. Weight is biased too far back, and makes it real easy to wash the front, not to mention the back breaking away prematurely because of the excessive loading that it sees. I've learned how to ride around it, but definitely don't prefer it.
     
  24. toodles

    toodles Turbo Monkey

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    Looks like it would be friggen awesome for going into rough sections wide open. Like proper rough stuff at 50kph. Might be a bit of a pain muscling through tight singletrack but for wider, multi-line sections down steep rough stuff I think the geo would be fantastic if you could keep your momentum up.

    Not a bike for riding lazy though it would be perfect for European and World Cup stuff.
     
  25. norbar

    norbar Turbo Monkey

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    If you live in the alps or other steep areas it's not a problem as the front wheel has some weight over it but with the current crop of dh bikes being slacker and slacker and CS getting longer only by a small % of an inch it's noticable on flat tracks. That's why I run super low front end (zero rise stem, flat 0 upsweep bars, slammed fork) for the flater courses and try to run spacers under the crown if it get's uncomfortably steep (though I know it's not e-cool).
     
  26. Commencal-guy

    Commencal-guy Monkey

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    From what I can recall from Dirt. The Geometry of the V3 Supreme is almost identical to the V2. Same HA and BB height and almost identical wheelbase. 64 Degree HA +1 and -1 Adj Sleeve. The pivot is placed forwards on the v3 compared to the v2 which is placed directly above the BB. Supposedly the V3 has a stiffer chassy compared to the V2.


    I know Gee's Supreme DH this past season was a stock production frame. The only thing that was different was his DHX RC4. Instead of the stock 9.5X3 shock his was actually a 9X3. This increased his wheelbase and lowered the BB. His HA was slacked to 61 Degrees.
     
  27. demo 9

    demo 9 Turbo Monkey

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    Addressing the tag, ill assume that idiocy wins world cups, and sells more bikes this year than most. Specialized has no idea what they are doing, i guess canfield doesnt either. Seems we were wrong all along, we need bikes designed to go 50mph over WC tracks we will never ride. I think that it would also make sense to bring back the soupar monstar so we can get slacker head angles and longer wheelbases
     
    #27 -   Mar 23, 2011
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2011
  28. bikerpunk98199

    bikerpunk98199 Turbo Monkey

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    Thank you, We've been waiting.
     
  29. Slater

    Slater Monkey

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    Way to keep your mind open to new ideas and not get defensive of the bikes you've owned!


    Also if you really want to get into it, the Jedi doesn't have short chainstays anywhere but at rest. At sag it is on par with all the rest of the Dh bikes out there, and in the last half of travel it has longer stays than almost any bike.
     
    #29 -   Mar 24, 2011
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2011
  30. norbar

    norbar Turbo Monkey

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    That's why the new one is even shorter to be closer to other bikes beyond sag.
     
  31. demo 9

    demo 9 Turbo Monkey

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    Maybe your just really talented and have access to dope world cup courses, but, id like to believe most of us dont. I cant think of 1 on the east coast in the states. (windham is not open for riding) Why do i need a giant chainstay and 59.9 degree head angles. I have tried them, had a DH-9 and a large 303. I havent ridden my demo 8 yet, but from the run i took on a friend of mines, the short stays are great, you can get your weight back, its easier to pump and "pull" out of berms and pockets. Should be easier to manual if your into that as well. Id be curious how well a mondraker (for example) rides for the normal people on normal tracks. How much experience do you have on short chainstay bikes? Out of curiosity, have you ridden a bike with short chainstays? owned 1?
     
    #31 -   Mar 24, 2011
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2011
  32. Slater

    Slater Monkey

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    I've been on my 2007 Demo since new, so a bit of time on short chainstay bikes. Had an SX trail before that. And have riden a fair number of other bikes as well.

    You'll understand when you spend some time on your demo. Really the whole "short rear end bikes turn better" thing is just feel. They don't actually turn better in my experience. And the rear ends just don't track as well, they break away sooner and have less feel. Also pumping efficiency has more to do with axle path than chainstay length, so that's not really relevant.

    Of course head angles can get too slack and chainstays can get too long. However until you ride a really slack bike with long stays, you should keep an open mind. I Have spent considerable time on a bike with 62.5 HA and 17.5 Chainstays and it was marvelous. Sure you have to ride a bit more agressively on flatter trails to make sure you don't wash the front, but it was not unnatural at all. Also the slacker your HA, the better the front of the bike will behave in the chunk (same as a more rearward axle path in the back) so that is another reason to give it a shot.
     
  33. ronan

    ronan Monkey

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    the geo has been changed drastically since the prototype from dirt, its down to a 62degree headangle before the cups (-+1) and the bb lower
     
  34. Commencal-guy

    Commencal-guy Monkey

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    Didn't they do this to Atherton's? v3 only? I thought they decided to use almost the same Geo as the V2 Supreme for the Production models. I know for a fact Gee's been testing numerous proto's.
     
  35. davedicko

    davedicko Chimp

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    For what its worth, I think there's just far too much fuss kicked up over this stuff. I own a Summum, I ride in Northern Ireland on tracks that are generally short, wet and relatively technical most of the time (some steep and some flatter) and I'm a fairly average rider. According to what most of the forums would have you believe I should then HATE this bike and find it makes me ride slower, but in fact I love it.

    I'm just running it with the 63* cups but I have the chainstays right out to the longest chips (450mm) and I love it. Its honestly the best bike I've ever ridden. Its just so stable in any sort of rough, but yet its still pretty nimble when it needs to be. It jumps well, its amazing in the corners and it pedals well. I have owned a Commencal Supreme DH (the old 7inch one), a Sunday and a 303RDH, and the Summum is far longer and slacker than all of them. I didn't know how I was going to get on with it, but I've heard Cesar on this forum a few times commenting that its not necessarily the bike being a better bike that will make you faster, its about how the bike feels to you. If it makes you more confident then you will ride faster. Thats exactly how I feel about this thing. But then there's probably other people who just haven't got on with it either....
     
  36. Mo(n)arch

    Mo(n)arch Turbo Monkey

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    This.
    And one thing I can say is, that a long wheelbase is confidence inspiring, just because the bike will be smoother. In my opinion you have to see the whole package. A long but light bike like the Summum will be smooth in the rough because of the wheelbase and the slack HA, BUT at the same time nimble enough because of the weight.
     
  37. Mo(n)arch

    Mo(n)arch Turbo Monkey

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    This will be the base version of the new Supreme. Looks really good. Marzocchi with the same stanchions like the boxxers?
    Some interesting feature is the hole for "cleaning". This way water and mud can flow off. Courtesy of Dan Atherton himself.

     
  38. frango

    frango Turbo Monkey

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    These RF cranks, which I can't recognize, are already vintage ;)
     
  39. scottishmark

    scottishmark Turbo Monkey

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    thank f*ck for that! The old one was just a bucket when it came to mud!
     
  40. Commencal-guy

    Commencal-guy Monkey

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    They are ganna need to make a larger hole...