Call me an amatuer, but what does FSR stand for? :S Full-suspension-racing or something of the like? Thanks
Definition of FSR...
- Thread starter Corksil
- Start date
FSR is a company name, who specilized ( amoung others ) has licensed the design from.
Really?splat said:
AFAIK, Specialized doesn't license the patent, they bought it - people license it from them. I thought FSR was the name they gave to it.
binary visions said:
I heard the same thing and I thought it stood for Full Suspension Rear
Future Shock Rear
Flexy Swinger Ride
I thought Specialized bought the design off of Horst Lightner (spelling?) who first intro'd the Mac Strut design on the AMP bikes. FSR (not sure what it's an acronym for) is the super trick name given by Specialized for the Mac Strut design.
specialized owns the fsr design, company's go through specialized to use it. I can't remember what it stands for though, i'll find out though. Beleive it or not the amp bikes were actually the first vpp.
i think its functional suspension rebound. because the main idea to the fsr is for the rebound to be so stable that it keeps the rear wheel on the ground better than most designs.
gastro said:
correct.
AMP as the first Virtual Pivot Point design? Really? I thought they were the first Macpherson Strut bikes? The first time I've ever heard of the VPP moniker was on the Outland.Dirtjumper999 said:
Full Suspension Ride
AMP was the first company to utilitze the Horst link, I'm almost positive that Outland was the first one to try the VPP design.Pau11y said:
Virtual pivot and VPP are not the same. Virtual pivot is a generic description for a bike with links instead of an actual pivot point. The swingarm moves around a "virtual" pivot point, and that point can and often does change as you move through travel. Just about every linkage bike (DW, Maestro, FSR) is a virtual pivot point bike. The exceptions are the Kona (and now, Turner) style rear ends that are really single pivots.
On the other hand VPP is a patented design and trademarked name. Only Outland/SCB/Intense bikes are allowed to be "VPP."
So, all VPP bikes are virtual pivot bikes, but not all virtual pivot bikes are VPP.
Edit: Hahaha, my point was that dirtjumper might be right if meant virtual pivot in the generic sense.
On the other hand VPP is a patented design and trademarked name. Only Outland/SCB/Intense bikes are allowed to be "VPP."
So, all VPP bikes are virtual pivot bikes, but not all virtual pivot bikes are VPP.
Edit: Hahaha, my point was that dirtjumper might be right if meant virtual pivot in the generic sense.
Well, I'd say that anyone saying "VPP" intends to mean Virtual Pivot Point, as in the patent, and if they don't then they're being misleading and deserve to be misunderstoodOGRipper said:
I heard it was Full Suspension Response... of course that was from a sales rep... and we all know the BS that come out of their mouths!mr2monster said:
Specialized owns the patents, and licenses (licensor) it to the licensee.
Hmm, lot's of definitions. I think I'll go with full-suspension-rear, because I like the way it sounds, but if anyone asks me, I'll point them here.
It is FULL SUSPENSION RIDE.Corksil said:Hmm, lot's of definitions. I think I'll go with full-suspension-rear, because I like the way it sounds, but if anyone asks me, I'll point them here.
Now the FSR, by your description is a vpp since the pivoting point is somewhere between the lower pivot and link. What/how does the Karpiels pivot classify? It actually moves up and slightly back as it progresses thru it's travel - floating vpp? What other frames behaves like this, DW?OGRipper said:
Yep, anything but a standard single pivot is a "virtual pivot".Pau11y said:
There's no such thing as "floating virtual pivot" (at least, not in common usage for bike designs) since almost no design actually fixes a real "virtual pivot" - so they all float, really. The FSR design doesn't fix a pivot either.
DW-link moves back during the first part of the travel, moves very close to vertical for a little, and then comes forward in the last part of the travel.
These are all virtual pivot designs, but I wouldn't call them "vpp" simply because "VPP" is a trademarked term and specifically refers to Outland/Santa Cruz's design.
Oh no, the chronic masturbator found me on the Monkey!revmonkey said:whoa hey gastro how ya doin'
And all you guys are really creative, but it really is Future Shock Rear. :mumble:
OK I talked to My LBS owner and specilzed dealer about this.( I didn't ask what it ment , dummy me )binary visions said:
and what he says happened is when Specilized first started using it they licensed it ( as did several other companies. ) after a A couple of Years ( around 98, 99 2000 ? ) they Bought the design/patant and the license. once specilized owned it they would only let Companies that already had Contracts for the licese use it, because they were contractually obligated too, they will not license it out to any one else any more.
I don't know about the rest (I think they've owned the patent for longer than that), but this certainly can't be true. Companies like Knolly have only been around for a few years and are using Horst link bikes.splat said:
Specialized may be holding tightly to their licenses, but they aren't completely restricting people from using them. Also, I'm sure the license doesn't say that companies are free to use the Horst link on an unrestricted basis, my guess is it's a frame-by-frame licensing deal - and certainly other frames have come out in the past few years.
found this out on the Net
Very interesting . so you are correct BV that Specilized did license it out. but it also looks like the are not doing it as much.
And this one is really intersting
Very interesting . so you are correct BV that Specilized did license it out. but it also looks like the are not doing it as much.
and also It was patanted in 1996
Where'd you find that article? That's another piece of inaccurate information. Titus does use a Horst link on their bikes (licensed from Specialized), and Kona doesn't use a chainstay pivot at all, they use a seatstay pivot, so of course they're not interfering with Specialized's patent.splat said:
I know that Ellsworth doesn't fall under the Horst link patent but I've never been completely sure why. I'm trying to look at their site, but in typical Ellsworth fashion, it's broken - like their bikes
. Ellsworth's suspension design is dubbed ICT (instant center tracking), and there are a couple bike manufacturers out there (notably Turner until recently) who were paying both Ellsworth and Specialized because their suspension design fell under both patents.
Incidentally, I've been poking around looking for the differences between ICT and Horst links, and there's just an absolutely shocking amount of misinformation out there... 
thats kinda weird, titus actually uses FSR, and has FSR printed on their bikes...
anyways, to set it in stone:
What does FSR stand for?
Question
What does FSR stand for?
Answer
At 11/22/99 11:04 AM we wrote -
FSR stands for "Future Shock Rear".
from specialized FAQ.
anyways, to set it in stone:
What does FSR stand for?
Question
What does FSR stand for?
Answer
At 11/22/99 11:04 AM we wrote -
FSR stands for "Future Shock Rear".
from specialized FAQ.
Wow, they should have come up with something a little better! Sounds like someone who rode the shortbus made it up.:mumble:revmonkey said:
Where is this rumored "Specialized FAQ"? I couldn't find it on their website. I'm in the "Future Shock Rear" camp - remember when they had a carbon fork out called the Future Shock? At least I think that's what it was called.........revmonkey said:
That's why it's best to ignore all that crap.binary visions said:Incidentally, I've been poking around looking for the differences between ICT and Horst links, and there's just an absolutely shocking amount of misinformation out there...
Ugh, it's all I can do not to sign up for forum accounts at all of these places and bring all of these threads back from the dead correcting people.SkaredShtles said:That's why it's best to ignore all that crap.
It's not so much that a few people have it wrong, since hey, I've had plenty of misinformation in my life, it just frustrates me when I see someone post something, "FSRs have a perfectly vertical axle path" and defend it to the death when someone corrects them. 'Cause you know that guy is still refusing to believe otherwise and is still going around telling people.
Learn from those who know more than you! Sheesh.
You see - you'll be happier if you just ignore all that crap.binary visions said:Ugh, it's all I can do not to sign up for forum accounts at all of these places and bring all of these threads back from the dead correcting people.
It's not so much that a few people have it wrong, since hey, I've had plenty of misinformation in my life, it just frustrates me when I see someone post something, "FSRs have a perfectly vertical axle path" and defend it to the death when someone corrects them. 'Cause you know that guy is still refusing to believe otherwise and is still going around telling people.
Learn from those who know more than you! Sheesh.
Guys used to tell me all the time what a terrible design my Trek Y bike was. I just smiled, nodded, and rode on my way.
"ICT" is not a set of initials, it doesn't stand for anything. It's actually a word that is pronounced "Ick."
ink:
ink:
OGRipper said:"ICT" is not a set of initials, it doesn't stand for anything. It's actually a word that is pronounced "Ick."
SS- I could not care less about what people choose to ride and would never criticize someone's choice just because I don't personally like the suspension design or whatever. But refusing to allow yourself to be educated on a subject is just dumb.
it's FUTURE SHOCK REAR.
It used to say it on the damn bikes.
They know it sounds retarded and that's why they quit.
It used to say it on the damn bikes.
They know it sounds retarded and that's why they quit.
Too much change in too short a time:
Mine just says FS on it but I'm pretty sure it stood for future shock. It weighs 2.4 lbs or something close.SkaredShtles said: