[douglas]

I spent like $400 on my road bike, what is the difference/advantage I would get out of buying a road bike in the $2000 range?


some info on my bike:
Alloy road frame, semi compact, replaceable dropout, 1-1/8" threadless fork w/ alloy steerer & carbon blades, Shimano Sora STI shifters, Shimano 2203/ Sora derailleurs, Tektro dual pivot brakes, Selle Italia XO saddle.
Wheels are ALEX Alloy, Black Anodized w/CNC Sidewalls, 14/15G Black Double Butted Forged Stainless steel spokes.


what I do/have done:
solo rides - up to 50 miles, some group rides 35-40miles normally, one century, one TT race

 

[Pau11y]

The added cost will be mostly in better componentry and the increased lifespan and dependability of said components. Altho, an increase of that size might also get you lighter and stronger frame materials as well. Sora will wear faster than a full Ultegra or Ultegra/DA mix.
$2000.00 (full bike) new is still in the realm of machine built production frames, but you might start to see some handbuilt production frames in that price range. At $400.00, there will not be any human production in that bike except in assembly and boxing.
Also the wheels are prob. much lighter, stronger, and more precise in its bearings surfaces that comes on a $2000.00 bike vs a $400.00 one. And since a bike is only as good as the wheels it's spinning...

Edit: Oh, I forgot. Just like Westy says, Dead Sexayh!

 

[Westy]

I went from a $800 road bike to a $2500 bike (MSRP not price paid)

The more expensive bike was,
much lighter
rode much smoother yet still put the power to the ground better
shifting/braking worked much better
dead sexy

 

[douglas]

The added cost will be mostly in better componentry and the increased lifespan and dependability of said components. Altho, an increase of that size might also get you lighter and stronger frame materials as well. Sora will wear faster than a full Ultegra or Ultegra/DA mix.
$2000.00 (full bike) new is still in the realm of machine built production frames, but you might start to see some handbuilt production frames in that price range. At $400.00, there will not be any human production in that bike except in assembly and boxing.
Also the wheels are prob. much lighter, stronger, and more precise in its bearings surfaces that comes on a $2000.00 bike vs a $400.00 one. And since a bike is only as good as the wheels it's spinning...

Edit: Oh, I forgot. Just like Westy says, Dead Sexayh!

yeah, better parts but what will it do for me when I am pedaling/riding/suffering/racing?

 

[DRB]

yeah, better parts but what will it do for me when I am pedaling/riding/suffering/racing?

You will be able to do those things longer and/or faster.

 

[Westy]

yeah, better parts but what will it do for me when I am pedaling/riding/suffering/racing?

The better shifting just feels better, like listening to a good stereo vs a 20 year old clock radio. It may not help you suffer less but it could prevent droping a chain or smashing your knee into the stem from a skipping chain. May not be worth the money if your on a tight budget.

A nicer frame/fork should ride much nicer. For me it the difference was huge when riding on rough roads, like a hardtail vs a full suspension.

The really big difference is I enjoy riding my new road bike much more than my old one.

 

[Wumpus]

yeah, better parts but what will it do for me when I am pedaling/riding/suffering/racing?

Better efficiency.

 

[Pau11y]

Life span of your bike/parts you've invested your hard earned $$.
It's also like driving an Escort vs. a BMW or Jag. Since I can't afford a BMW or a Jag, I make do w/ a Jetta. Look at that PORN I posted in the other thread. I can't afford that, so I make do w/ a DA equiped custom steel. It's not the top, but it does me very well and I really enjoy not having to fuss w/ it on the road. You can expect to not have to fuss w/ DA a WHOLE lot longer than w/ Sora.

 

[LordOpie]

$2k can get you into a custom steel bike. I'd rather have the best fitting bike with Sora than an okay fitting bike with DA/Record.

But I agree with ya Doug, components aren't super important as long as they work. You don't sit on a cassette, you don't stand on a derailleure. Tho I do think the value point is 105/Ultegra.

 

[sanjuro]

Most roadies would say, if you have to ask, you'll never know...

Seriously, you would know the difference after the first week. I did when I went from $1000 bike to my $5000 bike.

On a more objective level, my $1000 bike held up poorly to a full season of racing, where my $5000 bike is doing well two years after. You will see jammed shifting, mystery noises, and some difficulty with repairs.

I am not a huge bike snob, though. I felt fine on my $1000 bike, and I never used it as an excuse for anything.

 

[splat]

I think Longevity is another big point !

My Wife paid $1100 for her road Bike in 1979 , besides and Componet upgrade 2 Years ago , it was still the original , ( Sun Tour Supreb Pro ) Deraileurs, Brakes , wheels. Now its Campy .


and My Road Bike that I just replaced last year ( but still use on lunch rides at work ) I bought for $1200 in 1988 which was full Ultegra , the only Component I ever replaced was a rear wheel

 

[Serial Midget]

Yah... I paid $960.00 for a Univega Competition in 1984 and, aside from the break levers, it has all original components which where Superbe Pro. At the tiome I thought it was a huge amount of $$$ but in the long run it turns out to be a bargain. The bike is still getting about 400 miles on months on it since I loaned it to a riding pal earlier this year. He stomps a lot of ass on that bike. :devil:

My current frame is a 1991 and cost $1,200.00 when built, I think the D/A Ultegra mix drivetrain and wheels where about $750.00. Two years ago I rebuilt from the frame up with full campy chorus 10 speed and that was somewhere in the neighborhood of $2,000.00, if I where to replace my frame I would still stick with a full steet (including fork) Serotta CSI at about $1,800.00 - I expect to get 20 years and about 60,000 from a road bike.

So... $1,000.00 bikes will last about 3 or 4 years, 2 or 3 thousand well spent dollars can get you a ride that will last five times longer.

I think Longevity is another big point !

My Wife paid $1100 for her road Bike in 1979 , besides and Componet upgrade 2 Years ago , it was still the original , ( Sun Tour Supreb Pro ) Deraileurs, Brakes , wheels. Now its Campy .


and My Road Bike that I just replaced last year ( but still use on lunch rides at work ) I bought for $1200 in 1988 which was full Ultegra , the only Component I ever replaced was a rear wheel

 

[PonySoldier]

Granted I have limited math skills however the diff between $400.00 and $2000.00 is ~$1600.00

 

[Jeff 151]

Ultimate $2000 road bike: '05 Cannondale R1000.

10 speed Ultegra (new STI ergonomics, outboard bb bearings. . .etc.)
Mavic Ksyrium Elites, carbon cranks, post.
Sub 18 pound rocket.
Faster than scalded pussycat.

 

[Wumpus]

Faster than scalded pussycat.

When did they start selling them with motors?

 

[jacksonpt]

Ultimate $2000 road bike: '05 Cannondale R1000.

wrong.

Felt F55
carbon stays/fork
Dura Ace shifters and der
FSA carbon cranks
velomax wheels
17.5lbs

 

[Jeff 151]

wumpus, when you stand and gas one of these things you'll get it. jacksonpt, the f55 looks nice but are the velomax wheels any good? they're not even on the company's website. you also settle for tektro brakes and a powerpro? bb. What does Dura-Ace offer the average non-racer, that Ultegra doesn't?

 

[Serial Midget]

What does Dura-Ace offer the average non-racer, that Ultegra doesn't?

Pimp status.

 

[Pau11y]

What does Dura-Ace offer the average non-racer, that Ultegra doesn't?

Weight, longevity, precision of shifts (derailleurs) and bearing surfaces (hubs), and tweakability/servicability (specifically in the BB and shifters respectively).

Edit: oh, and what SM said.

 

[Reactor]

Ultimate $2000 road bike: '05 Cannondale R1000.
10 speed Ultegra (new STI ergonomics, outboard bb bearings. . .etc.)
Mavic Ksyrium Elites, carbon cranks, post.
Sub 18 pound rocket.
Faster than scalded pussycat.

Wrong. The ultimate bike is highly subjective, and a matter of taste, fit and well as technical specs.

I happen to like my new 05 Specialized Roubaix comp, I payed, less than $2000. Comfortable, full carbon (frame seatpost, bars, fork), and x-type carbon crank. Zerts inserts, Ksyrium equipe wheels, ultegra/dura ace (9speed). Most comfortable road bike I've ever ridden, and it still feels connected to the road. Sub 18 pound rocket, Flys up the hills while running over scalded pussycats.

The difference between my $1000 road bike and the new one, aside from the new bike not being run over by a car yet, is simply amazing. It's more comfortable, lighter, faster. My old car was a like a mid priced domestic sport sedan, nice but nothing special. My new bike is high end euro sports sedan, tuned for performance and commfort. When I shift it happens NOW, when I turn no vague feeling, hesitation or flexing, when I hammer no flexing, no doubts, it just happens.

One more thing. Like the difference between a cheaper mountain bike and a $2000 one, nothing breaks(without your help), you almost never find yourself tweaking and fiddling with components, no truing rims every ride.. You air your tires, give the bike a quick once over and you're off.

 

[Jeff 151]

Pau11y, I don't understand your post. How much weight is saved, enough to feel? Why will dura-ace last longer? How is it more servicable/tweakable? What do you mean by precision of bearing surfaces? Find me one person who feels the precision of ultegra shifting isn't good enough for them. And if you're buying dura-ace for the pimp status, you may be achieving another status . . . starting with a P . . .

 

[Jeff 151]

Pau11y, wus up? do you have answers to my questions? I don't come on here to agitate. but if someone rebuffs me, I expect them to be able to back it up. I think your view of dura-ace's superiority is exagerated. what if someone were to take your points to heart, and spend hundreds of dollars more for that stuff, expecting quantum leaps in performance. I think they'd be let down. So please respond to me, or delete your post and I will do likewise. Or I shall taunt you a second time.

 

[ioscope]

Road bikes are all the same just like BMX biikes!

 

[smedford]

Road bikes are all the same just like BMX biikes!

so are recumbants or whatever the hell those things are called.

 

[Pau11y]

Pau11y, I don't understand your post. How much weight is saved, enough to feel? Why will dura-ace last longer? How is it more servicable/tweakable? What do you mean by precision of bearing surfaces? Find me one person who feels the precision of ultegra shifting isn't good enough for them. And if you're buying dura-ace for the pimp status, you may be achieving another status . . . starting with a P . . .

&

Pau11y, wus up? do you have answers to my questions? I don't come on here to agitate. but if someone rebuffs me, I expect them to be able to back it up. I think your view of dura-ace's superiority is exagerated. what if someone were to take your points to heart, and spend hundreds of dollars more for that stuff, expecting quantum leaps in performance. I think they'd be let down. So please respond to me, or delete your post and I will do likewise. Or I shall taunt you a second time.

Sorry, I didn’t come back to this thread for a while. But here goes some info from which I made my comments (I didn't know I was being "called out"). Let’s start w/ the bearing surfaces. It’s made w/ a harder material than that of the Ultegra (you’ll have to look up the names of the materials used but the name Borozon comes to mind – excuse my spelling). It is also ground down to a higher precision, as are the balls and roller bearings used in the free pack. Together, this means a long life span of the bearings and the surfaces. DA shifters have ball bearings in them (2 sets), Ultegra doesn’t. Thus, in conjunction with (again) harder and more precise bearing (actually bushing) surfaces in the derailleurs, it means smoother shifts and extended life of the part. Now, new out of the box, they both feel pretty damn close. But give each say...500 miles w/ the same use and care, and you’ll be able to tell the difference. You WILL replace Ultegra parts more frequently than DA as you WILL replace XT parts more frequently than XTR.
Next, materials and the treatment of them is worth noting. If I recall, the old XT stuff used to be melt forge and the XTR stuff was cold forged. Both were good, but there are aspects related to the Al molecule density when the stuff is cold forged vs melt forged. And one definitely costs more than the other to tool and produce. And if there’s no difference in strength what would Shimano be thinking in this exercise of differing tooling and expense? With that said, I’m not 100% that this difference applies in the road stuff, nor do I have testing data comparing the two models within the Shimano line. But I do know this was the difference between XT and XTR back in the day of the square tapers which translated in the road world is equivalent to Ultegra vs. DA. BTW I tried to find weights of the Ultegra parts and can't.
Next, if you look at the equivalent parts between Ultegra and DA, you can actually see that more time and care was put into the DA parts in it’s finish. How does this translate into performance? It doesn’t to any significant degree. However, this is the Pimp factor.
Weight. The cumulative weight of DA parts IS lighter than the Ultegra parts (again, I couldn't find exactly weights of Ultegra parts). Example of this can be seen in complete bike form. This may not be much but in the world of gram counting… If you need an example of individual parts, look at the DA adjustable BB (173gm) vs the totally sealed Ultegra unit (227gm). Swinging the other way, the DA crankset does weigh more than the Ultegra by 10 grams. But justification for this I think was covered 2 paragraph up. The above 2 parts I did find weights for. Apply this to other parts such as brakes, shift levers, and derailleurs, stronger alloys needs less material which means less weight.
Lastly, from a personal experience standpoint, I’ve noticed that once you’ve “set” a DA bike, it’s there for a VERY long time, not coming out of adjustment. With Ultegra, after a while, it kinda looses its “crispness” requiring slight user adjustments such as over shifting to accomplish the shift jumps. This may be just me tho, but I’ve noticed this not only on roadies, but also on mtn bikes w/ XT vs XTR. But, I’m very picky about my shifts, a lot more so than most ppl. I believe this is the end result of the faster wearing materials in the Ultegra/XT vs the better materials in the DA/XTR. I don’t know if anyone here has had similar experiences but a few of my riding buddies have also commented on this. So if someone takes my comments to heart and drops hundreds more on a DA bike vs Ultegra, they can expect their components to last longer than the Ultegra they would have spent less on. BUT, I do have to give you that a lot of ppl are OK w/ slightly sloppy shifting and will make a slightly worn out setup last by compensating vs dropping those extra hundreds.

Now this is comparing Shimano to Shimano. I will make another claim that Campy Record will out last DA parts. It is more precise, lasts longer and runs smoother than DA. I know this not because I run Campy, but because I see more 15 year old Campy bike out there and not nearly as many 15 year old DA bike. It may not necessarily be lighter than DA (too lazy to look up weights on Campy Record parts at this point), but then again, it’s got DA beat by a mile in Pimp factor. Plus, you can rebuild Campy parts which does make it more Pimp as well as lasting longer. I just can’t afford the damn prices it commands or else I’d be running Record instead of DA

BTW, not to sound like a "P" as you so put it, does this sufficiently support my rebuff of your comment Jeff151? You may be the quintessential cyclist who can put out the pedal strokes smoother than God himself thereby not wearing out anything. But for us mortals, racers or non alike, wear will happen, especially when 40% of my miles are on dirt roads. I want stuff that wears slower so I don't have to fuss with it for a loooong time. So, if I'm an elitest prick for telling ppl DA is significantly better than Ultegra based on those criteria, then let me fly that flag high and proud.

Finally, last time I checked free speach was alive and well. With that in mind, who the hell are you to ask me to delete my post? This thread was asking for opinions, and I expressed mine. If you're not happy with it, you have every right to not read it and leave. If someone feels like they need more info from my posts after reading it, assuming they're adults, THEY can post those questions on thier own. Notice I didn't comment on YOUR idea of the "ultimate" bike even tho I think what you posted is a load of crap.

 

[DRB]

So please respond to me, or delete your post and I will do likewise. Or I shall taunt you a second time.

Aren't you scary?

 

[Raaar]

Personally, I think there are two kinds of riders: The first group are those riders that have reached such a pinnacle of fitness and skill that gram-counting and top-of-the-line bikes & parts are there only avenue of tweaking performance, and then there is the rest of us, the second group, and the vast majority of riders. We are semi-in shape, are carrying varying degrees of flab, and think we are faster than we really are. Ironically, it is usually the later that spends the most on bikes. But, the truth is, while high-end parts & bikes are oh-so sweet, most of us don't need them and only want them for bragging rights and to try to tweak our un-tweaked skills and bodies in some way less painful than giving up that evening beer or actually training.

So, I say ride the hell out of your $400 bike and get in shape. Show up at group rides and put the spanking on some folks. When you get to the point of breaking parts and being limited by your equipment, step it up to $1200-2k bike. A great rider will hurt you even if he is on a Huffy...