Quantcast

Gun Control

Discussion in 'Politics & World News' started by Beef Supreme, Dec 14, 2012.

  1. AngryMetalsmith

    AngryMetalsmith Business is good, thanks for asking

    Rep/Likes:
    283 / 1,507
    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2006
    Messages:
    12,869
    Location:
    I have no idea where I am
    Who the fuck really cares anymore ? Why even bother reporting another mass shooting ?

    At the current rate it is inevitable that I or someone close to me, or anyone on this forum for that matter, is involved in a shooting. And there is not a goddamn thing I can do about it. Oh, but you say, "you can vote". Problem is the NRA owns all of the GOP, a few of the Dems and therefore controls gun laws making your elected representatives useless on gun control. And make no mistake mass shootings are exactly what the NRA wants because it's good for business.

    So then, why even bother reading about another mass shooting ? And I certainly hate to agree with Potato Derp Face Huckabee-Sanders, but this isn't the time to talk about it. Why ? Because no one fucking cares !
     
    #3761 -   Nov 14, 2017
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2017

    Please register to disable this ad.

  2. Westy

    Westy the teste

    Rep/Likes:
    387 / 2,259
    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2002
    Messages:
    33,699
    Location:
    Sleazattle
  3. DaveW

    DaveW Space Monkey

    Rep/Likes:
    84 / 291
    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2001
    Messages:
    7,987
    Location:
    Karori, Poneke Te Ika-a-Maui
    Needs a twitter bumpstock to keep up with them.
     
    • Horns Horns x 1
  4. JohnE

    JohnE filthy rascist

    Rep/Likes:
    133 / 565
    Joined:
    May 13, 2005
    Messages:
    12,245
    Location:
    Front Range, dude...
  5. stevew

    stevew unique white person

    Rep/Likes:
    219 / 1,893
    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2001
    Messages:
    29,613
     
    • Like Like x 1
  6. Westy

    Westy the teste

    Rep/Likes:
    387 / 2,259
    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2002
    Messages:
    33,699
    Location:
    Sleazattle

    The Village People really didn't finish their look until the Indian joined.
     
  7. JohnE

    JohnE filthy rascist

    Rep/Likes:
    133 / 565
    Joined:
    May 13, 2005
    Messages:
    12,245
    Location:
    Front Range, dude...
    So much repressed ghey in that pic...
     
  8. Pesqueeb

    Pesqueeb bicycle in airplane hangar

    Rep/Likes:
    343 / 2,147
    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2007
    Messages:
    22,698
    Location:
    Riding the baggage carousel.
    Jesus. Shorts and lace up ropers? When the fuck has that ever been okay? :fie:
     
  9. pnj

    pnj Turbo Monkey till the fat lady sings

    Rep/Likes:
    4 / 14
    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2002
    Messages:
    4,602
    Location:
    seattle
  10. kidwoo

    kidwoo Celebrating No-Pants Day

    Rep/Likes:
    134 / 1,232
    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2003
    Messages:
    20,909
    Location:
    In my pants
    That's the problem with the argument that the real reason behind America's shooting problem is the mental health aspect, and only the mental health aspect. Of course it's part of it, but it's not a useful or realistic deflection. While that guy should (and did) have his firearm confiscated, you can't adopt a wholehearted reliance on arresting people for what amounts to thought crimes. You ever read tale of two cities?

    On a side note. We've got some people old enough to remember here..... How may mass shootings have involved one of the exact weapons that were barred from sale in the assault weapons ban? And how many mass shootings were occurring previous to? I'm well aware that functionally speaking there are other semi auto .22 variants but doesn't it sure seem like every single one of these fucks has an AR-15? There's a pretty strong case there for causation. No one can argue with a straight face that the expiration of the ban hasn't led to an absurd amount of those things in circulation. All the gunsplainers can rant and rave about congress only trying to ban 'scary looking' guns, but let's be honest. It's pretty obvious that's what these mouth breathing dipshits shooting up the place are drawn to.
     
    #3770 -   Nov 17, 2017
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2017
    • Like Like x 2
  11. AngryMetalsmith

    AngryMetalsmith Business is good, thanks for asking

    Rep/Likes:
    283 / 1,507
    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2006
    Messages:
    12,869
    Location:
    I have no idea where I am
    The Brady Act, after the Reagan assassination attempt, was the ban on assault rifles. It was allowed to expire under the Shrub Administration. And I do not recall hearing a whole lot about mass shootings until the ban was lifted. So yeah, common sense gun laws, even ones initiated by Republicans, clearly don't work, nope.
     
  12. dan-o

    dan-o Turbo Monkey

    Rep/Likes:
    120 / 625
    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2004
    Messages:
    4,333
    The ban was lifted due to it not having much effect on gun violence. Assault weapons were rarely used before the ban. Recent history excepted, they aren't use in the majority of shootings now either.

    Of course, that doesn't mean our current violence isn't a result of the ban ending. Or that it is.
     
  13. AngryMetalsmith

    AngryMetalsmith Business is good, thanks for asking

    Rep/Likes:
    283 / 1,507
    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2006
    Messages:
    12,869
    Location:
    I have no idea where I am
    From yer link:

     
  14. kidwoo

    kidwoo Celebrating No-Pants Day

    Rep/Likes:
    134 / 1,232
    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2003
    Messages:
    20,909
    Location:
    In my pants
    Just reference your own memory. How many mass shootings and how many times were AR-15s in the news before it expired? Shit's gone up yo. Back in the 90s a fella had a pack a truck full of horse shit and bleach.
     
    #3774 -   Nov 17, 2017
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2017
  15. dan-o

    dan-o Turbo Monkey

    Rep/Likes:
    120 / 625
    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2004
    Messages:
    4,333
    There's no question that the lack of an AWB contributed to the shit ton of these rifles in our country.
     
  16. Jm_

    Jm_ Turbo Monkey

    Rep/Likes:
    113 / 636
    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2002
    Messages:
    6,823
    Location:
    AK
    IMO, that's a large part of the problem, if not the actual problem, we've flooded ourselves in guns, I can go to walmart and walk out with an AR-15 in a few minutes and tons of ammo, people buy and hord them, they give them to family members, they are so numerous that even a small percentage "falling through the cracks", means thousands, if not millions, of weapons, in the hands of bad people, not to mention the totally legit-at-the-time-of-sale people that later snap. Then of course we glorify guns and give kids toy-guns to practice killing humans with, video games, glorify it in movies, make people believe that they can be John McClain in Die-Hard and be a hero, all contributing to the need to own more guns. The cat is out of the bag in many ways, we've gone so far down the path of stupid that it's hard to take that back. This all feeds back into the loop of accessibility and making it easy to kill a bunch of people real fast from a distance without getting your hands dirty. I like shooting guns, I seeing gun safety and responsible owners, but so many bat-shit-crazy far right idiots have made these mass murders pretty much guaranteed.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  17. dan-o

    dan-o Turbo Monkey

    Rep/Likes:
    120 / 625
    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2004
    Messages:
    4,333
    I agree.
    Beyond just 'more guns' though, something has changed to make this recent style of shooting increase in frequency.

    Whether it's 'mental illness', extreme entitlement or trump effect I don't know.
     
  18. AngryMetalsmith

    AngryMetalsmith Business is good, thanks for asking

    Rep/Likes:
    283 / 1,507
    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2006
    Messages:
    12,869
    Location:
    I have no idea where I am
    It's a whole host of things that contribute to the complex reasons why there is a dramatic increase in mass shootings, but it boils down to two basic elements, this country's unhealthy obsession with guns and the ridiculous availability of military grade weapons.

    Add to the mix an ever increasing population, politicians and media giants who are Hell bent on utilizing divisive tactics to push their own agendas, the massive marketing and lobbying machine of the NRA, and last but not least cultural impact. Like @Jm_ said, we live in a culture that promotes gun violence.

    And the most frightening aspect of it all is that mass shootings are now trendy. The media bombards us with stories of one shooting after the other, wether it's a local drive by or 500 get blasted at a concert. It's the copy cat scenario played out repeatedly. Not only do other psychos want in on the action, but closet ones stock up on whatever the weapon used in the mass shooting dujour. Which in itself is unspeakably disturbing.
     
  19. JohnE

    JohnE filthy rascist

    Rep/Likes:
    133 / 565
    Joined:
    May 13, 2005
    Messages:
    12,245
    Location:
    Front Range, dude...
    ...and somewhere in 'murikkka™ right now some twisted fuck is planning to stand up for his rights by slaughtering a bunch of fellow humans in cold blood, that he may or may not know, just because he (Or she, but probably a he. A white male he.) can.
     
  20. kidwoo

    kidwoo Celebrating No-Pants Day

    Rep/Likes:
    134 / 1,232
    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2003
    Messages:
    20,909
    Location:
    In my pants
    Keeping the pride alive in my home town.

    You think he'd be posing if it were a baseball bat or a knife? I've been told they're equivalents.



    Aside from the rifle...........dem guns :rofl:
     
  21. mykel

    mykel Monkey

    Rep/Likes:
    52 / 263
    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2013
    Messages:
    953
    Location:
    sw ontario canada
    Dumbass Nazi Douchebag - He's using the wrong instrument to shoot himself. :disgust1:
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  22. rockofullr

    rockofullr confused

    Rep/Likes:
    67 / 284
    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2009
    Messages:
    5,743
    Location:
    East Bay, Cali
    For the record, you motherfuckers have no idea what you are talking about.

    The "Brady Handgun Voilence Prevention Act" was mostly about background checks and had nothing to do with "assault weapons"

    The "Federal Assault Weapons Ban" (AWB) did ban "assault weapons" which were defined as:

    Which means the gun pictured below was legal as long as you unscrewed the flash suppressor and screwed on a compensator.



    Just thinking we should actually know what we are bitching about.
     
    • Useful Useful x 2
  23. AngryMetalsmith

    AngryMetalsmith Business is good, thanks for asking

    Rep/Likes:
    283 / 1,507
    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2006
    Messages:
    12,869
    Location:
    I have no idea where I am
    Meh, my memory isn't the best, but I did actually did see the live coverage of the Reagan assassination attempt and the aftermath of Brady getting shot in the head. Wasn't going by Wikipedia...Were you even born yet ?

    comp-pew.png
     
  24. kidwoo

    kidwoo Celebrating No-Pants Day

    Rep/Likes:
    134 / 1,232
    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2003
    Messages:
    20,909
    Location:
    In my pants

    Dan-o said the AWB. That doesn't include the word 'brady' :rofl:
     
  25. dan-o

    dan-o Turbo Monkey

    Rep/Likes:
    120 / 625
    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2004
    Messages:
    4,333
    I was referring to the Fed AWB.
     
  26. kidwoo

    kidwoo Celebrating No-Pants Day

    Rep/Likes:
    134 / 1,232
    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2003
    Messages:
    20,909
    Location:
    In my pants
    Nice avatar :rolleyes:
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  27. rockofullr

    rockofullr confused

    Rep/Likes:
    67 / 284
    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2009
    Messages:
    5,743
    Location:
    East Bay, Cali
    Yeah I know, but he seemed to think that there would be less AR-15s if the AWB were still in place. Which isn't true.

    All you had to do to make a basic AR-15 compliant with the AWB was remove the flash suppressor.

    Not following what you're indicating in that picture.....

    And no I wasn't born yet.
     
  28. dan-o

    dan-o Turbo Monkey

    Rep/Likes:
    120 / 625
    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2004
    Messages:
    4,333
    You don't think there would be less 'assault rifles' in circulation if the AWB had remained in effect? Have there been no sales since 2004?
     
  29. rockofullr

    rockofullr confused

    Rep/Likes:
    67 / 284
    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2009
    Messages:
    5,743
    Location:
    East Bay, Cali
    I dunno man. Depends on what you consider an "assault rifle". If you mean an AR-15 then no, they were never actually banned. A few easily removable features were banned.
     
  30. kidwoo

    kidwoo Celebrating No-Pants Day

    Rep/Likes:
    134 / 1,232
    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2003
    Messages:
    20,909
    Location:
    In my pants
    But doooood

    Those fucking things are literally EVERYWHERE now.

    I just realized I was typing with the barrel of one and I never even bought one!
     
    #3790 -   Nov 20, 2017
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2017
  31. rockofullr

    rockofullr confused

    Rep/Likes:
    67 / 284
    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2009
    Messages:
    5,743
    Location:
    East Bay, Cali
    No argument there. I'm just pointing out that the AWB would have in no way prevented any of the recent mass shootings unless you think a telescoping stock was the main problem.

    Also even once you ban all the stuff you don't like (such as then new laws in CA) you will still be able to buy an AR-15, just one that looks weird and sucks a bit. At the end of the day it's just a semi-auto rifle and we're never gonna ban all semi-auto rifles.



    Or you could lock the magazine and have to load it like a weirdo.



    But the real kicker is that you can still legally buy most of the shit that is banned. It's just parts until you put it on a rifle. So if you wanna kill a bunch of people you just buy the parts online and assemble it.
     
  32. kidwoo

    kidwoo Celebrating No-Pants Day

    Rep/Likes:
    134 / 1,232
    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2003
    Messages:
    20,909
    Location:
    In my pants
    I'm not asking for specifics of the law, I'm asking you to use your own memory. Are you old enough to remember (serious question)? There's a saturation now that didn't used to exist.

    You've seen the news about chucky manson dying today? You know how many people he killed? It's kind of laughable by today's standards. It didn't used to be like this, and the fact that he's so well known is proof of it. And it sure seems like 99% of these shooting sprees involve AR-15s. Specifically banned or not, it sure seems at least part of some flood gates opening.
     
  33. rockofullr

    rockofullr confused

    Rep/Likes:
    67 / 284
    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2009
    Messages:
    5,743
    Location:
    East Bay, Cali
    I wasn't around in the old times so I can't personally remember how many AR's there were back then compared to today. But I'd say the proliferation of ARs is more of a cultural thing than related to the AWB lapsing.

    I know lots of people who own ARs and their purchasing decision had nothing to do with "the AWB doesn't exist anymore gonna go buy something I could already buy" and a lot to do with "Check this out! This is fucking AWESOME!!! PEWPEWPEW". Add to that the fact that the AR is one of the most affordable and versatile rifles ever produced and I totally see why there are tons of them. Like Glock handguns, why are their so many? Because they're affordable and functional and they have developed a cultural "cool" factor.

    As an interesting side note, I do know quite a few people who bought ARs last year because of the new laws in CA restricting "assault weapons". If you bought them before Jan 1 2017 some features could be "grandfathered" in.
     
  34. kidwoo

    kidwoo Celebrating No-Pants Day

    Rep/Likes:
    134 / 1,232
    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2003
    Messages:
    20,909
    Location:
    In my pants
    Right.....they're everywhere now. Because manufacture of them shot up like a motherfucker after the ban expired. It really did. AK-47s were the collector's item before the expiration and you can still find blog posts, articles, and forum topics from that period with people asking about which they should buy because the market was getting flooded with ARs. Whether someone is thinking about this when they buy one is irrelevant. They're very very available now. And most of the builds have a few things that were covered in the ban.
     
  35. kidwoo

    kidwoo Celebrating No-Pants Day

    Rep/Likes:
    134 / 1,232
    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2003
    Messages:
    20,909
    Location:
    In my pants
    Also laughable in today's context

    "A 2004 critical review of firearms research by a National Research Council committee said that an academic study of the assault weapon ban "did not reveal any clear impacts on gun violence outcomes". The committee noted that the study's authors said the guns were used criminally with relative rarity before the ban and that its maximum potential effect on gun violence outcomes would be very small.[28]"

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Assault_Weapons_Ban

    Relative rarity. Hmmm

    Never before has something been so in need of the following phrase:

    Try it nao



    Plus this. Although I hate that there's no span reaching back before the period of interest.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feder...le:Mass_Shooting_Deaths_by_Year_1994-2017.jpg
     
    #3795 -   Nov 20, 2017
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2017
  36. rockofullr

    rockofullr confused

    Rep/Likes:
    67 / 284
    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2009
    Messages:
    5,743
    Location:
    East Bay, Cali
    Did it? Really?

    Let's look at the numbers. All graphs are from http://knowledgeglue.com/just-how-many-ar15s-are-out-there/ it was the best result that came up with some googling. Doesn't seem like a pro or anti gun website.



    I don't see a big jump in '04. I see a huge jump in 2010, 11, 12 though.

    So what happened in 2010? I don't know since I'm too young, but I hear a lot of conservative gun type people were feeling particularly distrustful of the government, particularly fearful for their personal safety, and afraid the government was going to take their guns.

    I couldn't find the numbers but I bet the Fox News viewership numbers look similar

    I think we should ban Fox News :banned:

    PS. AKs are probably still more of a collectors item them ARs.
     
    • Useful Useful x 1
  37. Jm_

    Jm_ Turbo Monkey

    Rep/Likes:
    113 / 636
    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2002
    Messages:
    6,823
    Location:
    AK
    A black guy was president.
     
    • Winner Winner x 2
    • Useful Useful x 1
  38. Pesqueeb

    Pesqueeb bicycle in airplane hangar

    Rep/Likes:
    343 / 2,147
    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2007
    Messages:
    22,698
    Location:
    Riding the baggage carousel.
    Anecdotally, this exact discussion was going on at work yesterday. Big rush among some of fellas to get a bunch of parts and lowers together before "some nut job gets them all banned". It was also noted how cheap AR's are now compared to just a couple years ago. As noted earlier, the market is saturated with the things.
     
  39. jimmydean

    jimmydean The Official Meat of Ridemonkey

    Rep/Likes:
    162 / 1,169
    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2001
    Messages:
    27,887
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    Trickle down economics...

    This allows for a wealth of cheap AR's so lower middle class 'Mericans can buy them with the big ass tax cuts they be gettin'.
     
  40. kidwoo

    kidwoo Celebrating No-Pants Day

    Rep/Likes:
    134 / 1,232
    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2003
    Messages:
    20,909
    Location:
    In my pants

    Look reeaalll close at that trendline right at 2004.