I know this thread needs to die, but I have to add one thing. This person sent you a PM, that means "Private Message", to simply give you some information that you might not be aware of. He didn't call you out publicly on the forum. Maybe you should thank him instead for letting you know. He might have just been acting in everyone's best interest.mountainbiker said:
I AM A "POACHER"
- Thread starter mountainbiker
- Start date
I like poached eggs..... :evil:
Wow time machines are cool
Mountainbiker is right. He never said he was going to ride the FR stuff at CP. He merely posted a simple invite to ride. To recieve a message like that (PM or otherwise) is a mistake on the sender's part. To assume makes an ass of U and me.
As far as building; get involved with the trail. Go to the maintainance days. Get to know the trial director. Put in good honest work and learn the right way to build stuff. Ask if you can put in small 'stunts' off-line or on the side of the trail. Go to the local sorba meetings. I do this at my local trail, Blankets Creek.
For some reason this year, there have been a lot of people 'cutting' the trail. Going around roots, rocks, and trees. I have been out there working the trail during the week on my rides moving logs and rocks covering up these short cuts. If i can, I arrange things so there is an alternate line (ie a jump or more difficult line). From my experience, most of these riders making/causing the cuts are xc riders. Nothing against them; we get alot of them that train out there, but it really irratates me that the riders that need these skills are the ones going around obstacles/features. It is mountain biking after all.
I have said this before and I will say it again.
If you want a smooth, flat, paved trail...ride the Silver Comet. Don't come here. If you can't ride this trail as it is built, stay on the begginer trail. Work on your skills. If you come to an obstacle and can't ride it, dismount and walk over it, do not go around it.
A few months ago, we had some very deep mudholes appear on one of our loops. I took the initiative to repair them. I 'commandeered' a tool from our Dingo trailer and just went to work. One corner had the problem dissapear completly, the other still needs some work. The one that I'm stiil working on, I decided to put in a small rock garden. I put it in the apex where no one goes through (I repaired the outside line first).
While I was working, I discovered something that really kind of bothered me. When riders would come up, most would'nt say anything to let me know they were coming. So I deciced to try a little experiment. When I am riding and someone is on the side of the trail and they don't see me coming, I usually yell out 'RIDER'. The lack of anyone saying anything got to me after a bit. I had a pretty good position and could see people coming. When some one did, I just kept my head down and kept digging. About 30 people went past. ONE person, just ONE said 'rider'. A few people even buzzed me. That pissed me off. When I first started working this corner, I blocked the trail so you would have to get off and walk around. One rider went around the blockage. I asked him three times to get off his bike and walk around. He did not. If you can't respect someone that is out there giving up their ride time to maintain the trail, you need to be a little less selfish. One guy even had the audacity to tell me that he saw a (my) bike laying on the side of the trail and had taken some parts off it and was going to sell them in the parking lot. He was an xc racer on a Moots sponsored by a shop in N.GA.
Nice, huh?
I know I got a little off topic but I'm sure you get my point.
As far as building; get involved with the trail. Go to the maintainance days. Get to know the trial director. Put in good honest work and learn the right way to build stuff. Ask if you can put in small 'stunts' off-line or on the side of the trail. Go to the local sorba meetings. I do this at my local trail, Blankets Creek.
For some reason this year, there have been a lot of people 'cutting' the trail. Going around roots, rocks, and trees. I have been out there working the trail during the week on my rides moving logs and rocks covering up these short cuts. If i can, I arrange things so there is an alternate line (ie a jump or more difficult line). From my experience, most of these riders making/causing the cuts are xc riders. Nothing against them; we get alot of them that train out there, but it really irratates me that the riders that need these skills are the ones going around obstacles/features. It is mountain biking after all.
I have said this before and I will say it again.
If you want a smooth, flat, paved trail...ride the Silver Comet. Don't come here. If you can't ride this trail as it is built, stay on the begginer trail. Work on your skills. If you come to an obstacle and can't ride it, dismount and walk over it, do not go around it.
A few months ago, we had some very deep mudholes appear on one of our loops. I took the initiative to repair them. I 'commandeered' a tool from our Dingo trailer and just went to work. One corner had the problem dissapear completly, the other still needs some work. The one that I'm stiil working on, I decided to put in a small rock garden. I put it in the apex where no one goes through (I repaired the outside line first).
While I was working, I discovered something that really kind of bothered me. When riders would come up, most would'nt say anything to let me know they were coming. So I deciced to try a little experiment. When I am riding and someone is on the side of the trail and they don't see me coming, I usually yell out 'RIDER'. The lack of anyone saying anything got to me after a bit. I had a pretty good position and could see people coming. When some one did, I just kept my head down and kept digging. About 30 people went past. ONE person, just ONE said 'rider'. A few people even buzzed me. That pissed me off. When I first started working this corner, I blocked the trail so you would have to get off and walk around. One rider went around the blockage. I asked him three times to get off his bike and walk around. He did not. If you can't respect someone that is out there giving up their ride time to maintain the trail, you need to be a little less selfish. One guy even had the audacity to tell me that he saw a (my) bike laying on the side of the trail and had taken some parts off it and was going to sell them in the parking lot. He was an xc racer on a Moots sponsored by a shop in N.GA.
Nice, huh?
I know I got a little off topic but I'm sure you get my point.
wowjet said:
'u know ur a dick when....'
Too many posts here to read...
I'll just say this, I poach the hell out of trails. I've poached most of the Benton Mc. trail and quite a bit of the A/T. Secret trails? Oh hell yes...when ever I can scratch one out. Hiking trails are the best, super tight switch backs, stair steps, logs....all the good stuff that fawkin cross-country, roadie geeks drag out of the trail.
The thing is, I'm also a hiker & a backpacker & realize the damage that I might cause. So, I'm discreet. I never go on weekends, I try to leave no trace (no skids through the corners), and I keep my mouth shut about it. Personally, I have spoke to a a few Forest Service guys and most of them are far more concerned about ATV's & illegal poaching than my peddling arse.
The trick is to be selfish and keep your mouth shut...Don't tell your buddy, or give the kid at the bike shop the hot tip. As soon as you do a car load of ass-hats will be bombing "hiker only" trails and ruining it for everyone. Riding alone sucks, but riding on the road sucks even worse.
I'll just say this, I poach the hell out of trails. I've poached most of the Benton Mc. trail and quite a bit of the A/T. Secret trails? Oh hell yes...when ever I can scratch one out. Hiking trails are the best, super tight switch backs, stair steps, logs....all the good stuff that fawkin cross-country, roadie geeks drag out of the trail.
The thing is, I'm also a hiker & a backpacker & realize the damage that I might cause. So, I'm discreet. I never go on weekends, I try to leave no trace (no skids through the corners), and I keep my mouth shut about it. Personally, I have spoke to a a few Forest Service guys and most of them are far more concerned about ATV's & illegal poaching than my peddling arse.
The trick is to be selfish and keep your mouth shut...Don't tell your buddy, or give the kid at the bike shop the hot tip. As soon as you do a car load of ass-hats will be bombing "hiker only" trails and ruining it for everyone. Riding alone sucks, but riding on the road sucks even worse.
hehehe, your doing a great job there aceRaaar said:
no doubt 
Raaar...your a dip****. That's one of the most brainless posts I've ever read...and I think we are all dumber for it.
What does it matter if I spout off here? None of you guys know me nor are you likely to. The trails I ride are in an area I grew up in and know very, very well. Almost all of the traffic on out trails comes on the weekends & even then it is very light in some areas.
You guys talk about Poaching trails & the troubles you are experiencing at places like Pisgah or Yellow River. Lucky for me, I ride in areas that are not popular and seldom used. You have problems because of the over-use & limited resources. That is not the case in my area. Many of the trails around here are little more than game trails and would become as much if the few bikers around didn't make the occasional stealth run.
I may be a dip****, but the fact is I've probably been riding for quite a few years and got very familiar with land-use games out west. You know what we did out there? We made trail after trail after trail, and when one got shut down we made another. The truth was, poaching was an understood part of riding. What we learned after a while, though, was that a few could get away with it. It was word of mouth that killed the trails. What was a sleepy little trail soon became a rutted out downhill course. People were bombing trails, scaring hikers, and just generally pissing people off. In fact, I just talked to a buddy in San Diego that told me they had reverted back to small groups riding underground trails. They had to do it, the growing crowds were forcing officials to enforce land-use regulations. No one cares about a cactus filled pig-trail, though.
I've seen the pictures you post of your trails...Yea, they look great but discreet they aren't. As long as you insist on building slalom course for trails & run shuttles with truck-loads of people you are going to have problems. You guys can call me a dip****, but I learned a long time ago that it is easy to climb through a window than bang my head against a locked door.
You guys talk about Poaching trails & the troubles you are experiencing at places like Pisgah or Yellow River. Lucky for me, I ride in areas that are not popular and seldom used. You have problems because of the over-use & limited resources. That is not the case in my area. Many of the trails around here are little more than game trails and would become as much if the few bikers around didn't make the occasional stealth run.
I may be a dip****, but the fact is I've probably been riding for quite a few years and got very familiar with land-use games out west. You know what we did out there? We made trail after trail after trail, and when one got shut down we made another. The truth was, poaching was an understood part of riding. What we learned after a while, though, was that a few could get away with it. It was word of mouth that killed the trails. What was a sleepy little trail soon became a rutted out downhill course. People were bombing trails, scaring hikers, and just generally pissing people off. In fact, I just talked to a buddy in San Diego that told me they had reverted back to small groups riding underground trails. They had to do it, the growing crowds were forcing officials to enforce land-use regulations. No one cares about a cactus filled pig-trail, though.
I've seen the pictures you post of your trails...Yea, they look great but discreet they aren't. As long as you insist on building slalom course for trails & run shuttles with truck-loads of people you are going to have problems. You guys can call me a dip****, but I learned a long time ago that it is easy to climb through a window than bang my head against a locked door.
hmmmmmm....lets see...this thread has had 934 views...wonder how many people jsut decided to start poaching illegal trails out of those views?
No, what you are is frickin' selfish. Rather than unite with others to ensure permanent access for cyclists in forested areas by actually contributing and fighting for what you believe in, putting your back into it, you just go tresspassing and make sure that in the future, the powers that be have a really, really good example of what jerks and irresponsible hoodlums we cyclists are.
No, what you are is frickin' selfish. Rather than unite with others to ensure permanent access for cyclists in forested areas by actually contributing and fighting for what you believe in, putting your back into it, you just go tresspassing and make sure that in the future, the powers that be have a really, really good example of what jerks and irresponsible hoodlums we cyclists are.
Yup, I'm selfish. You better believe it. Every weekend a flood of bike ladden vehicles make the long drive from Atlanta up here to ride the legal trails. Those trails are over-groomed and raped of any obstacle that might force someone to actually get off their bikes or improve their skills.
Why in the world would I want to band together with a bunch of weekend tourists and draw attantion to a trail that locals already know about and ride with no problems? Sorry bro, You keep fighting for the cause and I'll keep riding my singletrack.
Why in the world would I want to band together with a bunch of weekend tourists and draw attantion to a trail that locals already know about and ride with no problems? Sorry bro, You keep fighting for the cause and I'll keep riding my singletrack.
It seems to me that we have two totally different views of how the world turns.
Butch, you unite people toward the greater good. You have busted your tail to create a scene the south never had and I applaud your tenacity in its defense.
Raar, you seem like an intelligent person. You kick it on the DL hiding in the woods stealing everyones pies that they leave out to cool.
Personally, Raar I think you are a condescending hermit who believes that the trails are there for you and you alone. And to me you represent what is wrong with the world.
So keep on rockin and if you ever want to display your enormous talent come on down to Windrock. You can ride up the trails and show me how it gets done.
Directions to windrock can be found here: www.windrock-mtb.com or you can PM me and I'll get you what you need.
Ben
Butch, you unite people toward the greater good. You have busted your tail to create a scene the south never had and I applaud your tenacity in its defense.
Raar, you seem like an intelligent person. You kick it on the DL hiding in the woods stealing everyones pies that they leave out to cool.
Personally, Raar I think you are a condescending hermit who believes that the trails are there for you and you alone. And to me you represent what is wrong with the world.
So keep on rockin and if you ever want to display your enormous talent come on down to Windrock. You can ride up the trails and show me how it gets done.
Directions to windrock can be found here: www.windrock-mtb.com or you can PM me and I'll get you what you need.
Ben
Guys, I am only reffering to one aspect of my riding on this post. I love to see people riding, and I have introduced many, many folks to the sport. The fact is, when I am on pupulated trails I'll be the first one to offer you a tube, give directions, or lend hand when repairs are needed.
On the other hand, people have different tastes when it comes to riding. You guys up at Windrock truly kick some arse and I envy your ability to go large. There are also those folks in lycra on hardtails that hammer though trails in a constant state of cemptitiveness. Me, I dunno...I sort of fell in love with ugly, tight, briar filled game trails that most people wouldn't find fit to ride.
There are also trails that I absolutely would never poach, they are just too high profile. But others simply are not used and would dissapear all together if we stuck to the rulebook. It's not that I'm stealing your pie, I'm just eating it before it goes bad.
On the other hand, people have different tastes when it comes to riding. You guys up at Windrock truly kick some arse and I envy your ability to go large. There are also those folks in lycra on hardtails that hammer though trails in a constant state of cemptitiveness. Me, I dunno...I sort of fell in love with ugly, tight, briar filled game trails that most people wouldn't find fit to ride.
There are also trails that I absolutely would never poach, they are just too high profile. But others simply are not used and would dissapear all together if we stuck to the rulebook. It's not that I'm stealing your pie, I'm just eating it before it goes bad.
Raaar said:Guys, I am only reffering to one aspect of my riding on this post. I love to see people riding, and I have introduced many, many folks to the sport. The fact is, when I am on pupulated trails I'll be the first one to offer you a tube, give directions, or lend hand when repairs are needed.
On the other hand, people have different tastes when it comes to riding. You guys up at Windrock truly kick some arse and I envy your ability to go large. There are also those folks in lycra on hardtails that hammer though trails in a constant state of cemptitiveness. Me, I dunno...I sort of fell in love with ugly, tight, briar filled game trails that most people wouldn't find fit to ride.
There are also trails that I absolutely would never poach, they are just too high profile. But others simply are not used and would dissapear all together if we stuck to the rulebook. It's not that I'm stealing your pie, I'm just eating it before it goes bad.
Just stay invisible or we won't have any pie at all.
u need to chill just a tad and this thread needs to diebizutch said:
I'll chill when I'm dead.formermtboarder said:
this thread does need to die.
bizutch said:
Fer sure!Man, what a sanctimonious bunch. I went back & read the rest of the thread and realize my post was off topic...sorry, too much caffeine that morning I guess. But, the fact is, poaching trails has been a part of mountain biking since its inception. Yes, there have been plenty of instances in which folks have excercised poor judgement and hurt "the cause", but more often than not these stealth runs have went gone unoticed and caused no harm. I'm actually surprised to hear such anal panty-wringing from a group of mountain bikers. "You stole my pie...Waaaaaa!Waaaa!Waaaaa!" , "You are the reason trails get closed...Whaaaa, Whaaa, Whaaaa!", "The sign says NO BIKERS...WHaaaaaaa".
Guys, I stick to the old WWJD rule...and I firmly believe Jesus would say "ride it!".
No hard feelings....I'm done with this thread.
Guys, I stick to the old WWJD rule...and I firmly believe Jesus would say "ride it!".
No hard feelings....I'm done with this thread.