[rockwool]

Those of you that voted for him are going to wish that you voted for Ralph Nader instead..

http://news.yahoo.com/s/politico/20081208/pl_politico/16292

Obama has reversed pledges to immediately repeal tax cuts for the wealthy and take on Big Oil. He’s hedged his call for a quick drawdown in Iraq. And he’s stocking his White House with anything but stalwarts of the left.

Now some are shedding a reluctance to puncture the liberal euphoria at being rid of President George W. Bush to say, in effect, that the new boss looks like the old boss. /..../

OpenLeft blogger Chris Bowers went so far as to issue this plaintive plea: “Isn't there ever a point when we can get an actual Democratic administration?”

Obama’s pledge to repeal the Bush tax cuts and redistribute that money to the middle class made him a hero among Democrats who said the cuts favored the wealthy. But now he’s struck a more cautious stance on rolling back tax cuts for people making over $250,000 a year, signaling he’ll merely let them expire as scheduled at the end of 2010.

Obama’s post-election rhetoric on Iraq and choices for national security team have some liberal Democrats even more perplexed. As a candidate, Obama defined and separated himself from his challengers by highlighting his opposition to the war in Iraq from the start. He promised to begin to end the war on his first day in office.

On Iraq, he says he’s just trying to make sure any U.S. pullout doesn’t ignite “any resurgence of terrorism in Iraq that could threaten our interests.”

Did we really expect anything else but a hawk comming out of the bi-party system? Me, I had some hopes, but within I had serious doubts.

 

[Samirol]

To be fair, there isn't a point to have windfall taxes on a company when oil prices plummet. Nobody cares about oil companies with cheap gas. Anyone who thought that he was going to be leftist was fooling themselves, it was a choice between center-right and far-right.

On a national scale, voting Nader, Green Party, SPUSA, are all throwaway votes. Voting Libertarian Party actually affects what the Republicans are going to do, since they aren't doing so hot.

When I heard about his changed stance on Iraq, I was definitely disappointed, since I thought that he would push for that.

 

[FlyinPolack]

Not surprised, & the best is yet to come...

Let me reiterate once again: HE WORKS FOR SPECIAL INTERESTS.

You honestly believe Anything that Any politician says? Don't. Ever.

 

[johnbryanpeters]

Oh, give it a fvcking rest.

We elected a moderate pragmatist. Let's see what happens.

 

[dante]

Those of you that voted for him are going to wish that you voted for Ralph Nader instead..

not in the slightest. I like my politicians to be moderate and be willing to change their positions as circumstances change. Not going ahead with a windfall profits tax when the WINDFALL PROFITS DISAPPEARED shows me that he makes fact-based decisions. People didn't vote him into office because they thought he was the next coming of Che Guevara. They voted for him because they were sick of the current administration and it's rule from the hard right.

 

[$tinkle]

looks like the whole lot of you obamaphiles are now claiming anything convenient to justify your vote & try to not look like you got punk'd on his absolute campaign promises now "muted by reality".

srsly, remember how he said he'd unconditionally withdraw all combat troops from iraq w/in 16 months so he could fight "the real war on terror in afghanistan"? i certainly do.

don't get me wrong: obama's making sound decisions, even if they aren't original in thought. but the nytimes & other cumdrunk media outlets are probably growing weary of daily wiping egg off their face. (NYTimes: "Campaign Promises on Ending the War in Iraq Now Muted by Reality.")

That status-of-forces agreement remains subject to change, by mutual agreement, and Army planners acknowledge privately that they are examining projections that could see the number of Americans hovering between 30,000 and 50,000--and some say as high as 70,000--for a substantial time even beyond 2011.

has iraq changed significantly since his campaign to warrant this bait & switch [i don't believe so], or is he finally making well-informed decisions, or is he just another deceptive politician (a.k.a. "a pragmatist")?


100 more years!!!
100 more years!!!
100 more years!!!

 

[rockwool]

Oh, give it a fvcking rest.

We elected a moderate pragmatist. Let's see what happens.

Right, and what you didn't elecet was somebody who just a few weeks after all his promises isn't going to stand by some of the most important of them.

But I wasn't a bashing on a US politician as such (if that's what you thought?), he doesn't differ from any other one where election promises are alowed by their system.

not in the slightest. I like my politicians to be moderate and be willing to change their positions as circumstances change. Not going ahead with a windfall profits tax when the WINDFALL PROFITS DISAPPEARED shows me that he makes fact-based decisions. People didn't vote him into office because they thought he was the next coming of Che Guevara. They voted for him because they were sick of the current administration and it's rule from the hard right.

People didn't vote for Che. People voted for change, people voted for higher taxes on the richest, people voted for an end of an illegitemate war, people voted for "change".

He doesn't look to change on the big issues from what people voted against, and in before unprecedented masses to boot.

As far as big oil, the barrel isn't any longer at $140 but for how many years haven't Mobile and the others been among the most profitable companies in the world? If they don't have, then who does, you? Those that are less economicly fortunate than you? Some are going to pay for the $700bn defence budget (is that excluding what those two wars cost you?), and for the unemployment following the recession.

"Punked" could be the right word for it.

 

[Transcend]

Maybe people should at least wait until he actually has any sort of power in January and see what happens? Just a thought.

 

[Westy]

The national landscape has changed dramatically in the past 2 months. I'd be more concerned if he didn't change any policies.

 

[Silver]

looks like the whole lot of you obamaphiles...blah blah blah

As far as I can recall, most of the people who supported Obama here did so on the premise that he was the best choice available, and not because he was going to usher in a socialist utopia. That was the charge from your retarded side of the aisle, remember?

 

[johnbryanpeters]

Maybe people should at least wait until he actually has any sort of power in January and see what happens? Just a thought.

No thought here, move along, please, sir.

 

[$tinkle]

The national landscape has changed dramatically in the past 2 months.

2 months ago, he was campaigning with 3 weeks left.
what exactly "has changed dramatically" since he was elected which could explain away his now abandoned promises (with more to come it seems)?

I'd be more concerned if he didn't change any policies.

it would certainly be the first time in presidential history if he didn't

As far as I can recall, most of the people who supported Obama here did so on the premise that he was the best choice available, and not because he was going to usher in a socialist utopia. That was the charge from you retarded side of the aisle, remember?

then how do you explain surprise, [disappointment | elation], & shock from both sides on his cabinet selections & hand-tipping that contradicts campaign promises?

again, not that i mind.

of course, i do expect this will come at a cost later in his term, like each household paying their tax liability to planned parenthood, aclu, or the tides foundation in lieu of all firstborns converting to islam

 

[Silver]

how do you explain surprise, [disappointment | elation], & shock from both sides on his cabinet selections & hand-tipping that contradicts campaign promises?

Way to move the goalposts.

When you said "You who lot of obamaphiles" I naively assumed that you mean the ones on Ridemonkey Board 67 and not the people on the hard left in the United States as a whole.

Try again, Trig...

 

[$tinkle]

Way to move the goalposts.

When you said "You who lot of obamaphiles" I naively assumed that you mean the ones on Ridemonkey Board 67 and not the people on the hard left in the United States as a whole.

Try again, Trig...

true, i never should have lumped you in w/ samirol, who has the courage of his convictions

 

[ohio]

Not surprised, & the best is yet to come...

Let me reiterate once again: HE WORKS FOR SPECIAL INTERESTS.

Please try to explain what special interests have to do with rockwool's article.

Not that I agree with either of you, but you basically just did this:

Article - The Mets new manager is pretty similar to their old one.
You - See, I told you Mets were taking bribes!

 

[ohio]

I voted for him because my impression was that he was natural leader, natural consensus builder ("organizer"), brilliant, pragmatic, open-minded, and steady (I voted on "character" if you want to call it that). Thus far he has shown to be all of those things.

Emanuel is thus far the only pick I question, but more because I don't see the pragmatism, not because I'm afraid of undue influence on policy.

 

[FlyinPolack]

Please try to explain what special interests have to do with rockwool's article.

Not that I agree with either of you, but you basically just did this:

Article - The Mets new manager is pretty similar to their old one.
You - See, I told you Mets were taking bribes!

Read the original quoted text, & try again. Every one of those decisions came from the people behind the scenes. He said what the sheeple wanted to hear & they voted him in. "spare" change, That's what were going to get.

He's just a rich, well spoken man that has proven once again that a golden tongue wins elections.

 

[manimal]

People didn't vote for Che. People voted for change, people voted for higher taxes on the richest, people voted for an end of an illegitemate war, people voted for "change".

**minor derailment**
this popped into my head when i read that. some seriously funny t-shirts here
http://www.che-mart.com/store.php

 

[Samirol]

true, i never should have lumped you in w/ samirol, who has the courage of his convictions

Hey now, the only things I expected out of the Obama administration was getting out of Iraq and some very minor health care changes.

 

[ohio]

Read the original quoted text, & try again. Every one of those decisions came from the people behind the scenes.

Explain. What were the decisions? Who behind the scenes influenced them? Why?

Also, what do you have against Obama being rich? He's self-made, and came from humble beginnings. Do you think no one should be rich? Do you hate successful people? Do you prefer people become wealthy through inheritance or marriage?

 

[dante]

Also, what do you have against Obama being rich? He's self-made, and came from humble beginnings. Do you think no one should be rich? Do you hate successful people? Do you prefer people become wealthy through inheritance or marriage?

Oh please. He was born black, and to a "soon-to-be-single" mother. If that's not the typical silver spoon in his mouth, I'm not sure what is... I'm just amazed he's not Republican.

 

[rockwool]

Please try to explain what special interests have to do with rockwool's article.

Not that I agree with either of you, but you basically just did this:

Article - The Mets new manager is pretty similar to their old one.
You - See, I told you Mets were taking bribes!

Well, the Mets new manager got the job because he said he was quitting football for hoops (and taking the whole team with him), and now some of the fans are getting upset. Wich they have a right to, I think.

This wouldn't be a problem if we could take our politicians back to the store and get our money refunded, when they proove to be 'falsely declared goods'.

 

[rockwool]

**minor derailment**
this popped into my head when i read that. some seriously funny t-shirts here
http://www.che-mart.com/store.php

Not my humor. I would print up a t-shirt with Fidel on saying "I outlived 50 of YOUR presidents, sucka".

Seriously though, Bob Marley became dangerous to the ruling class in the USA when their kids came home chanting his songs every day. That's when the then boss of the CIA sent his son with a pair of cowboy boots to him.

When he later got cancer in his big toe, they searched his stuff and when they ripped the boots apart they found a copper thread by the toe. Copper is an excelent material to contain a chemical substance.

Che is still constituting that same type of threat like Bob Marley started doing during mid-late 70's, 40 years after his death...

 

[MikeD]

Not my humor. I would print up a t-shirt with Fidel on saying "I outlived 50 of YOUR presidents, sucka".

You forgot "...much to the chagrin of most of the population, especially those who depart my socialist utopia in bathtubs in a desperate attempt to escape my awesomeness."

 

[$tinkle]

Liberals voice concerns about Obama

Liberals are growing increasingly nervous – and some just flat-out angry – that President-elect Barack Obama seems to be stiffing them on Cabinet jobs and policy choices.

Obama has reversed pledges to immediately repeal tax cuts for the wealthy and take on Big Oil. He’s hedged his call for a quick drawdown in Iraq. And he’s stocking his White House with anything but stalwarts of the left.

Now some are shedding a reluctance to puncture the liberal euphoria at being rid of President George W. Bush to say, in effect, that the new boss looks like the old boss.

“He has confirmed what our suspicions were by surrounding himself with a centrist to right cabinet. But we do hope that before it's all over we can get at least one authentic progressive appointment,” said Tim Carpenter, national director of the Progressive Democrats of America.

OpenLeft blogger Chris Bowers went so far as to issue this plaintive plea: “Isn't there ever a point when we can get an actual Democratic administration?”

Even supporters make clear they’re on the lookout for backsliding. “There’s a concern that he keep his basic promises and people are going to watch him,” said Roger Hickey, a co-founder of Campaign for America’s Future.

Obama insists he hasn’t abandoned the goals that made him feel to some like a liberal savior. But the left’s bill of particulars against Obama is long, and growing.

i can relate how this must feel when i think of the missed opportunities bush squandered by running up the debt & not reigning in illegal immigration.

are liberals justifiably disappointed in the same manner as i was [about bush], or did they fail to correctly predict who obama must be if he is to be effective?

 

[narlus]

i think they were taken in by the republican's campaign claims that Obama was the most liberal member of the US Congress.

 

[$tinkle]

could be, for i believe the same (or similar) study put mccain as the 4th most conservative, which is laughable; he gave speeches w/ "Jesus" as much as obama said "allah" in his

 

[jimmydean]

When did Obama swear in? Did I miss it?

I will give him at least a year before I bitch about anything. I know he is at least 2 years out from even starting to turn things around.

 

[dan-o]

When did Obama swear in? Did I miss it?

x2, although I laugh every time I see him speak in front of the "Office of the President Elect" podium.

 

[rockwool]

You forgot "...much to the chagrin of most of the population, especially those who depart my socialist utopia in bathtubs in a desperate attempt to escape my awesomeness."

You should talk to your congressmen about lifting all sanctions, or at least the one that makes it possible for US citizens to go there without being find a gazilion, to see with your own eyes how things are, and not listen to what the Miami-Cuban lobby wants you to think.

There's another way if you're of the curious type and don't want to get fined. You can go with the Pastors for Peace caravan. I actually think you're openminded and adventorous enough to do a thing like that.

When did Obama swear in? Did I miss it?

I will give him at least a year before I bitch about anything. I know he is at least 2 years out from even starting to turn things around.

Turning things around takes time. Taking the wrong desitions, or not doing what he promised, should be bitched at emediatelly. Only way to get things done right.

x2, although I laugh every time I see him speak in front of the "Office of the President Elect" podium.

Do you also think he speaks funny, or is it just my limited view of different US-American dialects?

 

[ohio]

are liberals justifiably disappointed...?

Not until OBAMA IS ACTUALLY PRESIDENT. I hate to point out the obvious, but he is NOT YET ACTING PRESIDENT.

If he were just like Bush, surrounding himself with people that either think exactly like he does or tell him exactly what to do, we would have cause for worry. We have no reason at this stage to think that Obama is doing anything but surrounding himself with contrary and complementary opinions or augmenting his own skillset, which is exactly what he promised.

I'm holding my breath a bit to see what he does with all of that, but until he is in a position to DO anything, it's a bit premature to be disappointed. The chicken littles are the folks on the extreme left who are no different than Bush, and would have surrounded themselves with yes-men.

 

[SDH]

Let me get this straight............Pres. canidate making a whole bunch of promises that makes people's pantie's moist, then gets elected. All of the intel doors suddenly open and all of the classified information is put forth, and the canidate figures out AHHHH, this is why things were done and policies are changed etc.

real surprise.............yawn!

I have to say one thing I loved about asking Obama supporters why they voted for him and they said "change"! Then I asked cool, what kind of change? That is when I would hear these rants of idealistic issues not steeped in political reality etc. I have to say made me chuckle a bit.

My issue with Obama as I have stated before ( and it is not his fault) is the expectations peoople have of him are WAAAY to high given current policial environments.

 

[Samirol]

Things like healthcare and getting out of Iraq are idealistic and not based in reality?

 

[Transcend]

Things like healthcare and getting out of Iraq are idealistic and not based in reality?

Well as much as we all want to believe it is, it really isn't. You cannot abandon the mess made in Iraq. It will melt down worse than it has already.

And health care, while it HAS to happen, there is no money to pay for the type of system we all want to see.

That said, I believe Obama really does want to create change and will inject a ray of hope into the US process. How far he can go we'll have to wait and see. In the meantime, I think vilifying him before he is even in office is a bit ridiculous.

 

[splat]

I think vilifying him before he is even in office is a bit ridiculous.

But that is the America way

 

[jimmydean]

Turning things around takes time. Taking the wrong desitions, or not doing what he promised, should be bitched at emediatelly. Only way to get things done right.

I bitched for 6 years and nothing changed. I gave Bush 2 years, the least I can do is offer the same bumper to a guy I actually voted for.

 

[SDH]

Well as much as we all want to believe it is, it really isn't. You cannot abandon the mess made in Iraq. It will melt down worse than it has already.

And health care, while it HAS to happen, there is no money to pay for the type of system we all want to see.

That said, I believe Obama really does want to create change and will inject a ray of hope into the US process. How far he can go we'll have to wait and see. In the meantime, I think vilifying him before he is even in office is a bit ridiculous.

Yup....what he said
Transcend stated it correctly

Iraq: for better or for worse we broke it we bought it! McCain was stupid enought to admit that..........
Healthcare: Unfortunately not gonna be solved anytime soon. At least a viable solution. There is an old saying, wanna really screw someting up? Let the US gov't run it!

It is amazing how naive and emotional the American public is.

Obama harnessed that.......
marketing 101.....know your market base and leverage it. What Obama did, leveraging the market (Americans) is genius in itself

 

[Cant Climb]

My issue with Obama as I have stated before ( and it is not his fault) is the expectations peoople have of him are WAAAY to high given current policial environments.

The problem is America's situation. We are in a horrible place. I'm just thankful someone is going to office to try and fix stuff.....untimately i think the Iceberg of problems is too big and deeper than most people realize.

I really think we have gone too far into the red to fix this economy unless there is some American lead breakthrough with alternative energy for cars....that would lessened the burden of foreign oil and save the auto industry and we would have something people would want to buy......that would take a miracle though.

 

[Transcend]

I agree. I think America chose the right person to try and solve the problems the country is currently mired in. Whether he will succeed or not remains to be seen,. He has political capital to spend, but I'm not sure even Obama has enough to dig his way out of the hole America is in. He also has 2 young children, he wants to see them inherit an environment, a country and a planet that works. I believe he does want to make a difference for America as a whole, not simply for himself or his interests.

One thing is certain however, International Relations will be much improved and the world will hate America that much less over the next 4 years. That's a major step in the right direction.

 

[SDH]

The problem is America's situation. We are in a horrible place. I'm just thankful someone is going to office to try and fix stuff.....untimately i think the Iceberg of problems is too big and deeper than most people realize.

I really think we have gone too far into the red to fix this economy unless there is some American lead breakthrough with alternative energy for cars....that would lessened the burden of foreign oil and save the auto industry and we would have something people would want to buy......that would take a miracle though.

I am with you
Wait til the next big world win............TAX increase for all!

Funny, how the average American actually thinks we are not going to pay the piper for all of these bail outs! There is no free lunch, I do not care who is the Prez.

I love how the peeps blame the gov't and the leadership for the mess, the gov't blames the predatory tactics of the banks etc. The bottom line is when it is your buck, the buck stops with YOU (the American people)! The prez did not sign that BS loan you can't afford, the congress did not run up your CC bill in 67% of American families.....we did..........and now it is time to pay. Will we learn our lesson........yup. But as with our grandparents before us they learned, but it took 2 generations to fack up again. It is cycles...........We are living ours.