[mantispf2000]

So a while back, an Oregon bakery denied a wedding cake to a lesbian couple based on the bakery owner's religious beliefs. Lots of badness ensued, and the bakery closed its doors.

Fast forward, and I read today that the couple was awarded $135k by a judge because of this.

Now, I am not anti-much, unless you come to this country and can't speak the language. (To me, nothing more frustrating than trying to find out what someone wants, etc). Yet my question is.......

What ever happened to that little sign that reads "We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone"? Has it gone the way of the dodo bird? Have we, as a society, become that sensitive that if we are denied service, instead of pulling our big-kid pants and doing business elsewhere, we decide to sue?

Maybe I'm still foggy from all the fireworks explosions last night.

Thoughts?????

 

[Pesqueeb]

Thoughts?????

"Oregon bakery denies wedding cake to black couple based on bakery owners religious beliefs."



Obligatory edit: PaWN n00b!

 

[Jm_]

I believe the issue is holding out to the public, where you can not discriminate. You can refuse service, but you'd have to refuse it, not refuse it because you didn't like that the person was gay. If 100 people tried to get a cake made and 10 were turned down for no reason at all, then that might be supported, but if you were told "no, it's cuz you are gay", then you probably have a case. If you hold out to the public, I believe there are certain expectations and protections for the public.

 

[jdcamb]

Jesus should give you a signed copy of the Constitution if you're nice to gays before you die? That would be a good incentive for Christians to be nice to gays. Never mind that whole being Christian thing that the bible goes on about....

 

[mantispf2000]

"Oregon bakery denies wedding cake to black couple based on bakery owners religious beliefs."



Obligatory edit: PaWN n00b!

Oooopppssssssie........ Granted, I did say I was still foggy from the 'works last night.

I humbly request forgiveness, and will make a better effort in the future.......

 

[AngryMetalsmith]

They should be fined $135K, for discrimination and being stupid business owners. Gay cash deposits just like straight cash.

There is a hardware store in TN that posted a sign on the front door that said "no gays allowed". The owner, a Baptist minister, claims to be standing up for Christianity. He also goes on to say he doesn't hate the person, but hates the sin.

It's just hate speech, pure and simple.

 

[blackohio]

Personally I hope more fuckwad idiots put up signs that list their preferences of customers based on their own tribal superstitious beliefs.

I like to know my money isnt going to support dildos like this.

 

[AngryMetalsmith]

Personally I hope more fuckwad idiots put up signs that list their preferences of customers based on their own tribal superstitious beliefs.

I like to know my money isnt going to support dildos like this.

My mom, a Christian, always told me growing up, that if anyone tells you they are "a good Christian" don't trust them. So whenever I hear that phrase grace the lips of some random half wit, then I know, and am happy they let me know. Really does cut to the chase.

 

[mantispf2000]

Agreed, cash is cash, it spends the same, and unless your last name is Gates or Buffet, why not make as much as you can. As for the "no service", it seems that, as long as you say "no service", and don't put a label as to why, then a business is in the clear-ish.

Another thought is......... doesn't this somehow conflict with that whole "separation of church and state" mumbo jumbo?

I'm taking my dogs for a walk...........

 

[syadasti]

Another thought is......... doesn't this somehow conflict with that whole "separation of church and state" mumbo jumbo?

Why would you hope they're protected for violating civil rights unless you're a bigot? Big kids have been following the law since 1964, childish bigots have been put in their place ever since as it should be. The law has to be used to protect the oppressed minority, that's how it always goes with the creation and application against backwards obsolete views of the majority.

It's amazing how many worthless human beings don't understand that civil rights have priority, someone's bigotry doesn't give you the right to oppress people and you're not being oppressed by not being able to oppress people.

Federally almost everything is covered but sexual orientation because the federal law is older. It's specifically covered in Oregon law.

http://www.oregon.gov/boli/CRD/pages/c_crprotoc.aspx
Discrimination in Public Accommodation
A place of public accommodation is defined in state law as any place that offers the public accommodations, advantages, facilities or privileges, whether in the nature of goods, services, lodging, amusements or otherwise. It is illegal to discriminate in places of public accommodation on the basis of race, sex (including pregnancy), sexual orientation, national origin, religion, marital status, physical or mental disability, or age (18 years of age and older).

https://www.legalzoom.com/articles/the-right-to-refuse-service-can-a-business-refuse-service-to-someone-because-of-appearance

At the heart of the debate is a system of anti-discrimination laws enacted by federal, state and local governments. The entire United States is covered by the Federal Civil Rights Act of 1964, which prohibits discrimination by privately owned places of public accommodation on the basis of race, color, religion or national origin. Places of “public accommodation” include hotels, restaurants, theaters, banks, health clubs and stores. Nonprofit organizations such as churches are generally exempt from the law.

The right of public accommodation is also guaranteed to disabled citizens under the Americans with Disabilities Act, which prohibits discrimination by private businesses based on disability.

The federal law does not prohibit discrimination based on sexual orientation, so gays are not a protected group under the federal law. However, about 20 states, including New York and California, have enacted laws that prohibit discrimination in public accommodations based on sexual orientation. In California, you also can’t discriminate based on someone’s unconventional dress. In some states, like Arizona, there’s no state law banning discrimination against gays, but there are local laws in some cities that prohibit sexual orientation discrimination.

So, no matter where you live, you cannot deny service to someone because of his or her race, color, religion, national origin or disability. In some states and cities, you also cannot discriminate against people because of their sexual orientation. If there is no state, federal or local law prohibiting discrimination in public accommodations against a particular group of people, then you can legally refuse to serve that group of people.

Unless you won't bake wedding cakes period, you're breaking the law.

The answer is that you can refuse to serve someone even if they’re in a protected group, but the refusal can’t be arbitrary and you can’t apply it to just one group of people.

To avoid being arbitrary, there must be a reason for refusing service and you must be consistent. There could be a dress code to maintain a sense of decorum, or fire code restrictions on how many people can be in your place of business at one time, or a policy related to the health and safety of your customers and employees. But you can’t just randomly refuse service to someone because you don’t like the way they look or dress.

Second, you must apply your policy to everyone. For example, you can’t turn away a black person who’s not wearing a tie and then let in a tieless white man. You also can’t have a policy that sounds like it applies to everyone but really just excludes one particular group of people. So, for example, a policy against wearing headscarves in a restaurant would probably be discriminatory against Muslims.

A couple of recent court cases illustrate the fine line between discrimination and a justifiable refusal of service. In each case, a Colorado baker was sued for violating discrimination laws.

In the first case, the baker refused service to a customer who wanted her to bake a cake with anti-gay Bible verses on it. The customer argued that he was discriminated against because of his religious beliefs. But the court ruled that this was not discrimination because the baker had a consistent policy of refusing to create cakes that used derogatory language or imagery.

In the second case, a baker refused to create a wedding cake for a same-sex couple, saying that it violated his religious beliefs. The court held the baker liable, saying that his reason was just a pretext for discriminating against gays.

Which brings us back to the original restaurant signs. “We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone” sounds vague and arbitrary. As we’ve seen, a business can’t just randomly refuse to serve someone.

 

[vinny4130]

It's all bullshit. People forget that freedom of speech is not always what people want to hear. It's two apossing belief structures colliding. Neither will ever see eye to eye with the other. Both are "right" in their own minds both are jerks about it, but now people know who to avoid or support. I'm sure they learned their lesson, the people penalized are going to be soooo much more accepting now. I would rather hear the person loud and clear so I know who gets my business, time and energy. After all it's a cake, fucking first world problems.

 

[stevew]

so if your gaydar goes off....you don't deal at the black jack table?

 

[syadasti]

If you hate fundamental American values and seek the realization of the utopian Fox and Friends Phreeduhmb loving ideals:

 

[stevew]

^
can we thank barry for the nuclear program.....just saying...

 

[syadasti]

^
can we thank barry for the nuclear program.....just saying...

Just saying, you need to move to Iran for that Fox and Friend's Utopia where propaganda sayings like that are the "truth"..

http://www.nti.org/country-profiles/iran/nuclear/

Iran's interest in nuclear technology dates to the 1950's, when the Shah of Iran began receiving assistance through the U.S. Atoms for Peace program. Although Iran signed the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons (NPT) as a non-nuclear weapon state in 1968 and ratified it in 1970, the Shah may have had nuclear weapons ambitions. However, the 1979 Iranian Revolution and subsequent Iran-Iraq war limited the nuclear program's expansion. In the 1990's Iran began pursuing an indigenous nuclear fuel cycle capability by developing a uranium mining infrastructure and experimenting with uranium conversion and enrichment.

 

[mantispf2000]

so if your gaydar goes off....you don't deal at the black jack table?

Heck no!!!! As long as they remember it's black jack and not WSOP and remember to use one hand when holding the cards, I'll deal to anyone........

 

[stevew]

Just saying, you need to move to Iran for that Fox and Friend's Utopia where propaganda sayings like that are the "truth"..

note to self.....must remember to include smilies with posts when joking with syadasti....

 

[syadasti]

Quiz time - match the bigotry to the proper time period:

http://www.slate.com/blogs/outward/2015/07/06/segregation_or_same_sex_marriage_take_our_quiz.html

On a positive note, some support both generations, even Southerners (doesn't mesh with the bigot apologist narrative, sorry Steve):

 

[jonKranked]

"Oregon bakery denies wedding cake to black couple based on bakery owners religious beliefs."

point, match, game.

 

[IH8Rice]

I believe the issue is holding out to the public, where you can not discriminate. You can refuse service, but you'd have to refuse it, not refuse it because you didn't like that the person was gay.

they were morons when they brought up that they didnt want to bake them a cake because they were gay. if they just shut their mouth and refused service just because, then they wouldnt be broke and unemployed

 

[DaveW]

Frothers that are morons?
Who'd a thunk it!

 

[blindboxx2334]

They should be fined $135K, for discrimination and being stupid business owners. Gay cash deposits just like straight cash.

good god, i could not have said this any better. so i am QFT!!

 

[jdcamb]

If their was only a way for us to profit over the issue of Gay Rights. As it stands only gays seem to benefit from being gay. Us hetero folks get the shaft, well not really. butt... I mean but... Uh nevermind... Ahhhhh!

I once incorrectly said that the Pan Flute is the gayest musical instrument. That was wrong, I am sorry for that everyone....

 

[blindboxx2334]

I tired to coax my buddy to get into a relationship with me yesterday so we could cash in.

it did not work.

 

[jonKranked]

if the couple was requesting a dong shaped wedding cake, the baker may have had some legal standing.

 

[jdcamb]

I tired to coax my buddy to get into a relationship with me yesterday so we could cash in.

it did not work.

I suspect you may have been discriminated against. You should go to the nearest Home Depot and run around the store with your wang out so they can see what they are missing out on. You may need to rape your buddy with a Axe Handle before he relents. Just so you know you're born gay. It usually takes some time in Prison to figure that out. As soon as you're released you can sometimes change back however. I was really good at spades so I didn't have to worry about that. Do not assume that just because they are released they are gay however. With lesbians you usually find out in College.

 

[blindboxx2334]

thank you for the 'pro tip'. i will keep that in mind.

 

[Beef Supreme]

This whole thing just makes me cringe. These morons are nothing more than grifters and another idiotic right wing cause celebre. For starters, their bakery is out of business. They raised over 100k before their go fund me site was taken down and they are currently soliciting money through other sites. They are pretty much the Cliven Bundys of cup cakes. Fuck them and anybody who buys the BS being spread in support of them.

 

[jimmydean]

Personally I hope more fuckwad idiots put up signs that list their preferences of customers based on their own tribal superstitious beliefs.

I like to know my money isnt going to support dildos like this.

Like a jeebus fish on your business card.

 

[stevew]

Like a jeebus fish on your business card.

what...they're just fishing for men...

 

[DaveW]

Or fishing in the shallow end of the gene pool.

 

[stevew]

^
tooling for anus.

 

[Pesqueeb]

the Cliven Bundys of cup cakes.

 

[stoney]

Like a jeebus fish on your business card.

There are a few stores locally that have the fish on their advertisements and doors. One of which is a really good gardening store. I now shop for our garden supplies at Home Depot.

 

[stevew]

dick move.

 

[Pesqueeb]

dick move.

GTFO

 

[AngryMetalsmith]

GTFO

The whole concept of separation of church and state is lost on these nut jobs.

 

[Pesqueeb]

based on the bakery owner's religious beliefs. Lots of badness ensued, and the bakery closed its doors.

Fast forward, and I read today that the couple was awarded $135k by a judge because of this.

Turns out that the money award had nothing to do with the bakery owners so called "religious beliefs", they just had to pay the asshole tax.

 

[AngryMetalsmith]

Turns out that the money award had nothing to do with the bakery owners so called "religious beliefs", they just had to pay the asshole tax.

Wow. that fills in the blanks from other stories about this that I've read. Other news sources failed to mention that the bakery posted the engaged couple's names and address which led to death threats. And the fact that the bakery pulled some Kardashian like media whoring to push the "Christian Persecution" agenda.

Fuck those bakery bigots !

 

[jstuhlman]

there's a frozen yogurt place here called "sweet frog"-when I learned that "frog" stood for "fully reliant on god" i refused to keep taking the kids.