[Mr. Hankey]

I weighed my bike at the LBS the other day, and was disappointed with the results. It weighed 19.9lbs with 2 cages, and pedals. Basically it was race weight minus bottles. I was thinking I could make some improvements upon that and figured out a way to get the bike down to 15.7lbs with replacing allot of parts. First standouts were the wheels, and crankset. My wheels are 2025g a set. So a 1300g gram set would be my biggest win. Then the crankset. It is an old 2001 Ultegra Triple going to a modern crankset and BB would be from 1007total on mine to 660 for a FSA K Force Light. That would be the other big gain, then it was just 100 grams here 200 there, and what not. Those of you who did the math know I am talking 1062g or 2.35lbs just from crankset, and wheels so those might definitly be worth it. I think I would keep the old wheels, and use them to train on, and only use the new wheels for races.

I have been wanting a Cervelo Soloist Carbon for sometime, and was thinking of just buying one of those, but then I realized my current frame has 200g on the Cervelo. Basically with just wheels, and a crank I would be a pound off of the Cervelo's weight. Then I will drop another 200g when I upgrade to SRAM Force. Getting me even closer.

I am just trying to figure out what plan of attack on lightening my bike I should go about? Or will it even be worth it? I would like to think the mods I picked would be the most worthy. Rotating mass, and modern 10 speed shifting, not to mention I hate the way the Shimano Cables stick out the side. I could do all that for under 1500. Would these upgrades even be worth it or am I wasting my time, and money? Also what are your guys bikes weighing in at? Wondering how far off I am.

 

[Westy]

Are you racing? I'm a bit of a weight weenie when it comes to my MTB but I don't get it on a road bike. I'm constantly accelerating on the MTB, bunny hopping, generally man handling it in every direction. Weight makes a big difference to me offroad. But the road bike accelerates once a ride, weight affects climbing but wind resistance is so much more important. My new road bike weighs 19lbs, 3 lbs less than my old one and I don't notice any difference.

 

[Mr. Hankey]

Do you do any climbing on your roadie? My old one was 25lbs, and the 5lb drop was worth it to me. On the hills it was a noticeable difference. Sure on flat the weight is a non issue, and the aero advantage of the Soloist would be more important. I am basically wanting to aid in my climbing ability. I am obviously going to train harder, which is already in the works, but I want all the advantage I can get.

 

[Wumpus]

But the road bike accelerates once a ride, weight affects climbing but wind resistance is so much more important.

I'm no engineer, but when you are climbing isn't ever pedal stroke an acceleration?

I would go with lighter wheels and ditch the three rings(for racing purposes). I don't know that I would believe manufacturers posted weights, though.


Wheels -- just because a 'wheel' is lighter doesn't mean it is the best choice. Some of the reduced spokers have heavier rims to make up for the reduced spoke count.

 

[Westy]

I regularly do rides that include over 10,000 ft of climbing. Once I was on a sub 20 lb bike I was happy. I've ridden other peoples 15 lb super light rigs and they didn't feel that much lighter, certainly not as much as going from a 22 to a 19 lb bike. I always felt like I was going to break them. I think there is apoint of diminishing returns.

 

[Mr. Hankey]

I'm no engineer, but when you are climbing isn't ever pedal stroke an acceleration?

I would go with lighter wheels and ditch the three rings(for racing purposes). I don't know that I would believe manufacturers posted weights, though.


Wheels -- just because a 'wheel' is lighter doesn't mean it is the best choice. Some of the reduced spokers have heavier rims to make up for the reduced spoke count.

I already ditched the 3rd ring, could be part of my climbing problem only having a 42t small ring. The wheels I have are Rolf Vector Comps, they have 18sp front 24sp rear, at 2025g the weight must be somewhere? They are incredibly strong though, which is why I will still use them for training.

Oh and to Westy, yes I do race.

 

[Mr. Hankey]

I regularly do rides that include over 10,000 ft of climbing. Once I was on a sub 20 lb bike I was happy. I've ridden other peoples 15 lb super light rigs and they didn't feel that much lighter, certainly not as much as going from a 22 to a 19 lb bike. I always felt like I was going to break them. I think there is apoint of diminishing returns.

Damn thats allot of climbing. BTW Cervelo built a R3SL down to 10.34lbs, and have yet to break it. So I doubt you'll break a 15lb. bike, but I have no idea how much you weigh. I weigh 154lbs. so I know I won't break a 15lb. bike. I did notice my 345g bars are way stiffer than the 225g ones I removed. That is weight I can appreciate. Although a stiffer lighter set is on the to do list.

 

[Westy]

I'm no engineer, but when you are climbing isn't ever pedal stroke an acceleration?

If you have a crappy pedal stroke, yes. But those short spurts of acceleration don't make you go up the hill any faster. A heavier bike will not accelerate as fast but they will also decelerate slower. Of course a heavier bike does require more energy to get up a hill.

Riding a bike up a 1000 meter hill in 30 minutes would only require about 2 additional watts compared to a bike that weighed 1 kg less. It certainly makes a difference but for someone not racing is the money required to shave that 1kg worth the money?

 

[Westy]

.

Oh and to Westy, yes I do race.

Then ignore everything I've said.

 

[Mr. Hankey]

Then ignore everything I've said.

No it is OK I appreciate your input. I like to hear all sides of the story.

 

[ire]

Ah, good topic. I was just talking to a good friend last night about the best places to lose weight on my road bike. Wheels, cranks, bar/stem is the order we came up with. I bought some Dura-Ace SL wheels, I'm going to get this crankset:
http://road.fullspeedahead.com/fly.aspx?layout=product&taxid=52&pid=143

and I'll put on a Syntace or Rotor stem with, most likely, a Syntace bar. Stuff is expensive, but I'm fortunate enough to get it below cost (or else I couldn't afford it). He mentioned that shifters, brakes and ders. save a negligible amount of weight and cost a lot. We were kind of looking for most weight savings per dollar. Don't know if it helps, but that is my diet for my road bike.

<edit> I only race road occasionally, but I ride the bike a ton for training. Every dollar spent on the road bike, is a dollar well spent becuase road stuff lasts so long. I trash stuff on my XC bike pretty quick, so I stick to XT to keep the cost down.

 

[Mr. Hankey]

Ah, good topic. I was just talking to a good friend last night about the best places to lose weight on my road bike. Wheels, cranks, bar/stem is the order we came up with. I bought some Dura-Ace SL wheels, I'm going to get this crankset:
http://road.fullspeedahead.com/fly.aspx?layout=product&taxid=52&pid=143

and I'll put on a Syntace or Rotor stem with, most likely, a Syntace bar. Stuff is expensive, but I'm fortunate enough to get it below cost (or else I couldn't afford it). He mentioned that shifters, brakes and ders. save a negligible amount of weight and cost a lot. We were kind of looking for most weight savings per dollar. Don't know if it helps, but that is my diet for my road bike.

<edit> I only race road occasionally, but I ride the bike a ton for training. Every dollar spent on the road bike, is a dollar well spent becuase road stuff lasts so long. I trash stuff on my XC bike pretty quick, so I stick to XT to keep the cost down.

Ironically I already put a Syntace stem on the bike. I went the OS route with the F119, and I propose to buy the Syntace Racelite Carbon bars. The stem is the reason I put heavy bars on. It is so much stiffer with the heavy bars, but it could be due to the stem. I really like the Syntace products.

Your approach sounds good, and similar to my findings from my spreadsheet. The Force upgrade, Is as much of weight savings as I will get from my bars, but it will work better, and add a gear.

I am also looking into the whole ceramic bearing thing. Looks like a promising gain, or hella good marketing.

So what is the weight of your rig? What do you plan to drop it too?

 

[ire]

The bike is around 20 lbs, as far as intended weight...I don't know. I just wanted to drop some weight and add some bling FYI, the Syntace bars are super stiff, my friend has the bar/stem combo you are talking about.

<edit> it looks like for the components I listed above, they will come in at a combined 2557g

 

[Mr. Hankey]

The bike is around 20 lbs, as far as intended weight...I don't know. I just wanted to drop some weight and add some bling FYI, the Syntace bars are super stiff, my friend has the bar/stem combo you are talking about.

Good to hear. Maybe I will move that ahead of the force upgrade. I was a little leary of carbon bars, from friend's experiences.

 

[gonefirefightin]

I went with the FSA carbon race kit (bars/stem/post/cranks) and now run the Ti Zeros for pedals. everything else is dura-ace and carbon cages sitting around 15 and loving it. i could dump another grand or so into wheel set but the elites are working out fine.

I am averaging 1k miles a week right now, the difference is very noticable.

 

[ire]

I am averaging 1k miles a week right now, the difference is very noticable.

In what? How big your legs are??

 

[BikeMike]

You'll see the biggest difference in weight in tires, wheels and tubes. It's the rotating weight thing. Since you're riding a triple converted to a double, you might as well spring for a new crank set if you're looking to upgrade parts. A higher cadence up the mountains (given a 39 instead of a 42 small chainring) will help your climbing much more than a new stem or lighter bars.

I have to agree, with Westy that at a certain point you've got a bicycle that's light enough. Especially once you have nice wheels. The only exception I see is if you're racing all the time and are at a very competitive level.

Also, free gram savings can be had by cutting your seat post to the exact length you need.

 

[gonefirefightin]

In what? How big your legs are??

no way...........my ego!

 

[Wumpus]

Intersting discussion on wheel weight.

Mavic test engineers said that when testing wheels of different weights on a straight performance test - numerous riders going full-out uphill, working to maintain constant power output through all tests, that it "never" comes out as it should, with the lightest wheel being fastest for all riders, all of the time.

 

[Mr. Hankey]

Ok so it sounds like I need a new set of wheels, and while I am at it, lighter tires, and tubes. Then a crankset. Then go from there. That is gonna be my biggest gains it seems. It is crazy my old 2001 Frameset is lighter than some modern race frames. I just gotta replace all these old heavy components.

 

[ire]

Ok so it sounds like I need a new set of wheels, and while I am at it, lighter tires, and tubes. Then a crankset. Then go from there. That is gonna be my biggest gains it seems. It is crazy my old 2001 Frameset is lighter than some modern race frames. I just gotta replace all these old heavy components.

New frames may be stiffer around the same weight as yours (not knocking, just saying). The guy I bought my Dura Ace SL wheels from ran the tubeless setup, which is light, and he loved it. You may consider going that route. Check www.notubes.com, there are some non-tubeless rims that can use his system.

 

[Mr. Hankey]

New frames may be stiffer around the same weight as yours (not knocking, just saying). The guy I bought my Dura Ace SL wheels from ran the tubeless setup, which is light, and he loved it. You may consider going that route. Check www.notubes.com, there are some non-tubeless rims that can use his system.

It's all good man. There are some that are stiffer. I have ridden allot of new bikes before I decided on the old 5200. I rode the new Madone 5.2, and the Tarmac SL, both felt about as stiff as my bike. The only thing that felt stiffer was the Soloist. From what I am told the SL Treks are stiffer, and lighter. The Disco team was all using 5.2s this year though, so they must be light, and stiff enough. For the cost saving I couldn't go wrong. I would have to spend at least 3K on mods to equal out buying a new bike. Anyway on allot of the surfaces I ride around here. Like the Tar, and Chip on some of the roads I raced on Sat. They are nothing but comfort on the old 5200.

Yeah I was looking at the No Tubes stuff earlier. It seems like I could get a lighter conventional wheel Rolf Prima Elan Aero 1300g, run some 50g tubes, and be lighter. I do need to try some out though, for I hear the tubeless ride better. Gotta try some out. Interested in your feedback.

 

[ire]

Yeah, I should have mentioned that....the big thing is the ride quality of tubeless. My friend prototypes a bunch of the stuff for Stan and apparantely he has done a bunch of tests that indicate road tubeless offer less rolling resistance than tubulars (I was considering buying tubular wheels becuase they are lighter).

 

[Mr. Hankey]

Yeah, I should have mentioned that....the big thing is the ride quality of tubeless. My friend prototypes a bunch of the stuff for Stan and apparantely he has done a bunch of tests that indicate road tubeless offer less rolling resistance than tubulars (I was considering buying tubular wheels becuase they are lighter).

Gotcha. Wonder what the rolling resistance vs clinchers is like? Also whats your take on the ceramic bearings?

 

[ire]

Also whats your take on the ceramic bearings?

Can make a pretty large difference in an application where they are constantly being used, ie wheels, der pulleys, cranks. One of the guys on our team actually works for FSA so he gives us the low down on what their pro teams are using.

There was a really good site I used to go to that gave the actual numbers; it was the guy that made the bearings for everything in Rasmussen's bike for the '06 Tour. It was interesting how many watts you could save by switching everything to ceramic. I'll see if I can find the website.

 

[ire]

This isn't the site, but this article talks about the FSA BB.
http://www.cyclingnews.com/tech/?id=2006/reviews/FSA_MegaExo

FSA's Ceramic MegaExo bottom bracket eats up only about 0.5%. At the average pitiful 100W output that most of us kick out on a typical road ride, FSA's ceramic BB buys you four free watts. If you're a top ProTour rider spewing out 500W on a climb… well, you do the math. Pow, instant wattage increase.

 

[Mr. Hankey]

This isn't the site, but this article talks about the FSA BB.
http://www.cyclingnews.com/tech/?id=2006/reviews/FSA_MegaExo

Good reading. Sounds like a good upgrade to me. I'm thinking ceramic hubs, BB, der. pulleys, would all be worth it.

 

[ire]

Good reading. Sounds like a good upgrade to me. I'm thinking ceramic hubs, BB, der. pulleys, would all be worth it.

I believe this is the company that outfitted Rasmussen
http://www.enduroforkseals.com

<edit> They make a tool for pulling BB bearings out, write up here:
http://www.cyclingnews.com/tech.php?id=tech/2007/reviews/enduro_bearing_tool

 

[James]

Ah, good topic. I was just talking to a good friend last night about the best places to lose weight on my road bike. Wheels, cranks, bar/stem is the order we came up with. I bought some Dura-Ace SL wheels, I'm going to get this crankset:
http://road.fullspeedahead.com/fly.aspx?layout=product&taxid=52&pid=143

and I'll put on a Syntace or Rotor stem with, most likely, a Syntace bar. Stuff is expensive, but I'm fortunate enough to get it below cost (or else I couldn't afford it). He mentioned that shifters, brakes and ders. save a negligible amount of weight and cost a lot. We were kind of looking for most weight savings per dollar. Don't know if it helps, but that is my diet for my road bike.

<edit> I only race road occasionally, but I ride the bike a ton for training. Every dollar spent on the road bike, is a dollar well spent becuase road stuff lasts so long. I trash stuff on my XC bike pretty quick, so I stick to XT to keep the cost down.

I dig those cranks, nice, light, stiff, the ceramic BB is pretty sweet too. They didn't have the K-Force cranks in the 175mm length I need at the time, but these are a good sub.

Also, the company that set up Rasmussen is called Ceramic Speed. They're a Danish company. SRAM is working with them on their Red stuff, and a lot of other ProTour teams use their stuff.
Man, their derailleur pulleys are sooooo smooth. It's crazy.
http://www.ceramicspeed.com/

 

[Mr. Hankey]

I dig those cranks, nice, light, stiff, the ceramic BB is pretty sweet too. They didn't have the K-Force cranks in the 175mm length I need at the time, but these are a good sub.

Also, the company that set up Rasmussen is called Ceramic Speed. They're a Danish company. SRAM is working with them on their Red stuff, and a lot of other ProTour teams use their stuff.
Man, their derailleur pulleys are sooooo smooth. It's crazy.
http://www.ceramicspeed.com/

Good info bro! I still think Rasmussen was slighted. He should have won, and Rabobank, can go to hell. He never failed a test. It is BS, but that is neither here nor there. This thread is about making our bikes faster, and for the info you and IRE have shared I am thankful.

 

[ire]

Enjoy it Rasmussen, cause you lost the tour

 

[Mr. Hankey]

Alright I just did some spreadsheet calculating and found out how to drop 2377g or 5.24lbs. Which would get me to an illegal for uci 14.7lbs. Next I am gonna plug in all the prices into the spreadsheet, and figure out which upgrades will be the most cost effective. I am still leaving some weight on the table too. I am not changing the seat, the USPS kinda goes with the bike. The skewers, headset, and a few other items will remain, but most everything else is getting switched. I might keep the fork too, just to keep it all USPS themed, and it's only a 208g difference. Now to find all the prices, and plug them in.