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Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,029
7,549
So it looks as if I'm either going to sell the Evil or somehow get my hands on a normal xc bike by other means:

From Dave Weagle (Evil Bikes engineer):

If you really feel that you need to run the post with more than 5-6 inches (and thats pushing it) exposed (making a 19 inch frame) I suggest that you look into selling your Imperial and picking up something with a longer seat tube.
:eek: :(

Update: I think I'm going to keep it, but strip it down a bit to make it a dj/urban-specific bike (ie, cheap rigid fork w/disc tabs, single ring/guide). Time to see if JOJO's xc bike is still up for grabs... :rolleyes:
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,029
7,549
Originally posted by Barbaton
I hope someone sees this before you head out...

don't think I can ride tonight. have fun anyway.


T
No worries, I don't think anyone of us went tonight.

Addition: another item of note is that my beloved camera is back at Canon for warranty work. So don't go riding anytime soon. :eek: ;)

I think this image is appropriate for the weather:

 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,029
7,549
For those curious, here is the paper trail of my conversation with Dave Weagle about the proper use of the Imperial:

Hi again,

The extension of the seatpost in the pictures is a bit deceiving: the post
was stuck at that level because it had bent while I was running it higher
(at the minimum insert line, about 2 inches further out than in the picture
of the post in the frame) and had stupidly tried to lower it before doing
the ledge near Governor's Road in the Fells. Ideally, I would run the seat
higher, however, since I wasn't getting proper leg extension even then. The
12 inch figure came from my napkin calculations of where the minimum insert
line would be on a 410 mm Thomson, and I kept it just to make the length
component of ft.-lbs. cancel out.

As a solution, I'm going to keep the frame (whew!), but build it up as a
pure trials/urban/dj rig: rigid fork, single ring guide (I called John
P/Reggie yesterday and changed my long-standing DRS order to a SRS). For xc,
I'll save up a bit, and get one of those newfangled Hollowpoints. I hear the
guy who designed the 2003s is pretty sharp. ;-)

-Toshi

on 6/28/02 8:50 AM, Evil Bikes Product Support at support@evilbikes.com
wrote:

> Hi Toshi,
> !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> WAIT! I just looked at the pictures, that seatpost wasn't out 12 inches! What
> were you talking about? At the extension you have there, the bike should be
> totally fine, I run mine just a tad lower. Give it a shot with the stronger
> post, I think you will be all set. It looks like you were running it as i
> described before basically. (about 6 inches out)
>
> It is the mystical convergence that you are looking for Toshi, it is! :)
>
> I have ridden a Compo, but I did not like the geometry at all. thats just me
> though.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Toshi Clark [mailto:tjclark@fas.harvard.edu]
> Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2002 11:30 AM
> To: Evil Bikes Product Support
> Subject: Re: Imperials and bending seatposts
>
> Ok. Please help me sell this frame before I scratch it up any more.
>
> Why I went for the Evil was because I thought it was the mystical convergence
> frame that could take my Super T, go dirt jumping with me, handle my
> sport-level trials moves, and be a trailbike (like my old Intense). With this
> in mind, I'm not too keen on the Compo concept of steep angles, but maybe
> it'll work. You've ridden one?
>
> Finally, if you try the pictures now, they'll work. (They didn't this morning
> when you were writing your email because I hadn't woken up and turned my
> computer on.)
>
> on 6/27/02 7:34 AM, Evil Bikes Product Support at support@evilbikes.com
> wrote:
>
>> I don't think that you are going to be able to run this seatpost at "1 foot!"
>> (thats a lot on any bike) of extension from the frame. If you do crash, the
>> post will almost undoubtedly bend, not to mention that you will be putting
>> huge loads into your frame. If you really feel that you need to run the post
>> with more than 5-6 inches (and thats pushing it) exposed (making a 19 inch
>> frame) I suggest that you look into selling your Imperial and picking up
>> something with a longer seat tube. The Imperial is a 13" frame. It sounds
>> like you might be looking for a Planet-X Compo or Surly Instigator. Both come
>> in taller sizes , but are stronger than an XC bike. The Compo has some odd
>> geometry, so it might be something that you would want to ride first. Maybe a
>> P3 could work for you too. If you would like to sell your frame, we can help
>> you out. If you do run the bike with a lot of seat tube exposed, make sure
>> you have as much insertion as possible. This will help reduce loads on the
>> frame.
>>
>> I couldn't see the pictures, for some reason they don't work.
>>
>> I am almost positive that I am going to the fells tonight, but don't know
>> what time. If I come home before we take off ill drop you a line and let you
>> know, OK?
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Toshi Clark [mailto:tjclark@fas.harvard.edu]
>> Sent: Wednesday, June 26, 2002 11:08 AM
>> To: Evil Bikes Product Support
>> Subject: Re: Imperials and bending seatposts
>>
>> As a possible solution, I ordered up a really long Thomson (410 mm). You
>> probably know this, since it's a popular post that you use, but their website
>> says it is "integral-machined from one single piece of high strength 7000
>> series aluminum." On the Hurricane which I bent the min insert line was about
>> 4 inches from the end. On the Thomson, I'll probably have enough length that
>> I'll run it with perhaps 5 inches inserted when I'm seeking proper leg
>> extension.
>>
>> Here are two pics, in the frame and out, and my whiny thread on Ridemonkey
>> when it became stuck:
>>
>> http://140.247.135.42/images/humba/bent-seatpost.jpg
>> http://140.247.135.42/images/humba/bent-seatpost2.jpg
>> http://www.ridemonkey.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=23270
>>
>> One interesting note is that Thomson claims that "The tube will start to
>> yield and bend at the seat tube clamp at about 250 foot-lbs of torque." Since
>> I weigh about a buck seventy and the seatpost is angled at 55 degrees or so,
>> I figure the Thomson will take about a ~2.5 g beating before it bends ((250
>> lbs./ft.) / (1 ft. * Cos [55])) / (170 lbs.) assuming 1 ft. of exposed
>> seatpost at the max. You've done lots of testing and analysis, right? Is this
>> a load that is regularly seen at the seat during xc?
>>
>> Please let me know if you're going to ride the Fells on Thursday. My humba
>> (Harvard Uni. mountain bike association) crew on campus is planning on doing
>> a loop then.
>>
>> on 6/26/02 10:20 AM, Evil Bikes Product Support at support@evilbikes.com
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Oh, no doubt, you CAN run the post at some length, and the frame wont break,
>>> but the seatpost, thats a different story. You will put a lot of leverage on
>>> that badboy with it extended out super far, and some seatposts cant handle
>>> it. (I consider 19 inch effective to be very long, especially for a frame
>>> that size) You will most likely continue to have seatpost bending issues
>>> with the post extended past 5 inches out of the top of the seat tube. Maybe
>>> you can give it a try with the post at the 5 inch mark and see what you
>>> think?
>>>
>>> What material is the seatpost?
>>>
>>> How far does the minimum insertion line extend the post out of the seat
>>> tube?
>>>
>>> Let me know how it works out. I'd love to hook up for a ride sometime. I
>>> might be Fells ing it on Thursday actually.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Toshi Clark [mailto:tjclark@fas.harvard.edu]
>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 26, 2002 10:07 AM
>>> To: Evil Bikes Product Support
>>> Subject: Re: Imperials and bending seatposts
>>>
>>> I plan on using the Imperial for all of the riding I do, except for road.
>>> That's a mix of urban, dj, and, yes, xc. I just ordered a Thomson and am
>>> going to suck it up if it bends again. The seat positioning isn't all that
>>> awful, actually, even with long posts, especially since I'm used to the laid
>>> back geometry of my Intense Uzzi SLX. Anyways, I thought I'd dig up
>>> something you wrote way back on October 16th of last year (in "RE: Imperial,
>>> Bashguards, Availability"), with emphasis on "you can put a long seat post
>>> on it" ;-) :
>>>
>>>> You can put a long seat post on it, and it should give some long geometry
>>>> in front, if you run the chainstays in XC length (they are adjustable
>>>> between 14.9 and 17 inches), you should have no problems climbing whatever
>>>> you need to if you run a z-1.
>>>
>>> I bent my Hurricane 100 just from the normal pressure of sitting down during
>>> a loop around the Fells. Of course, I had it extended about 30 cm, all the
>>> way to the min. insert line. Hurricane is replacing it for free, and I've
>>> only heard of a Thomson bending once, so all is good.
>>>
>>> on 6/26/02 8:32 AM, Evil Bikes Product Support at support@evilbikes.com
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I do not recommend running the seatpost more than 5 inches out of the top
>>>> of the seat tube. It wasn't designed for XC use (as you will notice you get
>>>> a long TT and less efficient positioning for climbing [unless you are in
>>>> the 17 inch position] at anything over a 18 inch effective seat tube), so
>>>> you probably shouldn't use it at extended lengths if you can do it. I have
>>>> always used Thomson or Syncros on mine, and they have worked out for me,
>>>> but i only run the seatpost at 3-4 inches out.
>>>>
>>>> How did you bend yours? What length did you have it out to?
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Toshi Clark [mailto:tjclark@fas.harvard.edu]
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2002 11:07 AM
>>>> To: support@evilbikes.com
>>>> Subject: Imperials and bending seatposts
>>>>
>>>> Just as a heads up, you might have some people coming to you with bent
>>>> seatposts. I am no bruiser, and managed to bend a Hurricane 100 on my first
>>>> trail ride on the Imperial. It was inserted right at the minimum insertion
>>>> line, and bent backwards thanks to your slack seat tube design. Anyways, to
>>>> my point: what seatpost might be stronger than the Hurricane? Thompson?
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
 

Barbaton

Turbo Monkey
May 11, 2002
1,477
0
suburban hell
Originally posted by Toshi



Addition: another item of note is that my beloved camera is back at Canon for warranty work. So don't go riding anytime soon. :eek: ;)


no worries. I can always check one out from work. I've been thinnking of taking one of our nice DV cams out to shoot some footage anyway.


Thad
 

WTGPhoben

Monkey
Apr 21, 2002
717
0
One of them Boston suburbs
I just had a short morning ride, but I think Ari would feel left out if we didn't ride tonight too. Who's in?

BTW, TOSHI. Dave has a hook at work for Iron HOrse if you're into that.

until then... if we can find a wheel, my #2 bike is always available for rental:D
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,029
7,549
Originally posted by WTGPhoben
I just had a short morning ride, but I think Ari would feel left out if we didn't ride tonight too. Who's in?

BTW, TOSHI. Dave has a hook at work for Iron HOrse if you're into that.

until then... if we can find a wheel, my #2 bike is always available for rental:D
Jury duty sounds as if it was a blast, Ari. They dismiss you for being too liberal? :eek: :rolleyes:

I'm up for some riding tonight. I visited Paramount, btw, and Tyler said he can't compete with Supergo's prices, since he buys bikes for a considerably higher amount (he gave me figures, but I don't think those should be disseminated). You can't steal the front wheel off of it, but my road bike is free for use tonight, too.
 

Quadari

Monkey
Feb 1, 2002
308
0
Washington, DC
No...not dismissed. i never even got a chance to be impaneled. they were supposed to impanel three juries today but one got settled out of court and the other the guy pleaded guilty. so I just sat there and read my book from 8am until noon. then i got to go home.

I'm definitely in for a ride this evening.

Speaking of road bikes...for those who don't know I'm gonna be getting one! I'm in the process of buying a 2001 Lemond from a guy I found on roadbikereview.com.

It's gonna be sweet. :D
 

Quadari

Monkey
Feb 1, 2002
308
0
Washington, DC
Originally posted by Barbaton
so guess who just found his week lost cellphone in his bed.
hehe...one of my roomates did the same thing this year.

He lost a palm pilot i think it was back in november. Ended up getting a new one, which then broke, and then got a third one. Then when we were moving the couch down into storage he found the first one stuck way underneath the cushions. so now he has two.
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,029
7,549
One and all, we're going riding tonight. It will take about an hour for me to get the newly rebuilt fork back on and install the Evil chainguide which showed up today.

Random: nice move, Thad. :thumb: Ari, I didn't have any ghetto pictures (altho my old Proflex certainly wasn't ghetto, I have no pics, let alone on my computer).

For now, let's meet in front of 20 Dewolfe at 9:00 to be safe. note different time!
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,029
7,549
The ride, in fragments. New Evil guide. Many delays, all my fault. :D Earlier oil change botched by me, too. Fun pedal kick drops. Another bent seatpost. :rolleyes: Skater punk 13 year olds and nasty glaring cops. Ari and Keith going wild on the stairs. Multiple flats. Mulch in lieu of air. A bumpy ride home. Burning pizza. Now this. Ugh.
 

WTGPhoben

Monkey
Apr 21, 2002
717
0
One of them Boston suburbs
what toshi meant to say was that everyone (but me) decided to destroy their bikes, and succeded. I, on the other hand, spent the evening getting intimate with platform pedals for THE FIRST TIME EVER (I apologize, I'm an XC guy), and thanks to some strategically borrowed shinguards[thanks toshi], I escaped the night scot free.
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,029
7,549
Originally posted by Barbaton
where'd you guys go?
We hit up Government Center, but took quite the windy route to get there. :D

Anyone want to ride to Belmont Wheelworks today? I need to pick up a bolt that they ordered for the road bike.
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,029
7,549
Originally posted by Barbaton
oh. I thought they weren't letting people ride there anymore.
That pit area where the bmxers used to hang out is fenced off, but most of the fun stuff (like the wallrides) is still accessible. I'm not sure if we're supposed to be there, but that's another issue entirely. Oh yeah, I forgot to mention that both Ari and Keith were getting some solid wallrides in. :thumb:

(old pic)

 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,029
7,549
Ari,

At Belmont, Tim showed me the same Titus (with those cool bolt-on dropouts) as he did for you. I think I might go with a sane (LX/V brake/unknown fork?) build on one of those when the xc bug hits with full force. :eek:
 

WTGPhoben

Monkey
Apr 21, 2002
717
0
One of them Boston suburbs
so today's ride summary: We did the MTB loop and res loop at the fells. The trails are really getting hurt bad over there. people have been making new lines all over the place to get around the hard stuff, and with the wet weather, the new lines are starting to rip up the forest. We did our best to block off any new lines we saw so the vegetation could grow back. (and we apologize to the dude who tried to ride one of those new lines before we were done blocking it... oops [even though he shouldn't have been riding it anyway])

I think ari ad I might want the day off tomorrow, with the urban on fri and the trail on sat, sun might need to involve a lot of TV.
 

Quadari

Monkey
Feb 1, 2002
308
0
Washington, DC
Originally posted by WTGPhoben
I think ari ad I might want the day off tomorrow, with the urban on fri and the trail on sat, sun might need to involve a lot of TV.
I agree. my legs are sort of hurting right now. But it was most definitely a quality ride. Lots of fun, and a good workout.

World cup match in 6.5 hours! woohoo. who do you guys think will win.
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,029
7,549
Originally posted by Quadari
I agree. my legs are sort of hurting right now. But it was most definitely a quality ride. Lots of fun, and a good workout.
Coolness. My shoulder feels kind of funky, if anyone cares. :eek:
World cup match in 6.5 hours! woohoo. who do you guys think will win.
Who's playing? What's this "world cup" deal anyways? :D

For fun, I've decided to start combing the mtbr classifieds. If any of you are bored, please check out these ads and tell me what you think.

Breezer
Diamondback DBR
GT Xizang
Stumpy M4
Stumpy S-works
Klein sold already :(
Alison Dunlap's backup bike
GT Zaskar
Litespeed
Yeti ARC sold already :(

It's too bad JOJO's mtb was already taken -- I would have settled for that. :rolleyes: :D

Morning update: I met the guy who wants to buy my huge fork, and he's cool. He needs to sell his old (brand new, tho) fork first. This is a thread about the fork he is selling in order to buy mine: Stratos LR-1. <- Messing with the perpage number is fun.

Ari: did you end up downloading this to convert your fonts? I haven't tried it yet, but it's shareware... http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Way/4789/TTConverter15.hqx (a few minutes later) Ok, it seems to work, too. What could be better?
 

Quadari

Monkey
Feb 1, 2002
308
0
Washington, DC

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,029
7,549
Originally posted by Quadari
You could become an all Klein man!

Yeah, I tried that, but unfortunately it doesn't seem to work with the type of fonts that we were dealing with.
I'm leery of that White Bros fork, tho. :eek: Marzocchi, please. :D

Your fonts weren't .ttp files? I wanted the Fatboy Slim BLTC font that a13x uses in his pictures (which he hasn't posted for a while -- I'll post a sample), and it worked just fine for that. Do commercial fonts have some protection against conversion?
 

Quadari

Monkey
Feb 1, 2002
308
0
Washington, DC
Originally posted by Toshi

Your fonts weren't .ttp files?
No...they weren't. They were True Type, type 1 fonts, I believe. It was actually two different files the made up the PC font that converted into two different mac files. They had funny extensions that I can't remember right now.
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,029
7,549
Originally posted by Toshi
I wanted the Fatboy Slim BLTC font that a13x uses in his pictures (which he hasn't posted for a while -- I'll post a sample
Two of the bikes on my list above have been sold already. :( At least they were the sketchy ones (Klein with the WB, ok, the Yeti wasn't sketchy). Some guy selling his girlfriend's M2 already got booted off the list since he was very reluctant to send a pic because it would be a waste of his time if I ended up buying a different bike. With that attitude... :rolleyes:

Anyways, here's another sample of the Fatboy Slim font, from my new gratuitously oversized header image from my local web page:

 

WTGPhoben

Monkey
Apr 21, 2002
717
0
One of them Boston suburbs
For fun, I've decided to start combing the mtbr classifieds. If any of you are bored, please check out these ads and tell me what you think.
Gotta say the best deal in that lot is the DBR. It's got a sweet price and minus the rims, It's stacked. Besides, after having bombers for so long you'll cry yourself to sleep at night with a manitou. (the ti bike and the GT are also cool, but pricey... and who would want to beat up a collectors item?)

Also: I'm riding with byron after work. gonna be a speedy XC if anyone's interested. drop a brother an email (or post)
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,029
7,549
Originally posted by WTGPhoben
Gotta say the best deal in that lot is the DBR. It's got a sweet price and minus the rims, It's stacked. Besides, after having bombers for so long you'll cry yourself to sleep at night with a manitou. (the ti bike and the GT are also cool, but pricey... and who would want to beat up a collectors item?)

I guess the breezer is ok too if you like grip shift, but I can't stand the things.
I am definitely leaning towards the DBR as well. The guy was even the nicest in response to my call for pictures; or at least he was tied with the gold S-works guy. I just need my fork buyer to get the money and pay me and then all will be well.
 

Quadari

Monkey
Feb 1, 2002
308
0
Washington, DC
Toshi-

What's up here? You're going to have all hardtail bikes. Keith is gonna be the only one with a dualie. As he says, "Me with a dualie? Who ever thought it would happen?"

:D
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,029
7,549
Originally posted by Quadari
Toshi-

What's up here? You're going to have all hardtail bikes. Keith is gonna be the only one with a dualie. As he says, "Me with a dualie? Who ever thought it would happen?"

:D
Maybe I'll be able to climb hills :eek: :D
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,029
7,549
Originally posted by WTGPhoben
yeah, and someday I'll do big drops... .... .... HAHAHAHAHAHA.
Hey, use the Quote button at the bottom right (as opposed to the one in the Reply to Post page). Anyways, we coerced you into dirt jumping, so nothing's impossible. :eek:

Besides, I once was a decent climber (pic on left; note the mountains :D ):



Random pic: http://www.ridemonkey.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=302050 (Orven, RideMonkey, JOJO, together thanks to DaveW's Photoshop magic)