[JMAC]

Just wondering what wars the US has been in since WW2 have actually fixed any problems for the countries. I'm not an expert but.

Korea is still messed up

Veitnam is still messed up

Gulf war they didn't finish anything

Kosovo is still a mess with people dying

Bosnia still sucks right?

Afganistan is worse now than before because the US is reffusing to have areal government because that wouldn't be good for the US

Iraq and this one seems the most stupid of them all.

Just want to know people thoughts

 

[dangitboy]

I believe that due to the diversity of cultures...no matter what courses of action we ever take...war...cold war...sanctions...we will never get beyond temporary solutions, and band-aid approaches. Sad but true.

Dave

 

[LordOpie]

Past performance is not indicative of future gains.

 

[BurlyShirley]

Originally posted by JMAC
Just wondering what wars the US has been in since WW2 have actually fixed any problems for the countries. I'm not an expert but.

Korea is still messed up

Veitnam is still messed up

Gulf war they didn't finish anything

Kosovo is still a mess with people dying

Bosnia still sucks right?

Afganistan is worse now than before because the US is reffusing to have areal government because that wouldn't be good for the US

Iraq and this one seems the most stupid of them all.

Just want to know people thoughts

Korea? Ok, South Korea's free right?

Gulf War? Saddam Got out of Kuwait right?

Kosovo? Oh heavans, didnt we stop a genocidal maniac?

Afghanistan? Where's al queda's base now?

Iraq? I suppose you liked saddam?

What the he** kind of thread is this? Use your head man.

 

[valve bouncer]

Originally posted by BurlySurly
Korea? Ok, South Korea's free right?

Gulf War? Saddam Got out of Kuwait right?

Kosovo? Oh heavans, didnt we stop a genocidal maniac?

Afghanistan? Where's al queda's base now?

Iraq? I suppose you liked saddam?

What the he** kind of thread is this? Use your head man.

Actually South Korea was a US backed military dictatorship for more than 30 years after the war and a particularly nasty one at that. Can you say Kwangju massacre BS? Still they're better off than the North Koreans. Of course the war didn't solve the problem of North Korea and it looks like it's gonna have to be dealt with sooner or later.

Gulf War? It's deja vu all over again isn't it BS.

Kosovo- might be prepared to grant you that one. Seems like some sense was bombed into the Serbs and they got rid of Slobo, still it is the Balkans so who knows what's in store there.
Afghanistan- well just cause Fox don't show it, doesn't mean it ain't still happening there. 2 Special Forces guys killed just the other day and if you think Al Qaeda is all over then you have got rocks in your head my son.

Iraq (take 2), well let's just wait and see there BS. This has the potential to turn very ugly for the coalition. A possible scenario is that as civilian casualties continue to mount the political pressure both at home and abroad causes a change in tactics so as to minimise civilian casualties. This change puts coalition soldiers much more at risk and as coalition casualties mount the pressure on Bush and Blair becomes unbearable as public opinion turns more against the war. Unlikely? Perhaps, but that is just one of many possible scenarios. This war is of such a magnitude that its implications will still be felt a generation from now if not longer so now is definitely not the time to be attempting a summary of its outcome. Lets just wait and see. (That goes for JMAC too)

In a broader sense it seems that the fighting part of the war is really only one part of a larger whole. The reason that WW2 was so successful for the Allies is that not only did the conquer Germany and Japan but they occupied those countries and irrevocably changed them. Remember too that the occupation lasted longer than the war and with Marshal plan ensured long term stability both economically and politically. I mean it's no co-incidence that Germany and Japan are both democratic and rich. The two can't be seperated. This "enlightened self-interest" seems though to have changed now to just plain old "self interest" with no real thought being given to the aftermath of war.

Now don't think I'm advocating a coalition occupation of Iraq, that would be politically stupid. But what must happen is that there must be on-going dialogue, interaction and involvement with whatever regime is installed after Saddam is gone. And by on-going I mean more than 6 months or a year, I mean 10 or 20 years. It's a forlorn hope I know as the politicians only look forward to the next election and any politician with a true depth of vision is a rare bird indeed.

The coalition must not be content with just installing a sympathetic regime in Iraq, they must firstly install a democratic regime and then let the chips fall where they may. To those that say democracy is antithetical to Arabs and others in the middle east, I say you are giving up. Democracy is not a western value, by definition DEMOcracy is a human value. Democracy has been successfully embraced by countries as culturally diverse as India, Japan and South Africa just to name a few. In 20 years when Iraq is a fully functioning member of the international community with a stable democratic government, it is only then that we can be said to have been successful. It remains a distant dream however as our leaders lack the vision to pull it off.

 

[N8 v2.0]

The title of this silly thread reminds me of that silly (as in funny) scene from Monty Python's Life of Brian:

REG: What have the Romans ever done for us?

XERXES: The aqueduct?

REG: What?

XERXES: The aqueduct.

REG: Oh. Yeah, yeah. They did give us that. Uh, that's true. Yeah.

COMMANDO #3: And the sanitation.

LORETTA: Oh, yeah, the sanitation, Reg. Remember what the city used to be like?

REG: Yeah. All right. I'll grant you the aqueduct and the sanitation are two things that the Romans have done.

MATTHIAS: And the roads.

REG: Well, yeah. Obviously the roads. I mean, the roads go without saying, don't they? But apart from the sanitation, the aqueduct, and the roads--

COMMANDO: Irrigation.

XERXES: Medicine.

COMMANDOS: Huh? Heh? Huh...

COMMANDO #2: Education.

COMMANDOS: Ohh...

REG: Yeah, yeah. All right. Fair enough.

COMMANDO #1: And the wine.

COMMANDOS: Oh, yes. Yeah...

FRANCIS: Yeah. Yeah, that's something we'd really miss, Reg, if the Romans left. Huh.

COMMANDO: Public baths.

LORETTA: And it's safe to walk in the streets at night now, Reg.

FRANCIS: Yeah, they certainly know how to keep order. Let's face it. They're the only ones who could in a place like this.

COMMANDOS: Hehh, heh. Heh heh heh heh heh heh heh.

REG: All right, but apart from the sanitation, the medicine, education, wine, public order, irrigation, roads, a fresh water system, and public health, what have the Romans ever done for us?

XERXES: Brought peace.

REG: Oh. Peace? Shut up!

 

[nicklin]

Here's more to the list,

Nicaragua, Panama, Rowanda, Sri Leon, and, um, didn't the prime minister of Serbia just got sniped? By let's guess who...(David Spade impression) yeah, Milosevic faithfuls

Democracy only works when the country really wants it.

 

[Silver]

Grenada too....

Canada next, I hear, if they decriminalize weed. The DEA already has British Columbia on its Axis of Evil list, I hear.

 

[nicklin]

He He, Canadian weed, almost as intoxicating as Mexico City air and Water near Pittsburg's steel plants. Correct if I'm wrong, but doesn't the DEA have enough fire power to invade Canada as it is?

Funny stuff.

Anyone watch That 70's show? Remember when Kelsle said "If ham is Canadian Bacon, what the hell do you call bacon?