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Wheel Lacing Problems

Discussion in 'Beginners Forum' started by LowRacerRider, Oct 11, 2017.

  1. LowRacerRider

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    I have taken up a hobby of building recumbent bikes. I am currently building a low racer and am replacing both (front & rear) 20 inch wheels to generic disc brake hubs. Each time I have tried, I find the outbound spokes end up sticking out as too long. All the inbound spokes are fitting fine, but not any of the outbound spokes on either side of each wheel. What am I doing wrong?
     

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  2. StiHacka

    StiHacka Compensating for something

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    Are the wheels dished?
     
  3. LowRacerRider

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    The wheels are offset on each side from the center of the hub. I don't know if that means they are dished.
     
  4. Nick

    Nick My name is Nick

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    behind you, don't wait up.
    "dish" is exactly that, how the rim is positioned relative to the centerline between flanges.

    How offset are you talking about? a few mm, or more?
     
  5. LowRacerRider

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    Front wheel, Left Flange from center: 29.5mm; Right Flange from center: 22.5mm.
    Rear wheel: Left Flange from center: 20mm; Right Flange from center: 33mm
     
  6. rideit

    rideit Bob the Builder

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    do you know if the hubs (New vs. old) have identical flange diameters?
    You might need new spokes.
     
  7. LowRacerRider

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    Rims are XRIMS Z1000 Alloy 405X20-20X1.5 with an ERD of 397mm.
     
  8. rideit

    rideit Bob the Builder

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    But are the hubs identical?
     
  9. LowRacerRider

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    These hubs are new but they are genaric from China without any brand identified. they both have flange diameters of 58mm.
     
  10. rideit

    rideit Bob the Builder

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    The new ones and the old ones are both 58mm?
     
  11. LowRacerRider

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    They came as a set and appear to be identical except, of course that one is for the front and one is for the rear. both have the same disc brake mount and both have a width between the flanges of 53mm.
     
  12. LowRacerRider

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    No. I discarded the old ones as they were not equipped for disc brakes.
     
  13. rideit

    rideit Bob the Builder

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    I think I have identified your problem, the spokes you are trying to use are not correct for the new hubs.
     
  14. LowRacerRider

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    The spokes that were in the wheels clearly would not fit the new hubs. I used a bicycle spoke calculator to determine what spoke lengths I should use. All the inbound spokes appear to fit very well. It's the outbound spokes that appear to be as much as 5mm too long.
     
  15. rideit

    rideit Bob the Builder

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    Ok, I thought that you were trying to reuse the old spokes.
     
  16. LowRacerRider

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    I also discarded the original spokes. I could see they would not fit. I used a spoke length calculator to determine the spoke lengths to use and all the inbound spokes on both sides appear to fit very well, but none of the outbound spkes appear to fit and it looks like they are maybe 5-6mm too long.
     
  17. Nick

    Nick My name is Nick

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    behind you, don't wait up.
    explain 'inbound' vs 'outbound' for me. are you referring to leading vs trailing?
    typically any difference in spoke length is drive side or non-drive side, not leading vs trailing. maybe you have the correct spoke lengths and mis-laced the wheel??
     
  18. profro

    profro Turbo Monkey

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    Are the rims "right handed" or "left handed"? I usually mess up by putting the key spoke in the wrong hole. That will make the spokes appear to be the wrong length.

    Per Sheldon Brown:

     
  19. LowRacerRider

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    As I understand it, a hub has two flanges. Any spoke pushed through the outside of a flange to the inside is called an inbound spoke. Any spoke pushed from the inside to the outside of a flange is called an outbound spoke.

    I'm too new at this to know other than what I read on the internet.
     
  20. LowRacerRider

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    Based on my understanding of the key hole, my rims are both left handed.
     
  21. profro

    profro Turbo Monkey

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  22. profro

    profro Turbo Monkey

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    You may try relacing and move the key spoke. If it is next to the valve hole, then move it one hole away or vice versa.
     
  23. StiHacka

    StiHacka Compensating for something

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    That sounds like a lacing issue to me. What profro said.
     
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  24. LowRacerRider

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    I don't understand what you mean to replace or move the key spoke. Isn't the key spoke supposed to go in the the key spoke hole? How does doing this impact the excess length of all the outbound spokes?
     
  25. LowRacerRider

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    I now see that Sheldon works from the right side of the wheel (drive side). I had built mine using the instructions found on AtomicZombie with started on the left side of the wheel. I'l give Sheldon's way and let everyone know how it goes. Thanks everyone for your great suggestions.
     
  26. profro

    profro Turbo Monkey

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    The key spoke can go either the hole right next to the valve or one away from that depending on if the rims have offset spoke holes ("right or left handness). I have found that even though some rims appear to not be offset, they are in fact. It has frustrated me more than once resulting in what you describe. Moving the key spoke one hole away from the valve hole always fixes the problem.
     
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  27. johnbryanpeters

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  28. Jm_

    Jm_ Turbo Monkey

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    I usually run 3 or 4 spoke calculators and then look closely at the differences and make sure that I didn't make an error. I usually trust DT swiss and haven't had any problems using that one.
     
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  29. LowRacerRider

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    It must work as I now have a fairly nicely laced wheel. I also learned to start lacing from the drive side (right) where I had been lacing starting on the left side. My rims do have spoke holes with an offset but I must believe that by following Sheldon's methodology which probably included identifying the proper key spoke. I still may have some length problems as some of the spokes seem a little loose, but I'm sure I can work that out. I'm now going to use several spoke length calculators. Again thanks to all for the help.