[ALEXIS_DH]

whats up with that?
i want my bottom bracket to be 2mm lower, my chainstay 3mm shorter, and my stem 12 grams lighter?

wtf? does all that crap makes any difference, outside their mind for 95% riders out there?

i dont get too see many guys in other sports being such finicky whores, nor a ridiculously overpriced and diverse market to anal-probe them 4gr lighter ti bolts...

 

[cyclenski23]

talk to a roadie, then you wont think dh'ers are really that bad

 

[armada]

if you consider how much money we pay for bikes, do you still think we are finicky?

 

[StabprimoMonkee]

Dude... have you seen the moneys roadies pay for theirs?

 

[alfonz]

whats up with that?
i want my bottom bracket to be 2mm lower, my chainstay 3mm shorter, and my stem 12 grams lighter?

wtf? does all that crap makes any difference, outside their mind for 95% riders out there?

i dont get too see many guys in other sports being such finicky whores, nor a ridiculously overpriced and diverse market to anal-probe them 4gr lighter ti bolts...

i agree with you bro, it's a bit much! it def makes the sport seem gay! no punn intended.....

 

[IH8Rice]

Dude... have you seen the moneys roadies pay for theirs?

and have you seen how picky they are?




if you dont get it, youre doing it wrong. unless you like to settle for mediocrity

 

[Inclag]

talk to a roadie, then you wont think dh'ers are really that bad

I'm by no means a roadie, but you could argue that what they nitpick about actually does have realistic and tangible effects on their riding. There are many less variables in play as opposed to say downhill.

 

[Ithnu]

Look, I race and I'm bad a$s so I know. If you don't have the EXACT geometry Sam Hill has you're going to come in 2nd.

 

[ALEXIS_DH]

and have you seen how picky they are?




if you dont get it, youre doing it wrong. unless you like to settle for mediocrity

so you are telling me you could, in a double blind test, tell me if every bolt in your bike is made out of titanium or steel? or better yet, you could record consistently lower lap times?
this is an honest yes or no question.

now, we get phylosophical... whats you actual definition of "better"? whats your definition of mediocrity? are they real-life based definitions? do your definitions are factually supported? could they be quantified and meassured in real world applications?

is something "better" really "better" if it does not make any measurable performance improvement??? wouldnt it be more sincere in our part to admit "heck, i want ti bolts because they are trendy, and i buy them, just like girls drop $800 purses for $10 worth of leather and $790 worth of social proof, not because i believe they enhance my performance?"

maybe, i received too much engineering edumacation... but i smell bs in here.

 

[IH8Rice]

so you are telling me you could, in a double blind test, tell me if every bolt in your bike is made out of titanium or steel? or better yet, you could record consistently lower lap times?
this is an honest yes or no question.

no, but if youre making 2,3,4mm adjustments to the bike's geometry, you sure can

 

[William42]

because its fun? Because feeling more comfortable on your bike makes it more fun? MX bikes are even more picky. They also just happen to be more dialed.

Also, we sell lots of carbon road bikes to lots of people at my shop, ranging on avg from about 2 (entry level) to ~5G regularly, and special orders for higher priced bikes are in no way out of the question. I've seen one of them be on the level of the general RM population, but the rest are nowhere near. And the one didnt even buy a bicycle from us, she just had alot of money and alot of back problems, so she had gone a full custom route.

One funny note is, the only other customer we've had take up as much time getting the perfect bicycle setup as about your average RM member, was a.....heavy, mentally disabled guy buying a comfort hybrid who needed stem, bar, lever angles to be utterly perfect, and spent 7 hours in the stand fitting it. Its a damn good fit though.

Anyway, the moral I'm making in this overly long post is that RM happens to be a coagulation of the super finicky DHers. Most dont give a fyck.

 

[dump]

Allow me to let you in on a secret.

1. Your bike is not holding you back.
2. X widget isn't going to make riding any more enjoyable.

Carry on.

 

[dhrookie]

This is going to get good.....

 

[johnbryanpeters]

Allow me to let you in on a secret.

1. Your bike is not holding you back.
2. X widget isn't going to make riding any more enjoyable.

Carry on.

That.

 

[AutoPilotOff]

Im the last person to buy Ti bolts or even spend the $$$ for a Ti spring, but, its not uncommon to see all 5 on the podium within a second or two of each other.

Im not saying that the Ti bolts made the difference, but the racer that lost by .15 may think so.

But racing is a different story. Or at least they have an excuse. People that do this crap for riding there local spot are seriously crazy...

 

[marshalolson]

talk to a roadie, then you wont think dh'ers are really that bad

talk to a tri-athlete and you won't think roadies are that bad

 

[FlipFantasia]

Allow me to let you in on a secret.

1. Your bike is not holding you back.
2. X widget isn't going to make riding any more enjoyable.

Carry on.

but, but, if I spend more money on the latest and greatest, it will make me better!!!

 

[Iridemtb]

Allow me to let you in on a secret.

1. Your bike is not holding you back.
2. X widget isn't going to make riding any more enjoyable.

Carry on.

True to an extent. See I have not been riding as much and have gotten into motocross a little and am at the gym a lot too. When I look back to DH still and my Canfield Jedi in my garage I realize some things are functional while others don't make that much of a difference. Like my drop stem made a huge difference for me, but the colored chainring bolts, thomson seat post, and x.0 derailleur have not made a big difference. There are some things that help me be faster and some things that were unreasonable for me to buy.

 

[Jim Mac]

talk to a tri-athlete and you won't think roadies are that bad

Quoted for truth! I work pt at a shop and have had this experience. I think DH racers/Tri athletes and high end roadies (5K+ bikes) all fall under the 'finicky' category. Having said that, however, I have seen a lot more ego massaging during the sales process need happen in the roadie end of the spectrum.

 

[Big J]

I'm by no means a Pro but I was told being light on the brakes and fast in the corners wins DH races not fancy smanshy parts......though getting my DHX PUSH'd and upgrading to a Ti spring were the ticket to finally dialing in my V10's rearend....

J

 

[P.T.W]

talk to a tri-athlete and you won't think roadies are that bad

Talk to a member on here "Gridds" about the sport he works in..... they make NASA look like a bunch of Neanderthals

The average downhiller would have trouble telling you how much his bike weighs and id be surprised if most who brought them off the shelf could tell any geometry figures at all ....racer boys aren't average though.

 

[ALEXIS_DH]

talk to a tri-athlete and you won't think roadies are that bad

yeah, but those guys pee on themselves, and think of it as an important skill in dire need to be mastered...

their freakiness is in a different order of magnitude.

 

[norbar]

so you are telling me you could, in a double blind test, tell me if every bolt in your bike is made out of titanium or steel? or better yet, you could record consistently lower lap times?
this is an honest yes or no question.

Why that argument still pops out? People use ti bolts (like in MANY BOLTS) because you don't sarcifice strength and loose weight. Yes it's quite obvious that even going full ti on your bike won't make a differance but little changes add up. I'm pretty sure I can feel my bike being 3lb lighter. Is it always usefull? Nope but in some cases yes so If I can do it why not?

As for geo and 5mm differances. I'm quite sure you wouldn't want your dick 5mm shorter. - see it all depends from your point of view. Don't measure your bike geo in football fields but in dick-mm. That should make that changes more significant.


also. I'm with others. If I'm spending my money why wouldn't I pick the best? Because it's cool to say - I don't care about money I'm gonna buy whatever first comes to mind? It's not really being finnicky it's called being a conscious consumer. I buy everything that way. When I pay I want the best bang for the buck.

 

[Banshee Rider]

I'm by no means a roadie, but you could argue that what they nitpick about actually does have realistic and tangible effects on their riding. There are many less variables in play as opposed to say downhill.

This.

Alot of the wank I read on here comes second place only to triathletes. Fortunately, downhill has redeeming shred qualities that overpower the lamery. 90% of what is holding posters back could be overcome by getting fit, and not riding like a girl. I became a much happier (and better) rider when I figured that out... Back to regular discussion of millimeters and compression clicks.

 

[HAB]

Quoted for truth! I work pt at a shop and have had this experience. I think DH racers/Tri athletes and high end roadies (5K+ bikes) all fall under the 'finicky' category. Having said that, however, I have seen a lot more ego massaging during the sales process need happen in the roadie end of the spectrum.

The thing that really pisses me off about dealing with tri geeks isn't just that they're picky, but also that they're (for the large part) clueless. I get **** all the time where I'm doing something like trying to fit someone to a bike, and they insist that I'm wrong because they read ___ on a forum somewhere and thus my suggestion that they do something different is obviously BS. I think the issue is that a lot of them are runners first who decided to try triathlons and thus just don't know bikes. Most roadies know enough to recognize that I know what I'm talking about and are thus a lot more tolerable.

 

[Uncle Cliffy]

This is going to get good.....

It needs this:

 

[OGRipper]

Sure, people should be more honest about actual performance benefits vs. the desire to have the latest and greatest cool stuff. But some people are just more into gear than others, and fashion has always been one of the things that keeps the industry going.

And it's not just downhillers, there are lots of finicky folks in just about every cycling niche, just like every niche also has people who don't really care and are perfectly happy riding a clapped-out, massed-produced rig with nothing special about it. BMX'ers can be surprising anal. And how about the hipster fixie clowns? Performance has nothing to do with it.

 

[Sandwich]

to quote uncle cliffy's kidwoo quote:
Originally Posted by kidwoo
The internet sounds like a tough place to ride.


nobody cares up on the hill...but when we're sitting here, unable to ride, why not chat about this or that? I highly doubt, outside of chatting on a bike forum which was created to chat about bikes, that anybody cares outside of the top 5%.

Remember, this is a bike forum, where we talk about bikes. If you don't like it, or get upset when we talk about bikes, kindly go screw. I don't get why that's so hard to understand....

 

[cableguy]

As for geo and 5mm differances. I'm quite sure you wouldn't want your dick 5mm shorter. - see it all depends from your point of view. Don't measure your bike geo in football fields but in dick-mm. That should make that changes more significant.

Quote of the Day!!!

 

[Jim Mac]

The thing that really pisses me off about dealing with tri geeks isn't just that they're picky, but also that they're (for the large part) clueless. I get **** all the time where I'm doing something like trying to fit someone to a bike, and they insist that I'm wrong because they read ___ on a forum somewhere and thus my suggestion that they do something different is obviously BS. I think the issue is that a lot of them are runners first who decided to try triathlons and thus just don't know bikes. Most roadies know enough to recognize that I know what I'm talking about and are thus a lot more tolerable.

Agreed. Case in point: dude shows up at the shop with a used double 8 speed tri bike he had purchased a month ago. His "friend" had helped him purchase online 9 speed drivetrain components and wanted to change the bike over to a triple. Problem was that his 'online purchase' was far from complete - he had cluster/chain plus derailleur but no shifter pods/front rings/cranks/BB).He looked utterly confused after I explained that his "friend" had missed a few important pieces...and oh, did I mention that he showed up at 4pm Saturday during our peak season expecting us to slap the stuff on in time for a race the next morning?

 

[demo 9]

Anybody consider the mental aspect, i know (at least me) if i am happy about how my bike feels and looks (but matching colors dont affect anything) ill be happier and ride faster. Maybe its just me, but if i was dressed factory sam hill, i would assume id probably ride faster. I can only speak for myself, but if i have a nice matching DH bike, im probably happier, and probably ride better. I dont have the times to prove it, but so much of DH riding is mental, so i think its important. If i get 6 Ti rotor bolts, and think i lowered my unsprung weight, ill be happier, and think ill do better, than potentially do better. I may be the only 1 to admit it, but i think (judging by bikes) that alot of monkeys on here match components to make it pretty, which mentally may make you faster. Now whether you get a demo 8 and go replica sam hill or not is up to you, maybe you will be faster, but can u look at yourself in the mirror

 

[norbar]

I wouldn't claim that matching colors or new Sam Hill PJ's make me faster but there is a certain placebo effect to gear when I think it is better even if after time it comes out it isn't.

 

[FlipFantasia]

Anybody consider the mental aspect, i know (at least me) if i am happy about how my bike feels and looks (but matching colors dont affect anything) ill be happier and ride faster. Maybe its just me, but if i was dressed factory sam hill, i would assume id probably ride faster. I can only speak for myself, but if i have a nice matching DH bike, im probably happier, and probably ride better. I dont have the times to prove it, but so much of DH riding is mental, so i think its important. If i get 6 Ti rotor bolts, and think i lowered my unsprung weight, ill be happier, and think ill do better, than potentially do better. I may be the only 1 to admit it, but i think (judging by bikes) that alot of monkeys on here match components to make it pretty, which mentally may make you faster. Now whether you get a demo 8 and go replica sam hill or not is up to you, maybe you will be faster, but can u look at yourself in the mirror

aaaaahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah.......hahahahah....

 

[dump]

aaaaahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah.......hahahahah....

ditto.

 

[ALEXIS_DH]

Anybody consider the mental aspect, i know (at least me) if i am happy about how my bike feels and looks (but matching colors dont affect anything) ill be happier and ride faster. Maybe its just me, but if i was dressed factory sam hill, i would assume id probably ride faster. I can only speak for myself, but if i have a nice matching DH bike, im probably happier, and probably ride better. I dont have the times to prove it, but so much of DH riding is mental, so i think its important. If i get 6 Ti rotor bolts, and think i lowered my unsprung weight, ill be happier, and think ill do better, than potentially do better. I may be the only 1 to admit it, but i think (judging by bikes) that alot of monkeys on here match components to make it pretty, which mentally may make you faster. Now whether you get a demo 8 and go replica sam hill or not is up to you, maybe you will be faster, but can u look at yourself in the mirror

i admire your honesty. cheers for that.

 

[-BB-]

As for geo and 5mm differances. I'm quite sure you wouldn't want your dick 5mm shorter. - see it all depends from your point of view. Don't measure your bike geo in football fields but in dick-mm. That should make that changes more significant.

Going from 23in to 22.75 isn't too big a deal, so I'd be ok if it were 5mm shorter. My Top Tube of course....

 

[norbar]

Going from 23in to 22.75 isn't too big a deal, so I'd be ok if it were 5mm shorter. My Top Tube of course....

Yeah, it all depends what 5mm we are talking about

btw. demo 9 bash is getting silly. It's cool to color coordinate your bike and spend ****loads of cash. You just have to pretent you are too cool for your bike and the only reason you don't ride a used stinky garbanzo you've bought off a whistler rental is because you want to support the industry. He may be a bit too vocal about his point of view but we all love new gear and would have 10 bikes if cash allowed. I know I would so stop bashing the kid.

 

[c101aviojet]

This happens in many hobbies. For most people it's easier/faster to blame their (lack of) performance on their gear than on their own limitations, and drop insane money in "upgrades" (ranging from "merely aesthetical" to "essential") instead of going out and practice eat healthy and such. When that turns into a habbit, they get finnicky.

Obviously, a lightened bike (all other things equal) will help, as well as dialing your geo. I even think a good-looking bike can induce you to ride slightly better (perhaps it gives you a bit more confidence). But the truth is training alone will make much more of a difference than all of those toghether for all but the top pro riders.

 

[bdamschen]

for me i can feel even slight differences in head angle, wheelbase, top tube length (6'4"), bar width , and wheel weight. Those are all important to me within a small tolerance.

I'm never going to get faster by having the right numbers, but I will get slower if too many are wrong.

 

[ncrider]

It's really no different than any customizable sport/hobby. I used to be in the car world and the money spent there for tiny gains in performance/looks made exotic bike parts seem very cheap/reasonable.