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Worst Advice Ever...

bluebug32

Asshat
Jan 14, 2005
6,141
0
Floating down the Hudson
In MBA this month:

Q: I'm a serious trialrider looking to get my GF into the sport. What entry-level hardtails would you recommend? Is it best to look for a female-specific design?

A: ....If you're a serious rider, your GF will not enjoy bouncing along in your dual-suspepension dust, trying to shift, brake, and stay light on a cheap saddle to save her tenderness from destruction. Take your friend to a good ski area that caters to mountain bikes, rent her a dual sus. and treat her to a weekend of riding where her climbing and technical skills will not pose a barrier to enjoying the trails. If she likes it, then go shopping for a Santa Cruz Superlight or an equivalent lightweight dual suspension. Is she has a girlie body (not every woman does), get her a girlie-specific bike.



Discuss...
 

geargrrl

Turbo Monkey
May 2, 2002
2,379
1
pnw -dry side
bluebug32 said:
In MBA this month:

Q: I'm a serious trialrider looking to get my GF into the sport. What entry-level hardtails would you recommend? Is it best to look for a female-specific design?

A: ....If you're a serious rider, your GF will not enjoy bouncing along in your dual-suspepension dust, trying to shift, brake, and stay light on a cheap saddle to save her tenderness from destruction. Take your friend to a good ski area that caters to mountain bikes, rent her a dual sus. and treat her to a weekend of riding where her climbing and technical skills will not pose a barrier to enjoying the trails. If she likes it, then go shopping for a Santa Cruz Superlight or an equivalent lightweight dual suspension. Is she has a girlie body (not every woman does), get her a girlie-specific bike.



Discuss...

ugh.
The least they could do is educate the person on what WSD is and is not.

I think most list serve riding would scare the pants off a newbie, no matter how plush the bike. Except maybe for the Elk trail at Brundage.

gg
 

Snacks

Turbo Monkey
Feb 20, 2003
3,523
0
GO! SEAHAWKS!
I'm sure glad my BF didn't take me up to Whistler when I first started riding:dead: How in the heck would I handle a 7-8" travel DH bike while riding down, yes wide green trails, but with rocks, roots, turns and tons of people watching me when I had never ridden on dirt in my life:rolleyes:

At least that guy could have mentioned signing his GF up for a woman riding clinic:oink:
 

binary visions

The voice of reason
Jun 13, 2002
22,092
1,132
NC
Wow, what completely awful advice. Not that I'd expect anything more from MBA.

Seriously, though, nice way to turn someone off to the sport. Instead of starting her off on a nice, easy, wide-open piece of beautiful single track, let's chuck her into the middle of the woods on a big, heavy bike and make her navigate rocks, roots, and switchbacks :dead:

RC is a moron. Does he have so little control that he can't figure out how to ride slowly and encourage a newbie rider?
 

sanjuro

Tube Smuggler
Sep 13, 2004
17,373
0
SF
Dear RC,

My girlfriend has never ridden a bike before. Will buying her a $2000 Juliana with X.9 parts make her a better rider, or would a full XTR group do it? Or should I buy her a V-10 and be done with it?
 

LordOpie

MOTHER HEN
Oct 17, 2002
21,022
3
Denver
sanjuro said:
Dear RC,

My girlfriend has never ridden a bike before. Will buying her a $2000 Juliana with X.9 parts make her a better rider, or would a full XTR group do it? Or should I buy her a V-10 and be done with it?
Dear Noob,

You think too small. Get her a Gixxer and she'll be your's forevah.

RC
 

sanjuro

Tube Smuggler
Sep 13, 2004
17,373
0
SF
Dear RC,

My girlfriend has never ridden a bike before. I already booked our tickets to Whistler, and should I take her down A-Line or Dirt Merchant first?
 

geargrrl

Turbo Monkey
May 2, 2002
2,379
1
pnw -dry side
bluebug32 said:
haha....I was blown away by this "advice." I've been riding for a couple of years and have yet to DH. This poor guy is about to get dumped...
and these same guys wonder why there aren't more gals out there biking...
 

altagirl

Monkey
Aug 27, 2002
160
0
Utah
Well, if it was for me - it would have been excellent advice.

I really didn't like mountain biking much until my husband took me to Sundance and we did some lift served riding. Voila - loved it. It's fairly easy, and I had virtually no skills to speak of at that point. Sure there are places that are best avoided as a newbie, but personally - climbing scared me off more than any gnarly descent. It wasn't until I started downhilling that I decided there was riding worth actually climbing to get to...

And I am more curvy than the average woman (hip-to-waist ratio), but if you assume that he's talking about frame geometry/height/etc. - I'm 5'9" and I fit just fine on men's bikes. And I personally also recommend starting on a decent FS bike, which I know is a whole other debate.
 

sanjuro

Tube Smuggler
Sep 13, 2004
17,373
0
SF
altagirl said:
Well, if it was for me - it would have been excellent advice.

I really didn't like mountain biking much until my husband took me to Sundance and we did some lift served riding. Voila - loved it. It's fairly easy, and I had virtually no skills to speak of at that point. Sure there are places that are best avoided as a newbie, but personally - climbing scared me off more than any gnarly descent. It wasn't until I started downhilling that I decided there was riding worth actually climbing to get to...

And I am more curvy than the average woman (hip-to-waist ratio), but if you assume that he's talking about frame geometry/height/etc. - I'm 5'9" and I fit just fine on men's bikes. And I personally also recommend starting on a decent FS bike, which I know is a whole other debate.
I bought my cousin, who does not ride at all, a 2005 Rockhopper Woman's bike. This was a $500 hardtail, which I lightened with some hi-quality parts I had sitting around. On the other hand, a decent full-suspension usually starts around $1200, with some of the same deficiencies as the $500 bike.

If she chooses to ride a lot of dirt or none at all, this will be an excellent starter bike, much better than she needs but did not empty my bank account.

On the other hand, this is a good debate about making it easy for novice women. Fireroad shuttling is obviously an easy way to start riding. However, pedalling is an important part of any kind of riding, and there should be an introduction to that as well.
 

binary visions

The voice of reason
Jun 13, 2002
22,092
1,132
NC
zoey said:
Oh dear-I don't know what a trials rider is? Is that different than a trail rider?
Maybe he's trying to get his girlfriend into this?



altagirl said:
I really didn't like mountain biking much <snip> - climbing scared me off more than any gnarly descent.
I probably wouldn't take my girlfriend on any trails where there was any kind of serious climbing until she figured out that she enjoyed being on two wheels. Shuttle runs, walking the bikes, or flat trails first will let someone at least get a feel for being on a bike in the woods.

OTOH, everyone's different, so maybe you still wouldn't have enjoyed it until you hit a downhill slope :)
 

zoey

Monkey
Mar 19, 2006
138
0
california
Q: I'm a serious trialrider looking to get my GF into the sport. What entry-level hardtails would you recommend? Is it best to look for a female-specific design?

Well, to be fair, you could read this as he is a trials rider and he wants his girlfriend to get into doing that kind of riding too. Maybe she already mountain bikes but is ready to step it up?

It's funny though how you never read questions like "My boyfriend is a trials rider and I'd like to learn too. What kind of bike should I get?"

It's always the guys wanting to buy their girlfriends/wives a bike.
 

stephanie

Monkey
Dec 7, 2005
308
0
East County via East Coast
This statement may get me in trouble...but, some women, when first put on a fs bike, take to it quite easily and some don't. It's all individual. The first time I ever rode a dh bike was at Bootleg Canyon. I was also comfortable with technical xc riding and knew my limits and how much I was willing to push myself. Some people, in general, are naturally more athletic and seem to have an easier time adjusting to it. On the other hand, I definitely wouldn't go out and throw down huge $$ for someone's first bike. On the other other hand, I went with a large group of friends to Whistler last year. Two of the guys brought their girlfriends who had never really ridden before, but the girls each decided to try some of the easier trails at Whistler and had a blast. I guess the point is to never make a hasty judgment about what someone will/won't like.
 

TreeSaw

Mama Monkey
Oct 30, 2003
17,669
1,847
Dancin' over rocks n' roots!
I saw this and laughed out loud. My husband took me out riding some technical trails before I was ready for them and ended up getting his old bike--the one I was riding (too big for me to begin with) thrown at him (yes, I have anger management issues). I ended up buying a Trek hardtail and rode a lot by myself until I finally went for a ride with him again. He was amazed at the progress I had made and we started riding together all the time...that was 7-8 years ago. I started DHing on a 5" bike and despite my numerous crashes and not being able to stop breaking I loved it! Now, I race XC, ride as much as I possibly can and can't wait to get back to DHing this summer!

I guess to each their own, but don't listen to RC's crappy advice if you really want to get someone into riding!
 

mohshee

Monkey
Jan 31, 2006
222
0
MD by way of Austin, TX
This conversation has caused me to flashback to my first riding-date with my now hubby. I never really knew that guys that mountain bike DREAM and FANTASIZE about girlfriends who ride. But I have come across this a lot on the forums and such, call me naive.
I had done oodles of road riding and endurance riding, but was really new to mountain biking. Anyways -- he hit this sweet little root-drop into a creek crossing with lots of rocks. He was like, 'shay, take it slow, use your brakes and you may want to stop before you hit the water'. And I was like,' ok' (i.e. eh, looks easy -- well partly b/c he made it look so easy). But i went full speed down the drop and crashed into the rockbed and separated my shouldier. It wouldn't have mattered if I had a FS bike or hardtail. I still insisted we finish the ride, partly b/c the pain hadn't really fully kicked in. I definitely got brownie points for that one.
I think guys (secretly??) like it too when their chics get 'war wounds' out in the field.
 

redFoxx

Monkey
Apr 15, 2005
319
0
Seattle
zoey said:
It's funny though how you never read questions like "My boyfriend is a trials rider and I'd like to learn too. What kind of bike should I get?"

It's always the guys wanting to buy their girlfriends/wives a bike.
I don't think it bodes well when the BF is trying to get the GF into riding...I think she needs to show some interest in getting herself set up and finding a bike to ride. I'd say whether HT or FS doesn't matter, but more importantly that it fit decently and be comfortable. Plus he will probably lose patience riding with a newbie so she should be ready to go off on her own and find places to ride and explore. My first trails were relatively easy, lots of fireroads but I just liked getting out into nature. I don't think I would have wanted to do lift-assisted but everybody's different. I'd say he needs to be listening to what she feels like doing, not what he wants.
 

urbaindk

The Real Dr. Science
Jul 12, 2004
4,819
0
Sleepy Hollar
Wow I wouldn't still be married if I had followed that advice. My wife's intro to trail riding (not trials) was rough enough. I had the bike thrown at me, kicked off into the ditch, the works and we weren't even on particularly technical trails. If I had taken her to the top of ski run and said 'follow me' I never would have seen her again.

A friend of ours gave my wife an old hybrid bike and we rode together on the road and did a few fireroads / rail trails until I was pretty sure she was interested. Then I went out an got her an entry level Giant hardtail and we started on single track. That was an experience. I was totally unprepared to teach her how to ride.

I had been riding for so many years that things that seemed completely natural to me made no sense whatsoever to her. I made a lot of mistakes in assuming what her level of riding should have been. I figured if you were in good enough physical shape to ride 10-20 miles on the road you ought to be able to ride 3-4 on single track. Well I was wrong. I totally underestimated the technical aspects of riding. Very easy trails to me were infinitely difficult to her. I had to take a lot of steps backwards to find what level rider she was. Meanwhile she was really really frustrated. Fortunately for our sake, I figured it out. She's still riding after about 2 and half years.

Now we have our trails that we ride together and those that we don't. The big thing was to realize that that was OK in the grand scheme of things. Sometimes I wish she would progress a little but she seems happy riding what she rides and just doesn't have that drive. I guess that's OK too!
 

sanjuro

Tube Smuggler
Sep 13, 2004
17,373
0
SF
redFoxx said:
I don't think it bodes well when the BF is trying to get the GF into riding...I think she needs to show some interest in getting herself set up and finding a bike to ride. I'd say whether HT or FS doesn't matter, but more importantly that it fit decently and be comfortable. Plus he will probably lose patience riding with a newbie so she should be ready to go off on her own and find places to ride and explore. My first trails were relatively easy, lots of fireroads but I just liked getting out into nature. I don't think I would have wanted to do lift-assisted but everybody's different. I'd say he needs to be listening to what she feels like doing, not what he wants.
From a shop monkey's perspective, there are two debates here:

1. Getting your gf to ride.

2. Buying your gf a bike.

There has been a lot of discussion about motivating novice women, which I will skip over. But the classic joke in the shop is buying a gf a bike. Because someone works in a shop, you will typically buy a super bike, and if your gf breaks up with you, not only are you out the money spent on this bike, if she does not ride, then this super bike is totally wasted.

Buying a more expensive full sus rather than a decent hardtail falls right into this.
 

zoey

Monkey
Mar 19, 2006
138
0
california
I have the exact opposite problem. My husband hates to ride. It would be nice to have someone who understood the obsession of singletrack. Luckily for me he lets me go biking when I want, but still I sometimes wish he liked to mountain bike.

However, I have never ever gone on a forum and said "I'm trying to get my husband into biking, what kind of bike should I buy him?"

He's been a few times, it's not his thing, so there you go.
 

redFoxx

Monkey
Apr 15, 2005
319
0
Seattle
You just can't force someone to ride and to like the same type of riding. The most I think you can do is be open if they show an interest and give all the help you can if they ask for it. I would hate to have a BF who didn't ride or who didn't like the same type of riding as me. But I do know you can't try and change someone. Luckily my BF who used to love hills and epic rides is now getting into the dark side of shuttling and jumping. :)
 

bluebug32

Asshat
Jan 14, 2005
6,141
0
Floating down the Hudson
I actually got my BF into riding. Frankly, I'm so sick of seeing posts by guys wanting to know what bike to get their GF. I can see asking about saddles or shorts or something very specific (like we all ask each other on this forum), but some guys act like girls are aliens when it comes to fitting them on a bike. Despite what advertisers for WSP gear say, women aren't worlds different than men when it comes to the basic fit of a bike. Take her to a shop instead of asking virtual people what they think and assuming that we know the body type he's talking about. And then reading about this idiot editor who refers to protecting our delicate parts (I think guys have a few more delicate parts when it comes to a saddle by the way...). It's frustrating.
 

redFoxx

Monkey
Apr 15, 2005
319
0
Seattle
bluebug32 said:
some guys act like girls are aliens when it comes to fitting them on a bike. Despite what advertisers for WSP gear say, women aren't worlds different than men when it comes to the basic fit of a bike. Take her to a shop instead of asking virtual people what they think and assuming that we know the body type he's talking about. And then reading about this idiot editor who refers to protecting our delicate parts (I think guys have a few more delicate parts when it comes to a saddle by the way...). It's frustrating.
BB, I am so totally with you on this. It's all about the body types, not the GENDER. :mumble:
 

Quo Fan

don't make me kick your ass
I met my gf on a ride. She is a roadie, and had ridden off-road only about 3 times when we met. Our second ride together, we went to Viet Nam, and to this day, she says that I'm trying to kill her. :)

She is still a beginner rider, and her technical skills are improving. I teach martial arts, so I have the patience to teach noobies, and I realize that not everybody learns at the same pace. Every ride, I evaluate her skills, and if the need arises, I introduce her to a new skill. In the 10 months we've been riding together, I can see her skills improve. She also attended a women's only skills clinic, and that helped her confidence.

The point I'm trying to get across, is to let your significant other progress at their own pace.
 

robdamanii

OMG! <3 Tom Brady!
May 2, 2005
10,677
0
Out of my mind, back in a moment.
I'm late to the party, but this dingus who's asking the question is a "trail" rider, not a trial.

Still stupid as hell advice, but what can we expect out of RC.

Edited to add:
BB and I have completely different builds, almost opposite the typical "gender body frame". I'm tall and thin boned with long legs (great for a road bike, but out of place looking on a beefy trailbike), and she's more broad shouldered and built on a heavy bone structure. Natural mountain biker. RC's advice would have gotten me shot if I had said "you need a dude's bike because you're built more like a guy than a chick".

Although I do think it would be funny to throw her onto a Stab and see what happens. :evil:
 

sanjuro

Tube Smuggler
Sep 13, 2004
17,373
0
SF
bluebug32 said:
but some guys act like girls are aliens when it comes to fitting them on a bike. Despite what advertisers for WSP gear say, women aren't worlds different than men when it comes to the basic fit of a bike. Take her to a shop instead of asking virtual people what they think and assuming that we know the body type he's talking about.
That is a good point. I realize it is not easy to fit some people. For example I sold a bike to a gangly man, and he was in a rush to ride, so instead of spending some time letting me fit him and going for a few easy test rides, he goes on my 5 hour Sunday ride. I think he walked even the uphills, and I wouldn't be surprised if he never rides again.

In comparison, this weekend a woman bought a $2000 FS bike, and even though she has not been on a bicycle, she works in a motorcycle dealership. I couldn't believe how natural she looked, even on bikes too big for her.
 

altagirl

Monkey
Aug 27, 2002
160
0
Utah
sanjuro said:
I bought my cousin, who does not ride at all, a 2005 Rockhopper Woman's bike. This was a $500 hardtail, which I lightened with some hi-quality parts I had sitting around. On the other hand, a decent full-suspension usually starts around $1200, with some of the same deficiencies as the $500 bike.

If she chooses to ride a lot of dirt or none at all, this will be an excellent starter bike, much better than she needs but did not empty my bank account.

On the other hand, this is a good debate about making it easy for novice women. Fireroad shuttling is obviously an easy way to start riding. However, pedalling is an important part of any kind of riding, and there should be an introduction to that as well.
Fireroad shuttling wasn't what I was talking about BTW - just not too technical lift served singletrack. I'm under the assumption that we're talking about someone who already has the concept of riding a bike on pavement or something, or you should be starting in a parking lot or grassy field.

It does make sense to pass on or build up a cheap starter bike for learning purpuses. But I'd say for a lot of people, why not rent/demo a bike for the first couple of MTB rides? It doesn't make sense to me to spend the money buying any decent bike until the person it's for gets a sense of what sort of riding they like. Though I'm sure you can get some general sense by what other sports they like, we have friends who insisted on light XC bikes only to hate them after a month and wish they got a decent freeride bike instead. It would have been worth the money to demo for a few days before purchasing.
 

sanjuro

Tube Smuggler
Sep 13, 2004
17,373
0
SF
The actual post:

Q. Q: I am a serious trail rider looking to get my girlfriend into this great sport. What entry level hard-tails would you recommend with a budget of approx $500. Also is it best to look for a womens-specific design?
Rob/mbaction.com - 3/30/2006 9:24:36 AM

A. RC: Most men destroy their chances of sharing the trails with their mate on their first ride. If you are a serious trail rider, your girlfriend will not enjoy bouncing aling in your dual-suspension dust, trying to negotiate unfamiliar terrain on a hardtail, while learing to shift, brake and stay light on a cheap saddle to save her tenderness from destruction. Take her to a good ski area that caters to mountain bikes, rent her the best dual suspension mountain bike in the Chalet, and treat her to a weekend of riding where her climbing and technical skills will not be a barrier to enjoying the trails. If she likes it, then go shopping for a Santa Cruz Superlight or an equivalent lightweight dual-suspension machine. If she has a girlie body (not every woman does), get her a girlie-specific bike.
 

geargrrl

Turbo Monkey
May 2, 2002
2,379
1
pnw -dry side
altagirl said:
. But I'd say for a lot of people, why not rent/demo a bike for the first couple of MTB rides? It doesn't make sense to me to spend the money buying any decent bike until the person it's for gets a sense of what sort of riding they like. Though I'm sure you can get some general sense by what other sports they like, we have friends who insisted on light XC bikes only to hate them after a month and wish they got a decent freeride bike instead. It would have been worth the money to demo for a few days before purchasing.

If you are lucky to live somewhere you can rent/demo a bike. Around here, the pickings are very slim and resmeble rail-trail bikes.
 

TreeSaw

Mama Monkey
Oct 30, 2003
17,669
1,847
Dancin' over rocks n' roots!
jdschall said:
Wow I wouldn't still be married if I had followed that advice. My wife's intro to trail riding (not trials) was rough enough. I had the bike thrown at me, kicked off into the ditch, the works and we weren't even on particularly technical trails. If I had taken her to the top of ski run and said 'follow me' I never would have seen her again.

A friend of ours gave my wife an old hybrid bike and we rode together on the road and did a few fireroads / rail trails until I was pretty sure she was interested. Then I went out an got her an entry level Giant hardtail and we started on single track. That was an experience. I was totally unprepared to teach her how to ride.

I had been riding for so many years that things that seemed completely natural to me made no sense whatsoever to her. I made a lot of mistakes in assuming what her level of riding should have been. I figured if you were in good enough physical shape to ride 10-20 miles on the road you ought to be able to ride 3-4 on single track. Well I was wrong. I totally underestimated the technical aspects of riding. Very easy trails to me were infinitely difficult to her. I had to take a lot of steps backwards to find what level rider she was.
Meanwhile she was really really frustrated. Fortunately for our sake, I figured it out. She's still riding after about 2 and half years.

Now we have our trails that we ride together and those that we don't. The big thing was to realize that that was OK in the grand scheme of things. Sometimes I wish she would progress a little but she seems happy riding what she rides and just doesn't have that drive. I guess that's OK too!
Bingo!!! My hubby had the same trouble with me. It was quite an experience for him and for me learning how to ride. Now, he's amazed at how much I have progressed and I am usually the one hounding him to go out and ride :D