Please write to NORBA, Help me solve the US National Championships puzzle

DHCorky · May 12, 2006

I have found in coorporate situations I get the best results when I go to the boss of the person I am having problems with.

Maybe we need to start sending emails to the UCI and letting them know what is going on. They could put the pressure on NORBA to change things.

FCLinder · May 12, 2006

Does the race have to be held on the West Coast? There are a few places in the East that would be glad to host the race with plenty of elevation.

stiksandstones · May 12, 2006

DHCorky said:
I have found in coorporate situations I get the best results when I go to the boss of the person I am having problems with.

Maybe we need to start sending emails to the UCI and letting them know what is going on. They could put the pressure on NORBA to change things.

That could help-but you run the risk of them putting tighter guidelines on NORBA OR anyone else trying to start an organization and UCI cares about gravity 1% more than NORBA AND technically, the boss of NORBA is you-the rider, you pay their bills.

dante · May 12, 2006

Threepointtwo said:
I posted this on another thread but it fits here:

I just got a call from Justin Rogers, the National Events Director at USA Cycling and here's what he had to say.

The UCI has designated that for a National Championship to be recognized, it must be run by a particular date. I the past, NORBA has largely ignored this rule but they will not get away with it this year. The proper date is July 16th but NORBA received a waiver to run the race on the following weekend (the Mammoth date). When Mammoth fell through, the called every other possible venue but no other venue could take the race on this date. Moving the DH championships to Deer Valley would mean that the UCI would not recognize the US national champion.

Any suggestions? Also, the flaming emails are not really helping - except they may make you feel better.

while not as feasible as a west-coast race, I can GUARANTEE you that they did not contact east-coast mountains. mt snow has nothing scheduled (according to their events calendar) between their local series race on the 9th to their junior golf camp starting on the 25th, and with the amount of $$$ that a NORBA race (let alone a National Championships) brings, I can't see them turning them down. :mad:

stiksandstones · May 12, 2006

I think Todd S brought it up in another thread, a big cluster F was the dates, to be recognized by UCI, a race had to be held by a certain date???
All that stuff just confuses me

PatBranch · May 12, 2006

Hopefully EC is working on it.

Secret Squirrel · May 12, 2006

stiksandstones said:
I think Todd S brought it up in another thread, a big cluster F was the dates, to be recognized by UCI, a race had to be held by a certain date???
All that stuff just confuses me

Seeing as how the Deer Valley National is on the 8th and 9th of July...I don't see how the argument of "It would be too late" works...that's a week BEFORE the 16th....wtf??

stephanie · May 12, 2006

Threepointtwo said:
I posted this on another thread but it fits here:

I just got a call from Justin Rogers, the National Events Director at USA Cycling and here's what he had to say.

The UCI has designated that for a National Championship to be recognized, it must be run by a particular date. I the past, NORBA has largely ignored this rule but they will not get away with it this year. The proper date is July 16th but NORBA received a waiver to run the race on the following weekend (the Mammoth date). When Mammoth fell through, the called every other possible venue but no other venue could take the race on this date. Moving the DH championships to Deer Valley would mean that the UCI would not recognize the US national champion.

Any suggestions? Also, the flaming emails are not really helping - except they may make you feel better.

If that due date is true, then Deer Valley would be held a week before the actual cutoff.

Threepointtwo · May 12, 2006

Secret Squirrel said:
Seeing as how the Deer Valley National is on the 8th and 9th of July...I don't see how the argument of "It would be too late" works...that's a week BEFORE the 16th....wtf??

Good question. You may want to ask your friendly NORBA rep. I think these guys want to do what's best but this is a bad situation. If you have good ideas, let them know.

coma13 · May 12, 2006

I just drafted this letter to ABA and I'll be sending it to the President, Vice President, and National Director as soon as I get the issue date of the Norba article in Decline.

ABA Officials,

My name is Eric Thompson and I have a question for you. Does the American Bicycle Association have room for more than just BMX racing? I ask because the mountain bike community, specifically the disciplines of Downhill, Mountaincross, and Dual Slalom (who I will be referring to as "gravity riders") are in need of an efficient, experienced, and dedicated organizing body.

The ABA has shown, throughout the years, its dedication to the sport and theriders by maintaining a successful series, incorporating outside sponsors, and keeping the sport exciting for the riders. This is precisely the organization and management that the mountain bike c, which is on the threshold of booming, needs.

Currently the only national mountain bike racing series is the NORBA series organized by USA Cycling. Throughout the past years, USA Cycling has displayed a complete lack of concern for the gravity riders and a strict dedication to road and cross country racing. This is evidenced in their recent decision to hold the US National Championship at Infineon Raceway in Sonoma, CA, a venue with 800 feet of vertical drop at best. This decision left the gravity community stunned and caused me to think again about our relationship with USA Cycling. Mountain bike gravity events have much more in common with BMX racing than they do with cross country and road cycling. Sure, the gravity bikes have big wheels and gears, but the similarities end there. The gravity riders' distaste for the current state of the NORBA series was well stated in an article by Decline Magazine in the ?????? Issue.

There are currently tens of thousands of registered mountain bike gravity racers in the USA. The general consensus is a state of frustration with the organizing body of USA Cycling. While they flounder, local series throughout the country such as: Southridge Winter Series (www.southridgeusa.com), the Diablo Domination DH Series (www.diablofreeridepark.com), and many others across the states flourish on a local level.

The interest is there, the riders are there, the money is there, what is lacking is a decisive governing force with an interest in the riders and the sport to promote a successful national series. There are more than ample venues coast to coast, such as: Mt. Baldy, CA (under construction); Mammoth Mountain, CA; Angelfire, NM; Deer Valley, UT; Colorado Springs, CO; Mt. Snow, VT; Mountain Creek, NJ, and a host of other potential venues throughout the Appalachians, Rockies, and other mountain ranges that populate our land mass.

Logistically, running a gravity event is essentially the same as a BMX race, the only difference is the need for a chair lift or effective shuttle system. Downhill courses are already in place at nearly every mountain resort throughout the country and with some experienced assistance, any major resort, with the desire to do so, could host a national caliber event.

I sincerely appreciate the time taken to read and consider this suggestion. If you have any additional questions, or would like the opinion of any mountain bike industry leaders, please let me know and I will do everything in my power to facilitate the connection.

Thanks again,

Eric Thompson
Rogue Mountain Bike Apparel
760-458-4479
www.roguemtb.com

dante · May 12, 2006

coma13 said:
I just drafted this letter to ABA and I'll be sending it to the President, Vice President, and National Director as soon as I get the issue date of the Norba article in Decline.

ABA Officials,

<snip>

not positive about the elevation, but someone posted a topo map that showed that the elevation at the very top of the hill was 670'. Don't know where the ending elevation is, but it's a LOT less than 800' vert.

stiksandstones · May 12, 2006

^^^ that's the goods!!

coma13 · May 12, 2006

Can anyone give me the issue date of that Decline article?

PatBranch · May 12, 2006

Here is my norba one; don't have an ABA one yet.

Steve Johnson
CEO of USA Cycling

Jim Ochowicz
Chairman of the Board

Dear Steve Johnson and Jim Ochowicz,
The downhill course at Infineon Raceway in Sonoma, CA may be a great course for smaller races, but it is not nearly fit for a national event. First, it lacks the technical features and terrain necessary to test professional athletes' skill. Second, the hill at Infineon Raceway is not very tall at all when compared to places like Mammoth mountain.

Downhill races require a decent sized mountain with technical features such as rockgardens, jumps, drops, hard technical corners, fast open sections, steep downhill sections, etc. This terrain challenges downhill mountain bike racers and gives the course variety.

Replacing such a great event (Mammoth) with a place like Infineon Raceway would be dumb. If the Mammoth Mountain National race had been scheduled to later this year, (in case they got a lot of snow, which happened) this whole mess would have not been produced.

A realistic option would be one of the many downhill mountain bike resorts on East Coast (Plattekill, Snowshoe, Diablo, Mountain Creek, Whiteface, Hunter, Gore, Killington, Mt Snow, etc.) or places like Durango and Vail, Colorado, Brian Head, Utah in the Midwest would be great.

We (downhill mountain bikers) pay a lot of money to race, therefore, we deserve quality events.

Sincerely,
Patrick Branch

coma13 · May 12, 2006

dante said:
not positive about the elevation, but someone posted a topo map that showed that the elevation at the very top of the hill was 670'. Don't know where the ending elevation is, but it's a LOT less than 800' vert.

If someone can get me a more accurate figure I'll amend it before I send it.

Transcend · May 12, 2006

mtnbrider said:
Here is my norba one; don't have an ABA one yet.

Steve Johnson
CEO of USA Cycling

Jim Ochowicz
Chairman of the Board

Dear, Steve Johnson and Jim Ochowicz
The downhill course at Infineon Raceway in Sonoma, CA may be a great course for smaller races, but it is not nearly fit for a national event. First, it lacks the technical features and terrain necessary to test professional athletes' skill. Second, the hill at Infineon Raceway is not very tall at all when compared to places like Mammoth mountain.

Downhill races require a decent sized mountain with technical features such as rockgardens, jumps, drops, hard technical corners, fast open sections, steep downhill sections, etc. This terrain challenges downhill mountain bike racers and gives the course variety.

Replacing such a great event (Mammoth) with a place like Infineon Raceway would be dumb. If the Mammoth Mountain National race had been scheduled to later this year, (in case they got a lot of snow, which happened) this whole mess would have not been produced.

A realistic option would be one of the many downhill mountain bike resorts on East Coast (Plattekill, Snowshoe, Diablo, Mountain Creek, Whiteface, Hunter, Gore, Killington, Mt Snow, etc.) or places like Durango and Vail, Colorado, Brian Head, Utah in the Midwest would be great.

We (downhill mountain bikers) pay a lot of money to race, therefore, we deserve quality events.

Sincerely,
Patrick Branch

How old are you again? This is an example of a perfectly written letter by a kid. Good job. :thumb:

Please don't tell me an 18 year old in college cannot write a letter like this kid.

jonKranked · May 12, 2006

coma13 said:
I just drafted this letter to ABA and I'll be sending it to the President, Vice President, and National Director as soon as I get the issue date of the Norba article in Decline.

VERY well written. :thumb:

PatBranch · May 12, 2006

Transcend said:
How old are you again? This is an example of a perfectly written letter by a kid. Good job.

Please don't tell me an 18 year old in college cannot write a letter like this kid.

Thanks! I'm 16. It took half an hour during my photo class at a city college.

Transcend · May 12, 2006

mtnbrider said:
Thanks! I'm 16. It took half an hour during my photo class at a city college.

probably not the wisest choice of places to write it however.... :rofl:

PatBranch · May 12, 2006

I'm doing well in it.

coma13 · May 12, 2006

Was The Norba Article In The December 2005 Issue???

stephanie · May 12, 2006

i wish i was home, because i'd have an answer for you by now, eric. i'll keep checking back and if nobody's written in, i'll let you know once school is done for the day.

coma13 · May 12, 2006

stephanie said:
i wish i was home, because i'd have an answer for you by now, eric. i'll keep checking back and if nobody's written in, i'll let you know once school is done for the day.

Thanks Stephanie, I appreciate it!

Rye_Bread · May 12, 2006

Threepointtwo said:
I posted this on another thread but it fits here:

I just got a call from Justin Rogers, the National Events Director at USA Cycling and here's what he had to say.

The UCI has designated that for a National Championship to be recognized, it must be run by a particular date. I the past, NORBA has largely ignored this rule but they will not get away with it this year. The proper date is July 16th but NORBA received a waiver to run the race on the following weekend (the Mammoth date). When Mammoth fell through, the called every other possible venue but no other venue could take the race on this date. Moving the DH championships to Deer Valley would mean that the UCI would not recognize the US national champion.

Any suggestions? Also, the flaming emails are not really helping - except they may make you feel better.

what's his email address?

dante · May 12, 2006

Rye_Bread said:
what's his email address?

'jrogers@NOSPAMusacycling.org'

blt2ride · May 12, 2006

stiksandstones said:
With EC out for a few weeks with broken collarbone, this would be a good time for him to really get on the new governing body thing

I’m keeping my fingers crossed that the ABA will get involved in mountain biking. At this point, it’s safe to assume that NORBA is not going to make any improvements; which means that we need to start looking in another direction if we want to keep gravity racing alive.

I have been a member of the ABA for a long time, and have always been pretty happy with them as an organization—they actually listen to the riders and care enough to make improvements when they see fit. In addition, with Eric Carter’s help, I think the ABA can become a viable alternative to the NORBA Nationals.

To be honest, the one thing that irritates me the most is the fact that NORBA just doesn’t care about gravity racing. They don’t listen to peoples’ suggestions, and have absolutely no desire to make things any better for us. They continue to charge us more money and give us less...

coma13 · May 12, 2006

blt2ride said:
Im keeping my fingers crossed that the ABA will get involved in mountain biking. At this point, its safe to assume that NORBA is not going to make any improvements; which means that we need to start looking in another direction if we want to keep gravity racing alive.

I have been a member of the ABA for a long time, and have always been pretty happy with them as an organizationthey actually listen to the riders and care enough to make improvements when they see fit. In addition, with Eric Carters help, I think the ABA can become a viable alternative to the NORBA Nationals.

To be honest, the one thing that irritates me the most is the fact that NORBA just doesnt care about gravity racing. They dont listen to peoples suggestions, and have absolutely no desire to make things any better for us. They continue to charge us more money and give us less...

I just emailed off my letter to ABA. It's nice to hear that there are other people talking to them already (anyone other than EC?). Maybe Brian Lopes' presence in the Decline article will ring true with them since he obviously was heavily tied with the the BMX scene.

stiksandstones · May 12, 2006

coma13 said:
I just emailed off my letter to ABA. It's nice to hear that there are other people talking to them already (anyone other than EC?). Maybe Brian Lopes' presence in the Decline article will ring true with them since he obviously was heavily tied with the the BMX scene.

Email Lo-pants about it, maybe he could ring the ABA as well.

coma13 · May 12, 2006

stiksandstones said:
Email Lo-pants about it, maybe he could ring the ABA as well.

contact? I don't have his addy. if you've got it, hit me back via PM.

stiksandstones · May 12, 2006

coma13 said:
contact? I don't have his addy. if you've got it, hit me back via PM.

there is one on his website
www.brianlopes.com

BC VAN · May 12, 2006

just by putting up your thoughts here the ABA will see it, i forward all the links to Shannon, and those guys take a look at everything posted here.
we have done a sight inspection for an event hopefully to be held this september, i can tell you we are working towards one event first and then more if the industry and riders want it?

Secret Squirrel · May 12, 2006

BC VAN said:
just by putting up your thoughts here the ABA will see it, i forward all the links to Shannon, and those guys take a look at everything posted here.
we have done a sight inspection for an event hopefully to be held this september, i can tell you we are working towards one event first and then more if the industry and riders want it?

Keep it rockin' in the free world! :cool:

Msisle Dad · May 12, 2006

BC VAN said:
just by putting up your thoughts here the ABA will see it, i forward all the links to Shannon, and those guys take a look at everything posted here.
we have done a sight inspection for an event hopefully to be held this september, i can tell you we are working towards one event first and then more if the industry and riders want it?

We would travel to support the event., And if you can create a series all the better.

SPrider · May 12, 2006

if you build it, they will come

stephanie · May 12, 2006

coma13 said:
Was The Norba Article In The December 2005 Issue???

eric, just verifying that yes, the december 05 issue (#19) has on the
cover: "the death of NORBA and the end of a relationship?"

tacobelldhr · May 12, 2006

Brian, i'm sure everyone here who knows the dh community has to respect your sense of trying to change something one way or another. Regardless of your spelling, its the fact that NORBA despises us so badly that 3 or 4 "drunken downhillers" if you will cannot make a difference. All though it's a sad thing but that's how it is and unfortunetly for us our community sucks because of it....So there for im going to try my hardest to do my best and have fun. Because if everyone is consentrating so hard on hating NORBA and bieng mad about where they are at, i will be riding happily.

-jake

Murphy's Law · May 13, 2006

This may be a bit off topic, but what if an organizer stepped up and created a new national circuit for gravity racers only? I mean look at the US Open. PERFECT EXAMPLE of the fact that we don't need norba. that race in its 4th year has offered more cash purse than NORBA has since its inception. IMHO Norba took a nose dive into the toilet the moment USA CYCYLING took over. I have been racing the NORBA Nationals since 97, and have seen nothing but a steady decline in # of racers and spectators for that matter, over the years. If the guys up at mountaincreek can pull off such a successful race every year, whats to say we can't make a series out of it? leave NORBA out of it. add a mountaincross race, get 5 or 6 more venues across the country and start our own series. Started by Gravity racers, FOR gravity racers. I believe someone earlier in this thread said something to the effect of NORBA not wanting anything to do with the Gravity racing scene. So if we are a tumor to them, why do we continue to give them thousands and thousands of dollars that they don't really turn around and invest in our racing?????

Motionboy2 · May 13, 2006

Murphy's Law said:
This may be a bit off topic, but what if an organizer stepped up and created a new national circuit for gravity racers only? I mean look at the US Open. PERFECT EXAMPLE of the fact that we don't need norba. that race in its 4th year has offered more cash purse than NORBA has since its inception. IMHO Norba took a nose dive into the toilet the moment USA CYCYLING took over. I have been racing the NORBA Nationals since 97, and have seen nothing but a steady decline in # of racers and spectators for that matter, over the years. If the guys up at mountaincreek can pull off such a successful race every year, whats to say we can't make a series out of it? leave NORBA out of it. add a mountaincross race, get 5 or 6 more venues across the country and start our own series. Started by Gravity racers, FOR gravity racers. I believe someone earlier in this thread said something to the effect of NORBA not wanting anything to do with the Gravity racing scene. So if we are a tumor to them, why do we continue to give them thousands and thousands of dollars that they don't really turn around and invest in our racing?????

The problem isn't whether an organizer will step up, from what I understand the problem is that USA cycling holds the power. If an event organizer steps up they can have a national series, it would probably be fantastic, but since USA cycling is the governing body, they could choose not to recognize it and therefore the new national series would mean nothing to the rest of the world.

Unfortunately, again, from what I understand, you can't just start a race series and petition the UCI to become the official national series, you have to go to USA cycling and somehow retain the rights. When you retain the rights then you would be able to award points, and have the power to send riders to world competition.

That is why this is such a difficult process.

IronDad · May 14, 2006

Is there a specific rule (UCI, USCF, Norba) that prevents Norba from holding the XC national championships on a different weekend from the DH national championships?

Please write to NORBA, Help me solve the US National Championships puzzle

Monkey

Turbo Monkey

Turbo Monkey

Unabomber

Turbo Monkey

Turbo Monkey

There is no Justice!

Monkey

Monkey

Turbo Monkey

Unabomber

Turbo Monkey

Turbo Monkey

Turbo Monkey

Turbo Monkey

My Nuts Are Flat

Detective Dookie

Turbo Monkey

My Nuts Are Flat

Turbo Monkey

Turbo Monkey

Monkey

Turbo Monkey

Monkey

Unabomber

Turbo Monkey

Turbo Monkey

Turbo Monkey

Turbo Monkey

Turbo Monkey

Monkey

There is no Justice!

Monkey

Monkey

Monkey

Monkey

Monkey

Monkey

Calendar Dominator

Chimp