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IH Yakuza vs Sunday frame

S

Storchi

Chimp
Jan 31, 2007
16
0
Austria
Hi! I know that's another weird question, but:

How much in % is the Sunday frame better in suspension grip performancethan the Yakuza???? Sunday 100%- Yakuza 80% of the Sunday performance???
I know it depends on the shock- just lets compare with the same shock- a Fox Van R of 2007 (Sunday Expert and 07 Yakuzas).
I'm just curious because the geometry is almost the same (if you watch the IH homepage)........
Sorry for my English:monkeydance:
 
J

JRogers

talks too much
Mar 19, 2002
3,785
1
Claremont, CA
I'm sure someone will chime in with better info, but I know that the E-13 team here last year ran Yakuzas instead of Sundays. The Yakuza is a fine, durable frame and is lighter and cheaper than the Sunday.
 
skatetokil

skatetokil

Turbo Monkey
Jan 2, 2005
2,383
-1
DC/Bluemont VA
Well, the sunday is certainly going to pedal and brake better. DWlink makes some claims about traction that are extremely difficult to test, but the racer bois seem to love it. i just bought a yakuza type r but i'm waiting on a brake adapter and i havent had a chance to give it a real ride yet.
 
bdamschen

bdamschen

Turbo Monkey
Nov 28, 2005
3,377
156
Spreckels, CA
I have a kumicho type r, and it works great. It's pretty light, pretty simple was pretty cheap and is pretty fun to ride. I don't feel like the bike holds me back at all.

I've never rode a sunday, but I'm sure it's more plush, and probably tracks better than the kumicho, but I'm prefectly happy with what I'm riding.

Either one is a great bike, but you also probably get what you pay for.
 
ska todd

ska todd

Turbo Monkey
Oct 10, 2001
1,776
0
I've had more than one pro rider or magazine guy tell me "If you guys didn't make the Sunday, this would be one of the most popular DH bikes on the circuit."

Bottom line is that the bike is tight & light with some killer geometry...the low price and the fact that the Sunday is it's bigger brother just over shadow it some.

-ska todd
 
G

General Lee

Turbo Monkey
Oct 16, 2003
2,860
0
The 802
ska todd said:
I've had more than one pro rider or magazine guy tell me "If you guys didn't make the Sunday, this would be one of the most popular DH bikes on the circuit."

Bottom line is that the bike is tight & light with some killer geometry...the low price and the fact that the Sunday is it's bigger brother just over shadow it some.

-ska todd
Click to expand...
word! a certain bike i rode for the past 4 years comes to mind as a reason the Yakuza is a fully capable race bike. light, simple, good geometry, durable. . . . pretty much all you need. the first time i have to clean my sunday this year i'll be reminded how spoiled i've been with my previous frames.

get the shock dialed and it'll work great.
 
jcook90

jcook90

Turbo Monkey
Mar 3, 2006
1,211
1
Connecticut
my friend has one. he likes it except he broke the swingarm last week, it was a rental bike before he got it though. sounds like they're somewhat similar, a bit cheaper too, right?
 
Pip3r

Pip3r

Turbo Monkey
Nov 20, 2001
1,112
0
Foxboro MA
I beat the piss out of a Kumicho for this past season and got pretty comfortable on it. I have a shorter shock on it so it is lower and slacker than stock, more similar to a sunday (although it may be even lower and slacker than a sunday)
In retrospect, I think I wish I just ran the stock shock on it as I was clipping my pedals a ton.
Anywho, the bike pedals great especially for a single pivot. I ran mine without a floater so it did get choppy down steep chutes and all but never really bothered me.
For the most part, they do ride quite similar to the Sunday except at higher speeds the Kumicho has a bit more trouble tracking. Overall though it will provide a very similar riding style to the sunday and is way more than capable for most racers, not to mention its simplicity over the sunday.
 
dexter

dexter

Turbo Monkey
Sep 23, 2001
3,053
99
Boise, Idaho
the one i rode was dope, shorter shock, 7 inch 888 rc2x and a nasty build super light. if i was buying a bike i would totaly build one up in two seconds
 
skatetokil

skatetokil

Turbo Monkey
Jan 2, 2005
2,383
-1
DC/Bluemont VA
also, on the shorter shock did you guys still have a 2.5 inch stroke? how short can you go before the link clips your control lines like a pair of scissors?
 
Pip3r

Pip3r

Turbo Monkey
Nov 20, 2001
1,112
0
Foxboro MA
skatetokil said:
also, on the shorter shock did you guys still have a 2.5 inch stroke? how short can you go before the link clips your control lines like a pair of scissors?
Click to expand...
it actually had was an 8.75x2.75, where as the stock is an 9.0x2.75
Same travel diff geometry. This may void your warrenty though, not totally sure.
I did have some issues with the swingarm pinching off my brake lines and the cables rubbing into the frame. I changed up the brake routing alittle and dont think there will be any issues with it being pinched now but the rubbing i dont see much of a way around aside from putting some kind of protection on there.
 
Pip3r

Pip3r

Turbo Monkey
Nov 20, 2001
1,112
0
Foxboro MA
skatetokil said:
so if you got creative with your routing you could also run a 9.0x3 for a little more travel.
Click to expand...
That is something I hadnt even thought of untill half way through this season. You could just run a bit more sag with the extra travel to slacken and lower the bike out. I am not sure how well that would work, it would certainly be interesting. Not too many companies make that size though correct?
I would be very worried about the swingarm contacting the mainframe, as it is very close with the 8.75x2.75 already.
You could always just drill out a block of wood as if a 9.0x3 shock was bottomed and pop it in there and see how it would sit.
As is, I've never heard of anyone doing this.
 
Lumagent Morple

Lumagent Morple

Monkey
Mar 4, 2003
145
0
Somewhere in Alabama
An 8.75" x 2.75" shock will bottom out with 6" of shock left (if that makes sense). A 9" x 3" shock will bottom out with 6" of shock left also. Basically, if your 8.75" x 2.75" shock clears when it is fully compressed, the 9" x 3" will too.
 
haromtnbiker

haromtnbiker

Turbo Monkey
Oct 3, 2004
1,461
0
Cary, NC
Pip3r said:
it actually had was an 8.75x2.75, where as the stock is an 9.0x2.75
Same travel diff geometry. This may void your warrenty though, not totally sure.
Click to expand...
I'm in the same deal. I don't really like the swinger 4 way on mine now, and I want a dhx that only comes in 8.75x2.75. That would probably make the bb maybe too low for me.

Here is mine now:
 
Pip3r

Pip3r

Turbo Monkey
Nov 20, 2001
1,112
0
Foxboro MA
haromtnbiker said:
I'm in the same deal. I don't really like the swinger 4 way on mine now, and I want a dhx that only comes in 8.75x2.75. That would probably make the bb maybe too low for me.
Click to expand...
what travel are you running your 40 at? I ran an 8" travis on mine with the lower shock which will raise the BB and slacken the HA more than with a 7".
 
haromtnbiker

haromtnbiker

Turbo Monkey
Oct 3, 2004
1,461
0
Cary, NC
I have the fox at 8 inches now, but the crowns are down as low as I can go. If I got the 8.75x2.75 dhx I might lower the fork to 7 or 7.5 travel so it's not so slack. But then again, the bb would be uber low! :twitch:

 
B

bushrider

Monkey
Jul 4, 2006
146
0
NYC
Only Avalanche and Romic make 9.0 X 3.0 sized shocks.
FYI avy will also make odd sizes like 9.25 X 3.0.
A mate of mine has this size on his turner DHR, saves drilling a new shock mount in the swingarm for slacker geo.

Stratos may have made an El Jeffe in that size also.
 
Capt. Jack Sparrow

Capt. Jack Sparrow

Monkey
Jan 7, 2004
686
0
D.C. area
I loved my Yakuza Kumicho that I rode last year. Excellent bike for the price.

The Yakuza seems to be all the rage. I used to not get blogs hits about the Yakuza but since I sold mine (quit DH racing) last fall I get a couple hits a day from all over the world of people searching on Yakuzas.
 
heikkihall

heikkihall

Monkey
Dec 14, 2001
882
0
Durango, CO
I think that I can safely say that I am one of the few people in the world that has owned, ridden and raced both a Yakuza and a Sunday with nearly identical builts in the same season.

Here is my comparison. The Yakuza is light and nimble. It pedals well, absorbs bumps well, and brakes well. With a shorter shock I was able to get the geometry very close to eachother. In the tight woods of the easy coast I think that the Yakuza would be unbeatable in the right hands. It is one of my favorite bikes that I have ever owned or ridden.

The Sunday seems to be purely race bred, especially for your typical World Cup/ National style race course. It is right at home once the speeds are high. The faster you go the more stable it seems to become. It pedals, absorbs bumbs, and brakes even better but the difference is still not huge. I can flat out and honestly say that the Sunday is my favorite bike that I have ever ridden.

If you have any other questions please feel free to ask.
 
D

dw

Wiffle Ball ninja
Sep 10, 2001
2,943
0
MV
I have spent a lot of time on both the Sunday and Kumicho, and I designed both bikes. I think that the Kumicho is an awesome bike. It's unconventional pivot location makes for a bike with very good performance characteristics. I think that Heikki bascally summed it up. The Kumicho is a great bike, it just gets overshadowed by the Sunday and its nastiness sometimes. If the Kumicho had a Turner sticker on it the bike would be on the top of a lot of rider's lists.
 
haromtnbiker

haromtnbiker

Turbo Monkey
Oct 3, 2004
1,461
0
Cary, NC
Yea, I was thinking what makes other single pivots like the izumu and 224 better than a yakuza? If they both have the same rear shock, then nothing really. That's just my opinion though.
 
skatetokil

skatetokil

Turbo Monkey
Jan 2, 2005
2,383
-1
DC/Bluemont VA
any idea of the frame weight on the yakuza? I've seen plenty of izumus and 224s in the 35lb range but most people seem to build plow bikes with the kumichos. I have yet to throw mine on the scale but i would put it in the 40s.
 
D

dw

Wiffle Ball ninja
Sep 10, 2001
2,943
0
MV
haromtnbiker said:
Yea, I was thinking what makes other single pivots like the izumu and 224 better than a yakuza? If they both have the same rear shock, then nothing really. That's just my opinion though.
Click to expand...
I think that the Morewoods and Oranges are pretty nice single pivots. The Kumicho has a radically different pivot placement from both. The Kumicho feels quite different than an Orange in my opinion.
 
Tenacious Doug

Tenacious Doug

Monkey
Dec 25, 2003
402
0
Edinburgh, Scotland
dw said:
I think that the Morewoods and Oranges are pretty nice single pivots. The Kumicho has a radically different pivot placement from both. The Kumicho feels quite different than an Orange in my opinion.
Click to expand...
Can you tell us what difference the pivot location on the Yakuza makes in terms of physics and real world riding compared to the Morewoods and Oranges?
 
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