the next big thing

STpS technology.

Starfish Tension Predictive Suspension.

Your suspension automatically compensates for terrain, bases on how hard your arse is clenched up.

Single track? Suspension firms up,everything is all good.

First World Cup DH race? Your starfish tightens to the point that its argueable that theres even a hole there, and your suspension loosens up and gets ready to deal with the crap its about to see.


its the future I tells ya.

things would be considerably worse, but man they'd be entertaining.

Fork Oil tastes bad. Jello however, does not. The solution seems easy to me.

I think that the prices is the only thing that can move, like i know how great forks like the 40 and bos are but $1500 plus for a fork, when you really sit back and think about it its rediculous.

SRS Airbags.
Your body armour is attached via rip cord to your handlebars, as soon as you crash the rip cord is pulled and the airbag armour is deployed. You walk away from any crash unscathed.

Seriously though, I think there is plenty of development happening out there, it just takes time to surface.
Look at GT's Fury, Nicolai is still working on the gearbox. Millyard's seem to be in talks regarding their shock.
Sure there is no RN01, but maybe things are a bit more underground and small time at the moment..

dropmachine.com said:

STpS technology.

Starfish Tension Predictive Suspension.

Your suspension automatically compensates for terrain, bases on how hard your arse is clenched up.

Single track? Suspension firms up,everything is all good.

First World Cup DH race? Your starfish tightens to the point that its argueable that theres even a hole there, and your suspension loosens up and gets ready to deal with the crap its about to see.


its the future I tells ya.

Click to expand...

You know that's not as stupid as it first initially appears.

You could have a magnetically controlled ferro fluid like the Audi's and have input from cranks and brakes as well as speedo and maybe an inclinometer.

You could have the forks firm right up under braking, have the back firm up under pedaling, on fast but level terrain filled with fist size rocks everything could become lossy goosy. You could have a couple of micro switches that detected top-out and if for long enough, would prepare for touchdown.

On a step section forks would firm right up.

It's a fantastical idea.

Edit....Forget the magnetic ride, just have a few electric motors hooked the compression adjusters. They'd react fast enough if the threads on the adjusters were course.

So basically you've described a Williams F1 car from back in the days of Nigel Mansell.

Should be cheap to rig up.

MrPlow said:

SRS Airbags.
Your body armour is attached via rip cord to your handlebars, as soon as you crash the rip cord is pulled and the airbag armour is deployed. You walk away from any crash unscathed.
Seriously though, I think there is plenty of development happening out there, it just takes time to surface.
Look at GT's Fury, Nicolai is still working on the gearbox. Millyard's seem to be in talks regarding their shock.
Sure there is no RN01, but maybe things are a bit more underground and small time at the moment..

Click to expand...

You mean like this???

http://www.mrtrailer.com/htwhitair.htm

Horizontal wheel paths
Nah seriously im still holding out for an internal transmission that'l hit the spot

1) Automatic front and rear travel adjust, hydraulicaly without electronics
2) Integrated CVT transmission able to compete with Rohloff Speedhub

But my top-most priority is to say goodbye to derailures...

dilzy said:

You know that's not as stupid as it first initially appears.

You could have a magnetically controlled ferro fluid like the Audi's and have input from cranks and brakes as well as speedo and maybe an inclinometer.

You could have the forks firm right up under braking, have the back firm up under pedaling, on fast but level terrain filled with fist size rocks everything could become lossy goosy. You could have a couple of micro switches that detected top-out and if for long enough, would prepare for touchdown.

On a step section forks would firm right up.

It's a fantastical idea.

Edit....Forget the magnetic ride, just have a few electric motors hooked the compression adjusters. They'd react fast enough if the threads on the adjusters were course.

Click to expand...

nah, where would the consistancy be? you would never know how your bike would react and therefore any adjustment you make to riding position or if you tried to bunny hop or preload a jump, it would most likely be impossible to do with any consistancy. the rider would become the passenger.

Well last year we saw that skinsuits provided such an aerodynamic advantage that they've been banned. So it seems to me aerodynamics, especially for the rider, should be an area of advancement. Slipperier fabrics, helmet/visor/google streamlining, attention to detail when it comes to cuffs, collars, etc.

You might even end up with downhillers finally having their own image (even though I don't really subscribe to that BS complaint in the first place).

I think the Leatt is also a good advance - would like to see more WC pros in them to promote safety.

And of course I think shock tech will continue to improve, with forks catching up with some of the tech we've already got on rear shocks. Fast rebound technology from the offroad motorsport side is more appropriate for forks than rear shocks since fork rebound is less likely to eject a rider.

Just a few things that I would be working on if I were in the bike industry...

primo661 said:

nah, where would the consistancy be? you would never know how your bike would react and therefore any adjustment you make to riding position or if you tried to bunny hop or preload a jump, it would most likely be impossible to do with any consistancy. the rider would become the passenger.

Click to expand...

If it reacted fast enough and was integrated smoothly, it would just feel like you had perfect suspension setup for every situation. That would take some getting used to, but it wouldn't be long.

I agree with the bloke up a bit that getting rid of derailleurs is a high priority. For dh, someone needs to come up with a reasonably priced 5 speed gearbox that is compact and as close to the weight of a 9 speed cassette+derailleur.

Most gearbox's are very volumetrically in-efficient.

It would be nice to see one mounted up with a split pivot.

lighter dh tires ! it seems the weight of dh tires havnt changed in many years .i would love a sub (sub) 1000g dh worthy tire.

DirtyMike said:

You mean like this???

http://www.mrtrailer.com/htwhitair.htm

Click to expand...

Holy ShlIt I was joking

dilzy said:

I agree with the bloke up a bit that getting rid of derailleurs is a high priority. For dh, someone needs to come up with a reasonably priced 5 speed gearbox that is compact and as close to the weight of a 9 speed cassette+derailleur.

Most gearbox's are very volumetrically in-efficient.

Click to expand...

I agree, lets see some of that

xy9ine said:

things have been a bit boring from a technological development & innovation standpoint these days (pertaining to big go fast bikes). we've reached a point where most gear works pretty damn good, at a decent strength to weight ratio & reasonable value. we seem to have reached a point of incremental refinement vs radical change. cockpit layout, geometry, suspension technology & travel, and transmissions are nearing a uniform standard. not unlike moto-x, are we reaching a nexus of commonality in terms of an optimum dh platform design? ........
................any other areas that might see radical redevelopment in the near or distant future?

Click to expand...

they probably felt the same way in the early 90s. but I do tend to agree with you, it seems like nothing is happening.

the only thing I can see in the near future is a single pivot revival (higher mounted rearward path) and a big steel (4130) come back.

wireless shifting
body armour with integrated leatt brace

xy9ine said:

this actually surprises me as well. considering the considerable performance advantages of light rubber, why can't someone build dh-able tires with funky lightweight materials (ie, a non steel bead thats still rigid, lighter rubber compounds, etc). i'd also like to see a dead reliable, easy to use tubeless standard that doesn't require sealant.

Click to expand...

This is actually one area where I don't think you'll see that much improvement. OK, we might see mid-weight DH tires coming out of Specialized for all mountain / slope style type applications, but I don't think you'll see Sam Hill on them.

In fact, as far as I know, no top level pros even run tubeless. Some say this is so the mechanics can make quick and easy tire changes for conditions, or burping under high loads, etc. but I reckon it's more than that. I think that the two ply tire and tube gives just the right amount of stiffness and damping at race pressures for maximum grip.

Lighter rubber? I'm not sure that's physically possible. That's like lighter water...

If you cut up a Maxxis DH tire, which come in around 1200-1300g these days, you'll see there's not too much more that can be shaved out of it without sacrificing pinch flat protection and basic durability.

I still think there is room for improvement in the DH tire, but I don't see weight savings as the primary area...

Could be wrong though...

sethimus said:

wireless shifting

Click to expand...

already in use on road bikes, although not widespread

Pslide said:

This is actually one area where I don't think you'll see that much improvement. OK, we might see mid-weight DH tires coming out of Specialized for all mountain / slope style type applications, but I don't think you'll see Sam Hill on them.

In fact, as far as I know, no top level pros even run tubeless. Some say this is so the mechanics can make quick and easy tire changes for conditions, or burping under high loads, etc. but I reckon it's more than that. I think that the two ply tire and tube gives just the right amount of stiffness and damping at race pressures for maximum grip. This probably isn't applicable for mountain biking, I just brought it up as an example of a new solution to an old problem.

Lighter rubber? I'm not sure that's physically possible. That's like lighter water...

If you cut up a Maxxis DH tire, which come in around 1200-1300g these days, you'll see there's not too much more that can be shaved out of it without sacrificing pinch flat protection and basic durability.

I still think there is room for improvement in the DH tire, but I don't see weight savings as the primary area...

Could be wrong though...

Click to expand...

Obviously rubber can't be made lighter. Perhaps there will be a move away from rubber for all but the treads of a tire (the portions which actually contact the ground). With all the polymer development going on these days in other industries, its only a matter of time till something is developed that will bond to rubber and have a higher strength to weight ratio.

edit: there have been some developments for Army vehicles with wheels that don't inflate. its an advanced polymer honeycomb with a tread pattern on the outer circumference, it gives (fundamentally) the same ride characterics as a traditional inflated tire, but won't go flat (however one tire costs more than a set of traditional tires). This was developed for active combat areas so vehicles wont give flat tires from shrapnel/bullets/etc.

Something that incorporates bacon.

I've never really gotten all that excited about gearbox stuff and never imagined it would go very far. There are too many bike companies with lots of time and dollars invested in suspension systems that won't support a gearbox. The variety of choices in suspension performance is what makes mountainbikes so much fun. Not happy with what you've got? Try something else until you find what works for you.

I have also never had an issue with shifting performance or breaking deraileurs so the perceived performance gain with a gearbox just doesn't register with me.

x

Lex said:

I've never really gotten all that excited about gearbox stuff and never imagined it would go very far. There are too many bike companies with lots of time and dollars invested in suspension systems that won't support a gearbox. The variety of choices in suspension performance is what makes mountainbikes so much fun. Not happy with what you've got? Try something else until you find what works for you.

I have also never had an issue with shifting performance or breaking deraileurs so the perceived performance gain with a gearbox just doesn't register with me.

x

Click to expand...

if all people think like you we all still live on trees...

jonKranked said:

Obviously rubber can't be made lighter. Perhaps there will be a move away from rubber for all but the treads of a tire (the portions which actually contact the ground). With all the polymer development going on these days in other industries, its only a matter of time till something is developed that will bond to rubber and have a higher strength to weight ratio.

edit: there have been some developments for Army vehicles with wheels that don't inflate. its an advanced polymer honeycomb with a tread pattern on the outer circumference, it gives (fundamentally) the same ride characterics as a traditional inflated tire, but won't go flat (however one tire costs more than a set of traditional tires). This was developed for active combat areas so vehicles wont give flat tires from shrapnel/bullets/etc.

Click to expand...

It's quite easy to bond all sorts of materials to rubber and fabric cords, including polymers. And a tire carcass without rubber coating except in the tread area is a possibility, but does have hang-ups, such as cord protection from not only the terrain, but also oxygen and moisture, which has a weakening effect. Still, it's a possibility.

By the way, most "rubber" these days doesn't have much natural rubber in it...it's almost all synthetic polymers. At least for car tires...can't say for bike tires. Synthetic polymers are much better at providing grip...

I have 99% prototyped a pinchflat resistant tube, which is 90% Hypalon air resistant fabric and 10% butyl to provide stretch. It was a pain in the a$$ to make and never held air due to my poor manuf techniques (that's why it's 99% complete). It was also heavier than I calculated. However, if it would have worked, the idea was to use it with a single ply tire, yielding a pinch flat proof tire that had the same stiffness and damping characteristics as a two ply DH tire + tube but was about 300g lighter than the conventional combo. There's no reason why it wouldn't work if built properly, but I'm not sure I have the determination (and time) to have another go...

The military wheel you referred to is made my Resilient Technologies:



It is certainly suited to it's function on the hummer, but unless you are taking a bike into a hot zone (live fire), there's not much application for bikes. Weight and handling are the concern. Michelin also has their "Tweel", which the same concept for passenger cars. Michelin has huge R+D budgets and has been building tires for nearly 100 years, and the Tweel still doesn't work as well as a normal tire. There's a reason why the car tire hasn't changed much in the past 80 years (apart from steel belts), because it's very good at what it does. And you can't find a cheaper, lighter, more efficient spring than AIR for holding up a vehicle...

-Aaron

PS - Yes, I'm a tire geek.

I'd like to see drunk racing.

Oh wait....

Actually, something I think would be cool to see is a dual downhill format. It's been done before, but not on a large scale. Big open course, head to head bracket elimination format. Not unlike slalom, but on a DH course.

Carbon fiber underwear with optional bacon chamois. Oh yeah baby.



Seriously, I expect it to be a little while before something really big comes along. Clearly suspension technology will continue to improve incrementally, and we'll see more carbon and other materials applied to existing suspension designs (as they may be refined), and we'll continue to see weights go down without compromising strength. But a "big" thing is more than refinement. It means a real game-changer, and to me it will have to be a revolutionary drive train. Hammerschmidt has promise but it's pretty disappointing that it revolves around a granny ring. So far I haven't seen an enclosed/internal drive train that would convince me to swap, and I look forward to when that time comes.

I thing the next big thing to come is enough people getting into DH that there is good money to be made for the companies, the top level racers, and the resorts that host downhill trails/races/events.

sethimus said:

if all people think like you we all still live on trees...

Click to expand...

How so? Look at how much development there has been in frame and suspension technology without the use of a gearbox. Doesn't seem like lack of progress to me, just not gearbox progress.

I agree with what someone else just said about internally geared hubs that can be used with any suspension design. That would be progress in the right direction. Something that can be used in many frame applications instead of being limited to a specific frame that will most likely have to be a single pivot. Say what you want about the benefits of a gearbox but I'd rather have optimally performing suspension.

x

I just see things getting as light as possible in the future.

Also, for someone who mentioned a leatt brace integrated into the body armor, 661 is doing something like that for 09. Saw an ad in Decline. The back of the leatt brace buttons on to the top part of the spine protector after you remove a couple of the plastic plates. The armor was the core saver.

Everything you need to know about 2009, right here.

http://www.dropmachine.com/Feature

i dont really care as long as things stop been so damn expensive!!

Pslide said:

It is certainly suited to it's function on the hummer, but unless you are taking a bike into a hot zone (live fire), there's not much application for bikes. Weight and handling are the concern. Michelin also has their "Tweel", which the same concept for passenger cars. Michelin has huge R+D budgets and has been building tires for nearly 100 years, and the Tweel still doesn't work as well as a normal tire. There's a reason why the car tire hasn't changed much in the past 80 years (apart from steel belts), because it's very good at what it does. And you can't find a cheaper, lighter, more efficient spring than AIR for holding up a vehicle...

-Aaron

PS - Yes, I'm a tire geek.

Click to expand...

I didn't mean to imply that this would be suitable for cycling, just that it would be that kind of innovation would make "the next big thing".

the millard racing shock is suppose to be "fantabulous"
isnt he using technology that is only being used for the military?

lightweight parts that can last for more than a week

dw said:

lightweight parts that can last for more than a week

Click to expand...

So this is what you're working on

DW Link suspension stem.