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A Few Things From the Bike Shop.

HAB

Chelsea from Seattle
Apr 28, 2007
11,580
2,005
Seattle
As for the fit problem, same goes. Ask them why they want the adjustment, explain to them the options "I can do as you say, which will make it worse, or I can adjust X and Y, then Z and Q will happen, and you'll be happier. If said idiot understands what can actually make a difference, they'll be happier. If they're just too stupid and ignorant, let them ride with the saddle in the wrong position and they can suck it up. It doesn't really matter, so long as they leave your shop happy.
Of course I'm not going to say "no, stop being a moron, you actually want the seat up." I'll explain to them what actually make sense, say "let's try it my way and if you don't like it we can try yours." Then I'll set them up properly, they'll realize I was right (usually) and go away happy and a little more educated.

And stepping back to the douche with the derailleur "problem" I never said he was an idiot or making things up. All I told him was that, in it's current state, nothing was wrong with the bike, and offered up the only explanation I could think of for why he may have had an issue that resolved itself without any intervention. Might he have been happier if I'd lied to him, said I'd done something wrong, and pretended to have fixed it? Probably. Am I interested in lying to customers and admitting fault when I had none? No. Am I interested in falling over myself to assuage the complaints of someone who's going to be a whiney, angry, impolite cvnt? Nope. Frankly the shop's doing well enough that we can stand to have him go elsewhere, and as far as I'm concerned, good riddance. I understand that in order to keep a customer base we need to keep them happy, but I'm of the opinion (and my boss has repeatedly validated his support of this policy) that we've got no problem letting the one guy in a thousand who's going to genuinely be a dick to us walk away unsatisfied.
 

jonKranked

Detective Dookie
Nov 10, 2005
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And stepping back to the douche with the derailleur "problem" I never said he was an idiot or making things up. All I told him was that, in it's current state, nothing was wrong with the bike, and offered up the only explanation I could think of for why he may have had an issue that resolved itself without any intervention. Might he have been happier if I'd lied to him, said I'd done something wrong, and pretended to have fixed it?
I've done that before just to shut people up and get them out of the store. Because if they stand around and b*tch long enough, when they leave they take other customers with them. This way I can also spend less time dealing with logic black holes and get back to building and repairing bikes, which is what's gonna make the shop more money, thus ensuring we stay in business.

Besides, when I feel like bantering with morons, I come here.
 

Sandwich

Pig my fish!
Staff member
May 23, 2002
21,030
5,918
borcester rhymes
So you're encouraging using trickery on customers? Awesome.


And your steak analogy is a failboat. Only vegetarians don't know the difference between "rare" and "well done".
Trickery, no; being polite and making them happy, yes.

I know people don't really not know the difference between rare and well done; that was an exaggeration. But try walking into Ruth's Chris and ordering a rare steak then walk into Outback and do the same, and you'll probably end up with two different colored steaks even if they're the same cut. People's opinion's change or may not match fact, just make them happy and take their money.
 

jonKranked

Detective Dookie
Nov 10, 2005
85,558
24,181
media blackout
Awwwww......that's the sweetest thing anyone has ever said on here.:cupidarrow::cupidarrow::cupidarrow:
I have a lot of moronic and crude comments that I have to keep to myself throughout the day. I work with a lot of doctors and very bright researchers, so I have to maintain a certain level of professionalism. The majority of my daily bottled up ass hattery is unloaded here.
 

HAB

Chelsea from Seattle
Apr 28, 2007
11,580
2,005
Seattle
I've done that before just to shut people up and get them out of the store. Because if they stand around and b*tch long enough, when they leave they take other customers with them. This way I can also spend less time dealing with logic black holes and get back to building and repairing bikes, which is what's gonna make the shop more money, thus ensuring we stay in business.

Besides, when I feel like bantering with morons, I come here.
I think most of the time with that sort of guy, it's pretty apparent that he's just a whiny cvnt. The customers in the shop can probably see that and I'd like to think they don't see it as reflecting badly upon the shop. Plus 95% of the customers at the shop have been there before repeatedly and know we don't suck.
 

HAB

Chelsea from Seattle
Apr 28, 2007
11,580
2,005
Seattle
Trickery, no; being polite and making them happy, yes.

I know people don't really not know the difference between rare and well done; that was an exaggeration. But try walking into Ruth's Chris and ordering a rare steak then walk into Outback and do the same, and you'll probably end up with two different colored steaks even if they're the same cut. People's opinion's change or may not match fact, just make them happy and take their money.
The real fault with your steak point is not that people don't know the difference between rare and well done, but that how they want their steak cooked is totally a matter of personal preference. As the chef, the only way I can know how they want it is the order the waiter passed on to me. When someone brings up their bike and tells me that it needs ___ to fix ___ that's a much more cut and dry matter in which they could very well be flat out wrong. Nobody wants their derailleur adjusted badly, though I've had people suggest fixes to me plenty of times that would lead to it being all kinds of fvcked up. There's not much subjectivity to what constitutes a proper derailleur adjustment. The same cannot be said for how to cook a steak.
 

CrabJoe StretchPants

Reincarnated Crab Walking Head Spinning Bruce Dick
Nov 30, 2003
14,163
2,484
Groton, MA
I have a lot of moronic and crude comments that I have to keep to myself throughout the day. I work with a lot of doctors and very bright researchers, so I have to maintain a certain level of professionalism. The majority of my daily bottled up ass hattery is unloaded here.
I hear that brother!:cheers:
 

jonKranked

Detective Dookie
Nov 10, 2005
85,558
24,181
media blackout
The real fault with your steak point is not that people don't know the difference between rare and well done, but that how they want their steak cooked is totally a matter of personal preference. As the chef, the only way I can know how they want it is the order the waiter passed on to me. When someone brings up their bike and tells me that it needs ___ to fix ___ that's a much more cut and dry matter in which they could very well be flat out wrong. Nobody wants their derailleur adjusted badly, though I've had people suggest fixes to me plenty of times that would lead to it being all kinds of fvcked up. There's not much subjectivity to what constitutes a proper derailleur adjustment. The same cannot be said for how to cook a steak.
The issue with the subject at hand is what's know as the Chasm of _______ (I can't remember the term, it escapes me at the moment, its in one of my cognitive psychology books at home). Basically its the gap between how an object actually works, and how the user perceives it to work.

In this case, a bike rider is experiencing pain in his pelvis. He's a point A (where he has a problem - uncomfortable riding position and some pain) and wants to be at point B (problem is resolved, comfortable riding position and no pain). While looking at his bike/seat/seatpost, he reasons that the way to get from point A to point B is to lower the nose of his seat. While the solution may seem logical to him, it is not the correct route from A to B. Enter the bike mechanic, to show him the proper route from A to B (pushing the saddle back on the rails).

Basic crude cognitive analysis aside, you don't have to be a dick to show a customer the proper way to adjust/fix something.
 

ska todd

Turbo Monkey
Oct 10, 2001
1,776
0
The guy goes on a tirade about how the mechanics were incompetent and everything in the shop is outrageously overpriced. The manager then calmly tells the guy to take his bike, get the fvck out of his shop, and to never come back since he's obviously too smart to be dealing with us.
I'll raise you one. Years ago while working in an IBD, the alcoholic, seldom seen, part owner, old man was in the shop. One night at close a similar type customer as you describe came in to discuss a repair "with the owner". The manager that night tried to calmly review the problem with the customer when out of the office marches the old man waving a loaded rifle! I guess he saw that the woman tied up her large dog outside and he threatened to "kill the bitch...and then shoot the dog". Classic!

-ska todd
 
I know there are formal training programs out there (Barnetts?), how many of you current wrenches have had the opportunity to partake of one or more?
Honestly, I have seen many an issue with bikes from people that have gone through these schools, that is until they have had experience in a shop fixing some POS bikes and just making them work. They are great for the absolute basics, but honestly, I would much rather have a guy that has worked his way up through a shop and really tried to work on a bike than some guy fresh out of those schools.... I am willing to bet 95% of the top race mechanics out there have never been to those schools, and honestly I won't recommend them to anyone who is serious about becoming a mechanic. Work your way up and really learn from a solid mechanic in your area.

I will fully admit that there are plenty of retarded "mechanics" out there. I wouldn't let them within a 10 foot pole of my bikes. But then again I have been working on bikes for close to 10 years now in a professional status. We aren't all idiots, and most of the good ones actually have a college degree and just love wrenching. The major problem that arises is that a shop won't pay the labor rates to keep a mechanic that is willing to devote their life to it. As a grown "adult" 12 bucks an hour doesn't cut it. If shops were willing to pay a true living wage that a mechanic could survive on, then you would be seeing more quality mechanics around. And you know? A great way to do that is to support the shops that actually have good mechanics. So there you go...