Diesel truck owners...your advice appreciated.

Dog Welder said:

After falling asleep behind the wheel after a long couple days at work...I totaled my car and now knows what it feels like to be inside a dryer.

So since I'm in the market for a new ride I've been thinking about getting that diesel truck I've always wanted. But I had a few questions before I start my search.

1.) I'm thinking about going used so should I buy pre Ultra Low Sulfer regulations or post? I heard that new all new diesels have to be smogged. Also any performance differences between the old and new?

2.) I know that diesels are built stouter than gas, so what is a reasonable age and mileage for a used diesel. I see a few on CL that are 2003-4, that have 130k-150k on the odometer.

IF it helps I'm leaning toward Chevy/GMC duramax.

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ok as a diesel owner

Diesels are not smog tested [yet]

some of the older diesels have issues with the new ULSD fuels and need to have additives in the fuel,

Diesel engines are good for 200-300k dpending on Maintence

an O3 or 04 diesel is not old and will run quite well on todays fuel
old is pre 99 [as far as parts availability goes]

don't buy one with a chipped or reprogrammed diesel engine, chances are it was beat on [raced] and is more worn than th mileage indicates. A chipped Ford 6.0 is asking for a blown engine [$12,000], duramax is in a similar but not quite as bad boat.

Ford 7.3 Powerstroke.

You might consider a Dodge, the Cummins TD is hands down works better and last longer than the v8 versions made by ferd an gm. I only think the transmissions are suspect. The Dodge is also the quietest diesel pick- out there. and 130k on one is nothing for the powerplant, they'll run beyond 300k. It's just the rest of the truck that starts to fall apart at 200k.

Get a bus pass, stay away from a vehicle for awhile.



In all seriousness, glad you made it through. I know what its like to total a vehicle... not fun.

The 7.3 is made by International. The Cummins is great, but it doesn't make up for the rest of the truck unfortunately.

Go Euro and get a Dodge Sprinter (its really a Mercedes)



The turbo diesel in that van is killer.

new diesels can't run biodiesel or waste veggie oil (WVO)

We love our 2004 Dodge Ram 2500 Turbo Diesel. 325 HP/ 21 MPG. IMO Dodge vehicles have come a long way since merging w/ Mercedes. You can't go wrong with any diesel out there. I'm considering a diesel commuter car in the near future. Too bad the choices are so limited. Good luck.

46chief said:

The Dodge is also the quietest diesel pick- out there.

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uuuhhhh.....24V maybe....12V....nope.

Sghost said:

Ford 7.3 Powerstroke.

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x2

The powerstroke is hard to beat. A real low maintenance power house.

Dog Welder said:

IF it helps I'm leaning toward Chevy/GMC duramax.

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I wanted a Duramax real bad, but couldn't find one in my price range. After talking to a lot of people, I bought a 2000 F350 with a 7.3. I have run B99 since the second tank of fuel (The first tank was B50) and the truck runs smoother and has more power than when I bought it. The last oil change, te mechanic commented on how good my oil looked. The truck also runs a little cooler it seems.

I paid $7200 for my truck with 132k miles on it. 4x4 XL model.

ok.....Heres my background before we get started.

Been a diesel mech for more than 12 years, raced diesels for more than 13 and have owned just about every diesel motor that you an get in the states.


now....here are some suggestions based on my experience on and off the track.

duramax = pure crap. you cant polish a turd. I have owned two and had three under the company name. every single one had MAJOR fatal engine damage in under 70k miles with normal use. the only way these blocks will put out is if you spend more than 10 grand under the hood.

Dodge = if go you go cummins you need to get a 12 valve. it is by far the most dependable block dodge has ever made and you can squeeze more than 400k out of the block with 1grand in simple parts and a decent exhaust. The 24 valve is a good motor but has alot of quirks that require 4 grand of goodies in order to last as long as the 12 valve

Ford = stay away from the 6.0 liter diesel at whatever cost. they seem like really good deals for a reason. this motor was the precursor to fill a gap in the diesel race and it has some major short comings. I owned 2 and ran several through the company and every single one of them has been to the dealership with a months worth of major top end overhaul and replacement and even after the "fixes" from the dealership it still wont be worth keeping.

Fords 7.3 liter (turbo and pre turbo) are by far the best running deisels on the planet and require no real labor or parts to get more than 400k out of an original block with normal use.

The new ford 6.4 liter is now the best motor you can buy on the market. but I assume you arent looking for a $45,000+ truck.

now, about milage and smog

anything you buy before 2008 will not have to be smogged. but some states are starting to do "emissions control" on the newer diesels. thus is the reason for ultra low sulpher diesel. this shouldnt be too much of a big deal as of yet and I wouldnt worry about it for a few more years.

as far as milage goes the motors are ranked in fuel economy

dodge 24 valve cummins (worst)
duramax
Ford 6.0 liter
dodge 12 valve cummins
Ford 7.3 liter turbo
Ford 7.3 liter (pre turbo)
Ford 6.4 liter

Jimmydean picked up a 7.3 liter turbo and he loves it. with a few mods you can get great milage and even better power.

I have a 40 foot toy hauler and several gooseneck flatbeds and use my trucks to do hotshot hauling all over the place. the only trucks that have held up over the years are the 7.3 liters and the 6.4 liter fords

you can find alot of 7.3 liters with great prices on the market because alot of folks are upgrading to the 6.4 liter.

you can convert ANY diesel to burn biofuels and oil fuels but the cost to benefit ratio is no longer there since the initial set up is so pricey and the only way you can benefit is by commuting with the vehicle within the range of the tank.

the plus side to any of the 7.3 liters is once the motor does finally go you can stuff a Catapillar 302 in that engine compartment and have yourself a 12 second truck with 1100 horse.

if you have and questions when buying feel free to drop me a PM for my phone number and I can talk you through some things to look for when you find a possible buy.

Now I want a diesel too reading all that.

i find it interesting that Phord puts their turbos under the cab, costing stupid amounts of money just to fix it/service it.

im a 12v Cummins fan myself...all that sweet power from a 6cyl.

IH8Rice said:

i find it interesting that Phord puts their turbos under the cab, costing stupid amounts of money just to fix it/service it.

im a 12v Cummins fan myself...all that sweet power from a 6cyl.

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they actually made it right with the new 6.4 liter. its a twin turbo and they are rammed into the back and under the firewall but everything on the cab is quick connect. you lift the whole cab off to work on the motor. makes thing alot easier. it is faster to pull the cab than to pull the hood.

spent a lot of time in a 2007 chevy duramax 1ton 4x4 CC SRW with about 40k on it, the allison and a 2000 F250 7.3 powerstroke 2wd kinda bombed with 115k on it.
the chevy was a nice ass truck, smooth power, quiet, drives like a big buick, very comfortable. the allison is bad ass for towing. even touch the brakes on a downhill and the transmission shifts seamlessly letting you stay off the brakes quite a bit. not sure what the track record for those trucks is mechanically. but they are a hell of a nice truck to drive and look good too.
the ford is what I drive right now, it is a truck of a truck. uncomfortable ass bench seat, loud, fast, clunky. it has some mods done to it and was likely abused by the PO. it needs some TRE's and shocks so it sucks on the highway. I did just tow a car 1000 miles last weekend with it and it didnt miss a beat but it was a miserable drive.
definitely stay away from the ford 6.0 and the earlier chevy 6.5td. there were also a few years of cummins that had something wrong with the block but I forget.
dodges have a great drivetrain but the rest of it falls apart. known of a few late 12v's with crazy electrical problems. I'd find a dodge that looks like it has been taken care of and give it a nice long test drive on some bumpy roads. seriously, bumpy roads will give you a better idea of what is actually wrong with the truck and what shape the chassis is in.

I had a '97 7.3 powerstroke. Great motor. Made for spendy oil changes at 12 qts, but overall very low maintenance and it never let me down.
I sold it because I got tired of having that much truck. Solid front axle with leaf springs and a 5sp tranny that had to be double clutched. Make sure you really want a truck that cumbersome.
Sold it for a Toyota. Same mileage. Holds the same # of passengers and bikes. Much more comfortable.

I had a 2001 7.3 Crew Cab. I loved that truck and wished I never sold it. The only thing I had to do was the trans, which I have heard only last about 100K. Might blew up right around 105K, but the motor was rock solid and ran perfect with a chip and MBRP exhaust. Towed like crazy and has all kinds of room.

The only problem my brother has had with his 12 Valve Dodge....99 or 00....the dash on those fall apart/cave in....hauled his 40 foot trailer and big block new beetle just fine.

I have a 2000 F250 7.3 w/ 208k. Regular oil changes with Mobil Delvac at 5k, regular fuel filter changes at 20k. The only problems have been water pump seals and camshaft position sensors. Both have been remedied with after-market components. I have done nothing to this truck.

I also have my dad's 2003 Excursion w/ 270k. Again regular oil changes with Mobil Delvac at 5k and fuel filter changes at 20k. Nothing but water pump seals.

Solid trucks.

gonefirefightin said:

they actually made it right with the new 6.4 liter. its a twin turbo and they are rammed into the back and under the firewall but everything on the cab is quick connect. you lift the whole cab off to work on the motor. makes thing alot easier. it is faster to pull the cab than to pull the hood.

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faster to pull the cab? really? a hood is 4 bolts


well their new "scorpion" diesel will be revolutionary in the fact that the intake will be on the bottom and the exhaust will be where the intake manifold usually sits....making the turbo lab less and the turbo easier to access

Sonic Reducer said:

dodges have a great drivetrain but the rest of it falls apart. known of a few late 12v's with crazy electrical problems.

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their drivetrains have never been good...besides the engine. tranny problems, rear end problems...they all had them

6.4l f350 is the way to go cleaner and quiet if u want that and for 1500 bucks u can get a spartain tuner and do lo 12 quarter miles FORD!!!!

redman733 said:

FAIR WARNING if you go with the 7.3 or 6.0 Powerstroke..
They have a problem with their fuel tanks in the diesel trucks..
Whatever they use on the inside of the tank starts to deteriate and clogs up your entire system(Aluminum or a galvanized coating)
Do a search on Ford tanks in diesel and you will be shocked !!!!!!!!
Ford will not help at all and this problem has been going on since 2000-2007
.....
My father just had to replace his sending unit,fuel pump,and tank(2001 7.3 powerstroke)...
My uncle (2006 6.0 powerstroke) w/47,000 miles and the exact same problem and Ford would not help at all..His truck was $3,000 to fix...

They say this problem is more common in the colder climates but do a search and you will see it's just an excuse....

If your going to argue with me please do a search first no BS at all....
My local dealer had a stack of old tanks ten feet high when we went there..

Our local mom and pop garage told me they did 6-8 themselves...

It's a common and costly problem....

edit: I just did a quick search click below...
http://www.finishing.com/442/19.shtml

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must be something in your water....

downhill66 said:

6.4l f350 is the way to go cleaner and quiet if u want that and for 1500 bucks u can get a spartain tuner and do lo 12 quarter miles FORD!!!!

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Does it come with a period?

heres some more info on Phord's new 6.7L diesel
http://www.autoblog.com/2009/09/10/2011-ford-super-duty-to-debut-at-texas-state-fair-on-sale-q2-20/

by now everyone has given their opinion, but I will chip in for what it is worth.

i vote for 12V cummins. I have a 97 dodge with 100K. is not smog tested, so punched out the core of the cat, ran full 5in exhaust, new air intake and it runs amazing!

the latest trick was to shim the fuel pump. a friend of mine is a diesel mech for a tractor/farm implement shop and apparently my engine is identical to this front end loader that we beat the crap out of on a daily basis. we just ordered a fuel pump shim designed for the loader and i improved my power and fuel economy. i now get 25mpg everywhere doing everything. doesnt matter city, highway, lead foot, baby it.... always 25. i love this truck.

and knock on wood, but this truck is used to haul a 5th-wheel trailer full of cattle on a daily basis and so far no drivetrain issues. runs better than new

^^ moar shims apply to diesels??!???

awesome

6.0 -> 6.4 -> 6.7

Maybe in a couple of years they will be back at the 7.3?

zdubyadubya said:

is not smog tested, so punched out the core of the cat, ran full 5in exhaust, new air intake and it runs amazing!

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No 97 diesel had a catalytic converter

IH8Rice said:

their drivetrains have never been good...besides the engine. tranny problems, rear end problems...they all had them

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i thought they had the nv4500 which are supposed to be bad ass transmissions. guess i should of said i wasnt talking about automatics, i have no clue about those. what kind of axle problems were they having?

profro said:

I have a 2000 F250 7.3 w/ 208k. Regular oil changes with Mobil Delvac at 5k, regular fuel filter changes at 20k. The only problems have been water pump seals and camshaft position sensors. Both have been remedied with after-market components. I have done nothing to this truck.

I also have my dad's 2003 Excursion w/ 270k. Again regular oil changes with Mobil Delvac at 5k and fuel filter changes at 20k. Nothing but water pump seals.

Solid trucks.

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Except for the gear nob

profro said:

6.0 -> 6.4 -> 6.7

Maybe in a couple of years they will be back at the 7.3?

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nah, the 6.7L will be the new super duty engine of choice....we'll see if anyone else adopts this "backwards" engine design

Sonic Reducer said:

i thought they had the nv4500 which are supposed to be bad ass transmissions. guess i should of said i wasnt talking about automatics, i have no clue about those. what kind of axle problems were they having?

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yeah, the autos sucked big time.

the rear ends have been known to go kablewey

stevew said:

Does it come with a period?

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Oh Schnnnnnappppp!--- + Rep for you.

Toshi said:

new diesels can't run biodiesel or waste veggie oil (WVO)

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Huh? You can definitely run biodiesel in TDIs and I would assume in most trucks as well. Most people blend them with dino-diesel, especially if you're in a cold climate but in warm weather you can run up to 90% bio with no problems at all.

edit: by the way, do you really need to go to 3/4 ton and 1 ton trucks to get a diesel? Not sure what kind of work DW is doing, but unless you're towing a gooseneck or work as a mason, all of those trucks are way bigger than necessary.

I think what he means is that the new after-treatment technologies can be "poisoned" by other than ultra low sulfur fuels.

profro said:

I think what he means is that the new after-treatment technologies can be "poisoned" by other than ultra low sulfur fuels.

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yup45

ohio said:

edit: by the way, do you really need to go to 3/4 ton and 1 ton trucks to get a diesel? Not sure what kind of work DW is doing, but unless you're towing a gooseneck or work as a mason, all of those trucks are way bigger than necessary.

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Yes, 3/4 or 1 ton only in diesels for now. 1/2 ton running gear can't handle the torque, even on a mostly stock motor. There is too much grunt in the bottom end for 1/2 tons.

I wish they made a 1/2 ton diesel because the most I haul is some gear, 2 quads and a moto.

jimmydean said:

Yes, 3/4 or 1 ton only in diesels for now. 1/2 ton running gear can't handle the torque, even on a mostly stock motor. There is too much grunt in the bottom end for 1/2 tons.

I wish they made a 1/2 ton diesel because the most I haul is some gear, 2 quads and a moto.

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That's not the reason at all actually. There are several diesel cars sold here and everywhere else in the world, small diesel trucks abound.
It has to do with emissions, and public perception. Emissions that 3/4 ton and larger vehicles are excempt from.

buildyourown said:

Emissions that 3/4 ton and larger vehicles are excempt from.

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not for much longer