When are straight pull spokes going to be the new J-bends?

I dont think they will, for the most part the Jbend spoke still dominates the cycling world, and even when the proper size isnt there, most shops have a spoke cutter handy

What is so bad about J-bend spokes anyway?

buckoW said:

What is so bad about J-bend spokes anyway?

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They aren't new.

Cause they suck, & every wheel that uses them sucks. Flexy = Suck, ok?

Maybe I'm just getting old, but I'll stick with j-bends. They are easier to build with and maintain, since they don't turn.
Straight pulls aren't new either. Remember Pulstar hubs 15-20 years ago?

The hub ends up being heavier on for straight pulls too. This could be offset if you have the nipples on the hub side ala Cane Creek, but for the average cyclist, running j-bends on EVEN high tension is going to give you a cheaper, better, longer lasting wheel.

buckoW said:

What is so bad about J-bend spokes anyway?

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marketing

From experience, tensioning/truing straight pull spokes is a cunt compared to standard spokes.

Do many shops stock straight pull spokes?
Most stock Jbend....

scottishmark said:

marketing

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This^

Wait, I mean: Straight pull spokes are revolutionary! It took nearly a hundred years for someone to think this up, and only with the latest advances in amazing technology have we been able to make metal into various shapes with various properties. There are absolutely no drawbacks, and the benefits are unlimited.

erikkellison said:

They can't be tensioned as much as straight pull spokes, resulting in a more flexible wheel.

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"wheel flex" is actually totally independent of spoke tension. Seems counter-intuitive at first, but that is the truth.

Your spokes are springs. Suppose your spoke has a spring rate of 10. (meaning 10 lbs to stretch 1 inch) Suppose your spoke is pre-tensioned to 100 lbs. No matter how much the spring is pre-tensioned - it still only takes 10 lbs to move it another inch.

Many straight pull wheels have narrower flanges than J-bend because of the flange width needed to house straight pull heads. Narrower flanges mean more flex.

When was the last time you saw a DT J-bend break at the bend?

Were there any other reasons you wanted straight pull?

BOOMSLANG said:

When was the last time you saw a DT J-bend break at the bend?

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Exactly.

I was going to say the same. I've only ever broken spokes (DT Comp/Champ) at the nipple. Alternatively guys I know who run straight-pull spokes seem to have issues. Spokes spinning loose, spokes disengaging from the hub (Deemax).

buildyourown said:

Maybe I'm just getting old, but I'll stick with j-bends. They are easier to build with and maintain, since they don't turn.
Straight pulls aren't new either. Remember Pulstar hubs 15-20 years ago?

The hub ends up being heavier on for straight pulls too. This could be offset if you have the nipples on the hub side ala Cane Creek, but for the average cyclist, running j-bends on EVEN high tension is going to give you a cheaper, better, longer lasting wheel.

Click to expand...

BOOMSLANG said:

"wheel flex" is actually totally independent of spoke tension. Seems counter-intuitive at first, but that is the truth.

Your spokes are springs. Suppose your spoke has a spring rate of 10. (meaning 10 lbs to stretch 1 inch) Suppose your spoke is pre-tensioned to 100 lbs. No matter how much the spring is pre-tensioned - it still only takes 10 lbs to move it another inch.

Many straight pull wheels have narrower flanges than J-bend because of the flange width needed to house straight pull heads. Narrower flanges mean more flex.

When was the last time you saw a DT J-bend break at the bend?

Were there any other reasons you wanted straight pull?

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What these two said......

To add to it, there is more to wheel flex than what type of spoke it is.

Three big parts for wheel flex as far as the spokes go

What brand..... This can make a big difference
What build....how many cross, insdie pull outside pull etc
and flange width......

On top of that the hoop itself can make a big difference as well.....



But here is why Jbends are not going anywere..... Most bike shops sell jstyle's for 50 cents a peice.... Mavic spokes are ususally 10 dolalrs plus, and very specific.. IE left right front rear disc non disc...... The shops alot of times wont carry them because they have to order the entire box of them and sit on teh rest till they finally sell.... same goes for I9 spokes, although there are even more lengths and varieties than Mavics seeing how they use any hoops to build there wheels....... What are I9 spokes... eight bucks each?






Basically the price is just too much for these proprietary spokes to make it worthwhile for bike shops to stock them. Specially when if that shop has a spoke cutter, they just order up a couple cases of 400MM unthreaded spokes for all of their straight guage needs and cut them everytime, so they end up with ONE size in stock

Just personal experience, i own 5 sets of i9 wheels, none of them have needed ANY love in the 3-4 years i have obtained them, even the originals are still fine. Set and forget for sure, science may say their ****, but my experience has been great. I can agree with the price though, they are pricey.

when will tubeless wheelsets become the new tubed wheelsets?

2 years ago at my house

demo 9 said:

Just personal experience, i own 5 sets of i9 wheels, none of them have needed ANY love in the 3-4 years i have obtained them, even the originals are still fine. Set and forget for sure, science may say their ****, but my experience has been great. I can agree with the price though, they are pricey.

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Dont get me wrong, I am not saying I9's are a bad wheel or Bad setup at all......... They do tension different than other wheels, lacing is a bit different method, as far as strength... they hold up fine..... although seen mroe than a few pics of them that ahs shown that when thehyg o.. they go big.

Citing Mavic wheels and I9s as the basis for straight pull spokes being too expensive isn't fair. They both use non standard, proprietary spoke SYSTEMS, rather than everyday normal straight pull spokes.

Just sayin.

At the end of the day, straight pulls can be just as cheap as J bend spokes, it just comes down to volume.

Which are better? Meh, its debatable for days. Each have benefits, each have negatives.

Neither will pull hot chicks on the beach like Spins though.

I doubt that straight pull will take much hold anytime soon. Shops have lots of stock of j-bend spokes and most people don't want to start going with a new standard. I'm not sure about the advantage of straight pull either. I very rarely break spokes on my DH and XC bikes. But I've broken 3 or so straight pull spokes on a road wheelset in the last year or two- all separate incidents, all for very little reason. Doesn't say much about what is better or worse, but maybe at least that the build and configuration (and maybe luck) matter more than the kind of spoke.

erikkellison said:

They can't be tensioned as much as straight pull spokes, resulting in a more flexible wheel.

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The rim determines the what tension the spokes can be brought up to.

The only good thing about straight-pull spokes is that most of the time, you can replace a spoke w/o removing cassette or rotor.

While the elbow of a J-bend spoke is the weak point, and is the most likely location of failure, assuming the wheel is built properly, and the rim is round, there shouldn't be any issues with them failing.

Failing at the nipple concerns me, as that can be numerous issues...spokes too long, too short, bad nipples, nipples not seated properly...