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Road wheelsets. Mavic vs. Shimano.

mrbigisbudgood

Strangely intrigued by Echo
Oct 30, 2001
1,380
3
Charlotte, NC
The rear hub on my Roubaix SL2 Apex is starting to give up. It's a cheap no name hub that came with the bike...blah blah blah. I have a patent award coming, birthday is coming up, really good timing.

I'm looking at 2 wheelsets. Mavic Cosmic Elite and Shimano Ultegra. I have no experience with Mavic wheelsets, I've always purchased Shimano hubs (LX/105 and up) with Mavic or Sun rims. My only experience away from Shimano was a Rolf road wheelset that came with my KHS Flite 800, and I liked them. My gut says "stay with Shimano", but I want to try the Mavic route.

Is it worth it to venture away from Shimano to try the Mavic wheels? What is your experience with Mavic ROAD wheels? Should I stay brand loyal to Shimano even though I have SRAM on the bike? Any other options under $500 I should consider? Possible to build a custom set for under $500? Maybe just replace the hubs with something better?

(I think the Mavic wheels would look better than the Shimano wheels on the bike)
 
Oct 27, 2011
4
0
I have had most every brand wheelset and prefer the Mavics. They also seem easiest to sell if you decide that you want something different later. Ride-wise, there is so little difference in most. Mavic seems to stand behind their wheels as good as anyone, though their service is not rocket-fast, if you must have warranty work done. I have no complaints with Mavic. Rolf sure has nice wheels too, as you already know.
 

SuspectDevice

Turbo Monkey
Aug 23, 2002
4,157
359
Roanoke, VA
Normal Ultegra hubs laced with normal spokes to normal rims.
Cheaper, stronger, lighter.
Below about $1200 I have a hard time seeing any advantages to "system" stuff besides the ease of selling it.
my opinion.
 

-dustin

boring
Jun 10, 2002
7,155
1
austin
Patent award???

One company has proven marketing.
One company has a proven product.

I don't really care for Mavic wheels. They aren't lighter, stiffer, faster, or stronger than anything else that can be had at the various price points. But every shop in the world stocks the parts to service them. Literally the only reason I have considered them in the past.
 

mrbigisbudgood

Strangely intrigued by Echo
Oct 30, 2001
1,380
3
Charlotte, NC

Bicyclist

Turbo Monkey
Apr 4, 2004
10,152
2
SB
The Mavic freehub body design kind of sucks, and their stuff isn't particularly good in any one sense. Average weight, poor aerodynamics, expensive to service, but most of their wheels are strong.

The Dura-ace wheels I have (one generation older) have been just OK. 1 cracked rear rim, 1 broken front spoke that was kind of expensive to fix. They ride nicely and have been in service for 5 years on-and-off so I guess I can't complain too much. The rear hub isn't feeling so great these days and the freehub body is starting to pop. When they really start going I think I am just gonna scrap them and get conventional wheels - lighter, cheaper initially and down the road, and obsolescence-proof. I don't really see an advantage to this 'system' craze other than profits for the companies who make them.
 

dump

Turbo Monkey
Oct 12, 2001
8,195
4,419
I'm looking for a regular 32 spoke road wheel, ideally shimano with regular spokes. Does that still exist new?
 

SuspectDevice

Turbo Monkey
Aug 23, 2002
4,157
359
Roanoke, VA
I'm looking for a regular 32 spoke road wheel, ideally shimano with regular spokes. Does that still exist new?
Why yes it does! If your shop is too lazy to build build wheels they can order about a bagillion different configurations hand laced by nice people at all of the major parts distributors.
 

dump

Turbo Monkey
Oct 12, 2001
8,195
4,419
Why yes it does! If your shop is too lazy to build build wheels they can order about a bagillion different configurations hand laced by nice people at all of the major parts distributors.
Gotcha, thanks. I guess the online retailers don't seem to list them like they used to.
 

pugslybell

Chimp
Jan 23, 2002
71
2
Durango Colorado
The mavics drag a ton in the cold and require a ton more maintence then the shimano wheel(cleaning and lubing every 500-1000 miles). Upside to mavic is if you do break a spoke most shops will have one and they support their product for a very long time. Shimano does not support their product long term. Good luck finding spokes and nipples or a replacment rim in 4 years from shimano. I have owned and serviced both wheelsets and I would buy the shimanos again over the mavic product.
 

RUFUS

e-douche of the year
Dec 1, 2006
3,480
1
Denver, CO
Gotcha, thanks. I guess the online retailers don't seem to list them like they used to.
Cross bike or are you one hefty gentleman? I started on a road bike at around 215lbs and was running 20/24 spoke. I am now 170 and running the same but with carbon reynolds attack wheels.
 

SuspectDevice

Turbo Monkey
Aug 23, 2002
4,157
359
Roanoke, VA
Cross bike or are you one hefty gentleman? I started on a road bike at around 215lbs and was running 20/24 spoke. I am now 170 and running the same but with carbon reynolds attack wheels.
You had stock wheels. Stock wheels are universally ****ty. They select rims and hubs and choose lacing patterns to appeal to people on the showroom floor that don't know to avoid a sales gimmick.
A low priced wheel with 20/24 spokes will be heavier, flexier and less durable than a wheel buildt with double butted 3x spokes with a Shimano hub and standard rim.

The industry does a huge disservice(as we do in most parts selection) to spec bikes that sell, not the bikes we would choose to ride.
 

James

Carbon Porn Star
Sep 11, 2001
3,559
0
Danbury, CT
You had stock wheels. Stock wheels are universally ****ty. They select rims and hubs and choose lacing patterns to appeal to people on the showroom floor that don't know to avoid a sales gimmick.
This isn't always true, some companies are better than others at speccing "house" wheels that are more than the sum of their parts, and not just a part number shuffle...

A low priced wheel with 20/24 spokes will be heavier, flexier and less durable than a wheel buildt with double butted 3x spokes with a Shimano hub and standard rim.
Yes, and also a lot more expensive. There are a lot of give and takes with bike specs, especially at the lower levels. Shimano hubs often lose that battle, unfortunately.

The industry does a huge disservice(as we do in most parts selection) to spec bikes that sell, not the bikes we would choose to ride.
They can't be ridden if they aren't sold...
 

SuspectDevice

Turbo Monkey
Aug 23, 2002
4,157
359
Roanoke, VA
James,
I totally forgot what you do these days...
At the pricepoint I need to make and the quantities I order I'm looking at there is about at $25 difference between wheels I'd want to ride, and wheels that I wouldn't feel bad about speccing. I'll only ship bikes with "stock" wheels that use Shimano or Campy freehubs though. I'm lucky that I can do that for sure.

I dig that for somebody who is filling containers a difference like that, even with pricing scaled down for quantity it's huge wad at that scale.

One thing that I like is the Velocity is moving all of their production to Florida. Not only will that stuff be cheaper but I'll be able to get closer to a majority USA made bike.
Rad about Velocity though eh?


(also, as I'm sure you can imagine, I'd rather some bike companies not sell stuff that comes in at the same retail price as one of my completes, but with less-than-enthusiast level parts. It's a "gotcha!" thing.)
 

James

Carbon Porn Star
Sep 11, 2001
3,559
0
Danbury, CT
James,
I totally forgot what you do these days...
At the pricepoint I need to make and the quantities I order I'm looking at there is about at $25 difference between wheels I'd want to ride, and wheels that I wouldn't feel bad about speccing. I'll only ship bikes with "stock" wheels that use Shimano or Campy freehubs though. I'm lucky that I can do that for sure.

I dig that for somebody who is filling containers a difference like that, even with pricing scaled down for quantity it's huge wad at that scale.

One thing that I like is the Velocity is moving all of their production to Florida. Not only will that stuff be cheaper but I'll be able to get closer to a majority USA made bike.
Rad about Velocity though eh?


(also, as I'm sure you can imagine, I'd rather some bike companies not sell stuff that comes in at the same retail price as one of my completes, but with less-than-enthusiast level parts. It's a "gotcha!" thing.)
It's ok, my reply was meant to be somewhat light-hearted, and of course there is a pretty big difference between what you're doing on complete bikes, and anything else you're going to find in a store from a "big brand." When you get down to the sub-$1500 range, it becomes a very interesting dance to balance all of the needs/wants. When you get down under $800, it's a knife-edge, crazy what a tiny, tiny difference does to the whole house of cards.
A $25 difference in price is HUGE, hell man, I'm arguing about 30 cents in a lot of cases, or less!

Your economies of scales are much, much different, and while you don't enjoy the quantity discount that someone like me gets, you also do have as much infrastructure between you and the consumer.

It's really great about Velocity, love seeing more manufacturing come back to the US, even if it is Florida... :)
Every time I'm in Asia, I tell my factory contacts to keep vigilant, at some point the cost of manufacturing in the US is going to get cheap enough, especially when you consider all the other things like shipping cost/time, being able to make quick changes/adjustments, all those things, it's going to come back here. Maybe not for some years yet, and not everything, but already you're seeing companies "onshore" things back here in the US.
Just you wait...
 

dump

Turbo Monkey
Oct 12, 2001
8,195
4,419
Cross bike or are you one hefty gentleman? I started on a road bike at around 215lbs and was running 20/24 spoke. I am now 170 and running the same but with carbon reynolds attack wheels.
I'm 180 and probably 170ish when I'm in good shape. I just want a traditional 32hole wheel. I want it god and strong & want to mess with it as little as possible. The roads in montreal are horrible, so it's very likely that I could take my eyes off the road for a second and hit a good square-edged hole.

I don't want the latest light/carbon/whatever... just a classic, solid wheel.
Something like Shimano Ultegra, 3x, 32 holes, mavic open pro.

Will probably just end up ordering the parts & building myself.
 

dump

Turbo Monkey
Oct 12, 2001
8,195
4,419
One thing that I like is the Velocity is moving all of their production to Florida. Not only will that stuff be cheaper but I'll be able to get closer to a majority USA made bike.
Rad about Velocity though eh?
Velocity is going to make rims/spokes in the US now? If so, that's great!
 

SuspectDevice

Turbo Monkey
Aug 23, 2002
4,157
359
Roanoke, VA
Velocity is going to make rims/spokes in the US now? If so, that's great!
Wheelsmith spokes are still made in WI, and I think that DT may still be making some spokes in CO as well.

I'm not sure if velocity makes spokes.

It would be awesome if someone could make "affordable" domestic hubs. I'm no manufacturing engineer but it seems like you could make them pretty cheaply domestically if you were building enough....
 

jonKranked

Detective Dookie
Nov 10, 2005
85,573
24,191
media blackout
It's really great about Velocity, love seeing more manufacturing come back to the US, even if it is Florida... :)
Every time I'm in Asia, I tell my factory contacts to keep vigilant, at some point the cost of manufacturing in the US is going to get cheap enough, especially when you consider all the other things like shipping cost/time, being able to make quick changes/adjustments, all those things, it's going to come back here. Maybe not for some years yet, and not everything, but already you're seeing companies "onshore" things back here in the US.
Just you wait...
it's already starting to happen in certain industries
 

Bicyclist

Turbo Monkey
Apr 4, 2004
10,152
2
SB
Upside to mavic is if you do break a spoke most shops will have one and they support their product for a very long time. Shimano does not support their product long term. Good luck finding spokes and nipples or a replacment rim in 4 years from shimano.
Try again. According to Mavic they have stopped supporting many of the older Ksyrium models, and spokes aren't/won't be available. Down with proprietary senseless crap!
 

James

Carbon Porn Star
Sep 11, 2001
3,559
0
Danbury, CT
Wheelsmith spokes are still made in WI, and I think that DT may still be making some spokes in CO as well.

I'm not sure if velocity makes spokes.

It would be awesome if someone could make "affordable" domestic hubs. I'm no manufacturing engineer but it seems like you could make them pretty cheaply domestically if you were building enough....
Wheels Mfg is making hubs now, I'm not 100% sure on cost, but they're not exorbitant I don't think. They make great BBs...

it's already starting to happen in certain industries
Yeah, I read an interesting article on a headphone company that moved production back to the US, it's fantastic to see.
Of course I'm writing this from a meeting room at one of my factory partners in China... :)

James, are you with CSG?
Yes, I'm with CSG, currently working on the Schwinn IBD line.
 

dump

Turbo Monkey
Oct 12, 2001
8,195
4,419
Where do roadies hang out online. Want to get a peak at the classifieds where they are.

It's looking like an ultegra / mavic open pro wheelset is going to run around $400 new - hadn't expected it to be that much.
 

Bicyclist

Turbo Monkey
Apr 4, 2004
10,152
2
SB
Where do roadies hang out online. Want to get a peak at the classifieds where they are.

It's looking like an ultegra / mavic open pro wheelset is going to run around $400 new - hadn't expected it to be that much.
Velocipede Salon
Road Bike Review
Serotta Forum
eBay
Craigslist
Ask around at local rides and shops
 

dump

Turbo Monkey
Oct 12, 2001
8,195
4,419
great, thanks! Interesting framebuilding stuff over at Velocipede Salon.
 

spam16v

Monkey
Oct 27, 2004
284
0
Buffalo, NY
I just bought 2 sets of Aksiums off Bonktown when they dropped to $124.xx, friend asked me to snag a set for him, for a spare training set and he owed me some cash for letting him work on my lift in my garage. So I basically got my set for $50. If they suck, whatever. Anything has to be better than the trash that came with my bike.
 

spam16v

Monkey
Oct 27, 2004
284
0
Buffalo, NY
Eesh these things are heavy. I'll really appreciate the first real set of big boy wheels I get when that day comes I presume. Hope they're stiffer than the garbage I have now at least. The front will rub the fork w/23's if I really crank on it, and the rear rubs the pads as well if I set them too close.
 

CBJ

year old fart
Mar 19, 2002
12,863
4,161
Copenhagen, Denmark
I have ridden the Shimano Dura-Ace Wheels C24 CL Clincher for the last two years and they have been problem free. Really quite and roll nice. I like they way they look too. I got them really cheap on CRC when the dollar was strong vs. the pound so I had a hard time finding anything that could compete even whole sale in the US.
 

Banshee Rider

Turbo Monkey
Jul 31, 2003
1,452
10
I have ridden the Shimano Dura-Ace Wheels C24 CL Clincher for the last two years and they have been problem free. Really quite and roll nice. I like they way they look too. I got them really cheap on CRC when the dollar was strong vs. the pound so I had a hard time finding anything that could compete even whole sale in the US.
I'm waiting for the C24 tubeless clinchers to come in stock, and I'm ordering a set. Have any spoke issues with yours yet, or have they been solid? Any comparison to a set of full carbon clinchers to offer? They seem like a rad wheelset. In my territory it's all Ksyriums or full carbon clinchers, no one runs the c24, let alone road tubeless, so I'm going in blind on the purchase. Any input would be sweet.
 

CBJ

year old fart
Mar 19, 2002
12,863
4,161
Copenhagen, Denmark
Before them I had a DT Swiss 1.1 rim and 240 hubs so that is my only comparison. I have never ridden full carbon clinchers. I got them in June 2010 and I have not had any problems and I have not done anything to the wheels.