I seem to have acquired a weak(er) ass pedal stroke,lately

Xc riding and ride a bike around town for errands, sprinting up hills and out of corners.

It's all about interval training on the road bike. Try doing sprints uphill out of the saddle at 100% for 30-45 seconds and a slow burn for a minute to cool off and repeat for 30 mins. Don't forget to warm up and down.

XC riding and normal steady road riding doesn't exercise your fast twitch muscles so even with lots of riding, you'll be missing that explosive power that you're looking for. Also google "plyometrics" for cross training exercises. If you have a sore back (and even if you don't) I recommend trying some yoga and building that into your daily routine. Has done wonders for my posture and back which gets weak when being on the bike a lot.

James Wilson had an interesting post on Pinkbike (yes sorry, I said it!) which may be useful: http://www.pinkbike.com/news/Instantly-increase-your-pedal-stroke-power-mtb-strength-training-2011.html

hth

Tech XC riding on a 1x10 or a singlespeed is a great way to develop explosive power.

I've been riding singlespeed on my xc bike for a few weeks now because I don't have a shifter. I locked it in the middle of my cassette and I've noticed I've gotten much stronger in my legs now. The gear it's locked it spins out really fast on the flat, but I'm able to pedal up relatively steep hills if I put the power down.

Besides hitting the gym, i have found that riding out of the saddle on xc/am rides really helps with increasing power and make the power las longer in my pedal strokes. It becomes more like intervall training and it makes riding alot more fun even on flatter sections when i can just stomp on the pedals and pump the terrain like i do when i ride dh. It has really helped my overall stamina and the fun factor of just riding xc. The best thing is that the result is easily noticed since you will be able to for longer distances before you have to sit down.

roadbike+garmin edge 500,train your cadence

Turn your pro pedal on Larry.

frorider said:

Tech XC riding on a 1x10 or a singlespeed is a great way to develop explosive power.

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This, or anything that forces you to develop and maintain serious power. IME, mtb is all about sprinting and anerobic ability, this is what leads to "endurance". It's not about being able to set a certain output for a significant amount of time, it's about repeatedly going anerobic and being able to recover from it during a ride/trail. If you can not do this, you bonk and are left with nothing, hence your "endurance" is gone. Lots of riding forces you to go anerobic, that slightly steeper grade, that tech section you have to plow through uphill, that corner you want to pedal out of at max speed. If you are riding with someone else that is only slightly less fit, you can kill them by forcing them to go anerobic longer than they can recover from, so rather than them only being a little ways back, if they over-exert early on they can be "dead" for the entire ride or simply not be able to go on.

To develop this doesn't take anything special in my experience though. I rode my DH bike during the last XC race for kicks due to how strong I've gotten, but I started riding that 46-47lb beast everywhere and for everything (it's a freeride bike with one ring, so the riding position works), but before that I rode my "AM" type bike everywhere in the middle ring only and both bikes with 32t cassettes. The steepest and craziest climbs I could find. If I couldn't ride it in the middle ring, I tried as hard as I could and I walked when I could no longer turn the gears. Repeated this a long time and all of a sudden I'm making climbs people can't make in granny, let alone on a bike like this. This essentially becomes the "interval" training, riding your brains out until you can't go on, then recovering, repeating, etc. To carry on with the same idea, I put a road-cassette on my 29er. Only a 12-27, but most people would do the opposite. I feel that I get the same "load" on my body on my different bikes by doing this, rather than riding one bike that is set up differently and feel like I'm "cheating".

After a while, my perception started to change as well. My body and brain thought the 32-32 combo was a "granny gear" and I would shift down to that to reduce my load, but I kept trying to make the climbs in ever-higher gears. At least think about this: You probably have local SSers climbing up some crazy stuff with crazy gear combos. If they can do this in some combo like 32-17 to 32-20, surely you can climb it in 32-32 on a heavier bike, but it takes a while to train your brain and body to make it possible.

Do this and make some crazy power and ability to recover from anerobic efforts. It will make it difficult to get tired, but as always, proper fuel is critical. Understand complex vs simple starches, how the body breaks down stuff, what is good fuel for what situations or durations, etc.

Jm_ said:

After a while, my perception started to change as well. My body and brain thought the 32-32 combo was a "granny gear" and I would shift down to that to reduce my load, but I kept trying to make the climbs in ever-higher gears. At least think about this: You probably have local SSers climbing up some crazy stuff with crazy gear combos. If they can do this in some combo like 32-17 to 32-20, surely you can climb it in 32-32 on a heavier bike, but it takes a while to train your brain and body to make it possible.

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In the bad old days, we had 28 - 28 as granny gears. And that was in toeclips with sandshoes, my granny ring was even biopace. We used to get our bikes up all sorts of stuff. Now the thought of doing it in 32 - 32 (which is the same gear) makes my knees creak just thinking about it

Kettle bell swings.
Jump lunges (which will make you cry)
Plyometric box jumps (all sorts of variations)

And the thing that helps my back more than anything...explosive single arm overhead press(I think James video even shows that one)

Your back will thank you.

I kid you not... get to the gym and deadlift reps of 10-20, aim for 15. Squats are good too, and stiff leg deadlifts are good as well. I train at a gym and one thing I noticed on the gate in bmx was when I started deadlifting I could jump a rather large first jump I couldn't make before.

BUT, when you deadlift or squat, you have to make an explosive, and fast rep. You want some raw power and explosiveness.

I'll keep it simple, there are more muscle types, but for simplicity sake I will mention the two types that are predominant in the body. Type 1 muscle is slow twitch muscle. It utilizes and capitalizes on oxygen stores for energy, made for sustaining aerobic activity. Type 2 muscle is fast twitch muscle rely on oxygen, but to a much lesser degree. They rely on glycogen stores for a primary source of energy, and in general are not "endurance muscles".

Now the goal is to have endurance and strength, a hard thing to achieve (look at how hard MMA fighters train that need both aspects, or boxers).

Yoga is helpful for most. It sure won't hurt.

So my point is, you could benefit from sprints, you can benefit from plyometrics for sure too, but the difference won't be as big with some weight work I don't think.

There is a place for all other things mentioned, like tech riding on an XC bike, but to develop some nasty, raw power to make that jump, explode of corners and get through a poor execution at a rock garden, hit the weights.

This is coming from my own riding experiences, being a trainer at a gym with several certifications and taking anatomy and physiology and biology classes in college.

Jm_ said:

This, or anything that forces you to develop and maintain serious power. IME, mtb is all about sprinting and anerobic ability, this is what leads to "endurance". It's not about being able to set a certain output for a significant amount of time, it's about repeatedly going anerobic and being able to recover from it during a ride/trail. If you can not do this, you bonk and are left with nothing, hence your "endurance" is gone. Lots of riding forces you to go anerobic, that slightly steeper grade, that tech section you have to plow through uphill, that corner you want to pedal out of at max speed. If you are riding with someone else that is only slightly less fit, you can kill them by forcing them to go anerobic longer than they can recover from, so rather than them only being a little ways back, if they over-exert early on they can be "dead" for the entire ride or simply not be able to go on.

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Agreed, upping your lactate threshold can only help with the high-intensity, fast-twitch muscle dependent rigors of DH riding.


It sounds like you have a host of muscle imbalances, Scary.
Here's a generalization of what I know, anyone feel free to chime in with your own $0.02:
-pain on lateral compartment of thigh: tight iliotibial band, weak vastus medialis oblique mm.
-low back pain: tight hip flexors, weak rectus abdominis, weak posterior chain muscles (do squats/deadlifts, just don't over-do it)

Ya, getting old sucks, but at least we can buy cooler stuff

SCARY said:

I need to ride with pros who pedal.

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Ahh yes lets ride some AM at SoMo soon. Im holding a weekly Tuesday night ride from Pima Canyon at 6pm. If you have an XC or AM bike feel free to meet up with us! Also Thursday Im meeting up with some East Coast bros at Pima Canyon to show them around and ride Mormon/National, let me know if you'd like to join in on that ride too.

- Dennis

if you want to perform at a top level in DH or MX, you should reconsider a definitive surgical repair of that ACL. recovery time is long but i recommend biting the bullet now. assuming you're a young'un, your healing powers are at their peak and only decrease over time, as well as cumulative damage to that knee joint.

Full penetration, again and again. That's the only workout you need. It helps if she's young.

gemini2k said:

Full penetration, again and again. That's the only workout you need. It helps if she's young.

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Confirmed!

chillindrdude said:

if you want to perform at a top level in DH or MX, you should reconsider a definitive surgical repair of that ACL. recovery time is long but i recommend biting the bullet now. ..

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THIS! Had ACL surgery in 96. Kept damaging the meniscus while riding without it too. Would love to have not ridden until my surgery...then my meniscus would have been good.

How can you stand life without an ACL? I felt helpless without mine. I think I'd take a crap ACL repair over no ACL.