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Springs in 25 pound increments?

Ian Collins

Turbo Monkey
Oct 4, 2001
1,428
0
Pacific Beach, San Diego, CA
So i've come to realize i'm right in between a 350lb and 400lb spring for my DHR, and i'm in need of a 375lb spring

I'm about to order a spring from K9, and i like the fact that they're made by eibach, but i'm sticking with steel for the time being just to feel things out....if at all possible i'd like to avoid the higher cost and ordering from the UK if i can get something domestic.....

anyone have any leads on 3" stroke springs that are available in 25 lb increments?

IC
 

Ian Collins

Turbo Monkey
Oct 4, 2001
1,428
0
Pacific Beach, San Diego, CA
damnit....welp....i just emailed K9....i'm sure their products are nice, i'm just a cheap bastard and wish i could just order some random steel spring for $30 and feel things out....

it's weird, with bikes having such low leverage rates these days it's easy to get stuck between 50lb springs...one's too soft and one's too firm....you'd think there would be more options....

oh well...thanks guys
 

jonKranked

Detective Dookie
Nov 10, 2005
85,558
24,181
media blackout
damnit....welp....i just emailed K9....i'm sure their products are nice, i'm just a cheap bastard and wish i could just order some random steel spring for $30 and feel things out....

it's weird, with bikes having such low leverage rates these days it's easy to get stuck between 50lb springs...one's too soft and one's too firm....you'd think there would be more options....

oh well...thanks guys
yea i looked into their stuff a while back too. its def on the pricey side, but its harder to wind springs with the required tolerances to get them in 25lb increments than it is for 50lb increments.
 

gemini2k

Turbo Monkey
Jul 31, 2005
3,526
117
San Francisco
yea i looked into their stuff a while back too. its def on the pricey side, but its harder to wind springs with the required tolerances to get them in 25lb increments than it is for 50lb increments.
Yes, and as many people have said here on the board, the tolerances are greater than the 50lb increments that they sell them in. So a 400lb spring could be slightly stiffer than a 450 or slightly softer than a 350.
 

tuumbaq

Monkey
Jul 5, 2006
725
0
Squamish BC
Yes, and as many people have said here on the board, the tolerances are greater than the 50lb increments that they sell them in. So a 400lb spring could be slightly stiffer than a 450 or slightly softer than a 350.

This . . .

Its a waste of money to buy a Titanium spring without measuring it ON YOUR bike...Even ti springs can be off by as much as 25 pounds sometimes....You simply cant rely on the numbers off the springs , especially steel ( unless if you have measured it with a spring tester )

Its possible you might have a 400# that in reality is a 425# and your #350 could be a 335#.Now that would throw you off considerably and lead you to believe you need a #375.

My guess : you'll probably be fine with no preload on an accurate #400 and if not , a good #350 with 1 1/2 turn should get you the correct sag.

Im sure there is a number of suspension specialists that can sort you out and get you an accurate spring rate (by actually measuring it before selling it ) Last I check my guy was getting his from Diverse I believe and said they were best for accuracy ...not sure if they make MTB stuff anymore though.

Anyhow, you may know all of this already but I thought I'd throw that in...Most people are relying on something that isnt accurate AT ALL, even by ti standards.
 

blacksim549

Chimp
Oct 15, 2007
58
0
Quebec.
When I bought my '11 Wilson large frameset there was a 325lbs Fox coil spring on my RC4.

And a 275lbs coil spring on my friend's medium frameset.

Fox doesn't sell them?
 

baca262

Monkey
Aug 16, 2011
392
0
try an axial (thrust) bearing if you can get one cheap with the 400 lbs/in spring. makes the spring more linear and should remove bending under compression (for all the guys bitching about spring rubbing the shock body).

shock_thrust_bearings.jpg

1-K9-ShockBearings-02.jpg

edit - also about all the other crap about thrust bearings making suspension more sensitive and **** - it does none of this, just makes the compression curve of the spring linear since it's allowed to rotate when compressing.
 
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Ian Collins

Turbo Monkey
Oct 4, 2001
1,428
0
Pacific Beach, San Diego, CA
try an axial (thrust) bearing if you can get one cheap with the 400 lbs/in spring. makes the spring more linear and should remove bending under compression (for all the guys bitching about spring rubbing the shock body).


edit - also about all the other crap about thrust bearings making suspension more sensitive and **** - it does none of this, just makes the compression curve of the spring linear since it's allowed to rotate when compressing.
hmmmmmm...this is tempting....
 

bogusbill

Chimp
Oct 16, 2009
52
0
I weigh anywhere from 200-210lbs all geared up and Turner recomended a 550lb spring. I think I will experiment with steel though I really want Ti.
 

saruti

Turbo Monkey
Oct 29, 2006
1,167
73
Israel
you can use the 350 spring with more psi
like... 150psi and not the recommended 140psi.
I think it will be better
on my DHR, I find my self between a 300 and a 350
so I'm using a 300ti with 145 psi and 2 turns of prelode.
with this settings I have a 33% of sag.
my weight is 72kg (155lbs)
 

tabletop84

Monkey
Nov 12, 2011
891
15
When I bought my '11 Wilson large frameset there was a 325lbs Fox coil spring on my RC4.

And a 275lbs coil spring on my friend's medium frameset.

Fox doesn't sell them?
When I ordered my yt industries Tues ltd. I could choose in 25lbs-steps up from 225 till 475 but I just can find springs in 50lbs-steps in aftermarket-shops. That's weird. :confused:
 

Ian Collins

Turbo Monkey
Oct 4, 2001
1,428
0
Pacific Beach, San Diego, CA
you can use the 350 spring with more psi
like... 150psi and not the recommended 140psi.
I think it will be better
on my DHR, I find my self between a 300 and a 350
so I'm using a 300ti with 145 psi and 2 turns of prelode.
with this settings I have a 33% of sag.
my weight is 72kg (155lbs)
Not a bad idea but I'm already up to 180 psi, and I put enough preload on the spring that it started to affect the rebound a bit, then backed off a half turn...I probably need to just bite the bullet and get the 375 lb spring.
 

baca262

Monkey
Aug 16, 2011
392
0
that's odd, i opened the turner dhr model in linkage and it says you should be running a 350 spring (it's an exact model, manufacturer data)

View attachment 109873

it might be that you have a 350 that's actually under 350, more like 300. maybe you could try out someone else's 350? also, the weight distribution affects the calculated spring rate a lot so if you tend to hang off the rear of your bike you probably need a new spring. for the 50 50 it says @82kg (180lbs) 300 :think:

edit - if you're running a dhx rc4, this is even more weird
 

Ian Collins

Turbo Monkey
Oct 4, 2001
1,428
0
Pacific Beach, San Diego, CA
that's odd, i opened the turner dhr model in linkage and it says you should be running a 350 spring (it's an exact model, manufacturer data)

View attachment 109873

it might be that you have a 350 that's actually under 350, more like 300. maybe you could try out someone else's 350? also, the weight distribution affects the calculated spring rate a lot so if you tend to hang off the rear of your bike you probably need a new spring. for the 50 50 it says @82kg (180lbs) 300 :think:

edit - if you're running a dhx rc4, this is even more weird
i've tried two different 350 lb springs and two different dampers...i like my stuff pretty firm and i hit stuff pretty hard...i dunno...it's not WAY too soft...just a little bit
 

6thElement

Schrodinger's Immigrant
Jul 29, 2008
15,825
13,054
Makes me think my 400lb is going to be too stiff as I'm probably about 180lb rtr...
 

baca262

Monkey
Aug 16, 2011
392
0
i've tried two different 350 lb springs and two different dampers...i like my stuff pretty firm and i hit stuff pretty hard...i dunno...it's not WAY too soft...just a little bit
ah zo... well then, if you want it to be progressive, get the 375. if you want it firm and linear, 400 + thrust bearing. i'm riding my 888 ('05 rc) with both springs now and i've improvised 2 thrust bearings (knocked out the cone bearings out of a old front hub and put them on top of the springs) and it's still way too oversprung for me @140lbs (30mm sag) but it's plush as hell and goes thru travel nicely when i'm hitting stuff hard. it should work similarly on the rear end.
 

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
18,850
9,556
AK
try an axial (thrust) bearing if you can get one cheap with the 400 lbs/in spring. makes the spring more linear and should remove bending under compression (for all the guys bitching about spring rubbing the shock body).


edit - also about all the other crap about thrust bearings making suspension more sensitive and **** - it does none of this, just makes the compression curve of the spring linear since it's allowed to rotate when compressing.
It should just decrease the effective spring rate. If you are holding both ends and compressing the spring (read: ends not allowed to twist with spring), then you are simply "bending" the spring in another way while it's compressing. It should be the same as what the spring is doing when it's compressing, just in a different direction. If you let both ends rotate while the spring compresses, that additional force is gone obviously, and the effective rate will be a little less. Sounds like a decent option to try, although I'd try more agressive damping with the 350lb if the sag is correct.
 

Ian Collins

Turbo Monkey
Oct 4, 2001
1,428
0
Pacific Beach, San Diego, CA
baca: i'm thinking i'll be buying a 375# and the thrust washers so i have options....i can get a 400# easily and cheap if i want to try it with thrust washers...gives me some choices...

saruti, i'm still riding both shocks...i want to tinker with one more tune on the elka but it's pretty tits
 

Ian Collins

Turbo Monkey
Oct 4, 2001
1,428
0
Pacific Beach, San Diego, CA
Sounds like a decent option to try, although I'd try more agressive damping with the 350lb if the sag is correct.
yeah, that's the thing....i know the DHR is designed to use quite a bit less damping than one would think...i've already packed on way more than the recommended settings....i forget exactly what they are, and i'm too lazy to check, but i'm running something along the lines of 4-5 more clicks of everything, 40 more PSI, and 2 full additional turns in the bottom out chamber....