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Evil Undead

chillindrdude

chillindrdude

Turbo Monkey
Jan 18, 2002
1,852
23
Northern VA, a peckerwood with too many guns
short being given a free frame, not sure why anyone would spend their hard earned money on anything from them.

maybe RM, and other online forums are a small representative of the dh riding population, but after hearing stories upon stories of pivot issues, frame problems/recalls, and finally warranty nightmares, you have to wonder...

i forgot that i had 'liked' them on FB, so when that pre-production pic came up, i wanted to make a smart-alecky comment...:D
 
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dylan s

Chimp
Jan 16, 2010
63
0
chillindrdude said:
short being given a free frame, not sure why anyone would spend their hard earned money on anything from them.

maybe RM, and other online forums are a small representative of the dh riding population, but after hearing stories upon stories of pivot issues, frame problems/recalls, and finally warranty nightmares, you have to wonder...

i forgot that i had 'liked' them on FB, so when that pre-production pic came up, i wanted to make a smart-alecky comment...:D
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I though the same but looking at some of the comments on facebook some people seem to be pretty keen on getting one. One guy reckons he has one pre-ordered. Weather or not they put their money where there mouth is, now that is another story.
 
Sandwich

Sandwich

Pig my fish!
Staff member
May 23, 2002
21,061
5,970
borcester rhymes
good on them for maybe possibly coming close to maybe possibly there's a chance of releasing a frame. If they pull it off and resurrect the company, I'll legitimately be impressed, and I'll suppose that they deserve the success!
 
Mo(n)arch

Mo(n)arch

Turbo Monkey
Dec 27, 2010
4,441
1,422
Italy/south Tyrol
Like a real captain he is the last man standing on the ship.
Respect for that
There are some other dudes around though:


I still hope they can release the new frame. I think they deserve it.
That frame is dead sexy!
 
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ods

ods

Monkey
Feb 22, 2008
389
0
Port Angeles
I got the opportunity to ride one a couple of weeks ago, and though it was set up for someone who rides much harder and faster (I probably used half the fork travel), it was even better than the aluminum version. It's a gorgeous frame overall and squirts out of corners. From the first carbon proto to now shows how much work they did put into it. What Kevin said in his quote is exactly how things have gone and the fact that he stuck with it should be commended. Go Evil.
 
manhattanprjkt83

manhattanprjkt83

Rusty Trombone
Jul 10, 2003
9,646
1,216
Nilbog
I'll stick to my position on this one since the beginning. Unfortunate situation for Evil and they are doing what they can to make it right. They could have just thrown a big middle finger and shut the doors.

Im betting they survive this one.
 
Raingauge

Raingauge

Monkey
Apr 3, 2008
692
0
Canadia
I'm pretty sure Kevin could have shut the company down and saved himself a lot of trouble and money. The fact that he's still at it speaks volumes for his commitment to make the company a success.
 
norbar

norbar

KESSLER PROBLEM. Just cause
Jun 7, 2007
11,367
1,605
Warsaw :/
manhattanprjkt83 said:
exactly I dont understand why nobody can understand that.
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It's the right way to do. Especially if he sorts out the warranty issues though the stink is going to stick to him for some time. People still remember the bad zoke years and they only had minor issues compared to evil. I will wait a season to see how the bike performs in the long run but I wish Kevin all the best. I'm really curious how the carbon will ride.
 
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dropmachine

Turbo Monkey
Sep 7, 2001
2,922
10
Your face.
omfg. This thread is so full of stupid.

Look, say what you want about Kevin and his determination. At the end of the day he may be the nicest guy with the nicest of intention and **** nothing but butterflies. Thats not the issue.

The issue is that from the lack of any obvious communication and updates, it looks like the company completely **** the bed. I have no idea if they are in contact with actual frame owners (which is what I would at the very least hope for) but the lack of any apparent outside communication looks bad.

That said, it seems that moutain bikers are as dumb as the rest of the population, and will just buy it anyways when it comes out. Hype wins over common sense always.

Also, if the reports above of all the issues with the aluminum one are true and those problems are commonplace, how goddam terrifying is it that they are coming out with a carbon version next? Have fun riding those lemmings! :D
 
norbar

norbar

KESSLER PROBLEM. Just cause
Jun 7, 2007
11,367
1,605
Warsaw :/
dropmachine.com said:
omfg. This thread is so full of stupid.

Look, say what you want about Kevin and his determination. At the end of the day he may be the nicest guy with the nicest of intention and **** nothing but butterflies. Thats not the issue.

The issue is that from the lack of any obvious communication and updates, it looks like the company completely **** the bed. I have no idea if they are in contact with actual frame owners (which is what I would at the very least hope for) but the lack of any apparent outside communication looks bad.

That said, it seems that moutain bikers are as dumb as the rest of the population, and will just buy it anyways when it comes out. Hype wins over common sense always.

Also, if the reports above of all the issues with the aluminum one are true and those problems are commonplace, how goddam terrifying is it that they are coming out with a carbon version next? Have fun riding those lemmings! :D
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I think you miss the point. Kevin had 2 options. Close shop and screw all the customers karpiel style or try to make up for it, rescue the company and come up with a good and interesting product. Yes we are sceptical but we also have some hope for the project. Especially since the faulty linkage DW has been talking about has been modified so there should be no problems with it. From what I understand the frame producer is also changed so no problems there. With what was wrong in the orginal changed is it really that hard to wish him luck? Or do we have to **** all over him because he wants to do what's right?
 
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dropmachine

Turbo Monkey
Sep 7, 2001
2,922
10
Your face.
norbar said:
I think you miss the point. Kevin had 2 options. Close shop and screw all the customers karpiel style or try to make up for it, rescue the company and come up with a good and interesting product. Yes we are sceptical but we also have some hope for the project. Especially since the faulty linkage DW has been talking about has been modified so there should be no problems with it. From what I understand the frame producer is also changed so no problems there. With what was wrong in the orginal changed is it really that hard to wish him luck? Or do we have to **** all over him because he wants to do what's right?
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So you're telling me that hes doing this out of the good of his heart? That this couldn't possibly be a business decision based on future profits? For serious?

You're right, he could have bailed. Maybe he has, for all anyone knows. I'm not ****ting all over him. I'm saying that Evil has done a horrible job of keeping the public informed of whats going on, or doing much to clear up the brands cloudy image. Dave and John P did a goddam BANGUP job of building that brand into the legend that it was, and its a shame to see it go the way it has. Update the goddam website, Facebook or anything else.

Also saying that since they've changed producers so the issues are gone is pretty ridiculous. I'm fairly certain they didn't choose the current producer based on the extremely high likelyhood of poor QC issues. "Yes, this is the company to build Evil bikes. They do it in total darkness, use only chisels, string, and pictures off the internet. They are clearly skilled artisans."

Issues arise even with the best production companies. It just scares me that they haven't seem to have done the alloy one right yet, and are skipping straight ahead to carbon. Its like learning to juggle with apples, being rather ****ty at it, and moving to chainsaws right away.
 
Sandwich

Sandwich

Pig my fish!
Staff member
May 23, 2002
21,061
5,970
borcester rhymes
norbar said:
I think you miss the point. Kevin had 2 options. Close shop and screw all the customers karpiel style or try to make up for it, rescue the company and come up with a good and interesting product. Yes we are sceptical but we also have some hope for the project. Especially since the faulty linkage DW has been talking about has been modified so there should be no problems with it. From what I understand the frame producer is also changed so no problems there. With what was wrong in the orginal changed is it really that hard to wish him luck? Or do we have to **** all over him because he wants to do what's right?
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It's good that kevin is trying to make up for his mistakes by delivering a product to his former customers....but the sheer audacity of two years of nonsense with no communication and a complete avoidance of all things related to release date, price, and support of customers shows a lack of respect to the people paying his bills....

which is why I'll be amazed if he turns EVIL around, and if he is successful, then I will be convinced he deserves that success. Because, if you're so thick to buy a product from a manufacturer that screwed you over royally before, then kevin is truly a phenomenal businessman, and he's set an example for any small business to follow of how to turn lemons into lemonade.
 
norbar

norbar

KESSLER PROBLEM. Just cause
Jun 7, 2007
11,367
1,605
Warsaw :/
I agree with you both. Though if any of us were on his place what could we post to customers? The progress is slow so the info is scarce. That's how I see it.
 
S.K.C.

S.K.C.

Turbo Monkey
Feb 28, 2005
4,096
25
Pa. / North Jersey
dropmachine.com said:
So you're telling me that hes doing this out of the good of his heart? That this couldn't possibly be a business decision based on future profits? For serious?
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Kevin has gutted this entire thing out because:

1) It's not in him to quit.
2) Believe it or not YES - it's from the heart. He's passionate about EVIL and wanting it to succeed.
3) He's been busting his ass to make EVIL a successful brand, and yes, that means making profit.

You're right, he could have bailed. Maybe he has, for all anyone knows.
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He hasn't.

I'm not ****ting all over him.
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But... you are. LoL.

I'm saying that Evil has done a horrible job of keeping the public informed of whats going on, or doing much to clear up the brands cloudy image. Dave and John P did a goddam BANGUP job of building that brand into the legend that it was, and its a shame to see it go the way it has. Update the goddam website, Facebook or anything else.
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It's difficult to update the world on internal issues a company is experiencing. For example, the fiasco with the frame fabricator for the Revolts was a total nightmare. But that is something between EVIL and the fabricator. As far as keeping people informed, Kev has been in touch with every Revolt owner who has a warranty frame coming their way.

I've already seen the new website and it's fantastic, and I agree that it should be updated soon.

Also saying that since they've changed producers so the issues are gone is pretty ridiculous. I'm fairly certain they didn't choose the current producer based on the extremely high likelyhood of poor QC issues. "Yes, this is the company to build Evil bikes. They do it in total darkness, use only chisels, string, and pictures off the internet. They are clearly skilled artisans."
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They changed fabricators b/c the company that made the Revolts does not specialize in CF frame manufacture.

Issues arise even with the best production companies. It just scares me that they haven't seem to have done the alloy one right yet, and are skipping straight ahead to carbon. Its like learning to juggle with apples, being rather ****ty at it, and moving to chainsaws right away.
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Good analogy, but the Undead has been in development for around 2 years.

rpet said:
one Facebook post?

OMG - where do I Paypal my $3500?!?
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I have no idea where you are getting that dollar amount from considering that price lists haven't been released yet.
 
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blackohio

blackohio

Generous jaywalker
Mar 12, 2009
2,773
122
Hellafornia. Formerly stumptown.
At the end of the day, there are only a handful of us here that posting that are involved with Evil in any capacity (and I mean either as former/current customers) and we all seem to be less angry about the situation than everyone else here.

Last time I checked we were the ones with bikes sent back via warranty issues, not some of you other guys so pipe down. This has NO bearing what-so-ever on your real lives.

Would we have liked to see the situation handled differently, sure. Would it have been nice for there to have been a different communication strategy sure.

In the end, does it look like we'll be supplied with a brand new carbon frame, yes. When the time comes where we have frames, if someone doesn't feel safe riding it, theres a classifieds section they can list it for sale. They can walk away with cash-in-hand.

End-of-the-story.
 
Tetreault

Tetreault

Monkey
Nov 23, 2005
877
0
SoMeWhErE NoWhErE
mattmatt86 said:
2010 interbike
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exactly, this is getting to the point of ridiculousness. Its understandable that a new frame will take two years of development, but for there to be no communication what so ever is absurd. Companies like banshee manage to keep a blog updated with development on prototypes and new products as well as other brands. How ****ing hard is it to have some honesty and keep people informed?
 
jonKranked

jonKranked

Detective Dookie
Nov 10, 2005
85,859
24,451
media blackout
I once bicycled for two weeks while making a frame out of carbon fiber in taiwan while on the phone with customers telling them how to update the website.
 
blackohio

blackohio

Generous jaywalker
Mar 12, 2009
2,773
122
Hellafornia. Formerly stumptown.
I've had had a frame in for warranty and always have known whats going on and been informed of any dates/progress.

Sorry that you other guys who aren't customers, nor would ever be aren't kept up-to-date of Kevin's business.
 
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dropmachine

Turbo Monkey
Sep 7, 2001
2,922
10
Your face.
S.K.C. said:
Kevin has gutted this entire thing out because:

1) It's not in him to quit.
2) Believe it or not YES - it's from the heart. He's passionate about EVIL and wanting it to succeed.
3) He's been busting his ass to make EVIL a successful brand, and yes, that means making profit.


_ EVERY buisiness owner is passionate about what they do, its why they start the business. They are also in it for profit. Its useless saying hes "passionate" about it. Who cares.


He hasn't.

- How would anybody know?


But... you are. LoL.

Beleive me when I say I am not ripping him apart. Trust me on this. When I rip into somebody, you'll know it :D I am merely pointing out the lack of communication and farcical delay in getting new frames is pretty sketchy.


It's difficult to update the world on internal issues a company is experiencing. For example, the fiasco with the frame fabricator for the Revolts was a total nightmare. But that is something between EVIL and the fabricator. As far as keeping people informed, Kev has been in touch with every Revolt owner who has a warranty frame coming their way.

Horse****. Anybody with a modicum of brainpower knows that all you have to do is post up random tidbits on your site and facebook, and everybody is happy. Don't just post up a picture of some magical unobtanium frame made of unicorn taints and carbonz thats been in "development" for two years. Post some news for future and potential customers so you don't like a deadbeat mountainbike dad dodging support payments.

I've already seen the new website and it's fantastic, and I agree that it should be updated soon.

Well if they got a pretty website, that changes everything... ;)



They changed fabricators b/c the company that made the Revolts does not specialize in CF frame manufacture.

They chose the original fabricator no doubt due to their ability for making frames. Those bikes sucked. Now they are moving to a new material and fabricator without getting the first version correct. I say skip the middle man, break my collarbones now and shove carbon strands right into my eyes and up my arse. Saves time. POTENTIALLY, of course.



Good analogy, but the Undead has been in development for around 2 years.

It hink you mean 2 weeks. :)

Oh wait sorry thats delivery time. :D



I have no idea where you are getting that dollar amount from considering that price lists haven't been released yet.

Its true. The new frames are going to be about Tree-fiddy.
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At the end of the day, I don't care what evil does. I'll never own one. Its just kind of sad seeing such an iconic brand being handled in such a sketchy way. And i do feel bad for those that are waiting on a replacement frame, as I seriously have my doubts they will ever get it, good intentions or not.
 
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