Not that implausible. 50% stiffer than a noodle is easy to achieve by bracing it with another noodle.
I'd give one a rip though. Make my decisions after doing a few runs. Good to see another option out there.
DVO Suspension - potential new player?
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I'd give one a rip though. Make my decisions after doing a few runs. Good to see another option out there.
It's like trying to stiffen up my quads for my cowboy stance by tying my shoelaces together. Except that the knot is in my pocket and the laces run up the legs. You've still got the zone of interest working in between where it's needed and where the brace is.
It's just a lot of leverage on that thing. That's all I was ever getting at. And if they really want to claim some super in depth analysis, what a coincidence it works out to a nice even 50%. Know what I mean?
Somebody at some point will buy one, ride it with and without the magic fork guards and see what's up. Depending on what it costs, it might even be me. But pretending that every claim made by someone trying to sell something is somehow completely validated by their own professed testing in a press release is asinine. Especially if you've followed the bike industry for any length of time.
It's just a lot of leverage on that thing. That's all I was ever getting at. And if they really want to claim some super in depth analysis, what a coincidence it works out to a nice even 50%. Know what I mean?
Somebody at some point will buy one, ride it with and without the magic fork guards and see what's up. Depending on what it costs, it might even be me. But pretending that every claim made by someone trying to sell something is somehow completely validated by their own professed testing in a press release is asinine. Especially if you've followed the bike industry for any length of time.
Chinballs
kickstarter!wow with all the armchair engineers here we should be able to create a fork that's so perfect we could ruin the entire suspension market. just need some funding.
What with all the useful ideas/discussion you've come up with..ever I'd say you could start yourself a lint company.wow with all the armchair engineers here we should be able to create a fork that's so perfect we could ruin the entire suspension market. just need some funding.
I was trying to offer a good idea to help set them apart from the competition just a little more (every little bit helps), but apparently an oil seal doesn't seal. I'm trying to help them basically, because there's some things about all the current market forks I don't like.
Oh goooo on, be a good sport, do tell me how you think I'm wrong there, I'm simply dying to know!
It's the same amount of leverage as a conventional fork arch sees - and as you are well aware, that fork arch makes a huge difference to torsional stiffness. It's pretty clear that this isn't as robust or as stiffly connected to the axle as a conventional lower casting, but then again, you're dismissing claims that are far from unrealistic based on nothing other than looking at a photo. Nice even 50%? Ever considered the possibility that they rounded off values somewhat? Like your 203mm fork with a stated tolerance range of +/- 5mm travel. Maybe it was 43% and they're being optimistic. Maybe it was 59% and they don't want to overstate FEA projections. Nobody here has actually made obviously unrealistic claims about its ability to stiffen the fork. Personally, I'm impressed that they have gone to this length to address the torsional stiffness issues at all instead of just being all "well it works on motos so it's fine for bikes". It's reasonably innovative, and really doesn't have any downsides other than a little bit of extra weight (and maybe questionable looks) even if it added absolutely nothing in terms of stiffness.
Like I said, maybe their claims will turn out to be BS, but I suspect that it is more likely that you don't have a good grasp of what a 50% increase in torsional stiffness is (ie not actually all that much - it means deflection at the wheel drops by about 1/3rd for any given twisting force), than that their numbers are way off. I say this having actually had a reasonable amount of experience with structural design and R&D in the automotive industry, with some of the closest correlations between FEA and measured real world performance that I've ever personally heard of. But hey, maybe I'm just another e-engineer who's basing my expert opinions on nothing much at all.
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Obvious armchair engineer is obvious..Your an Engineer in a chair while writing this ARE YOU NOT?!
We only have 448 comments in this thread, and the Pinkbike article racked up over 700 in one day.
Damn Mayans.
Damn Mayans.
you die first then
We need to bring MOAR SHIMZ into this to get the RM folks going and posting more.. theres a few other classics that gets most folks riled up- someone get DW involved!!
Deduce all that are from DVO and you end up at about the same number
....not in a day though. 
Useful ideas? Insightful discussion? lol
I'm here because you guys are an entertaining bunch of asshats.
lOOKS gNAR dudes! Kool! Can'T waIt to get a pairs!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Oh my GOD!!
I never even considered that!
You're right!!
Come on.
There's whatever they may have measured (more likely modeled) and then there's the words they released. Again, you going out of your way to share an opinion is no different that me sharing mine. We've both got the same info. I've seen lots of unbreakable things break and lots of stiff things not be stiff. So have you.
But jeesh man, it's still vaporware at this point. Just accept that I hold the opinion that sometimes things might not always end up working as designed. That's about as obvious as saying 'sometimes people round numbers', but it happens..........a lot..............with bikes.
Young bryson will be ripping around on one of these soon enough I'm sure.
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did they whittle that out of a block of wood?
You sure that belongs here? I don't see a fenderizer.next up...
discuss the moar...
28000 posts says otherwise, but whatever floats your boat mate.
I'm skeptical too but would like to try one.
I mean hey, these things actually made a difference.
I mean hey, these things actually made a difference.
I'm sorry, you are wrong.
that's worth at LEAST 52.8% MOAR stiffness. And it's not rasta. They're two colors away though....come on devo...just one red ano rebound knob and a gold other thing. Then we can party. I'll grow out my dreads and we can get excited about the first olympics. It'll be RAD BRO.
did they ever say what coating they are using on their stanchions and rods?next up...
discuss the moar...
also i wonder if we can expect a TI spring stock on the shock?
mentioned in the pinkbike write up on the fork
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molybdenum_disulfide
Sounds like dry lube.
Almost...it came out of our Mojo 3D printer.
He should be beating one up in a few days.Oh my GOD!!
I never even considered that!
You're right!!
Come on.
There's whatever they may have measured (more likely modeled) and then there's the words they released. Again, you going out of your way to share an opinion is no different that me sharing mine. We've both got the same info. I've seen lots of unbreakable things break and lots of stiff things not be stiff. So have you.
But jeesh man, it's still vaporware at this point. Just accept that I hold the opinion that sometimes things might not always end up working as designed. That's about as obvious as saying 'sometimes people round numbers', but it happens..........a lot..............with bikes.
Young bryson will be ripping around on one of these soon enough I'm sure.
We try to spread around and answer things, but man that PB thread is just insane right now!Deduce all that are from DVO and you end up at about the same number
Please tell me you didn't come HERE for sanity
There's a lot of sh*t talking to be done.
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Sanity isn't something I have been given the privilege of keeping.Please tell me you didn't come HERE for sanity
Tons of it!!
It's the same stuff they coat piston skirts with for fancy car engines, you can do cams and things too but I have no idea how you apply it when or after anodizing.
I wonder what the core is in the arch/fork guard thing.
Hey Ronnie, are you at liberty to discuss that at this point?
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and the fork lost 10% rigidity on it's way from pinkbike to vital...
I believe I also have a can of it called molycote, aka anti-sieze. Obviously they must use vapour deposition or electro deposition instead of pasting it on out of the can, but then at least your fork legs would never sieze
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But kashima is a lame ass color that looks stupid on most bikes so it must be better. Please god tell me it works better because if DVO just proved that you can coat stanchions with that stuff and NOT look like that........fox has some splainin' to do.
I just noticed your signature. I think you and I got a lap together at whistler two seasons ago and you told me about how common it was for that mini schrader valve in a boxxer air spring piston to clog. I has your card.
That's because you have to factor in the Pinkbike-foot factor.and the fork lost 10% rigidity on it's way from pinkbike to vital...
Kidding aside, the fork looks really promising in person. Forums tend to self-select for negativity and it's easy to get hung up on some of the details of the CTA and the engineering side of the Emerald's development. I spent about an hour with them yesterday getting the low-down from Josh and taking apart all the damper bits. Vital's format doesn't lend itself to long product descriptions, but my first impression of the Emerald was definitely 2 thumbs way up. It was well thought out, solidly assembled, and designed with a real focus on the consumer/tuner. I really got the impression that these guys want customers to dive into the fork and make changes themselves, and are planning to go to great lengths to provide as much support as they can to make sure this happens. Some manufacturers have made their dampers almost impossible to work on yourself, or have buried the information deep in the tech manuals (if it's available at all) so that it's difficult to access. For years riders have been asking for more and more readily available tuning options and customer support to help explain how their forks and shocks operate, without much movement on the part of the industry. All other things being equal, I think this is a huge step in the right direction if DVO is able to pull it off and will hopefully encourage other manufacturers to follow suit. Just something to keep in mind....
godadamnit.. real world experience.. that doesnt count fer NUFFIN around here!!!!
i cant wait, i mean seriously, this fork just ticks all the boxes for me. i mean im almost planning to murder out my summum to get this green beast to work with my color scheme
Im just worried i have to use squashed kermit essence to keep it shiny green !!