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Gun Control

syadasti

syadasti

i heart mac
Apr 15, 2002
12,690
290
VT
$tinkle said:
well, let's take that to its logical conclusion: since - as you & you alone state - authority is necessary to categorize, nor may you arbitrarily call it 'pre-human'.
this statement is absurd. does 'fully developed' mean adult? fully developed lungs in utero? survives an emergency c-section, living in the NICU for 12 wks? natural childbirth only? how can you state i cannot say what it is, yet lacking the same "authority" you feel perfectly at liberty to say what it is not?
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Vertebrates embryos are not developed, viable separate beings - its a medical fact. They cannot survive outside of the uterus of the mother (or egg depending on species) and their organ systems are not developed and functioning normally - this is indisputable fact. You cannot assign status above an embyro/fetus to some thing by definition is a developing and unviable. An egg is not an chicken, you can never change that fact of reality because it looks like one as it develops to an untrained eye.

And again you posted many times for the Iraq war on Ridemonkey - you are fraud just as I said and was repped for in my original post above by another long-time RM member who doesn't have a 30 second memory. Over 100K civilians killed and you supported it. That's not pro-life - those are actual innocent human beings and you supported their violent unjustified conclusion.
 
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Jm_

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
18,979
9,638
AK
gastro said:
^ Antbody know if that was that the policy at Fort Hood as well?
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There'd always be nothing to stop a soldier from buying ammo at wal-mart and putting it in his weapon when they bring them out for training, there are also not 100% searches at the entry points to the bases. They are better than they were when I was in the service, but they don't search 100% of every car, far from it. You could go through with a rocket launcher in the trunk much of the time.
 
Jm_

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
18,979
9,638
AK
I'm always amazed at how precious "fetuses" are to Christians, yet they are simply: "screw anyone that's ever suffered or died due to inadequate health care". There must be something about that in the bible.
 
syadasti

syadasti

i heart mac
Apr 15, 2002
12,690
290
VT
Jm_ said:
I'm always amazed at how precious "fetuses" are to Christians, yet they are simply: "screw anyone that's ever suffered or died due to inadequate health care". There must be something about that in the bible.
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Help the sick and the poor as long as they are white. Otherwise stand your ground and blow them away in their family's own neighborhood. Its the pro-life thing to do.
 
norbar

norbar

KESSLER PROBLEM. Just cause
Jun 7, 2007
11,368
1,606
Warsaw :/
syadasti said:
Help the sick and the poor as long as they are white. Otherwise stand your ground and blow them away in their family's own neighborhood. Its the pro-life thing to do.
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No it's more of a "we will do everything to help you before you are born. After that? Tough luck ****er, you are on your own" They are pro life as long as you didn't start breathing. Maybe that's what's their beef is. Breathing
 
JohnE

JohnE

filthy rascist
May 13, 2005
13,440
1,965
Front Range, dude...
Jm_ said:
There'd always be nothing to stop a soldier from buying ammo at wal-mart and putting it in his weapon when they bring them out for training, there are also not 100% searches at the entry points to the bases. They are better than they were when I was in the service, but they don't search 100% of every car, far from it. You could go through with a rocket launcher in the trunk much of the time.
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He also did not use a duty weapon, iirc...
 
$tinkle

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
6
syadasti said:
Vertebrates embryos are not developed, viable separate beings - its a medical fact. They cannot survive outside of the uterus of the mother (or egg depending on species) and their organ systems are not developed and functioning normally - this is indisputable fact. You cannot assign status above an embyro/fetus to some thing by definition is a developing and unviable. An egg is not an chicken, you can never change that fact of reality because it looks like one as it develops to an untrained eye.
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you conflate medicine w/ biology & wanted to be taken srsly? of all the edits you do to every one of your posts, i would expect that to have made the short list.
next, "cannot survive outside the uterus of the mother" [and i think you mean 'host', as 'mother' denotes live birth] once again, means nothing; just more palin-esque ramblings of a bitter, forgotten soul w/ a narrow worldview

syadasti said:
And again you posted many times for the Iraq war on Ridemonkey - you are fraud just as I said and was repped for in my original post above by another long-time RM member who doesn't have a 30 second memory. Over 100K civilians killed and you supported it. That's not pro-life - those are actual innocent human beings and you supported their violent unjustified conclusion.
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argumentum ad populum aside, this is manufactured shock & awe. if it weren't, i could easily go back & find your railings against obama, who has ratcheted up the drone wars & other bush doctrines (not just in iraq/afghanistan).

but you give obama a pass, b/c he supports one of your pet causes: late-term abortions of viable human beings
 
syadasti

syadasti

i heart mac
Apr 15, 2002
12,690
290
VT
$tinkle said:
you conflate medicine w/ biology & wanted to be taken srsly?
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Biology is the root of medical/veterinary science, so what is your point?

Mayo clinic clearly notes the basic functions of the nervous system like hearing do not occur until at least four and half months into pregnancy. A fetus by definition is not a full formed functioning animal. You cannot redefine reality based your arbitrary feelings you have clearly demonstrated you can't comprehend that:

Mayo said:
Week 18: Baby begins to hear

Eighteen weeks into your pregnancy, or 16 weeks after conception, your baby's ears begin to stand out on the sides of his or her head. Your baby might begin to hear.

By now your baby might be 5 1/2 inches (140 millimeters) long from crown to rump and weigh 7 ounces (200 grams).
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And according to the Prolife Action League itself, almost all abortions occur before even that basic developmental marker. The fetus brain cannot detect sound let alone come close to consciousness.

PAL said:
Gestational Age Percentage
Less than 9 weeks 61.8%
9-10 weeks 17.1%
11-12 weeks 9.1%
13-15 weeks 6.6%
16-20 weeks 3.8%
21+ weeks 1.5%
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I've never said I was pro-life or a Christian and then hypocritical supported actions that extinguish others, innocent or otherwise, so what exactly would you be searching for?
 
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$tinkle

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
6
ok, i'll admit to being genuinely confused: is it consistent to be nakedly both pro-choice & pro-war (war is a choice by committee of elected officials, after all)? if so, shouldn't that then also translate to being pro-choice & pro-gun?

people should be granted moar freedumbz than gov't does
 
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syadasti

syadasti

i heart mac
Apr 15, 2002
12,690
290
VT
$tinkle said:
ok, i'll admit to being genuinely confused: is it consistent to be nakedly both pro-choice & pro-war (war is a choice by committee of elected officials, after all)? if so, shouldn't that then also translate to being pro-choice & pro-gun?

people should be granted moar freedumbz that gov't does
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To keep on topic, its exactly like gun zealots who want all guns, all the time. Its all or nothing just like the need to regulate the female body.

These fanatics want the pregnancies that will result in death or life-threatening harm to the mother and/or the birth of babies with severe birth defects that will for certain be fully developed and conscious to suffer a slow needlessly drawn out death. They want rape victims to be reminded of their rape everyday for the rest of their lives.

Its the right thing to do - ignore reality, worry about one percent of abortions, and throw out all reason. Everyone damned for the vocal irrational minority.
 
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$tinkle

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
6
"morally competing ideas"

syadasti said:
To keep on topic, its exactly like gun zealots who want all guns, all the time. Its all or nothing just like the need to regulate the female body.
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so you're anti-choice on guns? isn't that immoral to pass laws that regulate personal freedoms?
syadasti said:
These fanatics want the pregnancies that will result in death or life-threatening harm to the mother and/or the birth of babies with severe birth defects that will for certain be fully developed and conscious to suffer a slow needlessly drawn out death. They want rape victims to be reminded of their rape everyday for the rest of their lives.
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i'm pro-life in the sense of being against unnecessary/capricious termination (i.e., we broke up, my career's really taking off, oh **** not again, i'm just a careless whore, amnio sez tay-sachs/sickle cell/retahded)

incest beyond lineal consanguinity or blood siblings doesn't quite make sense to me as a legally justified escape hatch, as that's largely a societal taboo; not genetically justified

if pregnancy will result in death or inability to create life, then it's wholly consistent to allow termination

again: "morally competing ideas"
 
$tinkle

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
6
syadasti said:
I have a problem with people claiming that doing nothing or helping the greater of two evils get elected is a viable strategy.
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so your issue isn't with the taking of innocent life so much as it is someone's personal & private choice for a political strategy?
 
dante

dante

Unabomber
Feb 13, 2004
8,807
9
looking for classic NE singletrack
stevew said:
so you have no problem with innocent people being killed in drone strikes?
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From your article:

Obama has already authorized 283 strikes in Pakistan, six times more than the number during President George W. Bush's eight years in office, Bergen wrote earlier this month. As a result, the number of estimated deaths from the Obama administration's drone strikes is more than four times what it was during the Bush administration -- somewhere between 1,494 and 2,618.

However, an analysis by the New America Foundation says that the civilian casualty rate from drone strikes has been dropping sharply since 2008 despite the rising death toll.

"The number of civilians plus those individuals whose precise status could not be determined from media reports -- labeled 'unknowns' by NAF -- reported killed by drones in Pakistan during Obama's tenure in office were 11% of fatalities," said Bergen. "So far in 2012 it is close to 2%. Under President Bush it was 33%."
The foundation's analysis relies on credible media outlets in Pakistan, which in turn rely on Pakistani officials and local villagers' accounts, Bergen said, rather than on U.S. figures.
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Oh moral equivalency, you so CRAZY!
 
syadasti

syadasti

i heart mac
Apr 15, 2002
12,690
290
VT
jimmydean said:
IIRC drones have a lower reported rate of service related PTSD, so I guess I have less of an issue.
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You mean before drones there was warfare and civilian casualties plus military injuries/causalities and greater investment in infrastructure, employees, training, and other resources to support the traditional combat model? The horrors of technology, reducing the footprint of one of the most significant portions of our budget (defense spending far greater than any other country) plus reducing civilian and military causalities.

What happened to the good old days when a psychopath(s) could go in to a village in Vietnam unmonitored and slaughter them as he/they saw fit?
 
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Beef Supreme

Beef Supreme

Turbo Monkey
Oct 29, 2010
1,434
73
Hiding from the stupid
And the gun nuts go full Westboro Baptist. Anybody that heckles a parent of a slain child deserves to get ass cancer.

Connecticut Post said:
A false fire alarm, 45-minute waits to get into the Capitol complex, even the heckling of a bereaved parent of a Newtown shooting victim marked Monday's day-long legislative hearing on gun control.

"The Second Amendment!" was shouted by several gun enthusiasts in the meeting room as Neil Heslin, holding a photo of his 6-year-old son, Jesse Lewis, asked why Bushmaster assault-style weapons are allowed to be sold in the state.
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http://www.ctpost.com/local/article/Newtown-dad-to-lawmakers-Change-gun-laws-4228992.php#photo-4098381
 
$tinkle

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
6
might be an email thread thing, but w/evz
southern family member over email & fb said:
Subject: WHY DOES GRANDPA CARRY A GUN?

Things are getting worse and more people are getting desperate for needs, so if you have what they need they may try taking it from you. Be prepared to defend yourself rather than prepared to die or let loved ones die.


PEOPLE ASK WHY?

Why Carry a Gun?



My old grandpa said to me 'Son, there comes a time in every man's life when he stops bustin' knuckles and starts bustin' caps and
usually it's when he becomes too old to take an ass whoopin.'

I don't carry a gun to kill people.
I carry a gun to keep from being killed.

I don't carry a gun to scare people.
I carry a gun because sometimes this world can be a scary place.
I don't carry a gun because I'm paranoid.
I carry a gun because there are real threats in the world..

I don't carry a gun because I'm evil.
I carry a gun because I have lived long enough to see the evil in the world.

I don't carry a gun because I hate the government.
I carry a gun because I understand the limitations of government.

I don't carry a gun because I'm angry.
I carry a gun so that I don't have to spend the rest of my life hating myself for failing to be prepared.

I don't carry a gun because I want to shoot someone.
I carry a gun because I want to die at a ripe old age in my bed, and not on a sidewalk somewhere tomorrow afternoon.

I don't carry a gun because I'm a cowboy.
I carry a gun because, when I die and go to heaven, I want to be a cowboy.

I don't carry a gun to make me feel like a man.
I carry a gun because men know how to take care of themselves and the ones they love.

I don't carry a gun because I feel inadequate.
I carry a gun because unarmed and facing three armed thugs, I am inadequate..

I don't carry a gun because I love it.
I carry a gun because I love life and the people who make it meaningful to me.

Police protection is an oxymoron.
Free citizens must protect themselves.
Police do not protect you from crime, they usually just investigate the crime after it happens and then call someone in to clean up the mess.

Personally, I carry a gun because I'm too young to die and too old to take an ass whoopin'.....author unknown (but obviously brilliant)

**********************************************
A LITTLE GUN HISTORY

In 1929, the Soviet Union established gun control. From 1929 to 1953, about 20 million dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
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In 1911, Turkey established gun control. From 1915 to 1917, 1.5 million Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
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Germany established gun control in 1938 and from 1939 to 1945, a total of 13 million Jews and others who were unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated.
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China established gun control in 1935. From 1948 to 1952, 20 million political dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
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Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 to 1981, 100,000 Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
---- ------------- -------------

Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 to 1979, 300,000 Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
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Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 to 1977, one million educated people, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
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Defenseless people rounded up and exterminated in the 20th Century because of gun control: 56 million.
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You won't see this data on the US evening news, or hear politicians disseminating this information.

Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws adversely affect only the law-abiding citizens.

Take note my fellow Americans, before it's too late!

The next time someone talks in favor of gun control, please remind them of this history lesson.

With guns, we are 'citizens'. Without them, we are 'subjects'.

During WW II the Japanese decided not to invade America because they knew most Americans were ARMED!

If you value your freedom, please spread this antigun-control message to all of your friends.


The purpose of fighting is to win.
There is no possible victory in defense.
The sword is more important than the shield, and skill is more important than either.
The final weapon is the brain.
All else is supplemental.

SWITZERLAND ISSUES EVERY HOUSEHOLD A GUN!
SWITZERLAND'S GOVERNMENT TRAINS EVERY ADULT THEY ISSUE A RIFLE.
SWITZERLAND HAS THE LOWEST GUN RELATED CRIME RATE OF ANY CIVILIZED COUNTRY IN THE WORLD!!!

IT'S A NO BRAINER!
DON'T LET OUR GOVERNMENT WASTE MILLIONS OF OUR TAX DOLLARS IN AN EFFORT TO MAKE ALL LAW ABIDING CITIZENS AN EASY TARGET.​

I'm a firm believer in the 2nd Amendment!
If you are too, please forward.
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jimmydean

jimmydean

The Official Meat of Ridemonkey
Sep 10, 2001
41,155
13,323
Portland, OR
And why is it right wing nut jobs fail to see a middle ground? Any talk of "gun control" = "They'll take your guns, door to door!!!" :panic:
 
syadasti

syadasti

i heart mac
Apr 15, 2002
12,690
290
VT
Jim Mac said:
Duh! The world is very black and white! The earth is flat! Hitler bad!
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As dante pointed out, history shows Hilter was pro-gun since he removed gun regulations and encouraged ownership. I guess what the gun rights people are saying is Obama is doing the right thing by not emulating Hilter.
 
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