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kidwoo

kidwoo

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Aug 25, 2003
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Big J said:
If most were to read “Bloodlands, Europe Between Hitler and Stalin” by Timothy Snyder your views on gun control may temper.
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They won't.

I live here.

And knew two people killed in some of the news stories that made national coverage in the last few years. It's far too easy for dumb asses in this country to have as an easy option when something pisses them off "let meh go git muh AK/AR/Glock"

Careful with your recommendations on looking at other countries. Because none of the civilized ones have this problem.
 
JohnE

JohnE

filthy rascist
May 13, 2005
13,443
1,969
Front Range, dude...
...and using what happened 70 odd years ago under 2 of the worst tyrants in ever is misleading alarmist rhetoric that attempts to justify the extremist views of the gun lobby.

We must learn from history...and our recent history tells us that guns need to be kept out of the wrong hands, period. Too young? Sorry. Too crazy? Sorry. Felon? Too bad, so sad.

-License the owners.
-Track weapons sales.
-Tax them.
-Require insurance coverage...under your homeowners/renters policy will work nicely. The Right has no problem supporting the insurance lobby for other issues...this will just make them more $$ in the end.
-Track and regulate ammo sales.
--While you are at it, magazine sales too.
-Get away from the freedom argument. Those who stole our country from the natives needed weapons to feed and defend themselves.

Whe it is all said and done, it is a cottage industry unto itself. Weapons and ammo manufacturers will continue to look for ways around regulation, and will find same, thus perpetuating their business.
 
jonKranked

jonKranked

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Nov 10, 2005
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JohnE said:
...and using what happened 70 odd years ago under 2 of the worst tyrants in ever is misleading alarmist rhetoric that attempts to justify the extremist views of the gun lobby.

We must learn from history...and our recent history tells us that guns need to be kept out of the wrong hands, period. Too young? Sorry. Too crazy? Sorry. Felon? Too bad, so sad.

-License the owners.
-Track weapons sales.
-Tax them.
-Require insurance coverage...under your homeowners/renters policy will work nicely. The Right has no problem supporting the insurance lobby for other issues...this will just make them more $$ in the end.
-Track and regulate ammo sales.
--While you are at it, magazine sales too.
-Get away from the freedom argument. Those who stole our country from the natives needed weapons to feed and defend themselves.

Whe it is all said and done, it is a cottage industry unto itself. Weapons and ammo manufacturers will continue to look for ways around regulation, and will find same, thus perpetuating their business.
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but the Constitution™!!!!!
 
dan-o

dan-o

Turbo Monkey
Jun 30, 2004
6,499
2,805
My step-father, with 75 years of frequent gun handling/hunting experience, shot himself in the chest/shoulder after some reloading mishap yesterday. Out alone in eastern CO, he managed to arrange a helo medivac for himself before passing out. Was discharged from the hospital today still packing some hardware (bird shot) but generally OK.

Might be time to take the keys to the gun safe.
 
MMike

MMike

A fowl peckerwood.
Sep 5, 2001
18,207
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just sittin' here drinkin' scotch
dan-o said:
My step-father, with 75 years of frequent gun handling/hunting experience, shot himself in the chest/shoulder after some reloading mishap yesterday. Out alone in eastern CO, he managed to arrange a helo medivac for himself before passing out. Was discharged from the hospital today still packing some hardware (bird shot) but generally OK.

Might be time to take the keys to the gun safe.
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I bet it was Air Methods that went and got him
 
JohnE

JohnE

filthy rascist
May 13, 2005
13,443
1,969
Front Range, dude...
jonKranked said:
i've seen this posted on FB about half a dozen times today.

all were people applauding him exercising his rights (and taking another life)

yet no one asked how the crazy guy got the gun in the first place

http://downtrend.com/emilyh/suspect-waves-a-gun-at-customers-in-dollar-general-two-seconds-later-hes-dead/
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...or who the crazy guy was and why he was doing what he was doing. Not saying the shooting wasnt justified, but he could have been a Cop or Security guy trying to warn people about another shooter. Just sayin...

Gets better. The good guy with a gun is an accused pedophile...

http://www.wsfa.com/story/24474261/names-released-after-customer-kills-gun-wielding-man-in-dallas-co-store

"Jackson confirmed that Marlo Ellis, the customer who used deadly force, is facing charges of rape in the second degree and enticing a child for immoral purposes, stemming from a 2013 investigation involving a girl under the age of 16. Court documents state that Ellis picked the victim up at a school basketball game and drove her to his house where they had sex. The district attorney said Ellis' case is on the trial docket for February. He has been out of jail on bond."
 
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$tinkle

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
6
JohnE said:
"Jackson confirmed that Marlo Ellis, the customer who used deadly force, is facing charges of rape in the second degree and enticing a child for immoral purposes, stemming from a 2013 investigation involving a girl under the age of 16. Court documents state that Ellis picked the victim up at a school basketball game and drove her to his house where they had sex. The district attorney said Ellis' case is on the trial docket for February. He has been out of jail on bond."
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IANAL, but isn't that a felony charge? if so, isn't it SOP to surrender one's gun(s) until at least charges are settled?

oddly, i bet he'd still be lawful to open carry w/o a conviction

but what DA who seeks to be re-appointed or re-elected would file?
 
jonKranked

jonKranked

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$tinkle said:
IANAL, but isn't that a felony charge? if so, isn't it SOP to surrender one's gun(s) until at least charges are settled?

oddly, i bet he'd still be lawful to open carry w/o a conviction

but what DA who seeks to be re-appointed or re-elected would file?
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you do realize this is florida we're talking about?
 
Big J

Big J

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Jul 18, 2005
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JohnE said:
...and using what happened 70 odd years ago under 2 of the worst tyrants in ever is misleading alarmist rhetoric that attempts to justify the extremist views of the gun lobby.
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You don't have go back 70 yrs. the genocides of more recent decades should be enough and every last one of those delightful countries had very severe gun laws imposed upon its citizens. There’s nothing alarmist about facts.

What I do find alarming is the propensity of the Left in the USA towards totalitarianism and think nothing of trampling the rights of the individual as long the Left’s agenda is served.

The hubris of the Left is amusing since they claim to process the moral high ground while campaigning and maneuvering via legislation & the courts to suppress rights of those who disagree with the Left’s agenda, not just gun control but all issues.

I thought we were all to be tolerant of each other’s lifestyle and beliefs………or this only true if one agrees with in whole with the Left or Right???? Watch out for what you wish for you may get the government you want and that may not be a good thing for your children.

J
 
jonKranked

jonKranked

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Big J said:
You don't have go back 70 yrs. the genocides of more recent decades should be enough and every last one of those delightful countries had very severe gun laws imposed upon its citizens. There’s nothing alarmist about facts.

What I do find alarming is the propensity of the Right in the USA towards totalitarianism and think nothing of trampling the rights of the individual as long the Right's agenda is served.

The hubris of the Right is amusing since they claim to process the moral high ground while campaigning and maneuvering via legislation & the courts to suppress rights of those who disagree with the Right's agenda, not just gun control but all issues.

I thought we were all to be tolerant of each other’s lifestyle and beliefs………or this only true if one agrees with in whole with the Left or Right???? Watch out for what you wish for you may get the government you want and that may not be a good thing for your children.

J
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hey look at that!
 
Big J

Big J

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Jul 18, 2005
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Chicago
jonKranked said:
but the Constitution™!!!!!
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Exactly, it was written for this very reason. If some of you have drank deeply from the grape Kool-Aid well of the Left and Right nothing anyone says will sound reasonable to you.

If you think the Oligarchs in the Federal and State Capitols give a rodent’s rear end about you and your family though you’re loyal follower of the parties word you’re sadly mistaken. A majority politicians are in office to serve themselves, look how they scratch & claw to hold on to office instead of doing their service and move on. I like to see a show of hands of those who think Obama and his Chi Town crew truly care about you…….don’t be a party pawn.

J
 
jonKranked

jonKranked

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Big J said:
Exactly, it was written for this very reason. If some of you have drank deeply from the grape Kool-Aid well of the Left and Right nothing anyone says will sound reasonable to you.

If you think the Oligarchs in the Federal and State Capitols give a rodent’s rear end about you and your family though you’re loyal follower of the parties word you’re sadly mistaken. A majority politicians are in office to serve themselves, look how they scratch & claw to hold on to office instead of doing their service and move on. I like to see a show of hands of those who think Obama and his Chi Town crew truly care about you…….don’t be a party pawn.

J
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this times 1000! we need to re-introduce the concept that politician isn't a "career"
 
kidwoo

kidwoo

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Aug 25, 2003
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Big J said:
You don't have go back 70 yrs. the genocides of more recent decades should be enough and every last one of those delightful countries had very severe gun laws imposed upon its citizens. There’s nothing alarmist about facts.

What I do find alarming is the propensity of the Left in the USA towards totalitarianism and think nothing of trampling the rights of the individual as long the Left’s agenda is served.

The hubris of the Left is amusing since they claim to process the moral high ground while campaigning and maneuvering via legislation & the courts to suppress rights of those who disagree with the Left’s agenda, not just gun control but all issues.

I thought we were all to be tolerant of each other’s lifestyle and beliefs………or this only true if one agrees with in whole with the Left or Right???? Watch out for what you wish for you may get the government you want and that may not be a good thing for your children.

J
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Lay off the heavy handed sweeping generalizations and you might get a little further. Plus you just sound like a regurgitating robot.

Here's the header from the original constitution:

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
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Now when firearms are as easy as they are to acquire in this country, and when you or I fight any and all reasonable licensing and regulation of said firearms, that begins to impede on a few of those ideas. It's the same reason you need a license to drive, a license to fly, and the same reason for a whole host of regulations on operating dangerous things. With your familiarity with the 2nd amendment, you probably know that it's that the word 'regulated' appears. And no, you're not a militia. You also need to look at which ideas were prioritized in the drafting of the entire document. Firearms were an afterthought compared to the original tenets. Still there, but not first priority. Don't skip over that on your way to the bill of rights.

So yes, you need to be 'tolerant' of the idea that people should be able to go about their lives without worrying about some a$$hole with mommy issues having easy access to a device that provides nothing more than lots of really fast projectiles that go through bone.

Which is a more tragic impedance of rights? Your right to live under the delusion that you're going to stave of the largest military in the world threatened through some tighter licensing, or someone ending up dead because the NRA shuts down expanded background checks? That's not left or right, that's common sense. That's not Leftist totalitarianism. That's wanting fewer dead people. People who can pursue their dreams without being gunned down, a phenomenon pretty unique to this country. And no, you're not more special than the rest of the world just because you live here. Just less educated.
 
syadasti

syadasti

i heart mac
Apr 15, 2002
12,690
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Big J said:
You don't have go back 70 yrs. the genocides of more recent decades should be enough and every last one of those delightful countries had very severe gun laws imposed upon its citizens. There’s nothing alarmist about facts.
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The fact is your argument and account of history is flawed. Dante and myself debunked the Hilter BS pages ago, Hilter eased gun control laws when he came into power. And Iraq has the one of the highest rates of gun ownership in the world, it didn't stop anything. Guns are meaningless against a modern military and he had no problem committing genocide regardless of the fact that the Kurds had small arms.
 
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jonKranked

jonKranked

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kidwoo said:
Lay off the heavy handed sweeping generalizations and you might get a little further. Plus you just sound like a regurgitating robot.

Here's the header from the original constitution:



Now when firearms are as easy as they are to acquire in this country, and when you or I fight any and all reasonable licensing and regulation of said firearms, that begins to impede on a few of those ideas. It's the same reason you need a license to drive, a license to fly, and the same reason for a whole host of regulations on operating dangerous things. With your familiarity with the 2nd amendment, you probably know that it's that the word 'regulated' appears. And no, you're not a militia. You also need to look at which ideas were prioritized in the drafting of the entire document. Firearms were an afterthought compared to the original tenets. Still there, but not first priority. Don't skip over that on your way to the bill of rights.

So yes, you need to be 'tolerant' of the idea that people should be able to go about their lives without worrying about some a$$hole with mommy issues having easy access to a device that provides nothing more than lots of really fast projectiles that go through bone.

Which is a more tragic impedance of rights? Your right to live under the delusion that you're going to stave of the largest military in the world threatened through some tighter licensing, or someone ending up dead because the NRA shuts down expanded background checks? That's not left or right, that's common sense. That's not Leftist totalitarianism. That's wanting fewer dead people. People who can pursue their dreams without being gunned down, a phenomenon pretty unique to this country. And no, you're not more special than the rest of the world just because you live here. Just less educated.
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must spread rep.
 
Beef Supreme

Beef Supreme

Turbo Monkey
Oct 29, 2010
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Big J said:
What I do find alarming is the propensity of the Left in the USA towards totalitarianism and think nothing of trampling the rights of the individual as long the Left’s agenda is served.

J
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He is alarmed! Alarmed, I tell you!

The one thing we can conclude from the above statement is that J knows fvck-all about totalitarianism. Also maybe that ignorance is alarming.
 
Andyman_1970

Andyman_1970

Turbo Monkey
Apr 4, 2003
3,105
5
The Natural State
Big J said:
What I do find alarming is the propensity of the Left in the USA towards totalitarianism and think nothing of trampling the rights of the individual as long the Left’s agenda is served.
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GOP individual rights trampling.............

NSA
Marriage equality
Women's reproductive rights
Marginalizing any reliegion other than Christianity

Shall I go on??
 
gastro

gastro

Monkey
May 16, 2004
500
2
Down by law and I know my way around
kidwoo said:
With your familiarity with the 2nd amendment, you probably know that it's that the word 'regulated' appears. And no, you're not a militia. You also need to look at which ideas were prioritized in the drafting of the entire document. Firearms were an afterthought compared to the original tenets. Still there, but not first priority. Don't skip over that on your way to the bill of rights.
Click to expand...
kidwoo puts on his robe and originalist hat...
 
Big J

Big J

Monkey
Jul 18, 2005
421
0
Chicago
Beef Supreme said:
He is alarmed! Alarmed, I tell you!

The one thing we can conclude from the above statement is that J knows fvck-all about totalitarianism. Also maybe that ignorance is alarming.
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Really, do you have to resort to the personal attacks....oh ****, I forgot I'm on RM......

J
 
Big J

Big J

Monkey
Jul 18, 2005
421
0
Chicago
kidwoo said:
Lay off the heavy handed sweeping generalizations and you might get a little further. Plus you just sound like a regurgitating robot.

Here's the header from the original constitution:



Now when firearms are as easy as they are to acquire in this country, and when you or I fight any and all reasonable licensing and regulation of said firearms, that begins to impede on a few of those ideas. It's the same reason you need a license to drive, a license to fly, and the same reason for a whole host of regulations on operating dangerous things. With your familiarity with the 2nd amendment, you probably know that it's that the word 'regulated' appears. And no, you're not a militia. You also need to look at which ideas were prioritized in the drafting of the entire document. Firearms were an afterthought compared to the original tenets. Still there, but not first priority. Don't skip over that on your way to the bill of rights.

So yes, you need to be 'tolerant' of the idea that people should be able to go about their lives without worrying about some a$$hole with mommy issues having easy access to a device that provides nothing more than lots of really fast projectiles that go through bone.

Which is a more tragic impedance of rights? Your right to live under the delusion that you're going to stave of the largest military in the world threatened through some tighter licensing, or someone ending up dead because the NRA shuts down expanded background checks? That's not left or right, that's common sense. That's not Leftist totalitarianism. That's wanting fewer dead people. People who can pursue their dreams without being gunned down, a phenomenon pretty unique to this country. And no, you're not more special than the rest of the world just because you live here. Just less educated.
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You could have made your point w/out the personal attacks. I understand your passion and feel horrible for those who lost loved ones and friends to a low life that lacks the courage & character to off himself without affecting the innocent.

Generalities…..you may dismiss it as such but that’s how I feel about the political landscape of this country, one group after another pressing their will upon the individual.

Delusional…..not at all, one can only hope this democracy self corrects every now and then.

J
 
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