Any bicyle industry engineers out there?

GodSmack · Feb 16, 2014

birdman2447 said:
I am a young mechanical engineer who has been very into bikes since age 13 or so. I have always dreamed of working for a bicyle company where I could put my passion for cycling and engineering degree to use.

I browse some of the major bicyle companies job listings once a month or so. SRAM in particular seems to post listings for engineers often.

I talked to one industry engineer who will go unnamed who said bicycle industry engineers are overworked, underpaid and working in the industry too long will lead you to not enjoy bikes like you use to.

Any one out there who works in the industry care to chime in?

You get into the bike industry because of passion. There is no huge profit margin in bikes. An Engineer is a metal fabrication shop will make a much better wage.
Do you want to wake up and want to go to your exiciting job the world of bikes? Don't expect to be paid well but you might create a bike part that brings smiles to thousands of bikers.

Jm_ · Feb 16, 2014

There are two ways you can go about this. One can argue that the reason the wages are so pitiful is that people do this out of their "passion" and sell themselves short. It works for a while, until you realize all the things you could do with some $$$ that would make you happy and give you flexibility (like trips to Alps, NZ, Alaska, South America, and others to go on epic rides, just to name a few..).

The other, generally more sane way to do this is to get into an industry where there is high demand and the pay is good. Earn far more money and have the time and ability to buy some of your own welding, milling and possibly even CNC equipment. You can do a lot without a computer CNC, but as an engineer pulling down a good salary, this is not out of the question, as well as being in the "know" and able to buy time on other machines if needed. This way you can do it on your own terms in the way that makes you happy, rather than being forced to design some bike or component that you have no interest in. The general idea here is similar to what us pilots go through. We could go into the usual "airline pilot" career progression, where we fight it out earning 25K/yr at regional airlines year after year, barely surviving, for the "chance" to eventually "make it" when we are older, but this hinges on our airline staying in business and keeping our medical certificate. So many of us have sacrificed way too much to "fly for a living", having to commute across the country, work 14hr days, only to be paid for about 6 of those hours, and so on. It takes the life right out of someone.

Compare that with being in a position, possibly within the same industry (aviation for me), where I can enjoy a little bit of flying, but make a good salary, afford my own airplane, flying around where I want, when I want, and how I want, have money for vacations and other things (toys), not be traveling around like a gypsy constantly, and basically enjoy a higher QOL WHILE STILL FLYING AIRPLANES. This is the number one mistake IMO, people assume that if they do not become an airline pilot that they will not be able to fly. They get tunnel vision and completely exclude every other possibility. A doctor that owns a Beech Bonanza probably gets to enjoy flying far more than an airline pilot, but the airline pilots can't see that anymore.

So my advice is to do something you can live with, something you are interested in, but be careful about making it your "passion". Save that for your off time, for recreation, make sure you have the funds to support it, and so on. I'd like to get into welding and machining in the future too, but I don't think making that a career path is the best way to satisfy it.

Kanye West · Feb 16, 2014

I've considered that career path a few times now in various forms, and there are really only a couple positions within the entire industry that I would consider as realistic options at this point in my career. So, I've done significant research and personal investigation into the topic.

The best thing you can do, whereever it is you are at in your career, is pursue mechanical engineering 110%, learn as much as you can (outside of school) about actually making things and being productive and useful, and diversify your talents. Learn enough about engineering business and all the other outside factors to be considerate in your engineering/design decisions. Don't have an ego when working in teams, swallow your pride if someone critiques your work, and learn from it. Grow some thick skin, and it will help you later.

I'm assuming you're still in school, or fresh out of school. Develop yourself over the next few years in a much more rigorous industry, keep yourself involved in the bike industry, and if you do still want those opportunities, they will come to you, and you'll be at a much more advantageous position being a qualified and experienced engineer already, rather than working from the ground up. Bike companies know they can cherry-pick fresh grads who want a "cool" job all day long for wages that don't even cover expenses for a decent standard of living in their areas. So they do. If you're experienced and bring more functionality to the table, you have more leverage and stand a better chance of decent compensation.

Honestly, you'll be selling yourself very short in your development by starting out in bikes, and if you decide to go to some other industry afterwards, you'll have a hell of a hard time (regardless of the work you were doing) with ONLY bike industry experience on your resume.

Go somewhere else like aerospace, biomedical, automation, or semiconductor, develop your skills aggressively and broadly, then think about going into bikes if your lifestyle needs a change at that point.

For me, high-speed automation design serving industries like aerospace/bio/ag/semiconductor/automotive/energy taught me the widest variety of skills in the shortest amount of time, and opened the most doors. There is SO much you have to be good at and SO much to consider when doing the design. Super steep learning curve, but highly enjoyable. I personally think it's fun as hell, and I'm recently back in that industry and in a very good spot. It would probably take me years and years to get the same compensation within the bike industry, and I'd work myself to death for it, and wouldn't have nearly as powerful or useful of an engineering background, nor the wide range of mobility options. It'd be a means to a lifestyle of being broke and riding my bike a lot.

At the end of the day at my job, I return home mentally exhausted, and I love it. I am using EVERY single subject of engineering that I've ever learned pretty much on a daily basis. The actual product of my work is highly complex and tangible and stuff I take pride in. I don't think I'd get that out of the bike industry, except for a select couple of roles.

It's very hard for automation companies to find engineers who are competent and capable in that field, so they are usually willing to invest time/money/resources into training young and ENTHUSIASTIC engineers. Show drive and eagerness to learn and a genuine personal interest in learning new things. If I had to do it over again, I would have gone that direction sooner.

Just curious, what region are you thinking of working in?

Kanye West · Feb 16, 2014

Sounds like you have a good background and you're well on your way to becoming a legitimately useful engineer.

I wouldn't move across the country to pursue a bike industry position personally, unless it happens to pay enough for you to make that sort of investment.

It truly is scary how some engineers with very high responsibilities can't handle even the most basic design/hands-on concepts, and have never actually built anything in their lives. A good skill to learn is how to quickly identify these types from afar, and either 1) avoid working with them, or worse yet, FOR them and 2) how to catch their errors before they get out the door and somehow reflect poorly on you.

blackohio · Feb 16, 2014

go into an industry that pays you well. take earnings to devote to having fun. whistler is awesome when you work for bike company X. Whistler is better when you work for well paying company Y.

Beers expensive and you'll want to take stock in a yoga pant company when there.

joeg · Feb 17, 2014

I'd add "learn how to spell bicycle" to the list of skills you should master before looking at a bike industry profession.

Hacktastic's advice is pretty solid. First step: become a good engineer. Every career step after that is infinitely easier if you focus on that.

wiscodh · Feb 17, 2014

birdman2447 said:
I would love someday to do something semi hands on. Or as hands on as you can get as an mech engineer.

remember 90% of bike company's make stuff over seas. So hands on means sending CAD to asia, then flying over there

I would love to move to either Oregon or Colorado but all my family and friend are in the east. There are plenty of jobs in mass and south of there but Maine dosent have much to offer.

So whats stopping you??? family and friends can visit, you can make new friends pretty easy.

I understand what you guys are saying about mixing passion and work. Because my current employer dosent pay overtime they rarely work me more they say 45 hours a week. It's nice to get out of work at a reasonable hour and hop on the bike and just ride by 5pm any night I please.

HA, don't work in the bike industry, or action sports for that matter, if you hate long hours and no OT

see bold

Kanye West · Feb 17, 2014

joeg said:
I'd add "learn how to spell bicycle" to the list of skills you should master before looking at a bike industry profession.

blackohio · Feb 17, 2014

wiscodh said:
see bold

I would also like to add don't move to oregon unless your career chioce is being unemployed.

Harry BarnOwl · Feb 17, 2014

I'm in a similar position to you, working as a design engineer and fresh out of uni. I'm currently working in the oil industry, and I highly recommend it. The work is interesting and fun, but it's also quite a high pressure environment, which I personally really enjoy. For each day that a well isn't producing, it can cost an operator between $500,000 - $2,000,000, so getting the job finished to a high quality and quickly is crucial. I think this kind of environment builds really strong experience, and it's fairly common for engineers (at least for north sea oil over here in yurp) to become professionally chartered before they're 30. The pay is also really good, but a company will definitely get its pound of flesh out of you.

My long term plan has always included the possibility of designing bike stuff, but as many people have already mentioned I think that's something to do in your own time and on your own terms.

Kanye West · Feb 17, 2014

Harry BarnOwl said:
oil industry.....a high pressure environment

I see what you did there...

If I were to move anywhere besides southern/central coast CA, I would pursue petroleum engineering work 100%. The bit of contract P&ID/PFD work I've done has been interesting enough.

There's just not enough of it in this area. Wish there was.

fred.r · Feb 17, 2014

blackohio said:
Beers expensive and you'll want to take stock in a yoga pant company when there.

The yoga convention before last years Crankworx was amazing, from a spectating point of view.

SCARY · Feb 17, 2014

Hacktastic said:
I've considered that career path a few times now in various forms, and there are really only a couple positions within the stry that I would consider as realistic options at this point in my career. So, I've done significant research and personal investigation into the topic.

The best thing you can do, whereever it is you are at in your career, is pursue mechanical engineering 110%, learn as much as you can (outside of school) about actually making things and being productive and useful, and diversify your talents. Learn enough about engineering business and all the other outside factors to be considerate in your engineering/design decisions. Don't have an ego when working in teams, swallow your pride if someone critiques your work, and learn from it. Grow some thick skin, and it will help you later.

I'm assuming you're still in school, or fresh out of school. Develop yourself over the next few years in a much more rigorous industry, keep yourself involved in the bike industry, and if you do still want those opportunities, they will come to you, and you'll be at a much more advantageous position being a qualified and experienced engineer already, rather than working from the ground up. Bike companies know they can cherry-pick fresh grads who want a "cool" job all day long for wages that don't even cover expenses for a decent standard of living in their areas. So they do. If you're experienced and bring more functionality to the table, you have more leverage and stand a better chance of decent compensation.

Honestly, you'll be selling yourself very short in your development by starting out in bikes, and if you decide to go to some other industry afterwards, you'll have a hell of a hard time (regardless of the work you were doing) with ONLY bike industry experience on your resume.

Go somewhere else like aerospace, biomedical, automation, or semiconductor, develop your skills aggressively and broadly, then think about going into bikes if your lifestyle needs a change at that point.

For me, high-speed automation design serving industries like aerospace/bio/ag/semiconductor/automotive/energy taught me the widest variety of skills in the shortest amount of time, and opened the most doors. There is SO much you have to be good at and SO much to consider when doing the design. Super steep learning curve, but highly enjoyable. I personally think it's fun as hell, and I'm recently back in that industry and in a very good spot. It would probably take me years and years to get the same compensation within the bike industry, and I'd work myself to death for it, and wouldn't have nearly as powerful or useful of an engineering background, nor the wide range of mobility options. It'd be a means to a lifestyle of being broke and riding my bike a lot.

At the end of the day at my job, I return home mentally exhausted, and I love it. I am using EVERY single subject of engineering that I've ever learned pretty much on a daily basis. The actual product of my work is highly complex and tangible and stuff I take pride in. I don't think I'd get that out of the bike industry, except for a select couple of roles.

It's very hard for automation companies to find engineers who are competent and capable in that field, so they are usually willing to invest time/money/resources into training young and ENTHUSIASTIC engineers. Show drive and eagerness to learn and a genuine personal interest in learning new things. If I had to do it over again, I would have gone that direction sooner.

Just curious, what region are you thinking of working in?

So, it's at the end of the day..When you're mentally exhausted. ...that's when you start posting on RM? Cuz really, you could totally use that as a legitimate reason for being the way you are.....Seriously please let there be a reason

Kanye West · Feb 17, 2014

Well....the other reason is that talking smack on RideDonkey is pretty entertaining sometimes, aside from occasionally getting some useful technical information. And you conveniently place yourself as the butt of many jokes. Nothing personal, you just sorta put yourself out there.

blackohio · Feb 17, 2014

fred.r said:
The yoga convention before last years Crankworx was amazing, from a spectating point of view.

it was a thing of beauty. ride or crush ass, and by crush i mean stare at.

Harry BarnOwl · Feb 18, 2014

Hacktastic said:
I see what you did there...

If I were to move anywhere besides southern/central coast CA, I would pursue petroleum engineering work 100%. The bit of contract P&ID/PFD work I've done has been interesting enough.

There's just not enough of it in this area. Wish there was.

Haha I did see it but I hate it when people put "pun intended". But yeah we are essentially just high pressure plumbers.

yetihenry · Feb 19, 2014

blackohio said:
go into an industry that pays you well. take earnings to devote to having fun. whistler is awesome when you work for bike company X. Whistler is better when you work for well paying company Y..

I'd get paid more in the oil fields working for company Y, I could probably earn more than twice as much. But I'd have to work shifts and shut downs, so I wouldn't see my girlfriend/bike for weeks at a time.

I get paid less in Whistler (but more than a lot of people in this town), work in an industry I love, doing a job I love. More to life than money.

Millwright/NDT Technician for reference.

Jm_ · Feb 19, 2014

yetihenry said:
I'd get paid more in the oil fields working for company Y, I could probably earn more than twice as much. But I'd have to work shifts and shut downs, so I wouldn't see my girlfriend/bike for weeks at a time.

I get paid less in Whistler (but more than a lot of people in this town), work in an industry I love, doing a job I love. More to life than money.

Millwright/NDT Technician for reference.

I think you missed his point. QOL and being able to do what you want outweighs getting stuck in something "because you love it" or because it's "your dream industry/job". Sacrificing QOL for that just never works out.

jackalope · Feb 19, 2014

FWIW, it sound like yetihenry has the whole QOL thing worked out quite well.

yetihenry · Feb 19, 2014

QOL /= the $ on your pay stub at the end of the month. For some people long days in an office, having to squeeze in half an hour at the gym on the way home to try and make up for sitting at a desk all day, never getting out to a site isn't perfect.

The opportunity to earn a very good wage, rather than comparing everything to oil money.

Also just pointing out, there are more jobs than just designing bike parts in this industry.

SCARY · Feb 19, 2014

Hacktastic said:
Well....the other reason is that talking smack on RideDonkey is pretty entertaining sometimes, aside from occasionally getting some useful technical information. And you conveniently place yourself as the butt of many jokes. Nothing personal, you just sorta put yourself out there.

Yeah...no....its kinda my "thing".

Soooo.....I call dibs.

Kanye West · Feb 19, 2014

SCARY said:
Yeah...no....its kinda my "thing".

Soooo.....I call dibs.

Dibs on what?

SCARY · Feb 19, 2014

Wow.....avatar has changed , but yer still dumb.

At least I know it's still you.

Kanye West · Feb 19, 2014

I am aiming to have a more memorable presence here.

Try to forget that image. Just try.

SCARY · Feb 20, 2014

You'll always be dog sh1t to me

(Made myself laugh right out loud, right there)

Kanye West · Feb 20, 2014

I suppose that's fair.

You'll always be another Richard Simmons to me. :cupidarrow:

Jm_ · Feb 20, 2014

Also, my post earlier wasn't just to try and make someone think solely about money as it relates to quality of life (even though it's a HUGE factor), it's also to get people to think outside of the tunnel vision. As pilots, we think we can only be airline pilots, but we can be forest service pilots, various other agencies like FBI, DHS (CBP), e tc, airmed pilots, instructor pilots of various types including warbirds and jets, insurance guys that fly around and investigate/evaluate, corporate pilots, company test pilots, company delivery pilots, salesman and demonstration pilots, cargo pilots, contract charter pilots, FAA pilots (like me) and the list goes on and on. And then there are the multitude of good-paying aviation jobs that don't directly include flying, but pay well enough for you to afford to do so and that still keep you "in" aviation.

That's really what it comes down to IMO, get rid of the "tunnel vision". Realize what jobs and industries you'd be interested in, not the one that is your absolute passion, unless for some reason that one pays 3x what the other ones do, instead of 3x less. Boeing for example (I interviewed with them) is an amazing company, they move engineers and workers around so they don't get "bored" doing the same stuff, the engineers get to go abroad to work with teams in other places for short periods of time, and then come back. It's not sitting behind a computer clicking a mouse every day designing abstract parts. My Uncle worked for MD as an engineer (later Boeing when they got bought out) and traveled all over the world on trips, doing work with teams, investigations into mishaps, all sorts of interesting stuff, at the company's expense.

I'm not saying get into aeronautical engineering, but for the love of god don't limit yourself with tunnel vision. Realize the entire world of possibilities. Bikes can't be the only thing you like, and chances are those other things had to be designed at some point...

blackohio · Feb 20, 2014

yetihenry said:
I'd get paid more in the oil fields working for company Y, I could probably earn more than twice as much. But I'd have to work shifts and shut downs, so I wouldn't see my girlfriend/bike for weeks at a time.

I get paid less in Whistler (but more than a lot of people in this town), work in an industry I love, doing a job I love. More to life than money.

Millwright/NDT Technician for reference.

I think you did miss my point a bit. I was suggesting looking for a job that pays well (obviously one that doesnt
negate the good pay with bad hours.

I work in the auto industry, paid artist (essentially) Its like the bike industry, but with slightly better pay. Few years ago I was making over 80K and single. Now I make less (Still essentially single), and work more to have the bike stuff I want. I hustle and work 16-18 hour days to have the bikes and parts and car crap I want. I'd rather have my older (better) paying desk job than the one I have now. On paper my QOL is awesome, the reality is i'd rather have the pay than work nonstop.

SCARY · Feb 20, 2014

I take my dog to work.

Kanye West · Feb 20, 2014

SCARY said:
I take my dog to work.

You're homeless aren't you? "Work" = cardboard box under a bridge where you can practice stationary rollerblading in your tights?

SCARY · Feb 20, 2014

No.

I wanted to learn stationary rollerblading because I take my dog to work with my hard core Rollerblades , but she runs too fast when she's pulling me and it frizzes up my perm.

Any bicyle industry engineers out there?

Chimp

Chimp

sled dog's bollocks

220# bag of hacktastic

Chimp

220# bag of hacktastic

Generous jaywalker

I have some obvious biases

Monkey

220# bag of hacktastic

Generous jaywalker

Monkey

220# bag of hacktastic

Dwangus Bogans

Not long enough

220# bag of hacktastic

Generous jaywalker

Monkey

Monkey

sled dog's bollocks

Mental acuity - 1%

Monkey

Not long enough

220# bag of hacktastic

Not long enough

220# bag of hacktastic

Not long enough

220# bag of hacktastic

sled dog's bollocks

Generous jaywalker

Not long enough

220# bag of hacktastic

Not long enough