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New Enduro/DH light

Biffff

Monkey
Jan 10, 2006
913
0
looking at mini DH/ enduro bikes.... Particularly the Scott genius lt and Giant Reign.
Both bikes look good, but my big dilemma is deciding on which genius lt .... Plus or regular 27.5 if I decide to go with Scott.
On paper the plus looks like a winner to me. More traction with minimal loss in rolling resistance, boost sized axles ( which it seems everything is moving to) and it can even run as 29'r if needed.
This bike will be used for racing my local enduro series with occasional DH use.

Thoughts??
 

Biffff

Monkey
Jan 10, 2006
913
0
I was a 26 hold out, but can't deny that 27.5 is better then 26 in every way after running one for the past 2 seasons.
I still have 26" DH bike and will likely keep it.
Fact is I need a new bike, and it needs to be the fastest one.. I don't really care which one is a little "funner" then the other as they will both be fun.
It seems the whole industry is going toward plus tires and boost. In a couple years I need to be able to re-sell the bike so it will make a difference in that area.

Is plus faster??? Will they hold up to aggressive riding,??? Will plus and boost be here to stay??
 

blindboxx2334

Turbo Monkey
Mar 19, 2013
1,340
101
Wets Coast
so, we all know how we all feel about boost. but what is the general consensus on this '+' tire crap?

do they roll halfway decent with those big ass tires? i spend all of my time in the shed now a days (w/ my broken rigs), so i am lame..
 

kidwoo

Artisanal Tweet Curator
2.8 tires that weigh the same or less than tough 2.3 tires sound exactly like 'better for aggressive riding' all right.

For all the dumb shit bike companies are coming up with lately just to see if people will buy it, the general customer base is even worse because they usually will.
 

dump

Turbo Monkey
Oct 12, 2001
8,194
4,419
+ reminds me of 2001 and low pressure Nokian Gazzaloddi 3.0... except this time they want you to pedal up too. As woo said, lightweight casing is the only way the weight is kept down on a 2.8... and the last thing I want is a light casing on my tires. Let's not even start with what it feels like to ride at 14psi. No thanks.
 

jackalope

Mental acuity - 1%
Jan 9, 2004
7,596
5,894
in a single wide, cooking meth...
+ reminds me of 2001 and low pressure Nokian Gazzaloddi 3.0... except this time they want you to pedal up too. As woo said, lightweight casing is the only way the weight is kept down on a 2.8... and the last thing I want is a light casing on my tires. Let's not even start with what it feels like to ride at 14psi. No thanks.
This...also of interest, our very own Bike Magazine has a review of a Lane Bryant bike (today in fact) that I thought it was pretty good -

http://www.bikemag.com/gear/bikes/trail-bikes-gear/stumpjumper-6fattie/

The whole plus/fat tired bikes thing makes me think of something that was actually written in a MTBA review of all places:

"Blimp tires can make a less skilled rider more confident and faster, and make a skilled rider slower and contemplate suicide."

Paraphrasing just a bit, but its also something echoed in the article I linked above. As per the usual, I will recommend a Guerrilla Gravity Megatrail for a "mini-DH" bike (slack, low, 160 mm rear travel), but there's obviously a lot of great choices in this category now days. I want to say I'll be surprised if 148 takes off, but sadly I'm inclined to agree with Woo's concise assessment. But hey, if you want the "fastest", get one of them new 27.5 plus e-bikes and lay waste to the transition stages and flat/uphill parts in the timed sections. 2 birds stoned!!
 
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Dogboy

Turbo Monkey
Apr 12, 2004
3,208
581
Durham, NC
I want to say I'll be surprised if 148 takes off, but sadly I'm inclined to agree with Woo's concise assessment.
It already has, big time. Remember that 148 has less to do with plus size tires and more to do with better spoke bracing angles/stiffer wheels. Pretty much all FS bike from here on (until the next "standard") is going to use Boost 148 rear spacing - the minority will be the bikes that aren't Boost.
 

Biffff

Monkey
Jan 10, 2006
913
0
Just looking for some input.... Buying bikes in this segment is a huge investment. I don't want to drop 5g on something that is obsolete the minute I get it.
I am an experienced and aggressive rider. I am also 6.1 and 185 so I need the tires to hold up to that. Maybe plus isn't for me...
 

supercow

Monkey
Feb 18, 2009
969
128
I wobble my Reign down everywhere, pedal back up again... rinse and repeat. It really is a lovely bike.

ps: a bike is only "obsolete" if you allow it to be that in your head.


 
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Biffff

Monkey
Jan 10, 2006
913
0
I don't mean obsolete in how it performs. More so as in how it will re-sell or how easy it will be to service/replace wheels and hubs.
 

wydopen

Turbo Monkey
Jan 16, 2005
1,229
60
805
Having ridden a Genuis LT, new Giant Reign and a 27.5+ 160mm bike my advise would be to look at the Guerrilla Gravity thread and get yourself a Megatrail...
 

Biffff

Monkey
Jan 10, 2006
913
0
Having ridden a Genuis LT, new Giant Reign and a 27.5+ 160mm bike my advise would be to look at the Guerrilla Gravity thread and get yourself a Megatrail...
My choices are limited to Scott and Giant as that's what my local shops can hook me up with.
What did you like better Reign or Genius LT??
 

Trasselkalle

Monkey
Oct 28, 2014
138
25
Sweden
Aren't your options kind of different in style? I haven't ridden the Reign, but isn't that bike (quite a bit) less of a climber bike? I'd probably lean in the Scott direction, but I easily confess that is because I've liked several bikes from them in the past.
 

Biffff

Monkey
Jan 10, 2006
913
0
Aren't your options kind of different in style? I haven't ridden the Reign, but isn't that bike (quite a bit) less of a climber bike? I'd probably lean in the Scott direction, but I easily confess that is because I've liked several bikes from them in the past.
Angles are pretty similar... 65 (reign)vs 65.8 (genius lt plus). The plus is on taller tires. The medium reign and large genius lt are very close in top tube, reach and wheelbase.
I think the genius lt is more versatile due to its adjustable geometry and on the fly dampening adjustments.
 

Trasselkalle

Monkey
Oct 28, 2014
138
25
Sweden
Angles are pretty similar... 65 (reign)vs 65.8 (genius lt plus). The plus is on taller tires. The medium reign and large genius lt are very close in top tube, reach and wheelbase.
I think the genius lt is more versatile due to its adjustable geometry and on the fly dampening adjustments.
It's not all about the geo for climbing.

Even in terms of geo, I would be looking more at the seatpost angle (steeper on the Genius) and the top tube / reach (which isn't quite as long on the Genius). You can certainly pedal the Reign, but I haven't heard anyone who felt that was a strong-suit of the bike, whereas I have tried the Genius and thought it was a good climber.

Oh, and please note: there's nothing wrong with a downhill-oriented bike. I'm just commenting that to my understanding, one is more 'generally good' while the other one has clearly more 'downhill-emphasis' to its ride. To each their own in terms of prioritization.

Do you really have to have the Scott in the first batch to the store, in case you go for it? I'd easily suggest waiting until they have them in store if you buy at an LBS. Isn't that one of THE biggest reasons for even buying at an LBS?
 
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wydopen

Turbo Monkey
Jan 16, 2005
1,229
60
805
My choices are limited to Scott and Giant as that's what my local shops can hook me up with.
What did you like better Reign or Genius LT??
I dont know...probably the scott...my friend has had a few of them...feel ok when setup right but he has been through a few swingarms in the last year....The reign to me feels like it just blows through the rear travel...I had a 26" reignx that felt about the same suspension wise as the new ones....be prepared to siz e up on both of them....my medium megatrail is roomier feeling than the large genius...the main thing the scott has going for it is its a few lbs lighter than my bike
 

bengxe

Monkey
Dec 19, 2011
211
30
upstate NY
If you're looking for a mini dh bike the choice is pretty clear. The genius is a long travel trail bike, while the reign is a mini dh or enduro race bike. Based on the anti squat graphs, I'd say the reign should probably be the better climber too. And I'm pretty curious how/ why Scott got such a VPPish leverage curve out of a single pivot. I'm not familiar with that proprietary shock they use, but I doubt there's anything in there that could make this rideable.

http://linkagedesign.blogspot.com/2013/08/scott-genius-lt-2014.html?m=1
http://linkagedesign.blogspot.com/2014/08/giant-reign-275-2015.html?m=1
 
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manhattanprjkt83

Rusty Trombone
Jul 10, 2003
9,644
1,214
Nilbog
so, we all know how we all feel about boost. but what is the general consensus on this '+' tire crap?

do they roll halfway decent with those big ass tires? i spend all of my time in the shed now a days (w/ my broken rigs), so i am lame..
I just got done doing a review on one. In summary, they turn like sh1t, are somewhat sluggish, but are fun crawling around in slow speed rock tech. I can't ever see them gaining traction for true rippers or dh style bikes but crazier things have happened.
 

toodles

ridiculously corgi proportioned
Aug 24, 2004
5,479
4,719
Australia
Wouldn't the Reign be much higher specced at a given price point? Or is that only here in Australia?
 

Biffff

Monkey
Jan 10, 2006
913
0
Not really sure about the negatives about 27.5 +... It's just a 2.8 tire engineered to work on a lighter bike. Lots of riders have run similar sizes on DH bikes for years. Now there are frames and forks to accommodate larger tires.
I'm gonna give it a try. Seems like there will be lots of tire options to try too. I prefer stability to fast/twitchy steering.