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What trail bike tire casings don't suck?

kidwoo

kidwoo

Artisanal Tweet Curator
Aug 25, 2003
42,146
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Squirtin ketchup n' mustard on charred flesh
big-ted said:
Slaughter Grid has been my go-to rear tire for a while on the trail bike now, but I had a weird thing happen to one the other day. Landed a hip jump fairly cleanly (I thought, at least). Tire burped, made a horrible sound, and as I rode out the landing the tire was rubbing on the frame. "Shit." I thought, I've trashed the wheel. Nope. Rim is straight. No sign of any tire damage, and the bead is sat evenly around the rim. Somehow, the carcass of the tire itself had gotten distorted. Deflating and resetting didn't solve the problem. No sign of any damage on the outside of the tire, just a weirdly shaped tire.
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If you roll the tire and look down the centerline is it like a wobble that you'd see from the bead not seated in one section?

I had one like that and just figured I was an idiot and didn't notice it when I first put it on. But yeah it's like the casing on one side stretched or something. I just wrote it off as a screwy molding but it was bad enough that it seems odd I wouldn't have seen it when it was new and popping the bead on the first time. Same tire, slaughter grid.
 
Dogboy

Dogboy

Turbo Monkey
Apr 12, 2004
3,209
584
Durham, NC
kidwoo said:
If you roll the tire and look down the centerline is it like a wobble that you'd see from the bead not seated in one section?

I had one like that and just figured I was an idiot and didn't notice it when I first put it on. But yeah it's like the casing on one side stretched or something. I just wrote it off as a screwy molding but it was bad enough that it seems odd I wouldn't have seen it when it was new and popping the bead on the first time. Same tire, slaughter grid.
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I've seen a friend do that to a couple of Maxxis tires too. It's a weird thing, like something in the casing just lets go.
 
Jeremy R

Jeremy R

<b>x</b>
Nov 15, 2001
9,698
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behind you with a snap pop
kidwoo said:
Put a how-to up on your instagram.
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The tough part is deciding on a filter that best highlights my ass cheeks.

And FTR, chalk me up as another fan of the Slaughter tire. I have had that same tire on my Patrol since I got it.
It rolls fast, the sideknobs are there when you need them, and my favorite part of that tire is if your offline in a corner it is super easy to bring that tire around with the rear brake. That is not surprising though, but the two things that surprised me about that tire is that it still grips decent in the wet (not deep mud of course), and braking traction is even good in most conditions here.
 
slyfink

slyfink

Turbo Monkey
Sep 16, 2008
9,331
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Jeremy R said:
and braking traction is even good in most conditions here.
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what are your conditions?

I scared the bejeezus out of myself this past weekend trying to emergency-brake with it [Slaughter GRID on rear] in moon dust. this is essentially loam that has dried up and is just a big pile of silt. it was the end of a ride, and I got sloppy in a fast sweeping turn (bad body position, no lean on the bike). Realized I was coming in too hot, and just had no traction when I was on the brakes and wound up in the trees. My first ride with the tire I was in a similar situation where it just picked up a bunch of dirt and flung it up in the air rather than slow me down.

But in every other condition, I love love love that tire. I'm especially surprised at how it handles wet surfaces. Sure it get overwhelmed by mud, but slick wet is fine.
 
Jeremy R

Jeremy R

<b>x</b>
Nov 15, 2001
9,698
1,053
behind you with a snap pop
slyfink said:
what are your conditions?

I scared the bejeezus out of myself this past weekend trying to emergency-brake with it [Slaughter GRID on rear] in moon dust. this is essentially loam that has dried up and is just a big pile of silt. it was the end of a ride, and I got sloppy in a fast sweeping turn (bad body position, no lean on the bike). Realized I was coming in too hot, and just had no traction when I was on the brakes and wound up in the trees. My first ride with the tire I was in a similar situation where it just picked up a bunch of dirt and flung it up in the air rather than slow me down.

But in every other condition, I love love love that tire. I'm especially surprised at how it handles wet surfaces. Sure it get overwhelmed by mud, but slick wet is fine.
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Yeah, we don't get much moon dust here. If it is really dry, it gets sandy in spots. But mostly, i am on rooty and rocky singletrack where it thunderstorms at least every other day. I have sharted a couple of times in sand now that I think about it. But I rode pisgah soaking wet on a steep trail and traction was great on it all the way down. It is a surprising tire for sure.
 
big-ted

big-ted

Danced with A, attacked by C, fired by D.
Sep 27, 2005
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Vancouver, BC
Yup. Exactly as if the bead wasn't seated properly, except it was. One other guy in our group claimed he'd seen it also. I guess I'm now something like 1 for 6 for seeing this problem in Specialised tires, so I'd definitely give it a go again, but if I have the same thing happen Specialized's warranty department will be hearing from me.
 
Kanye West

Kanye West

220# bag of hacktastic
Aug 31, 2006
3,741
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big-ted said:
Slaughter Grid has been my go-to rear tire for a while on the trail bike now, but I had a weird thing happen to one the other day. Landed a hip jump fairly cleanly (I thought, at least). Tire burped, made a horrible sound, and as I rode out the landing the tire was rubbing on the frame. "Shit." I thought, I've trashed the wheel. Nope. Rim is straight. No sign of any tire damage, and the bead is sat evenly around the rim. Somehow, the carcass of the tire itself had gotten distorted. Deflating and resetting didn't solve the problem. No sign of any damage on the outside of the tire, just a weirdly shaped tire.
Click to expand...
Most of the Maxxis EXO tires I've gotten lately have had this problem.
 
'size

'size

Turbo Monkey
May 30, 2007
2,000
338
AZ
big-ted said:
Yup. Exactly as if the bead wasn't seated properly, except it was. One other guy in our group claimed he'd seen it also. I guess I'm now something like 1 for 6 for seeing this problem in Specialised tires, so I'd definitely give it a go again, but if I have the same thing happen Specialized's warranty department will be hearing from me.
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I had this happen with an S tire, they warrantied it no questions asked.
 
landcruiser

landcruiser

Monkey
May 9, 2002
186
40
San Jose, CA
Casing distortion on Maxxis and some Specialized tires (or anything else coming out of that factory) is a known issue. I assume it happens to other brands, but I don't know the failure rates well enough to call out any names.

Sometimes you see a tire that seems out of round straight from the packaging. Usually this is a molding error, where the tire layup wasn't square in the mold during curing.

Other times a seemingly good tire can warp under stress. I've usually seen this happen from wonky landings, G-Outs, or really stuffing the bike into a hard corner. This can be a processing error from earlier in the line: either the casing material was compromised or the operator mucked up the overlaps on the build drum. These failures won't really be prevented by most "tough" casings that rely on a patchwork of nylon or aramid fabrics. They're better prevented by 2ply constructions like Maxxis DD, Schwalbe SG, or any DH tire (if you don't mind the weight).
 
Flo33

Flo33

Turbo Monkey
Mar 3, 2015
2,067
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Styria
Count me in on the broken casing issues, only it has been two times on a Conti Rubber Queen 2.4 UST Black Chili. Warrantied both times without any questions, just had to send in the damaged tire. Both times after a corner jump with a bunch of side load on the wheel.
 
slyfink

slyfink

Turbo Monkey
Sep 16, 2008
9,331
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Ottawa, Canada
landcruiser said:
Casing distortion on Maxxis and some Specialized tires (or anything else coming out of that factory) is a known issue. I assume it happens to other brands, but I don't know the failure rates well enough to call out any names.

Sometimes you see a tire that seems out of round straight from the packaging. Usually this is a molding error, where the tire layup wasn't square in the mold during curing.

Other times a seemingly good tire can warp under stress. I've usually seen this happen from wonky landings, G-Outs, or really stuffing the bike into a hard corner. This can be a processing error from earlier in the line: either the casing material was compromised or the operator mucked up the overlaps on the build drum. These failures won't really be prevented by most "tough" casings that rely on a patchwork of nylon or aramid fabrics. They're better prevented by 2ply constructions like Maxxis DD, Schwalbe SG, or any DH tire (if you don't mind the weight).
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In other words, worth asking a refund for? so keep your receipt? thanks for the info....
 
landcruiser

landcruiser

Monkey
May 9, 2002
186
40
San Jose, CA
slyfink said:
In other words, worth asking a refund for? so keep your receipt? thanks for the info....
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I can't speak on behalf of anyone who would be giving out the refunds. It's the classic gray area where you'd have to argue whether you "abused" your tires or used them "normally." If it happened to me though, I'd mostly likely be asking about a refund, yes.
 
rollertoaster

rollertoaster

Monkey
Aug 7, 2007
730
179
Douglassville , PA
I've trashed a few casings myself, usually from stuffing the bike into a corner too hard. Once I actually heard the threads tear in the tire. I've solved the problem by just running double ply all the time
 
mtg

mtg

Green with Envy
Sep 21, 2009
1,862
1,604
Denver, CO
I've seen a couple tires with out of true casings as mentioned. It's never been any issue to get them replaced under warranty.

For the record, I think Maxxis EXO casings don't suck. The burliness per gram is pretty good, IMO.
 
Kanye West

Kanye West

220# bag of hacktastic
Aug 31, 2006
3,741
473
mtg said:
I've seen a couple tires with out of true casings as mentioned. It's never been any issue to get them replaced under warranty.

For the record, I think Maxxis EXO casings don't suck. The burliness per gram is pretty good, IMO.
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As I mentioned elsewhere, I had excellent luck with them in years past until the last few months. A handful of other local riders have had repeated slashes on them lately too and noticed they feel flimsier than they used to. I think their layup changed once they started making the DD, though I have no official confirmation of that.
 
dump

dump

Turbo Monkey
Oct 12, 2001
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Kanye West said:
As I mentioned elsewhere, I had excellent luck with them in years past until the last few months. A handful of other local riders have had repeated slashes on them lately too and noticed they feel flimsier than they used to. I think their layup changed once they started making the DD, though I have no official confirmation of that.
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If only we had woo's idea of the born-on date...
 
kidwoo

kidwoo

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Aug 25, 2003
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Squirtin ketchup n' mustard on charred flesh
dump said:
If only we had woo's idea of the born-on date...
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I ordered a tire straight from maxxis not too long ago and it was that wonderful gooey newness that I was talking about. It was a hard compound tire but you wouldn't know it. Not for the first two weeks at least. So good. People don't believe me but the struggle is real.


On the EXO front, I got a dhf 3c not too long ago that I've punctured both times I've ridden it (again yesterday). I agree, those things ain't what they used to be. It sucks chucking tires with crisp edges still on it.
 
OGRipper

OGRipper

back alley ripper
Feb 3, 2004
10,653
1,128
NORCAL is the hizzle
I've had casing distortion on a few different maxxis tires over the years, and I've seen others do it too. It's usually from a jump landing that burps the tire for whatever reason (off center landing, low pressure, or both). It renders an otherwise good tire totally useless, which is a drag.

On a separate note, I've been on the e.13's for most of this summer now and remain pretty stoked. Super versatile and (so far) good durability with no casing distortion. Definitely a contender. The e.13 carbon wheels and 9-44 cassette have also been solid for me this summer.
 
'size

'size

Turbo Monkey
May 30, 2007
2,000
338
AZ
landcruiser said:
It's hidden in here, unfortunately I don't remember the exact numbers to look at:
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and of course different manufacturers use different codes - my S and michelin tire codes look nothing like that.
if there is any relevance with DOT codes this could mean 30th week of 2010.
i do have an old wire bead DHF ST 2.35 26" tire with starting code of 2608 which i suppose could be accurate but i have no idea when that tire was being offered.

maybe after this info spreads we can get a tire code standard to go along with all the other standards we have.
 
landcruiser

landcruiser

Monkey
May 9, 2002
186
40
San Jose, CA
Every factory is different like you said. CST/Maxxis produced tires (including some Specialized, some Bontragers, E13, Onza, others) do not use the numbered week format as far as I recall. I believe they use a 5 digit code. First for the year, (6=2016) then month and day. Again, I'm not 100% sure on that anymore. And I don't remember which 5 digits to look at.
 
HAB

HAB

Chelsea from Seattle
Apr 28, 2007
11,580
2,006
Seattle
kidwoo said:
On the EXO front, I got a dhf 3c not too long ago that I've punctured both times I've ridden it (again yesterday). I agree, those things ain't what they used to be. It sucks chucking tires with crisp edges still on it.
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Sheeeeeiiiit. So much for the theory that they hadn't fucked up the 26" ones, just the new models.

I need some new trail bike rear tires, Slaughter/Butcher it is.
 
jstuhlman

jstuhlman

bagpipe wanker
Dec 3, 2009
16,694
13,044
Cackalacka du Nord
hrmf....my maxxis exos (whether ardent/hr2/dhf2, all 26) have been 100% unslashable on east coast rox...burp 'em if i forget to check my pressure and it get too low? occasionally. puncture/tear? not once in a decade, current gen tires included. maybe the squishiness of my unriedabru vpp curve adds an extra layer of protection?
 
SkaredShtles

SkaredShtles

Michael Bolton
Sep 21, 2003
65,705
12,739
In a van.... down by the river
jstuhlman said:
hrmf....my maxxis exos (whether ardent/hr2/dhf2, all 26) have been 100% unslashable on east coast rox...burp 'em if i forget to check my pressure and it get too low? occasionally. puncture/tear? not once in a decade, current gen tires included. maybe the squishiness of my unriedabru vpp curve adds an extra layer of protection?
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Maybe your east coast rocks are pussies? :D

I suppose next you're going to tell me you've never cracked a carbon rim on said rocks either?
 
HAB

HAB

Chelsea from Seattle
Apr 28, 2007
11,580
2,006
Seattle
jstuhlman said:
b-b-b-but then I'd have to replace my 6 year old fr500s! plus, i don't think you can even get crabon rims in 26" anyonre unless you're @kidwoo
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I've got two pairs of 26" Enves.

If you've gotten 6 years out of FR500s, you're not trying hard enough. :D
 
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