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Complete Guide to Downhill Rubber

toodles

ridiculously corgi proportioned
Aug 24, 2004
5,480
4,720
Australia
Sam Hill's prototype 'enduro' front tire (running on the back) from Michelin...

For those who can parse tread patterns, are Michelin back in the game?
Looks enough like a Magic for me to want to give it a go. Dunno if I'd want to pay for it, but I'd give it a rip.
 

FlipSide

Turbo Monkey
Sep 24, 2001
1,376
804
Speaking of michelin, there's a blast from the past in my sig.

View attachment 129727 View attachment 129728
Nice! You should announce this on the Vintage DH Facebook page. I'm sure you will find a buyer easily.

These were interesting tires. So much grip in the right conditions, it was ridiculously fun to ride them. On the other hand, they were quite dangerous on slick rocks and wood stuff...

They were also extremely slow rolling tires. I did trim a bit the center knobs on my rear Mud3 to make it roll better. It helped, but still these were only good for super sloppy soft shit.
 

Flo33

Turbo Monkey
Mar 3, 2015
2,057
1,298
Styria
Yeah, Mud3 was the shit! I still have a set in my bike hole. Ridiculous lean angles on wet grass turns possible. They also worked pretty good on snow.
 

Dogboy

Turbo Monkey
Apr 12, 2004
3,208
581
Durham, NC
Do we like these tires? Which compound? Arts has the LG1 on sale too.

Ive only seen pinkbike newbs complaining that they grip too well, have rolling resistance.
They roll slow as shit and wear pretty fast. They do grip though. For my money I'll go with something a wee bit less grippy and longer wearing.
 

HAB

Chelsea from Seattle
Apr 28, 2007
11,580
2,006
Seattle
I think I'd really like them as a front tire if the carcass was rounded off a bit. They're square as fuck though. I want to lean over more before hitting the side knobs.

That absolutely contributes to the slow rolling too. You get over by half a degree and you're on the side knobs.
 

ZHendo

Turbo Monkey
Oct 29, 2006
1,661
147
PNW
I'll chime in quickly and say that the LG1 tires have been utter garbage in my experience. Really slow rolling as others have mentioned, but absolute doom in the wet. I had one of my worst crashes ever when the tire let go unexpectedly on a generally sticky-when-wet rock on Dirt Merchant. I've ridden Dirt Merchant dozens of times in the wet, and was riding comfortably at speed when the tire let go. While I was willing to chalk it up as a fluke, they have proceeded to be pretty sketchy in wet weather locally as well. They do grip well in loose/dry conditions, and can hold an off camber line fairly well...until they let go, which can happen pretty suddenly.

Front tire wore exceptionally quickly, and to top it all off, I double flatted the front and rear tires on the fire road to Creekside in Whistler, and both casings were rendered unrepairable. They roll too slowly for the lack of durability and grip in the wet.
 

djjohnr

Turbo Monkey
Apr 21, 2002
3,001
1,693
Northern California
Just got a set of 2.3 27.5 Grid Emulators for the trail bike - 878 grams. 57mm at the side knobs, 54mm casing on a 25mm internal rim. Pretty low volume. I'm definitely going to return one for a 2.6 to run on the front.
 
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ZHendo

Turbo Monkey
Oct 29, 2006
1,661
147
PNW
Just got a set of 2.3 27.5 Grid Emulators for the trail bike - 878 grams. 57mm at the side knobs, 54mm casing on a 25mm internal rim. Pretty low volume. I'm definitely going to return one for a 2.6 to run on the front.
From Specialized tire description: "The Eliminator still has the bite of a DH tire, but also brings the manners to handle well on hardpacked trails. These characteristics also work well for trail e-bikes, too—combining the bite needed to stay in control on the trail with neutral handling on fire roads."

That second sentence is one of the most concerning product descriptions I've ever read.
 

roflbox

roflborx
Jan 23, 2017
3,163
834
Raleigh, NC
From Specialized tire description: "The Eliminator still has the bite of a DH tire, but also brings the manners to handle well on hardpacked trails. These characteristics also work well for trail e-bikes, too—combining the bite needed to stay in control on the trail with neutral handling on fire roads."

That second sentence is one of the most concerning product descriptions I've ever read.
:panic:
 

slyfink

Turbo Monkey
Sep 16, 2008
9,289
5,029
Ottawa, Canada
It looks like a trail version of the Assegai but when i got them the knobs are much smaller than pics lead you to believe. The Eliminator is a dry, loose over hard tire.
Looks to me like a (slightly beefed-up) overhaul of the Purgatory, and a competitor to the Maxxis Aggressor.
 

Cerberus75

Monkey
Feb 18, 2017
520
194
Looks to me like a (slightly beefed-up) overhaul of the Purgatory, and a competitor to the Maxxis Aggressor.
The best comparison is a SE4 with better side knobs. Which I would use for the same purpose as an Aggressor or Purgatory. The center knobs are more ramped though.
 

slyfink

Turbo Monkey
Sep 16, 2008
9,289
5,029
Ottawa, Canada
The best comparison is a SE4 with better side knobs. Which I would use for the same purpose as an Aggressor or Purgatory. The center knobs are more ramped though.
those are all decent tires. I found the Purg to be a bit wimpy. I find the side knobs on the Aggressor tend to wear out a bit quick. I have the SE4 on my rigid SS cruiser and have been pretty impressed with their rolling speed and bite. But I haven't really used them in challenging terrain. I haven't really bothered to seek out a Trek dealer to have a closer look though. I'd love to have a look at one of these eliminators, but the serious bike shops around here are dropping Specialized. The last shop I spoke with said their minimum order is too big. The only dealer left is one of those "lifestyle" retrailers, and they don't carry mountainbike inventory. They'll order stuff for you, but I can do that myself. and it usually costs less and comes straight to my door.
 

djjohnr

Turbo Monkey
Apr 21, 2002
3,001
1,693
Northern California
RE: the Emulator; so far I've found:

- Side knobs hold longer in the dry than Aggressors (by quite a bit) or DHR 2s. Still easy to control when they let go.
- Pack up with mud pretty easily as expected
- Deeper tread than Aggressors give better hold in dry loose conditions

I swapped the second 2.3 for a 2.6, but rain finally started here so I probably won't mount them back up until next summer. As a loose over hard conditions tire I like them a lot so far, although I worry about the sidewalls.
 

HAB

Chelsea from Seattle
Apr 28, 2007
11,580
2,006
Seattle
Vee Rubber: copying a DHF without bothering to think about why it is the way it is/.



The notched side knobs and the ramped center knobs are backwards relative to each other.