[no skid marks]

pretty much any preload only works for the distance it winds in. and that's if it's touching the spring at the start.
Preload should only be used to make sure the top of the spring is in contact so it doesn't clunk.
If you need preload for any other reason, you're running the wrong weight spring(too light).

 

[Xetal]

To hold oil up by the bushing/seal. On a cartridge fork with less oil splashing around they probably help, but there's enough oil in my 888 to keep the top of the sliders lubed. If you remove it from the spring side maybe add more oil.

I bought the super fine fork grease from crc. I guess it will do a better job then foam rings. Ill try it next week end and come back with results.

 

[JohnnyC]

Hi everyone,

I have a set of 2010 888 rc3 evos (non ti) and they're bloody soft, i keep bottoming them out with a massive CLACK, often on breaking into corners etc. I can push them through most of their travel if i bounce up and down with the front brake on.

I'm 81kg and have the VA all the way in and the HSC/LSC set to hard with quite a bit of preload....

Any ideas? harder spring or more oil ?

Does anyone have any suggestions as to how much oil to add and to which legs.

Is it a case of taking off the circlips and pouring some in the legs ?

many thanks !!

A) At 81kgs, you need at least the firm/6.5 spring

B) If it is blowing through that bad and making a bad metallic sound, you need to replace the o-ring on the compensator piston (or the whole piston) as oil will have blown past it, effectively lowering you oil height by quite a bit. If you unscrew the damper top cap you will probably find a bit of oil splashing around on top of that piston. There shouldn't be any there.

 

[IH8Rice]

A) At 81kgs, you need at least the firm/6.5 spring

or add more oil.
im 220lbs and using the stock spring with more oil added.

 

[Banga]

or add more oil.
im 220lbs and using the stock spring with more oil added.

100kg on the standard spring? crikey I'm 72kg and thinking I need to get on a hard when things get fast/rough.
Whatever works for you I guess.

 

[JohnnyC]

or add more oil.
im 220lbs and using the stock spring with more oil added.

Have you tried a stiffer spring? Just because that seems to be working OK, doesn't mean it couldn't be better.....

 

[IH8Rice]

100kg on the standard spring? crikey I'm 72kg and thinking I need to get on a hard when things get fast/rough.
Whatever works for you I guess.

its been revalved and extra oil has been added...the oil level was just increased s'more to get it a bit more progressive.

 

[spoon]

A) At 81kgs, you need at least the firm/6.5 spring

B) If it is blowing through that bad and making a bad metallic sound, you need to replace the o-ring on the compensator piston (or the whole piston) as oil will have blown past it, effectively lowering you oil height by quite a bit. If you unscrew the damper top cap you will probably find a bit of oil splashing around on top of that piston. There shouldn't be any there.

Hmm that sounds bad, I noticed a bit of oil on the top cap of the left leg, I'll open them up and have a look !

thanks

 

[Henkka.k]

...you need to replace the o-ring on the compensator piston (or the whole piston) as oil will have blown past it, effectively lowering you oil height by quite a bit. If you unscrew the damper top cap you will probably find a bit of oil splashing around on top of that piston. There shouldn't be any there.

Could you give more specific instructions how to replace that o-ring. How to remove volume adjustment from the shaft to be able to replace that o-ring?

 

[spoon]

Ok, so I took the top caps off and there is a ton of oil in the left leg as soon as i open it, above the big red thing with the large washer at the bottom...

I guessing by your descrption that this isn't right? The o ring looks ok, has the oil just gone past ? Do I just need to refill with that thing up ?

thanks

 

[JohnnyC]

Ok, so I took the top caps off and there is a ton of oil in the left leg as soon as i open it, above the big red thing with the large washer at the bottom...

I guessing by your descrption that this isn't right? The o ring looks ok, has the oil just gone past ? Do I just need to refill with that thing up ?

thanks

Yeah oil has gone past, try pop the circlip off the top of the damper (there will be a washer and an o-ring under it) then wiggle the top cap off of the damper. Then you should be able to remove the o-ring from the piston and slide it over the top of the cartridge. Find a replacement o-ring that matches it size and fit it (with lots of grease) then top up the oil and put it all back together.


There is a small o-ring inside the piston but it is a little trickier to get to. Jst do the big one and see how you get on.

 

[Xetal]

Yeah oil has gone past, try pop the circlip off the top of the damper (there will be a washer and an o-ring under it) then wiggle the top cap off of the damper. Then you should be able to remove the o-ring from the piston and slide it over the top of the cartridge. Find a replacement o-ring that matches it size and fit it (with lots of grease) then top up the oil and put it all back together.


There is a small o-ring inside the piston but it is a little trickier to get to. Jst do the big one and see how you get on.

Getting that top cap off the the Volume adjust assembly was impossible for me. I pulled it as hard as i could and it wouldnt come off. Not even wiggle a bit.

I got mad and but it back in before i do damages to it. I still have oil stacking over the adjust piston... Any one had to force it out ? how did you manage to do it ?

Vince

 

[Henkka.k]

Getting that top cap off the the Volume adjust assembly was impossible for me. I pulled it as hard as i could and it wouldnt come off. Not even wiggle a bit.

I got mad and but it back in before i do damages to it. I still have oil stacking over the adjust piston... Any one had to force it out ? how did you manage to do it ?

Vince

I removed the seal whitout taking off the top cap of the volume adjust. Put a lot of grease and the same seal back as I did not have correct replacement seal. Worked whole weekend.

Does anyone know the exact size of the seal?

I measured it and got 28 as inner diameter and 3mm for thickness.

 

[sketchygt4]

I know right?

This stuff literally IS the "Secret Sauce".

dhkid scored some in small batches about 4 years ago:
http://www.ridemonkey.com/forums/showthread.php?t=181688

Bullcrew also knows how to get the stuff.

Hi guys just out of interest what fork oil are you using? As I understand it the work treatment uses this additive from the UK
http://www.interflon.net/ws/ws/realtimenew.php?link=T80610&land=GB&taal=EN

I had a chat to one of the tech guys from Interflon and this was his response regarding the additive:
Our additives are designed to improve the lubricating qualities of an oil and N251-H is designed for Hydraulic oil.Hydraulic oil contains less than 3% lubricating properties as it designed for power conversion, hence our additive has been developed to greatly improve the lubricating properties of the oil without adversely effecting the viscosity and reducing the oils ability to perform its task. A 5% mix maximum is all that is required.

The advantages of this are the Hydraulic system components wear and friction is reduced at the metal to metal points of contact. Therefore allowing the system to operate with less resistance, reducing energy, heat and wear.

Given that most high end fork oils e.g. Silkolene Pro RSF, or Stendec Crystal Fork oil already contain friction reducing additives is there really that much difference to be found from this type of additive?

I'll conceed that replacing the foam wiper in the seals with a decent grease e.g. Stendec Easy-Glide Super-Fine, or Molykote 55, will much improve the initial slide of the fork and hence make them feel massively better by reducing the friction in the seals. But I can see myself that another additive in an oil already designed with additives can really make that much difference.

FYI Interflon is £55 per Litre excluding VAT or Delivery and that's the smallest amount that can be purchased.

 

[Lelandjt]

^I use Marzocchi fork oil. Different brands are different viscosities, regardless of labelling so sticking with stock oil makes tuning easier.

 

[Xetal]

I removed the seal whitout taking off the top cap of the volume adjust. Put a lot of grease and the same seal back as I did not have correct replacement seal. Worked whole weekend.

Does anyone know the exact size of the seal?

I measured it and got 28 as inner diameter and 3mm for thickness.

I would still like to be able to remove the Cartridge side cap ... It's just a shame that it dosent come out easy !

Anyone has a hint on how to yank it off the volume adjust assembly ?

 

[JD Risk]

I would still like to be able to remove the Cartridge side cap ... It's just a shame that it dosent come out easy !

Anyone has a hint on how to yank it off the volume adjust assembly ?

All you have to do to remove it is remove the c-clip on top and it should pull off with a bit of wiggling. I just took mine off with no problems.

 

[JD Risk]

I have an issue with my fork getting really stiff. At the start of the day it was fine and after five runs down the mountain it felt more like a rigid fork.

I pulled out the compression side internals and when removing the compensator piston that works with the air vol adjust, I noticed some oil sitting on top of the plunger. I'm replacing both the inner and outer o-rings on the compensator piston but don't have them yet. I'm hoping that will fix it.

I also heard a bit of air escape when I loosened the foot nut at the bottom. One of the techs at Marz told me told me undoing the foot nut and letting the air escape is all I have to do to remedy the problem. I still think it's the o-rings and asked him how air can be getting in without losing oil and he said he had no idea.

Anybody know what could be going on here?

 

[Racebike]

Pressure build up is a common thing on forks that have that design.

A few forks come with bleed ports to allow air to be bled easily. Some people who ride hare scrambles/endurance motorbike racing even have a setup to bleed the air out while riding.

Have you actually tried riding after you removed the air?

 

[Lelandjt]

^I burp both sides of my fork every 2 days. Removing that volume adjust o-ring makes burping much easier* and greatly increases air volume for a more linear feel. This may result in not enough bottoming resistance for you but try it and see how you like it. You can always add oil to reduce air volume a little.

*Just loosen both top caps till the o-ring clears the threads and you hear a hiss.

 

[JD Risk]

Thanks for the advice. Not sure why this became a problem only recently. I had the fork for a year and this is the first I've experienced it. If it's the pressure build up that you guys are describing, it seems the pressure build up would be associated with temperature increase inside the fork and would probably subside w/o burping if I took a break. I can't imagine it's sucking in outside air.

I think the oil getting past the o ring and into the air chamber effectively decreases the air volume and makes it more progressive and at the same time leaves less oil for compression damping and makes the fork feel like crap.

Didn't have a chance to ride the fork after a burp so I can't say for sure. I'll see what happens when I put new o rings in and report back.

 

[Lelandjt]

I can't imagine it's sucking in outside air.

It is. I've never bothered to try to figure out why but both my 888s, my Yamaha, and my KTM forks all do this. The moto forks have bleeders, the 888s need the top caps cracked. You can do this days after riding and hear a hiss.

 

[JohnnyC]

Pressure build up is normal and has always happened to Mrzocchi forks, but it usually only gets really bad if the fork hasn't been serviced in a long time. Had your fork been serviced at al before it got burped?

Getting that top cap off the the Volume adjust assembly was impossible for me. I pulled it as hard as i could and it wouldnt come off. Not even wiggle a bit.

I got mad and but it back in before i do damages to it. I still have oil stacking over the adjust piston... Any one had to force it out ? how did you manage to do it ?

Vince

The groove that the circip sits in may have flared out slightly, you should be able to see if the top part is wider than the bottom. You might need to clean it up a it o the top cap can slide over

 

[Xetal]

The groove that the circip sits in may have flared out slightly, you should be able to see if the top part is wider than the bottom. You might need to clean it up a it o the top cap can slide over

Got it out thanks. I had a good 1" of oil on top of the Volume adjust piston again ... Im just gonna yank out the o-ring on it and add oil ! To anyone that removed the o-ring there any hing on how much oil more ?

Im also gonna ditch the foam rings and replace them with super fine grease as suggested in the Crc Marzocchi vid up there in this thread. Any one experienced it yet and how is it ?


Thanks

 

[IH8Rice]

i dont think i noticed the grease being any smoother then the foam ring...im sure its the hand honed bushings that are making the biggest difference.


2012 88888's

888 RC3 EVO Titanium V.2 details:
- Travel: 200mm
- Left leg: RC3 EVO (Rebound piston V.2, low speed compression adjust, high speed compression shim stack valve, volume adjust)
- Right leg: Coil spring preload
- Spring: 1-side titanium
-Casting: Magnesium with 20mm axle
- Stanchion: 38mm nickel treatment tapered
- Steer tube: Aluminum
- Disc brake: 8'' PM (max disc 230mm)
- Weight: 2990g 20mm axle included
- Options: Direct mount stem

http://www.pinkbike.com/news/2012-Marzocchi-Gravity-Forks.html

888 CR - New Upper Crown

- Travel: 200mm
- Left leg: CR (Compression rebound)
- Right leg: Coil spring preload
- Spring: 1-side coil
- Casting: Magnesium with 20mm axle
- Stanchion: 38mm hard anodized tapered
- Steer tube: Aluminum
- Disc brake: 8'' PM (max disc 230mm)
- Weight: 3440g 20mm axle included
- Options: Direct mount stem

 

[Mo(n)arch]

Looking really good!
So, is the 888 evo gone now? No cheaper version of the EVO ti?
And the rebound piston V.2? Shimmed?

 

[IH8Rice]

And the rebound piston V.2? Shimmed?

i do believe so.

 

[lamp]

Wonder if it will be cheaper to snag an '11 RC3 evo and a '12 crown.

Or, CR + avy kit?

 

[Xetal]

Got it out thanks. I had a good 1" of oil on top of the Volume adjust piston again ... Im just gonna yank out the o-ring on it and add oil ! To anyone that removed the o-ring there any hing on how much oil more ?

Im also gonna ditch the foam rings and replace them with super fine grease as suggested in the Crc Marzocchi vid up there in this thread. Any one experienced it yet and how is it ?


Thanks

**update**

I got time to tune my fork and go ride. The Removal of the foam rings replaced by fine grease made a huge difference on the fork plushness. Both Foam Rings where dry as f*ck. Two tings come to my mind grease if fine but more maintenance, Foam Rings can be lubbbbed and put back in. I also believe some oil could be added to them from the outside. Just slide in a small wd40 like straw in between the stanchion and the dust seal and poor a bit of fork oil from the new opening.

I myself will ride another day with grease and open the fork up for inspection. I fear that over time grease will catch more dust then oil. Therefore more maintenance.

My Volume adjust piston still suck and oil got passed it. I called Canadian Marzocchi Tech rep and he told me marzocchi is coming out with an updated part to fix that issue. I run 0 click of VA ! He also told me i could ditch the VA assembly and add 100ml of oil to replace it.

What do you guys think ?

 

[Mo(n)arch]

If you open it up to control the grease, do it. You can always go back. If you do it, tell us something about the result!

 

[IH8Rice]

got another few rides on the fork with the added oil. i have to say, now that im running 250cc's on the spring side, i dont want to go to the firm Ti spring. im only running 1 click of preload and the VAR at full open. the fork feels amazing the and honed bushings feel awesome. b/w that and the grease in the seals, the fork if performing better than i could ever have hoped.

 

[boylagz]

@Xetal,

I've also removed the foam ring in my 66 RC3 Ti, and you're right, its dry as fook I removed 'em and used grease instead. It's smoother for sure.

Getting some Redline 15W oil to replace the stock medium one, see how everything feels. At the moment it's been pretty sick man, best fork ever.

 

[Xetal]

I ran 3 days with grease instead of foam rings and the plushness of the fork was greatly improved. I opened her up yesterday to see and there was plenty of grease left and it wasnt contaminated at all. So grease for me is a keeper.

The VA piston is obviously defect in my fork. Always over 1" of oil on top of it... I wacked it out and added 100ml of oil instead. Ill see how it performs. I dont use the VA adjustment anyways.

 

[peterdaam]

First off, i just have to say this thread has been amazing! Tons of great information and it's actually helped my decision to buy a 2011 888 RC3 EVO Ti

Just set it up on the bike and i have some questions and was hoping someone might be able to help or point me in the right direction.

I ran a Fox40 before and i wanted to achieve the same ride height etc. i'm wondering how important those MIN marks are on the fork?
I popped off both top caps and let the fork settle to where it bottoms out and it's no where near that min line, it's about 10mm below.
So i've decided to leave about 5mm from the true bottom out location, which puts the lower crown halfway through the MIN text mark.
Think this is ok?

 

[IH8Rice]

the tubes are butted just a few inches below that IIRC on the Ti version.
i would be careful....but 5mm shouldnt make a difference

 

[rockdog]

Hey Xetal, when you switched over to the ti spring in your fork did you change the spring perch as well?

 

[b.utters]

First off, i just have to say this thread has been amazing! Tons of great information and it's actually helped my decision to buy a 2011 888 RC3 EVO Ti

Just set it up on the bike and i have some questions and was hoping someone might be able to help or point me in the right direction.

I ran a Fox40 before and i wanted to achieve the same ride height etc. i'm wondering how important those MIN marks are on the fork?
I popped off both top caps and let the fork settle to where it bottoms out and it's no where near that min line, it's about 10mm below.
So i've decided to leave about 5mm from the true bottom out location, which puts the lower crown halfway through the MIN text mark.
Think this is ok?

Like Ih8rice said, there is a little bit of room to play with. You would probably be best of hitting something that will make your fork bottom out and then adjusting according to the marks that result from that.

Hey Xetal, when you switched over to the ti spring in your fork did you change the spring perch as well?

Yea mate, you will need to change the perch.

 

[peterdaam]

well i've done just that in theory... undid the top caps and push the stachions down as far as they would go (clunk). then set the new 'min' mark up about 5mm.

 

[Xetal]

Hey Xetal, when you switched over to the ti spring in your fork did you change the spring perch as well?

My new Ti spring came with the perch. But i feel like the original would be just fine. Going from a Ti to steel would most def. Need a steel spec perch since the coil OD is smaller.

If your ordering get the perch. If you have the coil in hands w/o the Ti spec perch just give it a try mate im pretty sure everything will be fine.

X

 

[rockdog]

Right on thanks for the info!