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2020 speculation thread

Brian HCM#1

MMMMMMMMM BEER!!!!!!!!!!
Sep 7, 2001
31,233
11
Bay Area, California
This is what science has proven, so if we actually regulated guns to any reasonable extent, these mass murder events would be less and more lives would be saved. This is the basic premise of what they have done in literally every other 1st world nation. No, they wouldn't "find a way" to still kill people, that is not what science has shown.
Keep in mind, if you outlaw all guns or ban certain types of guns, if someone wants one bad enough they'll still get one. Drugs are illegal, but people have no problem obtaining them. Might be more challenging but I'm sure they'll be readily available via the internet & over seas. Now instead of drug cartels, you'll have gun cartels smuggling weapons into the US for sale. Then there is no record of what's out there. It's a slippery slope. The problem is you can't win, but you're still better off knowing what's out there, who has what, than not.
 

Brian HCM#1

MMMMMMMMM BEER!!!!!!!!!!
Sep 7, 2001
31,233
11
Bay Area, California
Big difference in popping down to your local Walmart versus having to buy one from a criminal organization.
I agree, my point was if someone still wants one, they'll get one. Just might take a bit longer.. Believe me, I am for stricter gun laws, more in depth background checks. I think there should be checks when purchasing ammo to see if the ammo purchased matches the guns they have registered. However, I don't think they should take guns away.
 

Sandwich

Pig my fish!
Staff member
May 23, 2002
15,864
957
01776
this should probably moved to another thread, but here we go

No, its a real thing. However they were trying to pin it on Trump. Interference, yes. It needs to be looked into. Did it have a real effect on the outcome of the election? I doubt that. Do I think Hillary & Obama knew about what was going on? Hell YES! 30K emails wiped away, smashed Blackberry etc. My point was, the left was putting all their eggs in one basket with the Muller report & it turned up no collusion and no obstruction., I mean no obstruction as Trump allowed Muller to talk to everyone he wanted to and never blocked anyone from his investigation and was able to complete it. Muller looked like a lost puppy in the hearing a few weeks back. Clearly he just had his name on the report, he had no real clue what was even in it. It was just the left running around with their pitchforks looking for something.....anything and came up with nothing.
It absolutely turned up obstruction. https://thehill.com/policy/national-security/454502-mueller-trump-could-be-charged-with-obstruction-of-justice-after But he doesn't know whether it's legal to indict a sitting president as it's never been done. Congress won't impeach because it's controlled by moscow mitch. It would be a home run with an impartial congress. I absolutely agree that the left was pushing this thing harder than they should have, hoping for some weird miracle, but somehow spinning it around on obama and hilary is nothing shy of deranged. Mueller looked the way he did because he knew the democrats were going to try and drag this out, but the AG asked him to stick to his report and not go outside of it. He's a professional, despite what the far right has decided in the last 6 months of his career, and did his job exactly the way he should have.

I don't own a gun, nor have the desire to ever own one. However I would not stop a responsible person from having one. Okay, so they end up banning guns & let's say confiscating a high percentage of them. So what did we accomplish if one of those loony's says, well if I can have a gun, I'll drive my car/truck through a large crowd? I guess they can start to ban vehicles. Hey, what about making pipe bombs and walking in a crowd? I guess they can ban bombs too? My point is, if someone wants to commit a heinous crime, they'll find a way. At the end of the day banning guns will not solve a thing. Addressing the mentally ill, seeing the warning signs and trying to get them the help they need, would be the best start.
Most on the left aren't calling for confiscation nor gun bans (I am, because guns are stupid except for hunting and shooting bears). We believe in gun control, which is literally what you were loosely and stupidly advocating a few posts above (millennials). As for "They will find a way" really no they won't. The ability to make pipe bombs exists right now...but people really don't make pipe bombs, do they? In fact there's only been a couple of terror attacks with improvised explosives...the twin towers, the boston marathon, and the oklahoma city bombing. And you know what? We now have different security regulations for flying, a whole new law for anti-terrorism and the boston bombing wasn't all that effective. Heck, the berlin truck attack a few years ago still only killed 12. The difference here is that we have licensing requirements for driving. We have monitoring programs for fertilizer and ammonia. We have to take our shoes off to fly. We have done nothing to stem gun violence. You are absolutely right that evil will find a way, but we shouldn't make it more convenient for them.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antiterrorism_and_Effective_Death_Penalty_Act_of_1996
Keep in mind, if you outlaw all guns or ban certain types of guns, if someone wants one bad enough they'll still get one. Drugs are illegal, but people have no problem obtaining them. Might be more challenging but I'm sure they'll be readily available via the internet & over seas. Now instead of drug cartels, you'll have gun cartels smuggling weapons into the US for sale. Then there is no record of what's out there. It's a slippery slope. The problem is you can't win, but you're still better off knowing what's out there, who has what, than not.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antiterrorism_and_Effective_Death_Penalty_Act_of_1996


Sure, it's easy to buy stuff online. Just like it's so easy to buy drugs and alcohol on the internet, right? Hell, they shut down the silk road marketplace pretty easily, which is exactly what you are describing. And nobody's going to smuggle an m16 up their butt from canada.

I absolutely agree that we're better off knowing what's out there, which means we should force gun owners to register their weapons, carry licenses that prove they know how to handle them, and maybe even consider forcing them to carry insurance in case one of their weapons is used illegally or causes unnecessary harm. I bet we'll get a lot less crazies stockpiling assault weapons if each one carries an insurance bill of $1000 a year.
 

Brian HCM#1

MMMMMMMMM BEER!!!!!!!!!!
Sep 7, 2001
31,233
11
Bay Area, California
this should probably moved to another thread, but here we go
It absolutely turned up obstruction. https://thehill.com/policy/national-security/454502-mueller-trump-could-be-charged-with-obstruction-of-justice-after But he doesn't know whether it's legal to indict a sitting president as it's never been done. Congress won't impeach because it's controlled by moscow mitch. It would be a home run with an impartial congress. I absolutely agree that the left was pushing this thing harder than they should have, hoping for some weird miracle, but somehow spinning it around on obama and hilary is nothing shy of deranged. Mueller looked the way he did because he knew the democrats were going to try and drag this out, but the AG asked him to stick to his report and not go outside of it. He's a professional, despite what the far right has decided in the last 6 months of his career, and did his job exactly the way he should have.
What exactly did Trump obstruct, if Mueller & his team were able to complete their research and found nothing in the way of collusion. Every time I put on CNN or MSNBC they were screaming they had proof! Well where is it? Adam Schiff continually told the media, he himself had proof. I think we're all still waiting with baited breath. They left the door open for "impeachment" because they had nothing. Mueller's team was made up of all democratic attorneys, one or two of them said, they were going to do what ever it takes to remove Trump. It was not fair & impartial, if it was you'd have attorneys representing both sides. Mueller knew within the first few months there was no collusion, but his team was dead set on finding something, anything, even if it had nothing to do with collusion. They found Russia meddling, but it did not involve Trump. IMO, Obama & Hillary did know something about Russia meddling, it was clearly noted back well before the election but did nothing to stop it, because they thought it would work out in Hillary's favor. Bottom line, Mueller did not write the report and it was obvious. He stumbled over every question thrown at him by Republicans which proves even more the lefts agenda was to have Trump removed. Remember, there was no way in hell Trump would ever beat Hillary...... LOL
 

Nick

My name is Nick
Sep 21, 2001
14,401
2,917
behind you, don't wait up.
There is enough 'collusion', coordination and/or conspiracy with Russia in PLAIN SIGHT to choke a horse. If his top crew, kids, etc did it, as it's been proven they have, do you really believe he had no knowledge of what they did?

I still can't figure out if you're pro-Trump or anti-Democrat.
If the former, what has he done that improved your life or the future for you and your kids? He's dishonest and self serving. For the life of me I can't understand why it's easier for some to continue to support a guy fucking 98% of our country rather than admit he's a con-man and be willing to correct course.
 

Pesqueeb

bicycle in airplane hangar
Feb 2, 2007
26,935
3,435
Riding the baggage carousel.
Trump was never a "true" republican to begin with, he just ran on that ticket. That being said, Trump was elected president because both sides are severely broken & half of America wanted to try a something different instead of a politician.
Trump runs the country as a business, which explains his lack of tact.
Trump is the truest republican who ever joined the GOP. A 100% distilled self serving, racist, women hating, con man. He's GOP ethanol.

Trump runs the country as a business, which explains his lack of tact.
And the fact that the government is a complete shit show right now. And the gigantic deficit he's running as well. Remember when republican's cared about that? Fucking moron couldn't keep a Casino in the black.
 

Pesqueeb

bicycle in airplane hangar
Feb 2, 2007
26,935
3,435
Riding the baggage carousel.
it was clearly noted back well before the election but did nothing to stop it, because Mitch McConnell is a bought and paid for traitor.


 

Sandwich

Pig my fish!
Staff member
May 23, 2002
15,864
957
01776
What exactly did Trump obstruct, if Mueller & his team were able to complete their research and found nothing in the way of collusion. Every time I put on CNN or MSNBC they were screaming they had proof! Well where is it? Adam Schiff continually told the media, he himself had proof. I think we're all still waiting with baited breath. They left the door open for "impeachment" because they had nothing. Mueller's team was made up of all democratic attorneys, one or two of them said, they were going to do what ever it takes to remove Trump. It was not fair & impartial, if it was you'd have attorneys representing both sides. Mueller knew within the first few months there was no collusion, but his team was dead set on finding something, anything, even if it had nothing to do with collusion. They found Russia meddling, but it did not involve Trump. IMO, Obama & Hillary did know something about Russia meddling, it was clearly noted back well before the election but did nothing to stop it, because they thought it would work out in Hillary's favor. Bottom line, Mueller did not write the report and it was obvious. He stumbled over every question thrown at him by Republicans which proves even more the lefts agenda was to have Trump removed. Remember, there was no way in hell Trump would ever beat Hillary...... LOL
collusion =/= obstruction. Obstruction = obstruction. Obstruction="Not cleared of". "Not cleared of"=warrants indictment and a criminal trial. Indictment=not possible with a sitting pres. Not possible -> no indictment. Mueller is a republican. Or was. What do you make of that?
 

Brian HCM#1

MMMMMMMMM BEER!!!!!!!!!!
Sep 7, 2001
31,233
11
Bay Area, California
There is enough 'collusion', coordination and/or conspiracy with Russia in PLAIN SIGHT to choke a horse. If his top crew, kids, etc did it, as it's been proven they have, do you really believe he had no knowledge of what they did?
Then where is it? The democrats claimed Mueller had all the necessary evidence, it was a shoe-in! At the end of the day, there was no evidence of collusion by Trump, Mueller's team found nothing! The Anti Trump mob I'm sure turned over each & every stone and came up zilch on Trump. Again, Adam Schiff keeps saying the same thing as you, but still hasn't provided anything.

I still can't figure out if you're pro-Trump or anti-Democrat.
If the former, what has he done that improved your life or the future for you and your kids? He's dishonest and self serving. For the life of me I can't understand why it's easier for some to continue to support a guy fucking 98% of our country rather than admit he's a con-man and be willing to correct course.
I'm sorry but I prefer to have a president who puts his country first. I personally like what he stands for. I like that he's making an attempt to bring jobs back to the US. Obama himself said Trump would need a "magic wand" to boost manufacture growth to 4% GDP, well he brought it to 4.2% from what I believe was 1.5-1.8% under Obama & Bush Jr.. Stock market is very strong (I invest, not sure if you do?) look at how the Dow has jumped. Remember, stocks are bet on futures meaning Wall St is comfortable right now. Living in California, I am against immigrants entering illegally and costing the tax payers a shitload of money. We have a governor who just passed a bill to give undocumented immigrants free health care between the ages of 19-26. Sorry, I pay enough taxes here in CA to choke a horse, I don't need to pay out any more or give my hard earned money away to people not putting into the system. Democrats are for more government control, I'm for less control so prefer the Republican side. Trump has unemployment at a 50 year low. So what has Trump done to improve "my" life? Well my retirement portfolio has grown much faster in the last 2 years, the economy is thriving. I personally have been slammed with work. I do know under Obama our healthcare costs skyrocketed under Obamacare, getting Sanders in office will only get those numbers even scarier. You're just like the typical alt-left liberal, you can only feed off what the Anti Trump media gives you, which is everywhere you look. Try opening your mind and listen to what the other side is saying for once, maybe you'll find that this country isn't as bad as you want it make it out to be. I'll flip the script, what has Trump done as president that had a severe negative affect on you or your family? What has he done that has drastically changed your life for the worse? The only thing I can get for me personally was I has hit harder on taxes for 2018 than before.

*Edit* I will add one thing, I do think he's a very poor speaker, does have diarrhea of the mouth and should keep his mouth shut and stay off twitter a bit more. However, some of the shit he says does crack me up!'
 
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Brian HCM#1

MMMMMMMMM BEER!!!!!!!!!!
Sep 7, 2001
31,233
11
Bay Area, California
If only there was some sort of evidence of Trump asking Russia to get directly involved. Say on live TV, at a press conference, or something like that.
Did you let the Mueller team know what you found? If not you should! You could be the left's unknown hero! Nadler & Schiff may just drop to their knees in front of you with that kind of proof! You'll blow the lid right off the case!
 

Sandwich

Pig my fish!
Staff member
May 23, 2002
15,864
957
01776
Then where is it? The democrats claimed Mueller had all the necessary evidence, it was a shoe-in! At the end of the day, there was no evidence of collusion by Trump, Mueller's team found nothing! The Anti Trump mob I'm sure turned over each & every stone and came up zilch on Trump. Again, Adam Schiff keeps saying the same thing as you, but still hasn't provided anything.


I'm sorry but I prefer to have a president who puts his country first. I personally like what he stands for. I like that he's making an attempt to bring jobs back to the US. Obama himself said Trump would need a "magic wand" to boost manufacture growth to 4% GDP, well he brought it to 4.2% from what I believe was 1.5-1.8% under Obama & Bush Jr.. Stock market is very strong (I invest, not sure if you do?) look at how the Dow has jumped. Remember, stocks are bet on futures meaning Wall St is comfortable right now. Living in California, I am against immigrants entering illegally and costing the tax payers a shitload of money. We have a governor who just passed a bill to give undocumented immigrants free health care between the ages of 19-26. Sorry, I pay enough taxes here in CA to choke a horse, I don't need to pay out any more or give my hard earned money away to people not putting into the system. Democrats are for more government control, I'm for less control so prefer the Republican side. Trump has unemployment at a 50 year low. So what has Trump done to improve "my" life? Well my retirement portfolio has grown much faster in the last 2 years, the economy is thriving. I personally have been slammed with work. I do know under Obama our healthcare costs skyrocketed under Obamacare, getting Sanders in office will only get those numbers even scarier. You're just like the typical alt-left liberal, you can only feed off what the Anti Trump media gives you, which is everywhere you look. Try opening your mind and listen to what the other side is saying for once, maybe you'll find that this country isn't as bad as you want it make it out to be. I'll flip the script, what has Trump done as president that had a severe negative affect on you or your family? What has he done that has drastically changed your life for the worse? The only thing I can get for me personally was I has hit harder on taxes for 2018 than before.

*Edit* I will add one thing, I do think he's a very poor speaker, does have diarrhea of the mouth and should keep his mouth shut and stay off twitter a bit more. However, some of the shit he says does crack me up!'
I'm not sure if you're a Boomer, but you act like one. Trump hasn't hurt me much, but I'm a hetero middle class white guy with a job that can't be automated nor outsourced. He's totally fucking over my kids though, with anti choice supreme Court justices and anti science environmental doctrine. My kids are going to inherit a broken country that can't keep up with other nations. Fucking over our environment for the sake of a few extra gdp isn't worth it. We should be investing in technology that keeps us at the forefront of energy Independence and keeps the us at the cutting edge, not behind for extra oil profits
 

Nick

My name is Nick
Sep 21, 2001
14,401
2,917
behind you, don't wait up.
Then where is it? The democrats claimed Mueller had all the necessary evidence, it was a shoe-in! At the end of the day, there was no evidence of collusion by Trump, Mueller's team found nothing! The Anti Trump mob I'm sure turned over each & every stone and came up zilch on Trump. Again, Adam Schiff keeps saying the same thing as you, but still hasn't provided anything.
270 contacts between the Trump team and Russia, while denying any contact at all
38 meetings with Russian operatives, zero reported as required
Countless incidents of lying about the contacts and meetings, and constant changing of stories after being exposed
34 Trump team members charged with crimes
6 (?) convicted of everything from lying to the FBI ABOUT TALKING TO RUSSIA to money/tax crimes.

Where there is smoke, there is most certainly fire. They lied about it because they had a consciousness of guilt. Just because Trump himself was successfully insulated from it (my opinion) isn't enough for me to suspend disbelief of these facts.

I'm sorry but I prefer to have a president who puts his country first. I personally like what he stands for. I like that he's making an attempt to bring jobs back to the US. Obama himself said Trump would need a "magic wand" to boost manufacture growth to 4% GDP, well he brought it to 4.2% from what I believe was 1.5-1.8% under Obama & Bush Jr.. Stock market is very strong (I invest, not sure if you do?) look at how the Dow has jumped. Remember, stocks are bet on futures meaning Wall St is comfortable right now. Living in California, I am against immigrants entering illegally and costing the tax payers a shitload of money. We have a governor who just passed a bill to give undocumented immigrants free health care between the ages of 19-26. Sorry, I pay enough taxes here in CA to choke a horse, I don't need to pay out any more or give my hard earned money away to people not putting into the system. Democrats are for more government control, I'm for less control so prefer the Republican side. Trump has unemployment at a 50 year low. So what has Trump done to improve "my" life? Well my retirement portfolio has grown much faster in the last 2 years, the economy is thriving. I personally have been slammed with work. I do know under Obama our healthcare costs skyrocketed under Obamacare, getting Sanders in office will only get those numbers even scarier. You're just like the typical alt-left liberal, you can only feed off what the Anti Trump media gives you, which is everywhere you look. Try opening your mind and listen to what the other side is saying for once, maybe you'll find that this country isn't as bad as you want it make it out to be. I'll flip the script, what has Trump done as president that had a severe negative affect on you or your family? What has he done that has drastically changed your life for the worse? The only thing I can get for me personally was I has hit harder on taxes for 2018 than before.

*Edit* I will add one thing, I do think he's a very poor speaker, does have diarrhea of the mouth and should keep his mouth shut and stay off twitter a bit more. However, some of the shit he says does crack me up!'
My investments are soaring, as are many others. I don't believe that will continue indefinitely, it's a temporary boost which I'll be glad to enjoy while it lasts. We're almost certainly moving into a recession and much of those gains will shrink for many people, unemployment may rise a bit too.

I'm sure not an "alt left liberal" whatever that even means. I'm a gun-toting fiscal conservative who also believes in certain social programs and will always opt to support people over corporate welfare and military spending. Believe it or not I get my news from many sources, from the left and right to newspapers. I read, and I consume a ton of news.

"What has Trump done as president that had a severe negative affect on you or your family?"

- Effectively defunding the country via massive tax cuts to people and corporations who didn't need nor deserve them
- MASSIVE increase to the deficit with no signs of stopping (something I'd think you would care about)
- gutting or defunding programs from EPA to Intelligence to Homeland Security, which will have immediate and long term negative effects on everybody, the environment, American safety, etc.

I'm not one to run around with hair on fire, Brian, but this shit is real and happening, and far too many people can't seem to wrap their heads around it. In time it will effect you and your family too.

Thanks for answering. Most conversations on this subject are pointless as the two sides have no interest (or capability) in understanding the other.
 
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Pesqueeb

bicycle in airplane hangar
Feb 2, 2007
26,935
3,435
Riding the baggage carousel.
270 contacts between the Trump team and Russia, while denying any contact at all
38 meetings with Russian operatives, zero reported as required
Countless incidents of lying about the contacts and meetings, and constant changing of stories after being exposed
34 Trump team members charged with crimes
6 (?) convicted of everything from lying to the FBI ABOUT TALKING TO RUSSIA to money/tax crimes.

Where there is smoke, there is most certainly fire. They lied about it because they had a consciousness of guilt. Just because Trump himself was successfully insulated from it (my opinion) isn't enough for me to suspend disbelief of these facts.



My investments are soaring, as are many others. I don't believe that will continue indefinitely, it's a temporary boost which I'll be glad to enjoy while it lasts. We're almost certainly moving into a recession and much of those gains will shrink for many people, unemployment may rise a bit too.

I'm sure not an "alt left liberal" whatever that even means. I'm a gun-toting fiscal conservative who also believe is certain social programs and will always opt to support people over corporate welfare and military spending. Believe it or not I get my news from many sources, from the left and right to newspapers. I read, and I consume a ton of news.

"What has Trump done as president that had a severe negative affect on you or your family?"

- Effectively defunding the country via massive tax cuts to people and corporations who didn't need nor deserve them
- MASSIVE increase to the deficit with no signs of stopping (something I'd think you would care about)
- gutting or defunding programs from EPA to Intelligence to Homeland Security, which will have immediate and long term negative effects on everybody, the environment, American safety, etc.

I'm not one to run around with hair on fire, Brian, but this shit is real and happening, and far too many people can't seem to wrap their heads around it. In time it will effect you and your family too.

Thanks for answering. Most conversations on this subject are pointless as the two sides have no interest (or capability) in understanding the other.
Whoa, take it easy Che Guevara! There is no room in Brian's rhetoric for those sorts of "facts". "What you're seeing and what you're reading is not what's happening." It's all Fake News! The Golden God will deliver us, only He can fix it all.

I'm not sure if you're a Boomer, but you act like one. Trump hasn't hurt me much, but I'm a hetero middle class white guy with a job that can't be automated nor outsourced. He's totally fucking over my kids though, with anti choice supreme Court justices and anti science environmental doctrine. My kids are going to inherit a broken country that can't keep up with other nations. Fucking over our environment for the sake of a few extra gdp isn't worth it. We should be investing in technology that keeps us at the forefront of energy Independence and keeps the us at the cutting edge, not behind for extra oil profits
You guys are wasting your time. Brain is all in until the day the flavor-aid gets handed out. Any one still saying
I'm sorry but I prefer to have a president who puts his country first. I personally like what he stands for.
has a super loose attachment to reality. Nothing he has said since the Post-election thread, despite being heavily debunked and picked apart by literally dozens of other :monkey:s has changed. "Alternative facts" are now the only facts. The Republican party, and people still willing to identify as such, collectively, have been content to commit crimes and compromise national security when they think it can benefit the party for decades.

Republican voters repeatedly condone this behavior by not cleaning house. In fact, as we are witnessing here, they are more than happy to double down. (also note, the graphic above is woefully out of date. :rofl: )

Democrats, for their part, have spent far too long "characterizing" their Republican colleagues as good-faith actors representing a differing ideology of governance. This has not been true since Eisenhower.

You have to come to understand what these what people like Brian truly represent. This isn't about nuance in policy, or if there should even be a policy any more. You're not talking to $tinkle, (RIP) or n8. This is a push to reordering the country and the milieu in a way that hasn't been a threat since my grandpa went to europe to drop bombs on it. Democrats, their supporters, and any "classic republican" who might possibly still exist (small "r" on purpose) have to start treating Republicans and Trump like the existential threat to the Constitution that they are. Apathy and expecting adherence to the old "norms" are our greatest enemies right now. My hair is on fire, because
this shit is real and happening, and far too many people can't seem to wrap their heads around it.
I can wrap MY head around it and its freaking me the fuck out.


Edit: Also, @Sandwich, can I put in an order to have Nick's title changed to "Noam Chomsky 4 lyfe"?
 
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Sandwich

Pig my fish!
Staff member
May 23, 2002
15,864
957
01776
I'm frankly a little shocked that Trump's blatant racism isn't enough to sell you on him not being fit for the presidency
 

Brian HCM#1

MMMMMMMMM BEER!!!!!!!!!!
Sep 7, 2001
31,233
11
Bay Area, California
I'm frankly a little shocked that Trump's blatant racism isn't enough to sell you on him not being fit for the presidency
You're right, especially the recent one in Baltimore! How dare he call a rat infested city, a rat infested city! The nerve of some people! He should have referred to them as rodents. Thats much less racist!
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
25,877
1,673
You're right, especially the recent one in Baltimore! How dare he call a rat infested city, a rat infested city! The nerve of some people! He should have referred to them as rodents. Thats much less racist!
Are you obtuse, or just stupid?

He uses “infested” only for brown and black people-inhabited places. He’s talked about shithole countries—again, brown and black. He’s openly mused why we can’t have more immigrants from Norway.

He’s a racist, full stop.
 

Brian HCM#1

MMMMMMMMM BEER!!!!!!!!!!
Sep 7, 2001
31,233
11
Bay Area, California
270 contacts between the Trump team and Russia, while denying any contact at all
38 meetings with Russian operatives, zero reported as required
Countless incidents of lying about the contacts and meetings, and constant changing of stories after being exposed
34 Trump team members charged with crimes
6 (?) convicted of everything from lying to the FBI ABOUT TALKING TO RUSSIA to money/tax crimes.

Where there is smoke, there is most certainly fire. They lied about it because they had a consciousness of guilt. Just because Trump himself was successfully insulated from it (my opinion) isn't enough for me to suspend disbelief of these facts.



My investments are soaring, as are many others. I don't believe that will continue indefinitely, it's a temporary boost which I'll be glad to enjoy while it lasts. We're almost certainly moving into a recession and much of those gains will shrink for many people, unemployment may rise a bit too.

I'm sure not an "alt left liberal" whatever that even means. I'm a gun-toting fiscal conservative who also believes in certain social programs and will always opt to support people over corporate welfare and military spending. Believe it or not I get my news from many sources, from the left and right to newspapers. I read, and I consume a ton of news.

"What has Trump done as president that had a severe negative affect on you or your family?"

- Effectively defunding the country via massive tax cuts to people and corporations who didn't need nor deserve them
- MASSIVE increase to the deficit with no signs of stopping (something I'd think you would care about)
- gutting or defunding programs from EPA to Intelligence to Homeland Security, which will have immediate and long term negative effects on everybody, the environment, American safety, etc.

I'm not one to run around with hair on fire, Brian, but this shit is real and happening, and far too many people can't seem to wrap their heads around it. In time it will effect you and your family too.

Thanks for answering. Most conversations on this subject are pointless as the two sides have no interest (or capability) in understanding the other.
We all have a different take on things. I personally like Trump, he's not politically correct and to be quite honest, I miss the days one could speak your mind without worrying about offending anyone. Anyways, I'm a registered Republican, my first time voting was for Reagan in 1984, but did vote for Bill Clinton his first time around as I didn't think Bush Sr was that good of a President. I do try to keep an open mind. Never liked Obama, personally thought he was a lousy President but hey, he was the leader of the free world and had to make the best of it for 8 years. Again, as far as Democrats go, I really like Tulsi Gabbard and think she would make a great first woman president and would even consider voting for her in 2024 if she ran then.
 

Nick

My name is Nick
Sep 21, 2001
14,401
2,917
behind you, don't wait up.
But doesn't all of that contact with the Russians bother you, considering what we KNOW about their interference in the States and in other governments?

You can speak your mind without worrying about offending anyone, just don't worry about offending anyone!

* disclaimer: expectations may be higher for leaders of nations.
 

SCAZrider

Chimp
Jul 3, 2018
2
2
But doesn't all of that contact with the Russians bother you, considering what we KNOW about their interference in the States and in other governments?

You can speak your mind without worrying about offending anyone, just don't worry about offending anyone!

* disclaimer: expectations may be higher for leaders of nations.
We all have a different take on things. I personally like Trump, he's not politically correct and to be quite honest, I miss the days one could speak your mind without worrying about offending anyone. Anyways, I'm a registered Republican, my first time voting was for Reagan in 1984, but did vote for Bill Clinton his first time around as I didn't think Bush Sr was that good of a President. I do try to keep an open mind. Never liked Obama, personally thought he was a lousy President but hey, he was the leader of the free world and had to make the best of it for 8 years. Again, as far as Democrats go, I really like Tulsi Gabbard and think she would make a great first woman president and would even consider voting for her in 2024 if she ran then.
That seems like code for "I want to be a jerk to other people"....
 

Brian HCM#1

MMMMMMMMM BEER!!!!!!!!!!
Sep 7, 2001
31,233
11
Bay Area, California
Are you obtuse, or just stupid?

He uses “infested” only for brown and black people-inhabited places. He’s talked about shithole countries—again, brown and black. He’s openly mused why we can’t have more immigrants from Norway.

He’s a racist, full stop.
Seriously? Bernie Sanders said it was rat infested in 2015. Why was it not racist then? There are a lot of shithole countries that are just, well.... shitholes. Has nothing to do with the race. I was in Belize about 7 years ago. The main downtown city of Belize was a shithole, it was very dirty and was warned to to go hang out there at night as it's too dangerous. Spent time in the jungle (an hour away from downtown) & on Ambergris Key and the people couldn't have been nicer, same people, different area. Still a 3rd world country, but had nothing to do with race. As for has his comments about Norway, I think the point he was trying to make. If they're coming from Norway for example they are more than likely to have money and be self sufficient once arriving. Most coming over here illegally come here with just with the clothes on their back and a higher chance of depending on the government for free handouts/medical etc. Big difference as it's not costing the tax payers anything coming from Norway.
 

Brian HCM#1

MMMMMMMMM BEER!!!!!!!!!!
Sep 7, 2001
31,233
11
Bay Area, California
Yea but, that's kind of the point of America. Those are the people who need help the most. That's who we should be helping.
Point taken. But shouldn't we help our homeless, disabled vets who served our country, first? Don't they deserve more? Shouldn't they be given free healthcare & welfare before someone who's here illegally? Sorry, but I'd rather see my tax dollars take care of our vets first. Once they are all taken care of, then help others with whats left.
 

Pesqueeb

bicycle in airplane hangar
Feb 2, 2007
26,935
3,435
Riding the baggage carousel.
My bad, he compared it to a third world country not rat infested.
False equivalency bullshit, once again.

The words you're looking for are "i regurgitated some demonstrably false right wing talking point taken completely out of context to cover for the racist asshole I support."

Point taken. But shouldn't we help our homeless, disabled vets who served our country, first? Don't they deserve more? Shouldn't they be given free healthcare & welfare before someone who's here illegally? Sorry, but I'd rather see my tax dollars take care of our vets first. Once they are all taken care of, then help others with whats left.
If only the president could do something about that.
 

Sandwich

Pig my fish!
Staff member
May 23, 2002
15,864
957
01776
President business is keeping the economy humming!


This is from your guys, btw. Or, you could tune into a more impartial news source:





how many of those indicators do you count? 8/12? maybe more? maybe president business can tweet about additional tariffs and we can all watch our 401ks die. Good thing is I have time for a real president to fix the economy and mine will recover.
 

Sandwich

Pig my fish!
Staff member
May 23, 2002
15,864
957
01776
You're right, especially the recent one in Baltimore! How dare he call a rat infested city, a rat infested city! The nerve of some people! He should have referred to them as rodents. Thats much less racist!
oh my fuck you're daft. I love that you alt-righties get to move the goalposts every time somebody explains your bullshit. Do you not believe in vaccines, either? Flat earth?



He said there are good neo-nazis. He pardoned Joe Arpaio, who, even if you agree with what he was trying to achieve, did it in a horrific manner that is unbecoming of America. We're so far past JUST racist tweets that it's really not charming anymore.
 

Pesqueeb

bicycle in airplane hangar
Feb 2, 2007
26,935
3,435
Riding the baggage carousel.
President business is keeping the economy humming!


This is from your guys, btw. Or, you could tune into a more impartial news source:





how many of those indicators do you count? 8/12? maybe more? maybe president business can tweet about additional tariffs and we can all watch our 401ks die. Good thing is I have time for a real president to fix the economy and mine will recover.
"He's running the government just like one of his business!"
 

Sandwich

Pig my fish!
Staff member
May 23, 2002
15,864
957
01776
I hate that comment. If he was a legit businessman, I could get behind it, but he FAILED MISERABLY AT RUNNING A BUSINESS, SEVERAL TIMES, THEN SCREWED OVER EVERYONE AROUND HIM. It's wild.
 

jonKranked

Press Button, Receive Stupid
Nov 10, 2005
54,752
4,205
media blackout
I tell my dad something along those lines, then he says "Well he's got more money than me". Yeah, Bill Gates and Jeff Bezos have shitloads of money, but they're not necessarily qualified to run the country...
i read a statistic somewhere a few years back (i believe during the '16 election), that if D2S had taken all the money that he inherited from his father, and invested it in index funds (or something akin), he would have over 3 times the amount of money he claims to have.