roman polanskiSkaredShtles said:And "true Christianity" is more like, what? Roman mythology?
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A Question For Christians
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Hmmmm... that reads alot like Catholic mythology.$tinkle said:
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Mmmmm.......... falafel..........$tinkle said:
Because them goats got it going on, Pan gets his goat ALL the time. Oh yeah...$tinkle said:
True, but we don't really associate cows with a monetary value in this society (maybe for farmers). Let's just boil it down to a selfless act of giving.Andyman_1970 said:
Andyman_1970 said:As I'm not too "up" on end times stuff, I believe some of those things you mention Alexis, will be fulfilled with the Messiahs second coming - or first coming for those of you who missed Him in the 1st century...........
oh c'mon.. the tanakh doesnt talk about the messiah meeting the requirements on 2 installments...
my LRS (local rabbi in synagogue)i told me IDs were to be shown at the door...
does that mean are you allowed to believe, in a religious way on par with the bible, stuff not specifically told on the bible??
1. Does it mention specific dates and timeframes (perhaps using MS Project)?ALEXIS_DH said:
2. Well, he would say that wouldn't he?
3. Are your beliefs entirely limited to what you read in scripture (which is after all written by men, translated, edited and compiled by men)?
Your arguments undermine your position as much as Andy's. When it comes to religion, faith is all.
fluff said:
thing is, i dont have any binding beliefs on faith...
in fact.. lately i´ve been exposed to the idea of "religion without faith"....
would that still be religion?
I would say if your getting into Judaism, faith is an intregal part of that system of beliefs - why did Abraham strike off to go be nomadic in a time when that was unheard of, he had faith in what God said to him.ALEXIS_DH said:thing is, i dont have any binding beliefs on faith...
in fact.. lately i´ve been exposed to the idea of "religion without faith"....
Here's an interesting article on the Messiah : Click hereALEXIS_DH said:
Summary of the article:
1. The OT/Tanaach describes a wide range of roles for the messiah, some of which are at tension with others.
2. These tensions are present in ANY system that attempts to take the OT/Tanaach seriouslyJewish or Jewish-Christian.
3. Attempts to resolve the tensions concentrated around splitting the messianic figure into two figures, making the descriptions conditional, or ascribing them to different times/situations in a single messianic figure.
Under any of these proposed resolutions (Jewish or Christian), the problem of messiah-recognition would exist.
4. The tensions are mainly concerned with how to integrate the data describing a Suffering/Rejected messiah, and the data describing a Triumphant/Acclaimed messiah.
5. The one-messiah, two-appearances option does a better job of explaining the biblical textual details, without unwarranted introduction of multiple messianic figures, and without compromising fulfillment of all the messianic promises.
Actually the prophet Hosea says that YHWH will return and it will be like the former (spring) and latter (fall) rains. In the Hebrew mind, the term "rains" was used to picture the spring and fall feasts (remember the Hebrew mind thinks in terms of pictures, images, metaphors). Now the term feast in the Hebrew is the word mikrah, and can also mean rehearsal. So the feasts are something pointing to a larger event.ALEXIS_DH said:
Now, think about the "latter rains" - the fall feasts:
Rosh Hashanah - the Jewish New Year (aka the feast of trumpets) the central picture is that of a trumpet being sounded - when Messiah returns it will be with the sound of a trumpet.
Yom Kippur - the Jewish Day of Atonement - the central picture of this feast is that of a goat being led out into the wilderness - now when Messiah returns He'll separate the sheep from the goats.
Sukkot - the feast of Tabernacles YHWH dwelling among us - so in Revelations 21 & 22 a new heaven and a new earth come down and YHWH dwells among us.
So the concept of Messiah coming in "two installments" is not foreign to either the Tanakh or Jewish thinking.
well, my question would be "why is he the messiah when he doesnt comply will the messiah requirements in the torah""??
Actually he fulfills all three hundred and somethign requirements-50 or so before he was able of concious decisions-like where he was born, the fact his family came form egypt-the exact lineage all the way from Abraham is exact.
is he a descendant, thru his dad, of david? Yes.
how can he has paternal lineage if catholics (dunno about protestants) believe in the "inmaculate conception"????
What does the immaculate conception have to do with the man that was his earthly Father? Have you read the bible? Luke and Matthew in particular have his birth accounts.
what about the new testament? when somewhere in luke it says "there are 40 something generatiosn between jesus and david"... and ¿¿mathew?? i think says 20 something???
If you read the lineages they are actually adapted for poetic reasons. Historical lineage is available and they just left a few of the unneccessaries out.
Actually he fulfills all three hundred and somethign requirements-50 or so before he was able of concious decisions-like where he was born, the fact his family came form egypt-the exact lineage all the way from Abraham is exact.
is he a descendant, thru his dad, of david? Yes.
how can he has paternal lineage if catholics (dunno about protestants) believe in the "inmaculate conception"????
What does the immaculate conception have to do with the man that was his earthly Father? Have you read the bible? Luke and Matthew in particular have his birth accounts.
what about the new testament? when somewhere in luke it says "there are 40 something generatiosn between jesus and david"... and ¿¿mathew?? i think says 20 something???
If you read the lineages they are actually adapted for poetic reasons. Historical lineage is available and they just left a few of the unneccessaries out.
Talk about forum necromancy...
Well, Ezekiel seems to have a good idea of what the aliens AND the spaceships were like. (That passage has always tripped me out...not that I'm a biblical scholar or even a Christian, but still...)Andyman_1970 said:So you mean they weren't little gray dudes with black eyes wanting to scan our brains? Dang, I'll have to re read the Hebrew on that one..............
1:1 Now it came to pass in the thirtieth year, in the fourth month, in the fifth day of the month, as I was among the captives by the river of Chebar, that the heavens were opened, and I saw visions of God.
1:2 In the fifth day of the month, which was the fifth year of king Jehoiachin's captivity, 1:3 The word of the LORD came expressly unto Ezekiel the priest, the son of Buzi, in the land of the Chaldeans by the river Chebar; and the hand of the LORD was there upon him.
1:4 And I looked, and, behold, a whirlwind came out of the north, a great cloud, and a fire infolding itself, and a brightness was about it, and out of the midst thereof as the colour of amber, out of the midst of the fire.
1:5 Also out of the midst thereof came the likeness of four living creatures. And this was their appearance; they had the likeness of a man.
1:6 And every one had four faces, and every one had four wings.
1:7 And their feet were straight feet; and the sole of their feet was like the sole of a calf's foot: and they sparkled like the colour of burnished brass.
1:8 And they had the hands of a man under their wings on their four sides; and they four had their faces and their wings.
1:9 Their wings were joined one to another; they turned not when they went; they went every one straight forward.
1:10 As for the likeness of their faces, they four had the face of a man, and the face of a lion, on the right side: and they four had the face of an ox on the left side; they four also had the face of an eagle.
1:11 Thus were their faces: and their wings were stretched upward; two wings of every one were joined one to another, and two covered their bodies.
1:12 And they went every one straight forward: whither the spirit was to go, they went; and they turned not when they went.
1:13 As for the likeness of the living creatures, their appearance was like burning coals of fire, and like the appearance of lamps: it went up and down among the living creatures; and the fire was bright, and out of the fire went forth lightning.
1:14 And the living creatures ran and returned as the appearance of a flash of lightning.
1:15 Now as I beheld the living creatures, behold one wheel upon the earth by the living creatures, with his four faces.
1:16 The appearance of the wheels and their work was like unto the colour of a beryl: and they four had one likeness: and their appearance and their work was as it were a wheel in the middle of a wheel.
1:17 When they went, they went upon their four sides: and they turned not when they went.
1:18 As for their rings, they were so high that they were dreadful; and their rings were full of eyes round about them four.
1:19 And when the living creatures went, the wheels went by them: and when the living creatures were lifted up from the earth, the wheels were lifted up.
1:20 Whithersoever the spirit was to go, they went, thither was their spirit to go; and the wheels were lifted up over against them: for the spirit of the living creature was in the wheels.
1:21 When those went, these went; and when those stood, these stood; and when those were lifted up from the earth, the wheels were lifted up over against them: for the spirit of the living creature was in the wheels.
1:22 And the likeness of the firmament upon the heads of the living creature was as the colour of the terrible crystal, stretched forth over their heads above.
1:23 And under the firmament were their wings straight, the one toward the other: every one had two, which covered on this side, and every one had two, which covered on that side, their bodies.
1:24 And when they went, I heard the noise of their wings, like the noise of great waters, as the voice of the Almighty, the voice of speech, as the noise of an host: when they stood, they let down their wings.
1:25 And there was a voice from the firmament that was over their heads, when they stood, and had let down their wings.
1:26 And above the firmament that was over their heads was the likeness of a throne, as the appearance of a sapphire stone: and upon the likeness of the throne was the likeness as the appearance of a man above upon it.
1:27 And I saw as the colour of amber, as the appearance of fire round about within it, from the appearance of his loins even upward, and from the appearance of his loins even downward, I saw as it were the appearance of fire, and it had brightness round about.
PEOPLE! LET IT DIE!
Jesus.
Jesus.
blue said:
Nah it's too fun to do that.
So it was like an incestous mariage then?ito said:
No kidding...................I forgot all about this one........Tenchiro said:
That's right. Don't you dare go and get your answers from unapproved sources. It might make you question your faith, and we can't have that now, can we?scotty2hotty said:
And then it's but a short stumble to forum necrophilia...Tenchiro said:
Just say no to the Morgue.......but they look sooooo inviting, just lying there....fluff said:
Drop dead gorgeous?Secret Squirrel said:
Lay back and crack open a cold one?fluff said:
Man, but that bitch was hard-hearted.blue said:
fluff said:
Give you the silent treatment did she fluff?
Nah, just the cold shoulder.DaveW said:
fluff said:
Give her a deadarm to get her back!
May this thread now RIP.