[skinny mike]

every time i go to the gym, mentally i feel like i am not lifting enough, while physically i don't feel like i can do too much more. today i went just to lift and was done with my full workout in a half hour, which seems a bit short to me. i've only been focusing on my core and upper body lately. but i do 2 sets of 8-10 for each exercise and instead of resting i just switch to a different exercise.

i'm mainly wondering if i should be doing more similar exercises to really get the most out of my time in the gym. my goal for the summer is to get up to 150(so about a 10lb gain) so i'm looking to bulk up as much as possible.

anyone got some good advice?

 

[reflux]

When was the last week that you took off? It sounds like you may need to give your mind and body a week off, or at least cut out a workout or two and tone down the intensity (think the equivalent of spinning rather than sprinting).

Are you on a program? If not, get on one ASAP. There are a ton of coaches out there, each with their own program. And you know what? As long as you stick with it for ~10wks (CONSISTENTLY!), you will see results. I subscribe to Coach Dos Men's Health Power Training.

You want to bulk up? Eat. And when you're full, eat more. Also, drop the core work. Stability won't help you pack on the pounds. If you start implementing squats and unilateral lifts (one arm, one leg), trust me, you will get all the stability work you need.

 

[bitingback]

how many exercises do you do for each area of body?

i'm not looking to bulk up by any means...but i know i do about 7 different exercises for my upper body and about 6 for my core. with each area of body i have about 12 different exercises that i alternate with to try and keep things fresh. i may have about 4 different ways to work the triceps for instance, and will do 2 of those for each work out. same thing for biceps, lats, pecs, etc. this way i'm always working a set of muslces in a couple of different ways with alternating those ways every couple of work outs. make sense? some will be with free weights some will be with using my body weight (i.e dips, push ups, pull ups, etc.)

the only thing i have the same routine for are my legs. which i tend to use machines and free weights.

hope this helps a little.

 

[skinny mike]

i don't have any real program per se, but i have come up with a workout routine that seems to work ok for me. i just feel like with some changes i can get something that's even better. i do everything but the sitting lat pulldowns with free weights and for the most part i use dumbbells. basically my typical workout looks something like this:
(i do one set and then move right onto the next exercise after that, so i do each "circuit" twice)

biceps curls
one arm triceps extensions
front raises
sitting lat pulldowns
reverse curls

then i move onto core:
incline weighted sit ups
weighted reverse sit ups or whatever they are called for my lower back
weighted side bends

and finally i finish up with the rest of my shoulders and chest:
decline bench press
upright rows
rear delt rows

then after each workout i drink a protein shake.

 

[bitingback]

based on what you posted...i would say to try and add more exercises that you can alternate on various days...

for instance for my triceps i do any of the following (and i don't know the official terms so bare with me)

assisted dips (that's using your body weight)
weighted bar drop (that's where i'm lying down on a bench and have a bar with weights and drop it below my head)
back push ups (where i'm at the edge of a bench and drop my body down off the bench to the floor and back up till i fail)
dumbbell drop (i take a dumbell and with both hands drop and extent behind my head)
dumbell pull back (i take a dumbell and lean over the bench and pull my arm backward)

all of these work your triceps but each one does it a little differently so i'm always feeling like i've challenged my muscle. i usually will pick 3 of those to do per workout session.

of course...honestly...i am only going by what i've learned from various trainers and what has worked for me in the past. put from what you said about feeling like you're not lifting enough...although all of that is just mentally...maybe adding more and changing it up regularly...might help.

also...i know for weight loss...you have to remind yourself that it's the "bigger picture". it takes time. just rememember that everytime you're at the gym...you've done something good for your body. the hardest part of any goal is the mental motivation. just stick with it.

 

[Wumpus]

When I lift, I usually divide it into a three day rotation -- 1)Chest/back, 2)Shoulders(arms if you have to*), 3)Legs. I have about four/five exercises for each group.

I try to stay from the machines as much as possible and use barbells/dumbbells. This helps to recruit all the stablizing muscles.

This site is a good reference for some different exercises to break up your routines -- http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/exercises.htm








*IMO -- working arms is a waste of time. they get plenty of exercise if you use free weights during your workout.

 

[Wumpus]

When I lift, I usually divide it into a three day rotation -- 1)Chest/back, 2)Shoulders(arms if you have to*), 3)Legs. I have about four/five exercises for each group.

I try to stay from the machines as much as possible and use barbells/dumbbells. This helps to recruit all the stablizing muscles.

This site is a good reference for some different exercises to break up your routines -- http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/exercises.htm


*IMO -- working arms is a waste of time. they get plenty of exercise if you use free weights during your workout.

Couple of more things:

I have it down where I can be in and out of the gym in less than 30 minute. I'm there to get my exercise and get out. Legs may take a little longer because I sometimes do 10 minutes on the bike for a warmup.


I've been timing myself, and I rest one minute between reps(3x) and a couple of minutes between exercises except if I'm doing back and chest the same day, then I superset one back/one chest exercise.

i'm mainly wondering if i should be doing more similar exercises to really get the most out of my time in the gym. my goal for the summer is to get up to 150(so about a 10lb gain) so i'm looking to bulk up as much as possible.

I was 150 and 6'3" in my early 20s. Nothing I would do ever put any weight on. Then one day I woke up, and I was 220lb.

 

[skinny mike]

i went to the gym and did pretty the same workout(slightly out of order), except i increased the weight on everything. i actually think i have a pretty good program going right now. i do 10 reps at most per set and if i can do more or don't feel tired by the last rep then i increase the weight. i was only to do about 6-8 reps today for each set of each exercise. i'm taking tomorrow off to give the muscles a bit of rest.

 

[demo8razor]

how often are you lifting? and you're doing circuit type stuff, you're really not going to get any bigger.

the most important thing is food and to eat a lot, keep the fat to a minimum get atleast 1 gram of protein per pound and then carbs you have to come up with on your own should be atleast 2 grams per lb to gain muscle maybe 3 or even 4 but probably 2-3 somewhere in there

as far as how you are lifting, you are doing the same things too often if you are doing that every day or even 3 times a week also a cycle gives muscles too long to recuperate so you are not taxing them

as far as reps, reps are what works for you, usually different reps are needed for different body parts, the consensus though is 8-12 works best for growth of most body parts, arms usually respond to no less than 10 and quads respond better to higher reps 12 or more but still going heavy and pushing yourself to momentary failure

i don't know how many days you want to spend in the gym, but if you are serious and really want to add 10 lbs its going to take more than 30 minutes your body needs some rest between sets around a minute doing it not a circuit

try something like monday- chest triceps tuesday-back biceps wednesday - legs thursday- delts and traps

for chest, back, biceps, triceps, delts pick 3 excercises and do 3 sets per excercise traps you can probably get away with 2 excercises legs, quads are probably going to need say 3 excercises and hamstrings will need a couple excercises and calves probably need as much as you can throw at them

another thing, you said you are not training legs, you will not grow very much if you do not train legs, also whatever you train the day before legs will most likely be what grows and becomes the strongest. that is because they get the benefit of huge amounts of chemicals and hormones being released from training legs which basically make up half of your body

i can give you more details about exercises and such if you would like you can tell me what you want to accomplish exactly, i have come a long way with lifting through trial and error

 

[skinny mike]

ok so i think what i'm going to try for a little while is doing an entire upper body workout one day, then a day of cardio and legs, and then a rest day. if i feel like i'm taking too much time off then i might do upper body, cardio/legs, upper body, legs, and then a rest day. we'll see how it goes.

 

[Mikey_C]

if you are serious about bulking up you are def not doing enough. its not a matter of time spent at the gym its what you do while your there. The first step is to put together a training routine.

First thing is if you are not resting in between sets you are doing more of a cardio workout than strength training. You need at 60-90 sec in between sets, seond you need to be doing atleast 3 sets of the exercise. 2 set is for the beginner to just get used to the movement while avoiding injury. And finally, you need to concentrate on the larger muscle groups, tricepts/bicepts are secondary to chest/back and legs. You want to focus on chest/back and your tri/bi will get stronger and are not nearly as important as the big stuff. There are many other reasons too

To see real results have someone put together a plan for you. I would be happy to put togehter something for you that will build strenght and increase mass if thats your goal. Just let me know the # of days a week you plan to lift, the time you spend at the gym, your age, any injuries you may have. I dont profess to be an expert but in my 10+ years my training has lead to various goals, from gaining 20lbs ins mass for college football to successful endurance racing shape.

 

[skinny mike]

i am looking to bulk up some, but i'm not looking to gain 30 lbs. ideally i'd like to gain about 10-15 pounds by the end of the summer, which will put me at 150-155. i generally do 2 days on and 1 day off, but now that i've started work i'd be happy with 4 days at the gym a week. the amount of time i spend at the gym is dependent on what i do there, i never have any time constraints when i go and lift. i'm 19 and the only injury i've had in the past 6 months was achilles tendonitis, but i haven't had any issues with it since april.

 

[ReductiMat]

First, our bodies learn to adapt to external stimulus. If you don't change up your routine every four or five weeks, you'll plateau and likely burn out.

• Lose the core work and replace it with heavy, compound movements like front-squats, overhead-squats, deadlifts or good-mornings
• When on the concentric part of the exercise (the push part), think explosion.. don't just lift it, fire it off into orbit
• Most body-part split routines you read about are for the most part for juicers... you don't need five exercises for your shoulders. I'll reiterate.. you should be doing multi-compound exercises.. if you have time, then maybe throw in one or two isolation movements if you so desire
• Switch up your reps/sets (and weight)... for a month, for your larger muscles, try ten sets of three reps, five sets of five reps, etc.
• Keep your intensity high. If you can talk on the phone, quit wasting your time. Either leave, or readjust your goals

If you really do want to advance, this site is indispensible:
http://www.t-nation.com/

Note, these articles range from typical gym-rat articles to borderline scientific journal entries.

You might be interested in this one.

A large number of trainers that post on this site are world renowned (think pro-sports, olympics, etc.). I suggest looking out for articles by Eric Cressey, Dan Johns, Chad Waterbury, Alwyn Cosgrove... hell, I could go on, but I won't.

 

[waveringhobbit]

Have you every consulted a doctor before actually doing these exercises? Sometimes it's all in the genes.

 

[ReductiMat]

That's called Muscular Dystrophy. You'd know it if you had it.

 

[Mikey_C]

in bulking up at your age/weight 10% is a lofty goal in 3 months so no need to fear getting too big.

4 weeks 4 days a weeks work on 3x8 reps with enough weight to fail on the last set(ok to increase weight each set to make sure you can barely do that last few reps as long as you keep form) atleast 90-120 seconds between sets. To keep my heart rate up between sets i usually do core in between sets.

you can substitute dumbells or barbells( i do 2 dumbell days and 2 barbell days each week) the more 'free' the weight like dumbells vs barbells are good beacuse they require you to stabilize the weight while lifting. You must alwasy make sure you are using proper form which is alot harder with dumbells.

with any of these exercises you can do alternates as long as you are workign the correct muscles, with the goal of working a major muslce group for 6-9 sets. with atleast 1 full rest day for each muslce group(legs sometimes require more recovery/rest time, esp in the beginning.

The key is to choose the alternative that you are most comfortable with, some people prefer stragith bar to cabels for example which is perfectly fine. With tri/bi im not very specific on what you do so as long as you get 6 sets of each, it doesnt matter the method you chooose


Same goes for core do whatever you prefer doing, i gave some suggestions but there are many alternaatives. Also core is a bit different which is why i do a intense and light day with 20 reps.

day1(chest, shoulder back)
flat bench 3x8
bent over rows 3x8(arms perpendicular to chest)
incline press 3x8
lat pulldown 3x8
military press 3x8
standing rows 3x8
intense core*, like decline situps 4x20
reverse situps 4x20
*i always alternate sets for abs and back and have lest rest in between
-----------------------------
day2(legs, tri, bi)
squats 3x10
deadlifts 3x10
weighted step-ups 3x10
box jumps 3x10
dips 3x8
tricept ext 3x8
straight bar curls 3x8
bumbell curls 3x8
light core, seated twists 3x20

------------------------------
day 3-rest
------------------------------
day 4(similiar to day one first 4 exercises you can do the same way you did or choose an alternate,;dumbless calbe etc)
flat bench 3x8
cable rows 3x8
incline press 3x8
close grip pull ups 3x8
decline press (or cable press) 3x8
straight bar rows(with back slightly bent arms abotu 45 degrees from chest) 3x8
dumbell fly 3x8
shoulder shrugs 3x8

heavy core
------------------------------
day 5(legs, bi, tri)
leg press 3x8
hack press 3x8
leg curls 3x8
leg extensions 3x8
calf raises (standing)3x20
calf raises (seated or atleast knees bent 3x20
tri ext(palms facing) 3x8
curls(palms facing) 3x8
tri ext 3x8
tri curls 3x8
light core

off weekends!


4 days a week is what i do--lift mon, tues, rest wed, lift thurs, fri. 4 days a week is really the max you need. try to get 30 grams of protein in your body following a workout. No need to get fancy, i personally stick with skim milk

You should be soar the next day(and maybe the day after) if not you need to increase the weight. After 4 weeks you can step it up to 4 sets for another 4 weeks(can step up to 4 sets after 2 weeks if you feel you are ready!


Any questions, clarification about exercise, movement, etc, lmk.

 

[reflux]

...

• Lose the core work and replace it with heavy, compound movements like front-squats, overhead-squats, deadlifts or good-mornings
• When on the concentric part of the exercise (the push part), think explosion.. don't just lift it, fire it off into orbit
• Most body-part split routines you read about are for the most part for juicers... you don't need five exercises for your shoulders. I'll reiterate.. you should be doing multi-compound exercises.. if you have time, then maybe throw in one or two isolation movements if you so desire
• Switch up your reps/sets (and weight)... for a month, for your larger muscles, try ten sets of three reps, five sets of five reps, etc.
• Keep your intensity high. If you can talk on the phone, quit wasting your time. Either leave, or readjust your goals

...

If you follow any advice from this thread, make sure it is from this post. Great post.

 

[oiswego]

you're gonna have to be a LOT more specific as to what your goals are....looking to gain 10-15 lbs is easy, it all depends on what you want to gain.

personally, i'd go for lean muscle.
a lot of the info here isn't very good, and i've done most of it over the years listening to different people. but, everyone's body is also different.....

i've been in the gym for about 10 years now, started out just as a hobby and quickly evolved into an obsession! i'd done the normal keep in shape workouts to powerlifting and now i'm more into bodybuilding.

and the most important thing i can say is this: it's NOT how much weight you can lift!!
it's doing the move correctly so you fully engage the muscle.

for instance, i am fully capable of bench pressing 315 for reps....but i never do it because i don't want to be some big mass. instead i alternate between 2 techniques:
1) lower weight with timed reps: i'll load up the bar to 135 and count to 3 before the bar touches my chest. wait for 1, then push until elbows have locked for a time of 2
this engages your muscles a lot longer than "exploding" or any other info you've gotten so far.

2) and i'm surprised no one mentioned this one: supersets are where you really build lean muscle......same example-135 on bench press, 8-10 slow reps for 5 sets, after each set do some dumbell presses and rest ~30-60 seconds between sets.

i've been doing this for about a year and half now, and by my count i've put on 15 lbs of lean muscle.....i've taken 3 months off before and didn't lose any of my size at all, that's how good this method is.

for time in the gym--who cares? it's not a contest. do your workout, and leave.
i try to target one major body part each time in the gym, sometimes 2 alternating parts (like chest and back). i usually stick to 4 or 5 main excercises with at least 3 more for supersets and usually i do situps in between each to fill the time. this accomplishes a few goals---keeps my heart rate up the entire time, ensures i'm taxing my targeted muscle as much as possible, and gets me in and out to do other things.

on the flip side--has anyone mentioned diet other than to "eat"?? for this though, you're way better off speaking to a dietician to find out the proper meals you should be eating to accomplish your goals.

now, if you're only looking to pack on mass----then listen to the other posts suggesting to lift a lot of weight, and hope you don't injure yourself. eat lots of peanut butter sandwhiches and consume around 220 grams of protein a day for your body weight (roughly 1.5 grams for each pound you weigh).

going this route in the gym takes longer to put the weight on, but you're also going to keep it a lot longer----it took me 10 years, but i've put on about 50 pounds of muscle in that time to my current weight of 205. if you're interested i'd more than willing to share my routine---and it may look easy, but trust me it's not. by the end of my workouts i'm nearly ready to throw up.

good luck! and now that you've hit "the wall" don't let it discourage you---it happens to everyone! (took me about 3 months to go from benching 205 to 225---VERY frustrating!)

 

[skinny mike]

so what exactly is a superset? is it just following one exercise with another very similar exercise right after it?

 

[oiswego]

kind of---

think of it like this: you do one excercise, and follow it immediately with a similar excercise of less weight or lower intensity.

for example: you do a set of 10 weighted dips, after the set you drop down and do a set of 10 (maybe! ) triangle pushups.

and from my post--a bench press of lower weight, followed by dumbell presses.

 

[ReductiMat]

a lot of the info here isn't very good, and i've done most of it over the years listening to different people. but, everyone's body is also different.....

i've been in the gym for about 10 years now, started out just as a hobby and quickly evolved into an obsession! i'd done the normal keep in shape workouts to powerlifting and now i'm more into bodybuilding.

and the most important thing i can say is this: it's NOT how much weight you can lift!!
it's doing the move correctly so you fully engage the muscle.

for instance, i am fully capable of bench pressing 315 for reps....but i never do it because i don't want to be some big mass. instead i alternate between 2 techniques:
1) lower weight with timed reps: i'll load up the bar to 135 and count to 3 before the bar touches my chest. wait for 1, then push until elbows have locked for a time of 2
this engages your muscles a lot longer than "exploding" or any other info you've gotten so far.

2) and i'm surprised no one mentioned this one: supersets are where you really build lean muscle......same example-135 on bench press, 8-10 slow reps for 5 sets, after each set do some dumbell presses and rest ~30-60 seconds between sets.

i've been doing this for about a year and half now, and by my count i've put on 15 lbs of lean muscle.....i've taken 3 months off before and didn't lose any of my size at all, that's how good this method is.

for time in the gym--who cares? it's not a contest. do your workout, and leave.
i try to target one major body part each time in the gym, sometimes 2 alternating parts (like chest and back). i usually stick to 4 or 5 main excercises with at least 3 more for supersets and usually i do situps in between each to fill the time. this accomplishes a few goals---keeps my heart rate up the entire time, ensures i'm taxing my targeted muscle as much as possible, and gets me in and out to do other things.

on the flip side--has anyone mentioned diet other than to "eat"?? for this though, you're way better off speaking to a dietician to find out the proper meals you should be eating to accomplish your goals.

now, if you're only looking to pack on mass----then listen to the other posts suggesting to lift a lot of weight, and hope you don't injure yourself. eat lots of peanut butter sandwhiches and consume around 220 grams of protein a day for your body weight (roughly 1.5 grams for each pound you weigh).

going this route in the gym takes longer to put the weight on, but you're also going to keep it a lot longer----it took me 10 years, but i've put on about 50 pounds of muscle in that time to my current weight of 205. if you're interested i'd more than willing to share my routine---and it may look easy, but trust me it's not. by the end of my workouts i'm nearly ready to throw up.

good luck! and now that you've hit "the wall" don't let it discourage you---it happens to everyone! (took me about 3 months to go from benching 205 to 225---VERY frustrating!)

There is a lot of recent evidence that shows that by focusing on maximizing motor unit recruitment that the majority of gym rats will be able to get better results, quicker and in less time than by the methods you outlined above.

Your post raises a number of other questions as well:

• Does your obsession lead you to keep current with the latest in fitness research? If so, what have you read lately?
• What did your powerlifting programs look like?
• Do injuries only happen when lifting heavy?
• How often, and how extensively do you switch up your routine?
• What are your top two goals for training?

I'm confused that you state you don't want to, "be a big mass", yet you train like a body builder. Muscular hypertrophy typically comes from higher volume work.

can as well.

Perhaps I've somehow misread your post as there seems to be a number of contradictions contained therein.

That said, anyone would benefit from your routine just as anyone would benefit from digging ditches for a month. Challenge your body and it will respond in kind.

 

[demo8razor]

there is many contradictions there, and hardly any good information, except maybe for supersets, but someone who is just starting to take lifting seriously does not need them

 

[oiswego]

there's no contradictions there at all actually.
and if you look enough, you'll find exceptions to every rule.

if you can show me the majority of powerlifters who maintain a lean and cut physique...then i'll accept that error.

seriously....i've been doing this long enough, have tried different routines enough, and have dealt with numerous trainers to know better than to "contradict" myself.

and what do you think motor recruitment is?? maxing out?? it's engaging the muscles more and for longer, forcing them to adjust to the load you place on them. seems like i described exactly how to do that.

it always amazes me that the people who always have the most advice are usually the people how haven't been lifting for very long. the very same people that think the gym is a contest---i don't care how much you can lift, if your form sucks your workout is pointless. these are the same people who live and die by "supplements", and believe the endless marketing.

it's about taxing the muscles, making them work more and dieting correctly. it's that simple. the methods i've described WILL build lean muscle, muscle that won't melt away when you stop eating 4000 calories a day, and stop eating all the no2 and creatine (water weight does not equal muscle ).

and for the record:
when i was powerlifting >5 years ago, i mainly stuck to the big 3 with other minor excercises 5 days a week. took lots of supplements, ate lots of calories and protein. put on a lot weight--moved a lot of iron, but there was no definition at all. just mass. powerlifting does not produce a good looking body, just a big body.

i typically switch up my routine every 1-2 months. this usually involves adjusting the excercises, and/or adjusting the time i do my workout so the muscles are constantly in a state of shock. i never adjust it too drastically, typically i'll stick with a major body part and make slight adjustments to the excercise, like i'll use less weight and time it longer, or choose a different excercise that wil target the same major muscle but also engage different minor muscles.


injuries happen at all times---it's actually disappointing to me that you bring this up. do some research (or better yet, try it yourself)--start lifting really heavy progressively and see what happens. you should also notice that powerlifters wear all types of braces for their joints. you've never wondered why that is? it's to prevent injury.


my goals are simple---pack on as much lean muscle as possible, while burning fat. my goal is to reach 40 and have a better body than most 20 year olds.

and finally---show me the contradictions in my last post. i've re-read it several times now, and i honestly see none. of course, there's always the possibility you don't know what you're talking about, much less what you're reading. i suppose then you would see a contradiction.

 

[Jettj45]

i am looking to bulk up some, but i'm not looking to gain 30 lbs. ideally i'd like to gain about 10-15 pounds by the end of the summer, which will put me at 150-155. i generally do 2 days on and 1 day off, but now that i've started work i'd be happy with 4 days at the gym a week. the amount of time i spend at the gym is dependent on what i do there, i never have any time constraints when i go and lift. i'm 19 and the only injury i've had in the past 6 months was achilles tendonitis, but i haven't had any issues with it since april.

10-15 pounds of pure muscle is a lot of hard work. You should definitely be doing muscle group days. IE: day one(chest/abs/cardio), day two(back/shoulders), day three(Bi's/Tri's/forearms/cardio), day four(LEGS), day five(cardio) 1-2 days rest. You should be consuming at least 150 grams of protein a day, whey is the best. 3-4 sets of 10-12 reps for everything.

 

[donttouchthis]

is there anything that you take or eat that is healthy and gives you energy? I find myself loosing motivation quickly into my workout. I don't want any energy drinks and I'm looking to loose weight, not bulk up...

 

[oiswego]

unfortunately motivation is not something you can "fix" with a different diet.
if it's energy you're looking for, look into a small meal of simple carbs about 30 mins pre-workout--these are foods like cereals, snack foods, soft drinks, crackers, breads and even pasta.

in my experience, music that has a definite and discernible rhythm helps my motivation....that rules out most rap and hip hop as the rhythm usually has offstep beats. 2 good genres are drum&bass and hardcore.....as long as it's mostly rhythm with a quick driving beat