Man these debates are a riot this cycle. Bla bla - voted this way, bla bla cut taxes, bla bla rushed into war, bla bla i have a plan, bla bla I own a timber company? 
and away we go...round 3
- Thread starter Transcend
- Start date
Its pathetic really. I'd have some badass monologue like Conan Obrien if I was up there. Id just make fun of the other guy or something. This is lame.
They both have great ideas, It's shame we one or the other and not the best of both.Changleen said:
I still dont understand exactly how Kerry is going to pay for the healthcare and I wish GWB would quit trying to be funny. Cheney for president.
Wouldnt you? They tried to screw him just weeks ago.Changleen said:
holy crap!!!!BurlySurly said:
The US media its very pro-white-house IMO.
they just wont dig into their crap enough to make hard points. they just hover around waiting for anecdotal news rather than biting the meat.
you gotta watch more bbc, and less fox news.
Holy ****, John Kerry is crazy.
He's talking about creating 2 ENTIRE DIVISIONS to add to the army, tossing around healthcare to EVERYONE, creating more US special forces, adding more funding to schooling, increasing college grants, increasing the minimum wage, cutting taxes on the middle class AND REDUCING THE DEFICIT.
WTF is he talking about?
He's talking about creating 2 ENTIRE DIVISIONS to add to the army, tossing around healthcare to EVERYONE, creating more US special forces, adding more funding to schooling, increasing college grants, increasing the minimum wage, cutting taxes on the middle class AND REDUCING THE DEFICIT.
WTF is he talking about?
The US media is pro US, it is not pro white house in any sense IMO.ALEXIS_DH said:
I will have a good synopsis of all of this in a few minutes, right after I review my political economy notes for my exam tomorrow. ugh.
A brief summary. Litany is indeed the word of the week. neither have viable economic plans, and kerry is beyond crazy with his. Where is all of this money coming from? The "upper bracket tax cut" can, in no way, fill this HUGE whole. good luck with that deficit buddy. Hey, at least he has lofty goals and visions.
Bush is an absolute moron, who has no idea why the world hates the usa now. Bush's whole campaign is based on him fighting "the war on terror" that is actually against Iraq, and anti abortion/religious right win nut jobs. Bush has absolutely NO plan for the future besides push big business and continue wasting resources over seas.
Most of the media is quite conservative and pro bush (fox etc), CNN is very liberal. The only real news you can follow is FAIR (a 3rd party election organization), and a few overseas medias such as BBC and CBC.
All in all, a huge waste of time. The questions needs to be much more poignant, ridiculously over the to to see how the candidates react. They both love to ignore questions, and tonight was a draw in my opinion.
My solution - have a co-presidency. Take the best of both worlds, hire an actual economist to come up with the plan (not keynes or friedman, yeesh).
A brief summary. Litany is indeed the word of the week. neither have viable economic plans, and kerry is beyond crazy with his. Where is all of this money coming from? The "upper bracket tax cut" can, in no way, fill this HUGE whole. good luck with that deficit buddy. Hey, at least he has lofty goals and visions.
Bush is an absolute moron, who has no idea why the world hates the usa now. Bush's whole campaign is based on him fighting "the war on terror" that is actually against Iraq, and anti abortion/religious right win nut jobs. Bush has absolutely NO plan for the future besides push big business and continue wasting resources over seas.
Most of the media is quite conservative and pro bush (fox etc), CNN is very liberal. The only real news you can follow is FAIR (a 3rd party election organization), and a few overseas medias such as BBC and CBC.
All in all, a huge waste of time. The questions needs to be much more poignant, ridiculously over the to to see how the candidates react. They both love to ignore questions, and tonight was a draw in my opinion.
My solution - have a co-presidency. Take the best of both worlds, hire an actual economist to come up with the plan (not keynes or friedman, yeesh).
I dunno. I thought Kerry genuinley won that one. He did explain his economic plan fairly well even if you don't believe his exact mathematics. Bush couldn't expain his (I doubt he actually understands it fully himself) worth a cr4p.
I noted that on CNN International the first question after the debate was essentially on style rather than substance. What is it about journalism these guys understand? I mean come on!
'Who projected themselves better?' - WTF? Listen to these guys - they are incapable of addressing actual issues! Sometimes it seems they even make a rare issue related question into 'perceptions of appearances'. Non-newscasting at it's finest.
I noted that on CNN International the first question after the debate was essentially on style rather than substance. What is it about journalism these guys understand? I mean come on!
'Who projected themselves better?' - WTF? Listen to these guys - they are incapable of addressing actual issues! Sometimes it seems they even make a rare issue related question into 'perceptions of appearances'. Non-newscasting at it's finest.
BurlySurly said:
That's about what I take away from all this as well.......time to go vote.
About CNN, you aparently have no grasp of how important public image is for the most powerful man in the world. Image is HUGE in politics, and will affect the voting population of the US greatly, as many people are still completely without a clue when it comes to the issues. Although, this is less the case with this polarized election cycle.Changleen said:
Kerry didn't win anything. I am neither democrat or republican, hell I'm not even American, but I am a student of politics. It was a very clear waste of time, they both recited useless out of context facts. Kerry couldnt explain his economic plan (which is abysmal) and Bush did even worse. Bush will just stay with the status quo (the war on terror).
This is a conversation about democracy, no socialist allowedChangleen said:Well done. I commend your astounding intellectual capacity. You are truly a scholar and a gentleman.
how about you both keep the broad generalisations to yourselves?zod said:This is a conversation about democracy, no socialist allowed
I am aware of the utterly piontless and superficial 'image' issues Americans continue to have, and I think they are idiotic. Hence my comment. Why not have a fashion show rather than a debate? Especially if that's how you're going to report the debate anyway! US Journalism continues to suck.Transcend said:
That's like, just your opinion, dude...
RIIIIIGHT. Well when the way a candidate in ANY election carries himself as a slob and wins, you give me a call.Changleen said:
can you say charismatic leader? Yes, it is what politics is based on.
About healthcare: The US spends more as a % of GDP and covers less people...I still don't know why the whole bogeyman of "Government funded healthcare" comes from. A couple of charts from the Economist...
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The US seems to be spending more, covering less people, and getting less for the money.
Vive le free market! (Which doesn't work for healthcare for pretty basic reasons...)
Vive le free market! (Which doesn't work for healthcare for pretty basic reasons...)
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George Bush said he 'cun't speak English so good' just a few minutes ago...Remember? Anyway, you're the one 'generalising' here. I was simply pointing out how stupid it is, that Politics, of all things, is decided on as a matter of appearances over substance. Do you understand, Mr. Student?Transcend said:
Hey, if I was American, I'd wanna die sooner as well.Silver said:
Changleen said:
wow, you really are a twit with no clue of how the world works aren't you? Go find a sheep to entertain you.
It has nothing to do with "image", it has to do with representation to the world. I for one, wouldn't want a slack jawed yokel representing me. (and yes, bush comes close).
You apparently couldn't care.
And you pay more for it.valve bouncer said:Hey, if I was American, I'd wanna die sooner as well.
Nice custom title
Also notable, on a points basis (pure debating standpoint, with no care whatsoever to the actual issues) here is how the chips fell.
Points Scoring: The Scorer's Table unenthusiastically reports this bout as going to Senator John Kerry by 12 rounds to 4, with 5 rounds even. On individual points, Senator Kerry is awarded a net total of 19 points, and President Bush a net of 2, having undermined his own effort with no less than eight points subtracted, three of them in a disastrous 12th Round in which the President had to be told time was up, answered a question with, in essence, 'all of the above,' and stumbled by inadvertently criticizing himself by claiming the borders of Texas were tighter than they'd been when he was Governor there. He also lost points for having twice invoked the 2000 election, and for once having given back at least a minute of time when the question hadn't really been answered.
The Scorer's Table acknowledges that the chief scorer was in a surly mood because he was kept from Yankee Stadium. New York leads Boston, 3-1, bottom eight, with Boston threatening
Points Scoring: The Scorer's Table unenthusiastically reports this bout as going to Senator John Kerry by 12 rounds to 4, with 5 rounds even. On individual points, Senator Kerry is awarded a net total of 19 points, and President Bush a net of 2, having undermined his own effort with no less than eight points subtracted, three of them in a disastrous 12th Round in which the President had to be told time was up, answered a question with, in essence, 'all of the above,' and stumbled by inadvertently criticizing himself by claiming the borders of Texas were tighter than they'd been when he was Governor there. He also lost points for having twice invoked the 2000 election, and for once having given back at least a minute of time when the question hadn't really been answered.
The Scorer's Table acknowledges that the chief scorer was in a surly mood because he was kept from Yankee Stadium. New York leads Boston, 3-1, bottom eight, with Boston threatening
Thanks to Shirley and DT for that one.Silver said:And you pay more for it.
Nice custom title
Oh, a wannabe 'racist'! Great!Transcend said:
And I'll tell you again...
I was lamenting the way the world works. I was commenting on the trends of the times. I was talking about that I thought it sucked.
Do you understand?
Jeeze. You're very uppity. Maybe you should stick to your homework.
Someone just shouted "kerry's daughter is a hoe" on CNN. That is comedy.
You mean thesis.Changleen said:
And i do not see why you lament how the world works, if you want to be represented by a bum, you go ahead. Acting presidential is important, whether you like it or not. Being prepared is even more so, and looking like you aren't panicking to answer a question (see bush, round 12) is all part of this image that has to be portrayed.
Those charts don't take into consideration the extremely unhealthy lifestyles that Americans have. Take the life expectancy numbers and compare them with obesity numbers and I guarantee you will have an inversely proportional relationship.Silver said:
All I can say is that my sister and her family in the UK and a handful of people I work with in Canada hate their healthcare system and are afraid to see Doc's. Of course they are the type of people who consider their health as something they need to plan for and not a responsibility of the government.
Although I want Kerry as president I want a Republican congress that will prevent any new entitlements he may want to push.
Lifestyles aren't that much different in Germany and Canada...Westy said:
The biggest difference is administration costs. In the US, we take that in the ass...
I've had experience with both the Canadian and the US system, and personally, I had better care under the Canadian one. And, for the record, I can afford health insurance.
BurlySurly said:
i think you are confusing those 2 things.
(thanks to the worldwide know tactic of we-gvmt=we-nation so widely used by gwb).
I thought it was cool how when the moderator asked John Kerry how he was going to pay for all this stuff, John Kerry said " I'll tell you EXACTLY how Im going to pay for it" and the proceeded not to explain at all how he was going to pay for it.
I also thought president Bush's explanation of his Constitutional Ban on gay marriage was good, but that his argument on abortion was pretty ****ty.
I also thought president Bush's explanation of his Constitutional Ban on gay marriage was good, but that his argument on abortion was pretty ****ty.