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Any Formula 1 Fans?

IH8Rice

I'm Mr. Negative! I Fail!
Aug 2, 2008
24,524
494
Im over here now
No issues with 1.6s here, its not like F1 didn't cope with small capacity turbo engines in the past!
their whole reasoning behind it is stupid.
how can consumers relate to a 1.6L turbo making up to 800hp?? how "green" of a message is that?
they preach about cost cutting yet they introduce KERS, drop it, then re-introduce KERS again along with new engines.

the turbo F1 cars of yesteryear are long gone. those engines were batsh!t crazy...1300hp+ from a 4cylinder? :drool:
 

ridiculous

Turbo Monkey
Jan 18, 2005
2,907
1
MD / NoVA
KERS never left. But now Bernie is applying his middle finger by raising the minimum car weight to 640 kg.

Adding to the bullsh*t is the adjustable wing passing thing for next year.

HE REALLY NEEDS TO GO.
 

IH8Rice

I'm Mr. Negative! I Fail!
Aug 2, 2008
24,524
494
Im over here now
KERS never left. But now Bernie is applying his middle finger by raising the minimum car weight to 640 kg.

Adding to the bullsh*t is the adjustable wing passing thing for next year.

HE REALLY NEEDS TO GO.
KERS wasnt officially banned/stopped, but no one used it this year after it proved to be a joke. (proven by Brawn winning)
arent they not forcing teams to use KERS now?

the adjustable wing idea is good IMO, but not in form its being implemented. they should be allowed to make a maximum number of adjustments per lap like when the driver-adjustable front wing was reintroduced this year
 

ridiculous

Turbo Monkey
Jan 18, 2005
2,907
1
MD / NoVA
No one used it because the teams all got together and said they wouldnt use them to help cut down on development costs. It was just an agreement amongst every team.

The adjustable wing does have promise to it but like you said the implementation is abosolutely fail. Hell if you could use the wing for any significant amount of time/ when you wanted these cars wouldnt even need KERS.

But again its all crap. More power than mechanical grip is whats needed.

non-homologous engine type and a fuel capacity limit would spur the innovation and green tech he wants. If he would just pick a fuel capacity limit, say X gallons, and thats all you get to finish a race. Whether you race with a v12 or a turbo 4, it doesnt matter so long as you build it to finish the race with the fuel he allots.
 

IH8Rice

I'm Mr. Negative! I Fail!
Aug 2, 2008
24,524
494
Im over here now
non-homologous engine type and a fuel capacity limit would spur the innovation and green tech he wants. If he would just pick a fuel capacity limit, say X gallons, and thats all you get to finish a race. Whether you race with a v12 or a turbo 4, it doesnt matter so long as you build it to finish the race with the fuel he allots.
i dont think its a fuel capacity limit. i think its a fuel usage limit. teams are still limited by the amount of fuel they carry since re-fueling is still banned (unless that changes for 2013)
also Bernie is actually on the side of people against the new engines too. its the FIA
 

Secret Squirrel

There is no Justice!
Dec 21, 2004
8,150
1
Up sh*t creek, without a paddle
i dont think its a fuel capacity limit. i think its a fuel usage limit. teams are still limited by the amount of fuel they carry since re-fueling is still banned (unless that changes for 2013)
also Bernie is actually on the side of people against the new engines too. its the FIA
Wow...I know I was out of the loop on F1 for a number of years...but I've been REALLY out of the loop...No re-fueling on pit stops? when did this rule go into effect?
 

IH8Rice

I'm Mr. Negative! I Fail!
Aug 2, 2008
24,524
494
Im over here now
Wow...I know I was out of the loop on F1 for a number of years...but I've been REALLY out of the loop...No re-fueling on pit stops? when did this rule go into effect?
it made for some interesting racing. cars obviously got faster towards the end of the race b/c of decreased weight, pit stop strategy wasnt as crucial like it was in the past, the pit stops were under 4 seconds(!) and it also helped root out the teams that obviously couldnt cut it. some of the newer teams didnt build their fuel cells large enough and couldnt finish races
 

Secret Squirrel

There is no Justice!
Dec 21, 2004
8,150
1
Up sh*t creek, without a paddle
this year.
it made for some interesting racing. cars obviously got faster towards the end of the race b/c of decreased weight, pit stop strategy wasnt as crucial like it was in the past, the pit stops were under 4 seconds(!) and it also helped root out the teams that obviously couldnt cut it. some of the newer teams didnt build their fuel cells large enough and couldnt finish races
Ah....interesting...
 

CHepler

Monkey
Sep 5, 2005
212
18
pit stop strategy wasnt as crucial like it was in the past
While I certainly agree with that looking at the season, isn't it ironic that (bad) pit strategy decided the championship this year.

not a fan of the no re-fueling
 

IH8Rice

I'm Mr. Negative! I Fail!
Aug 2, 2008
24,524
494
Im over here now
its official, 1.6T engines for 2013

Soon we can all say goodbye to the high-revving V8s currently shrieking their way around the world's Formula One circuits. F1 has officially enacted new rules that require all teams to run a new turbocharged 2.4-liter four-cylinder engine design by 2013. In addition, the maximum engine speed will be reduced from the current 18,000 rpm to a maximum of 12,000 rpm.

All told, the changes are expected to allow the vehicles to use around 35 percent less fuel than the outgoing eight-pots, even while churning out very similar power numbers. While neither the FIA nor F1 organizers are willing to throw out any solid numbers, there is word that the engines will use high-pressure gasoline injectors that can dump fuel into the combustion chamber at up to 7,251 psi.

Atomization? Yeah, it looks like they've got that covered.

Interestingly enough, F1 is also moving to limit the number of engines (again) that a team can use during a season. Right now, the rules allow for a stable of eight engines, though by 2013, that number will drop to five before falling to four soon after. That would mean on top of nabbing better fuel economy and yielding high power, the new lumps will need to be stout enough to take the abuse of multiple races without popping.
http://www.autoblog.com/2010/12/10/officially-official-formula-one-goes-with-1-6-litre-four-cylind/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed:+weblogsinc/autoblog+(Autoblog)&utm_content=FaceBook
 

IH8Rice

I'm Mr. Negative! I Fail!
Aug 2, 2008
24,524
494
Im over here now
oh and team orders are back

The FIA has confirmed several key rule changes for 2011 and beyond including the lifting of the ban on team orders during the final meeting of the World Motor Sport Council (WMSC) in Monaco.

Team orders were originally banned following Ferrari's manipulation of the 2002 Austrian Grand Prix but the issue again reared its head in this year's German Grand Prix when Ferrari ordered Felipe Massa to surrender the lead to team-mate Fernando Alonso, sparking furious debate.

"The article forbidding team orders (39.1) is deleted. Teams will be reminded that any actions liable to bring the sport into disrepute are dealt with under Article 151c of the International Sporting Code and any other relevant provisions," read the FIA statement.

Along with a return to team orders, the FIA also rubber-stamped the introduction of adjustable rear wings for overtaking and the return of energy-recovery KERS systems.
http://en.espnf1.com/f1/motorsport/story/36209.html
 

CHepler

Monkey
Sep 5, 2005
212
18
I was really hoping that engine change wasn't going to happen.
Team orders have always been around, and if Massa hadn't been so blatant would have never come up this year. That and the non-discrete radio transmission telling him to.

of coarse Massa did it better than I could have. I most likely would have taken Alonso out on his way around me and lost my ferrari ride.
 

IH8Rice

I'm Mr. Negative! I Fail!
Aug 2, 2008
24,524
494
Im over here now
i think reinstating team orders is a good idea. they were obviously happening since the ban and will always play a part in F1. the drivers are going to listen to the people who pay them and whats good for the "team."
they are even more prevalent since radio broadcasts have been able to be heard by everyone and now for next year, the broadcasters will be able to hear everything.

bringing in new engines is indeed a step backwards, especially in "cost cutting." bringing KERS back isnt going to help either, nor will the limit of engines and the tranny regulation too.
should be interesting to see how many teams will use the spec Cosworth engine in 2013 w/ engine developments costs rising.
 

ridiculous

Turbo Monkey
Jan 18, 2005
2,907
1
MD / NoVA
Yeah I dont really care about the team order rule very much. However, the new engines are ridiculous. Especially with the restrictions they have put on them. Somebody really wants to slow this sport down. 12k rpm?!? Thats a full 10k cut in less than 10 years. Unbelievably stupid.

I wish the engine manufactures would fight this.
 

IH8Rice

I'm Mr. Negative! I Fail!
Aug 2, 2008
24,524
494
Im over here now
great articles on expenses by FOM and the teams/drivers
http://en.espnf1.com/f1/motorsport/story/36119.html
http://en.espnf1.com/f1/motorsport/story/35234.html


How much are the drivers paid … and who has been the worst-paid champion?
The best paid driver in 2010 was Fernando Alonso, who received $40 million in salary from Ferrari - a record for any driver. He hasn't always been top of the pile though and is also the worst-paid champion in the last decade. When he won his first title in 2005, as a relatively unknown driver, he received 'only' $6 million from Renault.

In terms of cost to run against points, which was the most and least successful team in 2010?
The best performing team was McLaren, which spent an estimated $460,000 per point it scored in 2010. The worst were the three new teams, who together spent around $200 million without gaining a single point.

We often hear about the huge sums Bernie Ecclestone charges to host a grand prix. Exactly how much does he cream off from circuits?
Formula Money estimates that the total amount that Formula One Management (FOM) received from the 19 Formula One circuits this year was $561 million. Bernie Ecclestone personally doesn't get any direct share in this, however, as a 5.3% shareholder in FOM's Jersey-based parent company Delta Topco he receives a portion of the business's profits. The revenue from race hosting fees is believed to be the source of FOM's biggest profits since there are very few costs associated with it: the company simply grants the rights to races and receives money for doing so.
 

ridiculous

Turbo Monkey
Jan 18, 2005
2,907
1
MD / NoVA
i think reinstating team orders is a good idea. they were obviously happening since the ban and will always play a part in F1. the drivers are going to listen to the people who pay them and whats good for the "team."
they are even more prevalent since radio broadcasts have been able to be heard by everyone and now for next year, the broadcasters will be able to hear everything.

bringing in new engines is indeed a step backwards, especially in "cost cutting." bringing KERS back isnt going to help either, nor will the limit of engines and the tranny regulation too.
should be interesting to see how many teams will use the spec Cosworth engine in 2013 w/ engine developments costs rising.
Looking further into this it doesnt look AS bad as it seems so far.

F1 ENGINE RULES FROM 2013
1.6-litre, four-cylinder turbos with energy recovery and fuel restrictions to replace current 2.4-litre normally aspirated V8s
Fuel efficiency to increase by a target of 50%
Overall power to remain same at approx 750bhp
Checks and balances to ensure costs are contained and performance across all engines remains comparable
Plan for advanced 'compound' turbos to be introduced in subsequent years
Power of Kers energy recovery systems to increase from 60kw in 2011 to 120kw in 2013
That plan for advanced or multiple turbos in coming years sounds juicy.
Also what this will do to the aero work will be interesting now. That above head intake probably wont be so necessary anymore.
 

IH8Rice

I'm Mr. Negative! I Fail!
Aug 2, 2008
24,524
494
Im over here now
Looking further into this it doesnt look AS bad as it seems so far.

That plan for advanced or multiple turbos in coming years sounds juicy.
Also what this will do to the aero work will be interesting now. That above head intake probably wont be so necessary anymore.
i wonder if that 50% is the target for 2013 or the years after that. the few articles i rear threw 35% out as a fuel mileage increase.

id like to see the aero packages from the V10 2007 era. they looked so crazy they were a good ugly. and the sound they made in combination with the traction control's noise was something to dream of.

you are no fun.
its a Honda. my SN shoulda given it away ;)
 

ridiculous

Turbo Monkey
Jan 18, 2005
2,907
1
MD / NoVA
i wonder if that 50% is the target for 2013 or the years after that. the few articles i rear threw 35% out as a fuel mileage increase.

id like to see the aero packages from the V10 2007 era. they looked so crazy they were a good ugly. and the sound they made in combination with the traction control's noise was something to dream of.



its a Honda. my SN shoulda given it away ;)
True. Whats funny about all of this is, a cars economy will benefit significantly more from a better aero package than its power plant, as F1 has proved time and time again (and physics for that matter). Constructors should be allowed to do the 2007 era aero body work going by the same logic as all of these "green" engine changes.




Though, as a McLaren fan, I must say im not entire disappointed by all of these new moves. I am really hoping McLaren and Ricardo finish their skunk works 4 cyl engine together to these new 2013 specifications. Everything seems to be falling in line quite nicely for them.

RE:Rice. IH8Rice as well. :thumb:
 

ridiculous

Turbo Monkey
Jan 18, 2005
2,907
1
MD / NoVA
Ferrari, the first to pass its crash test.

http://www.motorsport.com/news/article.asp?ID=396787

There monoque is rumored to have some "smart" composites built in to it. Materials with memory that can distort. If this is true, this is great news for Ferrari as once a chassis is approved by the FIA, it can't be changed.


Ferrari the innovator in 2011? silly season continues.

enjoy some more badassery.

 

ridiculous

Turbo Monkey
Jan 18, 2005
2,907
1
MD / NoVA
Their initial F11 rendering has some interesting veins all over it. Some of which include splitters under the nose section. Both williams and mclaren have tried this in the past only to abandon them after a few races.

Im no fan of big red, but i really hope that their smart material rumor is true. As that is the first middle finger of 2011 to the FIA and its sh*t rule book.
 

IH8Rice

I'm Mr. Negative! I Fail!
Aug 2, 2008
24,524
494
Im over here now
Their initial F11 rendering has some interesting veins all over it. Some of which include splitters under the nose section. Both williams and mclaren have tried this in the past only to abandon them after a few races.

Im no fan of big red, but i really hope that their smart material rumor is true. As that is the first middle finger of 2011 to the FIA and its sh*t rule book.
the veins just near the rear wing look like someway to get around the ban on the f-duct



why do you think their new smart safety material will be so beneficial for the Scuderia?
 

IH8Rice

I'm Mr. Negative! I Fail!
Aug 2, 2008
24,524
494
Im over here now
good to see Bernie isnt all that crazy
Ecclestone has admitted that he too is worried about the new exhaust note.

"I don't care whether it's 1.6 or 1.8 litre engines - I'm worried about the sound," he is quoted by motorline.cc. "If we lose the sound of Formula One, we will be losing a great deal."
 

mklie

Monkey
May 25, 2007
123
0
i hope to make it to Austin for the first race too. hopefully their planned 12hr commute to and from the race, doesnt actually turn out to be 12hours!
i was making plans to go to Indy right before they canceled the race there and this year's plans for Montreal didnt pan out :mad::mad:, so im really hoping to make it to Texas ( i didnt think id ever say that :D)
I would suggest going to Canada before the US. Been to both Indy and Montreal. Much more of a race atmosphere in CA. The shops all change over to F1 stores and the subway takes you everywhere. TX would be hard pressed to give you the same beyond the race.