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Anyone looking forward to getting a PS3 might want to think twice...

Tenchiro

Attention K Mart Shoppers
Jul 19, 2002
5,407
0
New England
New Sony lockware prevents selling or loaning of games

Sony has filed for a patent for a technology to tether a video-game to a console so that you can't sell it, loan it out, play it on a new console after your existing one is stolen or damaged, etc. Some speculate that this is intended for use with the PS3, but wherever it's deployed, it's very consistent with Sony's ongoing contempt for its customers. Once you've installed rootkits onto everyone's PCs, what's a little unfair trade practices aimed at killing the aftermarket?

The technology would allow an authentication code to be read and then rendered unreadable, making the software unplayable on any machine but the one which first read it.

DRM is often touted as "enabling business models" -- e.g., the business-model of charging you more money if you want a version of the DVD that you can watch in more than one household -- but here we have it being teed up to destroy the business model of anyone who makes a little bread selling old games.

This "new business model" business is really bogus. They take the media that today lets you do everything copyright permits -- timeshifting and quotation, format-shifting and backup -- and they take away all those things. Then they painfully dribble each of those rights back as a "feature" that you pay extra for.

Drip, drip, drip -- each drop of functionality painfully and expensively squeezed into your living room, every time you want to do something you used to do for free.

That's not a business-model. That's a urinary tract infection. Link (via Wonderland)
 

binary visions

The voice of reason
Jun 13, 2002
21,653
402
NC
Do companies not see that forcing people into situations like that actually promotes piracy?

I have to wonder how many people will, after they're burned on one or two games, find the latest and greatest hack for the console and use that instead of buying anything else? People who might otherwise not be bothered will certainly think a little harder before handing Sony their money.

Sony has had some sketchy stuff going on lately. It's too bad, they make some really awesome digital cameras and some other great electronics as well, but I'm going to be a lot less ready to hand over my hard earned money for a Sony branded product if I can't even begin to condone their business practices.
 

Secret Squirrel

There is no Justice!
Dec 21, 2004
8,154
0
Up sh*t creek, without a paddle
Tenchiro said:
That's not a business-model. That's a urinary tract infection.
Awesome...

You: "Hey, my PS3 had a hardware meltdown that was a factory defect...But I have 25 games that I've already played..."
Sony: "BWWAAAHHHAAAAAAA!!! Bend over and grab your ankles big boi. Time to pony up and buy 25 duplicate copies and hope your next purchase from us doesn't crap out on you...."

I can see the beginnings of a corporation just making something blow up at 366 days after you first purchase an item that has a 1 year warranty on it...

Count me out...
 

blt2ride

Turbo Monkey
May 25, 2005
2,334
0
Chatsworth
binary visions said:
Do companies not see that forcing people into situations like that actually promotes piracy?

I have to wonder how many people will, after they're burned on one or two games, find the latest and greatest hack for the console and use that instead of buying anything else? People who might otherwise not be bothered will certainly think a little harder before handing Sony their money.

Sony has had some sketchy stuff going on lately. It's too bad, they make some really awesome digital cameras and some other great electronics as well, but I'm going to be a lot less ready to hand over my hard earned money for a Sony branded product if I can't even begin to condone their business practices.
I agree with that. This will be a bad move for Sony...
 
Man, If that is aimed at the PS3, they are gonna have a heart-attack, when the PS3 suddenly drops off the market!!! B/c people are not gonna want to buy that, and game dealers are gonna refuse to sell it, since allot of the game dealers also strive on the "Used-Market", and this is gonna kill them! Not to mention the rental places like Block-buster! If Sony is planning that for the PS3, then they are so doomed!!!
 

LordOpie

MOTHER HEN
Oct 17, 2002
21,033
0
Denver
I'm starting to hate Sony more than Wal-Mart.

Altho, my 70 yo mom works at W-M and if they try to install a rootkit in her, well, I'll go back to hating them the most then.
 

binary visions

The voice of reason
Jun 13, 2002
21,653
402
NC
LordOpie said:
excellent point.
Well, before we go leaping to any conclusions, there's no guarantee this will even be applied to the PS3, only that the protection exists.

If it is applied to the PS3, you can bet your ass that there will be some kind of exception/workaround for rental games. Sony is not so shortsighted that they would rid themselves off the enormous bulk game licenses bought by companies such as Blockbuster.
 

LordOpie

MOTHER HEN
Oct 17, 2002
21,033
0
Denver
binary visions said:
If it is applied to the PS3, you can bet your ass that there will be some kind of exception/workaround for rental games.
there won't be a "workaround" or BB employees will leak it.

The exception would have to be two different sets of the same game produced.

Regardless, Sony sux donkey balls.
 

Tenchiro

Attention K Mart Shoppers
Jul 19, 2002
5,407
0
New England
binary visions said:
Well, before we go leaping to any conclusions, there's no guarantee this will even be applied to the PS3, only that the protection exists.

If it is applied to the PS3, you can bet your ass that there will be some kind of exception/workaround for rental games. Sony is not so shortsighted that they would rid themselves off the enormous bulk game licenses bought by companies such as Blockbuster.
Why even develop and patent a technology if you aren't going to use it. Of course they could always use it on music CD's...
 

golgiaparatus

Out of my element
Aug 30, 2002
7,344
41
Deep in the Jungles of Oklahoma
No way this will ever happen... it'd put blockbuster out of the loop for selling sony games... then Xbox would have a huge lead, Sony wont have that. Either way, I dont give a rats nickel... I'm not buying one of these new gen consoles until Halo 3 comes out, and that sure wont be on the PS3.
 

H8R

Cranky Pants
Nov 10, 2004
13,965
4
golgiaparatus said:
... I'm not buying one of these new gen consoles until Halo 3 comes out, and that sure wont be on the PS3.
Are you on xbox live yet??
 

PatBranch

Turbo Monkey
Sep 24, 2004
10,461
7
wine country
Ps2 works fine for me. My second one broke, but a new one is on the way.

I know for sure that "banning something promotes it" . hahaha .......long story->

I go to a charter school (im in 10th grade) where i do my home work on their website. My dad installed software on my computer so i would do just homework and not screw around looking at bike stuff (all I think about). Within a minute of noticing, i figured out how to turn it off. For a while, ended up being on RM more.
 

maxyedor

<b>TOOL PRO</b>
Oct 20, 2005
3,218
359
In the bathroom, fighting a battle
What is wrong with the PS2? Oh wait Sony declared it antiquated, time for an upgrade, I can't see this software working very well, what happens when you go to a buddies house? And on music cd's I often listen to the same cd in my car as I do in my house, I'm not going to buy two copies, oh wait I steal music of the internet anyway nevermind.
 

PatBranch

Turbo Monkey
Sep 24, 2004
10,461
7
wine country
oly said:
sony was in the news this mornign too about their programs that open your PC to attack. Im sure its old news to all you cyber geeks, but here is a link...

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/11/12/sony_suspends_rootkit_drm/
also...
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/11/15/sony_bmg_bodycount/

better go return your Celine Dion cd's now....
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/11/10/sony_drm_trojan/
Look at that - The sony crap that installs it self on to computers can contain the trojan virus. I hate all this virus/anti pirating crap.

How can sony put this sh!t on cds of other record companies.
from the link below said:
MacInTouch correspondent Darren Dittrich claims a recently purchased copy of Imogen Heap's Speak for Yourself CD contains an extra disc partition for "enhanced content". Within it sits Start.app, a Mac application that sits alongside the usual Windows files. The CD ships on the RCA label, part of of Sony BMG.

Darren reports that running Start.app presents the user with a licence agreement. Pressing the Continue button pops up a dialogue asking for an administrator's username and password - a warning that something is about to be installed somewhere - to allow the program to copy over two kernel extensions: PhoenixNub1.kext and PhoenixNub12.kext.
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/11/11/sony_bmg_mac_drm/
 

Barbaton

Turbo Monkey
May 11, 2002
1,477
0
suburban hell
mtnbrider said:
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/11/10/sony_drm_trojan/
Look at that - The sony crap that installs it self on to computers can contain the trojan virus. I hate all this virus/anti pirating crap.

How can sony put this sh!t on cds of other record companies.
They released an uninstaller the other day. Unfortunately, it makes the security hole bigger, since it leaves code execution and reboot methods in place that can be run by a malicious website via ActiveX. Oops.

EDIT: Oh, and they do add kernel extensions to OS X for their DRM, but it's apparently not secret, or exploitable by others. At least so far...
 

PatBranch

Turbo Monkey
Sep 24, 2004
10,461
7
wine country
I have always been using windows. I have always had probems. I think I'm getting a power book for christmas. I heard they are better for graphics which is what i do alot and video editing, which is what i'm getting into.
 
Aug 2, 2005
222
0
The Island
There is no way that this is going to happen. We are all following an unconfirmed story from boingboing.net! If you think the consumer backlash from 20 CD's was huge how do you think people would react when they buy a $400+ dollar videogame system that is rigged??? We're sitting here crushing sony for 20 cds containing rootkits (yes it's shady, but no it's not the end of the world), and defending Microsoft and their monopolistic business practices???? Am I the only one that sees the insanity in this???
 

Reactor

Turbo Monkey
Apr 5, 2005
3,978
1
Chandler, AZ, USA
Sony announced yesterday, they will exchange the RootKit/DRM CD's for CD without copy protection.

It seems 500,000 people mostly in the US,UK and Japan are running the stuff. Several worms are trying to take advantage of the fact the Sony driver hides all files that start with $sys$ to hide themselves. Microsoft has added it to their "malware" list and their anti-virus software will start removing it in the near future.

People are starting to get fed up with the DRM crap and starting to rebel. I wouldn't count on it being in the PS3.



By the way, SOCOM Fire team bravo for the PSP rocks!
 

Tenchiro

Attention K Mart Shoppers
Jul 19, 2002
5,407
0
New England
Reactor said:
People are starting to get fed up with the DRM crap and starting to rebel. I wouldn't count on it being in the PS3.
All of the next gen technologies that I have been reading about rely heavily on hardware and software DRM models. Windows Vista being on the forefront of the upcoming offenders.

Although they won't compromise security as heavily as SOny has just done recently.
 

golgiaparatus

Out of my element
Aug 30, 2002
7,344
41
Deep in the Jungles of Oklahoma
H8R said:
Are you on xbox live yet??
Naah, still having funding problems for the cable internet.
I've written it off. Beides, just got married, have a new band that is working stuff out at a rapid pace, and work full time... I dont have the time to feed myself something I know I would become addicted to especially having very little free time as is.

I can say that my buddy is a level 21 and I can still hang with him... we played a little last weekend and he beat me to 50 on lockout/slayer but only by 6 kills :)
 

Barbaton

Turbo Monkey
May 11, 2002
1,477
0
suburban hell
Senôr Lopez said:
There is no way that this is going to happen. We are all following an unconfirmed story from boingboing.net! If you think the consumer backlash from 20 CD's was huge how do you think people would react when they buy a $400+ dollar videogame system that is rigged??? We're sitting here crushing sony for 20 cds containing rootkits (yes it's shady, but no it's not the end of the world), and defending Microsoft and their monopolistic business practices???? Am I the only one that sees the insanity in this???
????? why do you use so many question marks????? ;)

FTR, it's not unconfirmed. Yesterday Sony made an announcement acknowledging the patent and that they don't intend to use the tech in the PS3, begging the question: what do they intend to use it in?

MS does boneheaded things too but they're old hat and we're all sick of complaining about it or have stopped using their stuff. The only thing of theirs that I use is Office occasionally if I have to write a doc for a client or something. I don't own a VG console but if I bought one it'd probably be an old NES. :p
 

Tenchiro

Attention K Mart Shoppers
Jul 19, 2002
5,407
0
New England
Senôr Lopez said:
There is no way that this is going to happen. We are all following an unconfirmed story from boingboing.net! If you think the consumer backlash from 20 CD's was huge how do you think people would react when they buy a $400+ dollar videogame system that is rigged??? We're sitting here crushing sony for 20 cds containing rootkits (yes it's shady, but no it's not the end of the world), and defending Microsoft and their monopolistic business practices???? Am I the only one that sees the insanity in this???
The rootkit from those 20 CD's infected computers on over 500,000 networks, including the government. If this was a teenage hacker that released this you know he would spend some time in the pokey.
 

berkshire_rider

Growler
Feb 5, 2003
2,557
10
The Blackstone Valley
Tenchiro said:
The rootkit from those 20 CD's infected computers on over 500,000 networks, including the government. If this was a teenage hacker that released this you know he would spend some time in the pokey.
:stupid:

Anytime you are *forced* to install a third-party application from a company you have never heard of, should be reason enough to question whether to continue. Take the crap back and get a refund. It's amazing to think people wouldn't find it "weird" they couldn't play their newly purchased music on Winamp, WM9, or whatever it is they use for their other music.
 

LordOpie

MOTHER HEN
Oct 17, 2002
21,033
0
Denver
berkshire_rider said:
:stupid:

Anytime you are *forced* to install a third-party application from a company you have never heard of, should be reason enough to question whether to continue. Take the crap back and get a refund. It's amazing to think people wouldn't find it "weird" they couldn't play their newly purchased music on Winamp, WM9, or whatever it is they use for their other music.
while I agree, the problem is you get a large corporation like Sony and people trust/assume that Sony knows what they're doing. We're talking about your average person who just doesn't know much about computers.

It's like getting new tires from your mechanic... do you check/tighten the lug nuts?