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Are Western DH racers faster than EC racers?

General Lee

Turbo Monkey
Oct 16, 2003
2,860
0
The 802
Gemini2k have you done an east coast race?
East Coast racing is gnarlier. End of story. Sorry guys.
This thread is stupid, but this is f'ing hilarious Hunter you need to get out more, or at least travel to a few riding spots outside driving distance from CT. I've raced/ridden just about everywhere and i've found 'easy' trails right next to gnarly ones in just about every state i've been to. when you've graduated high school, and have raced/ridden all over the country for a few years, you'll have a much more informed idea of what the East Coast is and isn't.

as for East Coast racing being gnarlier, i hate to break it to you but Plattekill is not the hardest place in the world to ride, or even the steepest/scariest/coolest. From my experience (roughly 14 years, 20 states, and somewhere in the neighborhood of 120 races so take it for what it's worth), the chance of getting a 'gnarlier' race in the east/west/south/rockies/norcal/socal/PNW vs a lame or average course is pretty much equal everywhere. it has zero to do with geographical area.

Everybody thinks their local trails are the raddest sh*t ever. Fact

rant over. you can all back to thumping your chests and measuring your d*cks now;)

Edit: will you guys ever learn to sop using the terms 'east coast' and 'west coast' to describe what are essentially about a dozen very different riding areas. even with the strictest definition of west coast you're talking san diego to seattle. do i need to explain why that is rediculous?
 
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Huck Banzai

Turbo Monkey
May 8, 2005
2,523
23
Transitory
This thread is stupid, but this is f'ing hilarious Hunter you need to get out more, or at least travel to a few riding spots outside driving distance from CT. I've raced/ridden just about everywhere and i've found 'easy' trails right next to gnarly ones in just about every state i've been to. when you've graduated high school, and have raced/ridden all over the country for a few years, you'll have a much more informed idea of what the East Coast is and isn't.

as for East Coast racing being gnarlier, i hate to break it to you but Plattekill is not the hardest place in the world to ride, or even the steepest/scariest/coolest. From my experience (roughly 14 years, 20 states, and somewhere in the neighborhood of 120 races so take it for what it's worth), the chance of getting a 'gnarlier' race in the east/west/south/rockies/norcal/socal/PNW vs a lame or average course is pretty much equal everywhere. it has zero to do with geographical area.

Everybody thinks their local trails are the raddest sh*t ever. Fact

rant over. you can all back to thumping your chests and measuring your d*cks now;)

Edit: will you guys ever learn to sop using the terms 'east coast' and 'west coast' to describe what are essentiall about a dozen very different riding areas. even with the strictest definition of west coast you're talking san diego to seattle. do i need to explain why that is rediculous?

Whats with all the logic and reason?

Im NE/NW - the rest is moot! (OH NO HE DIN'T!!)
 

Da Peach

Outwitted by a rodent
Jul 2, 2002
13,681
4,904
North Van
Is there ANY way I could get ahold of wallpaper resolution size copies of some of those images (if any relation to you?) They are amazing.
I don't know the photog personally, but given the gang he hangs out with, I'd wager that if you contacted him via his website and told him where you saw it, he'd help you out.
 

fortenndu

Turbo Monkey
Apr 22, 2008
1,573
0
Boone, NC
This thread is stupid, but this is f'ing hilarious Hunter you need to get out more, or at least travel to a few riding spots outside driving distance from CT. I've raced/ridden just about everywhere and i've found 'easy' trails right next to gnarly ones in just about every state i've been to. when you've graduated high school, and have raced/ridden all over the country for a few years, you'll have a much more informed idea of what the East Coast is and isn't.

as for East Coast racing being gnarlier, i hate to break it to you but Plattekill is not the hardest place in the world to ride, or even the steepest/scariest/coolest. From my experience (roughly 14 years, 20 states, and somewhere in the neighborhood of 120 races so take it for what it's worth), the chance of getting a 'gnarlier' race in the east/west/south/rockies/norcal/socal/PNW vs a lame or average course is pretty much equal everywhere. it has zero to do with geographical area.

Everybody thinks their local trails are the raddest sh*t ever. Fact

rant over. you can all back to thumping your chests and measuring your d*cks now;)

Edit: will you guys ever learn to sop using the terms 'east coast' and 'west coast' to describe what are essentially about a dozen very different riding areas. even with the strictest definition of west coast you're talking san diego to seattle. do i need to explain why that is rediculous?
Oh lord don't you know everything.
I've never ridden anywhere but driving distance from CT right, do you stalk me? You make yourself look like a fool all to often. You don't know everything about everyone, go write it on a blackboard until it gets ingrained in your brain.
 

jonKranked

Detective Dookie
Nov 10, 2005
85,562
24,182
media blackout
Oh lord don't you know everything.
I've never ridden anywhere but driving distance from CT right, do you stalk me? You make yourself look like a fool all to often. You don't know everything about everyone, go write it on a blackboard until it gets ingrained in your brain.
Don't get so defensive junior. Lee T has a point. I was once in your position rollin' through the pits like my shat don't stank. The east coast has some great riding, but until you get out and experience more kinds of terrains, you're still just gonna be another east coast grom. When I moved out west I realized what a hack of a rider I was.
 

fortenndu

Turbo Monkey
Apr 22, 2008
1,573
0
Boone, NC
Don't get so defensive junior. Lee T has a point. I was once in your position rollin' through the pits like my shat don't stank. The east coast has some great riding, but until you get out and experience more kinds of terrains, you're still just gonna be another east coast grom. When I moved out west I realized what a hack of a rider I was.
I lived out west until a couple years ago and go back for a month every year. Sorry brah.
 

jonKranked

Detective Dookie
Nov 10, 2005
85,562
24,182
media blackout
Dude, I lived in South Bay on the beach where there's a history of surfing, and not once did I hear ANY of the locals use the term "brah". The only people there who used it, were the people who didn't live there.
 

fortenndu

Turbo Monkey
Apr 22, 2008
1,573
0
Boone, NC
Dude, I lived in South Bay on the beach where there's a history of surfing, and not once did I hear ANY of the locals use the term "brah". The only people there who used it, were the people who didn't live there.
That would be the point...
I lived in the Marin, also known as where mountain biking started for 14 years.
 

General Lee

Turbo Monkey
Oct 16, 2003
2,860
0
The 802
Oh lord don't you know everything.
I've never ridden anywhere but driving distance from CT right, do you stalk me? You make yourself look like a fool all to often. You don't know everything about everyone, go write it on a blackboard until it gets ingrained in your brain.
oh snap i just got called out by the 17 year old kid who once bought mine or a teammates old transcend/orange 224 and invites me to come ride his local trails that i grew up on. at least in terms of stalking, wouldn't you think it would be the other way around?

plain and simple for you: you can't claim "East Coast racing is gnarlier. End of story. Sorry guys, " its like a virgin telling a porn star how to f*ck..

I don't know everything, but if the subjects is bikes or bike racing i know quite a lot. if i said something as dumb as what i quoted from you at least i'd have some actual experience to offer as evidence. but I'd still be wrong.
 

fortenndu

Turbo Monkey
Apr 22, 2008
1,573
0
Boone, NC
oh snap i just got called out by the 17 year old kid who once bought mine or a teammates old transcend/orange 224 and invites me to come ride his local trails that i grew up on. at least in terms of stalking, wouldn't you think it would be the other way around?

plain and simple for you: you can't claim "East Coast racing is gnarlier. End of story. Sorry guys, " its like a virgin telling a porn star how to f*ck..

I don't know everything, but if the subjects is bikes or bike racing i know quite a lot. if i said something as dumb as what i quoted from you at least i'd have some actual experience to offer as evidence. but I'd still be wrong.
So apparently buying a frame and inviting you to come ride trails that you grew up on and I put hours of work into is stalking but claiming to know where I ride every weekend and knowing my life story is not. I'm lost.
 

gemini2k

Turbo Monkey
Jul 31, 2005
3,526
117
San Francisco
Windrock, TN

We have got a pretty big mtn and some gnarly trails. However does that make us better national level racers? No. I think its a concentration of competition that drives most people to be faster. We have never had that here, so as a result only a few us have done well regionally. Go figure.
Rode there last year, every trail, in the wet too. That place is probably one of the best all around networks of downhill trails, some long runs, lots of variety. You guys are very lucky to have that But, medium difficulty I'd say. I don't think I had a problem with any sections of any of the trails.
Again, the trail Ianjenn posted makes everything else I've ever seen look like smooth paved XC. I won't even dare try to ride that trail. There's a difference between "technical" like some of the stuff on the east coast, and "death defying" like some of the trails near here (and I'm not talking about tunnel).
 

jonKranked

Detective Dookie
Nov 10, 2005
85,562
24,182
media blackout
oh snap i just got called out by the 17 year old kid who once bought mine or a teammates old transcend/orange 224 and invites me to come ride his local trails that i grew up on. at least in terms of stalking, wouldn't you think it would be the other way around?

plain and simple for you: you can't claim "East Coast racing is gnarlier. End of story. Sorry guys, " its like a virgin telling a porn star how to f*ck..

I don't know everything, but if the subjects is bikes or bike racing i know quite a lot. if i said something as dumb as what i quoted from you at least i'd have some actual experience to offer as evidence. but I'd still be wrong.
Lee, you can take your well informed opinions, years of riding, and industry experience, and shove them somewhere you don't want them shoved! ;)



And I challenge you to a race on the gnar-est place to ride EVER - freakin' MARS!
 

profro

Turbo Monkey
Feb 25, 2002
5,617
314
Walden Ridge
Rode there last year, every trail, in the wet too. That place is probably one of the best all around networks of downhill trails, some long runs, lots of variety. You guys are very lucky to have that But, medium difficulty I'd say. I don't think I had a problem with any sections of any of the trails.
Again, the trail Ianjenn posted makes everything else I've ever seen look like smooth paved XC. I won't even dare try to ride that trail. There's a difference between "technical" like some of the stuff on the east coast, and "death defying" like some of the trails near here (and I'm not talking about tunnel).
I know you possibly couldn't remember the names or probably even knew them at the time, but there are a few local locals trails that visitors don't see. Did you end up on a trail that was a rock garden top to bottom? Wasn't that steep, but a full blown rock garden. Thats Southern Rocks. IMO, the best trail I've ridden anywhere. Also did you get to do the Windmill runs? All 4 of them?
 

slowitdown

Monkey
Mar 30, 2009
553
0
I agree with Transend. The courses are very different. I have raced out west a lot and I have never seen a course as technically difficult out west as the SS#2 course last year.
What are you counting as "out west" compared to Snowshoe No. 2? There's probably 2x or more the number of courses out here in the west. So just saying "the west" tells nothing. I haven't ridden Snowshoe but I have skied there and I can say that there's no way Snowshoe is tougher than quite a few of the courses and trails I've ridden in the northern Rockies. No way at all. I wonder what western courses you rode. Did you ride Schweitzer?
 

mccdh

Monkey
Sep 9, 2008
181
0
Comox
DH racers out west tend to be more well rounded bike riders... I know plenty of people who race here on the eastcoast that only own DH bikes... The eastcoast of the US is the only place on earth (unless you live at a ski hill) where you can ride DH within 2 hours of major population centers...

People who build their own tracks to ride, and earn their own elevation tend to have a lot more invested in the sport...
are you drunk....
 

slowitdown

Monkey
Mar 30, 2009
553
0
I like how all pissy the western riders get as they try to defend that they have more rocks
where has that happened?

all I've seen is Easterners claiming the argument is over without even comparing.

I grew up riding in the mid-atlantic. Y'all are freakin' on nitrous oxide. Nothing in New England or the Mid-Atlantic or Windrodck compares to most of the Northern Rockies or the Canadian Rockies. Nothing. The only people who think the East Coast can compare are people who haven't seen the proper trails.

It's absurd to even argue this. There just isn't any vertical out East. The mountains are older. Regional pride can't overcome round, old, flat mountains.
 
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Huck Banzai

Turbo Monkey
May 8, 2005
2,523
23
Transitory
Reality, what a notion. Its quite funny how serious people seem to be taking themselves, and this topic. I believe in my asessment as a generlization, but dont really give a crap. Im notorious for instigating, and its quite easy to get people pissy and full of themselves.

Try to realize that no matter what is said, or who is or isnt 'convinced' the reality of what is remains the same. So before it gets really stupid, lighten up.



I think pretty much everyone here is 'arguing a different point'

elevation, speed, rockiness, fear factor, blah blah blah

A rare occasion when I believe a thread should be locked and die before some other knows better than you, assumes youve been no-where, iconic figure comes and lays it down again.

OH f' it - since its a diarrhea pit, Ill mix in some lumps and throw:

"Which western mountain is hosting a WC race this year?"

EDIT: Self noted fail above, which should read NEXT year.



now run with it
 
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mccdh

Monkey
Sep 9, 2008
181
0
Comox
Reality, what a notion.

I think pretty much everyone here is 'arguing a different point'

elevation, speed, rockiness, fear factor, blah blah blah

A rare occasion when I believe a thread should be locked and die before some other knows better than you, assumes youve been no-where, iconic figure comes and lays it down again.

OH f' it - since its a diarrhea pit, Ill mix in some lumps and throw:

"Which western mountain is hosting a WC race this year?"


now run with it



Crankworx...end of story.
 

HAB

Chelsea from Seattle
Apr 28, 2007
11,580
2,005
Seattle
hahahaha yup.

Having lived and ridden both, I'll put in my $0.02:

The west coast tends to be more wide open, faster trails. The trees are less dense (generally) which gives better visibility. There's a lot of loose dry stuff, but a good amount of hardpack. They have some very technical, rocky trail sections - and some gnarly rock gardens.

The east coast is generally not very wide open. The trees tend to be closer together resulting in lower visibility. We get a lot of rain (this year especially) so there's a lot of mud. When its dry, its fairly well packed. The trails are very technical, and VERY rocky. We have gnarlyrock gardens, but we also have trails that are more than 90% rock garden from start to finish.


Not saying the west coast isn't tech and rocky, just that the east tends to be more tech and rockier.

Also, the west coast seems to have more (and better) berms.
:stupid:

I split time between SoCal and NY. Obviously I haven't ridden everything, and there are exceptions, but kranked's observations about mirror my own. Generally speaking, the trails I've ridden out west tend to be a lot faster and more wide open, with faster, more bermed corners. East coast stuff tends to be more chunky and often more steep, with lots more hard on the brakes picking your way through something ridiculous. Not nearly as many high speed corners. Both are fun, just different characters.


Edit: and when I say east coast- west coast, I'm talking north east versus SoCal. Poor word use on my part, but y'all can deal.
 
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Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
18,852
9,557
AK
:stupid:

I split time between SoCal and NY. Obviously I haven't ridden everything, and there are exceptions, but kranked's observations about mirror my own. Generally speaking, the trails I've ridden out west tend to be a lot faster and more wide open, with faster, more bermed corners. East coast stuff tends to be more chunky and often more steep, with lots more hard on the brakes picking your way through something ridiculous. Not nearly as many high speed corners. Both are fun, just different characters.


Edit: and when I say east coast- west coast, I'm talking north east versus SoCal. Poor word use on my part, but y'all can deal.
Yeah, that's my gripe, comparing a relatively small portion of the east coast (Jersey, NY and what else?) with a small portion of the west coast (SoCal), and calling it "East vs West". There's so much more riding.
 

gemini2k

Turbo Monkey
Jul 31, 2005
3,526
117
San Francisco
I know you possibly couldn't remember the names or probably even knew them at the time, but there are a few local locals trails that visitors don't see. Did you end up on a trail that was a rock garden top to bottom? Wasn't that steep, but a full blown rock garden. Thats Southern Rocks. IMO, the best trail I've ridden anywhere. Also did you get to do the Windmill runs? All 4 of them?
Yep, rode southern rocks, and I'm pretty sure I did all the windmill runs. Sorry, but I'm actually NOT talking out my ass (for once). Like i said, no disrespect, that place is AWEZOME.
 

stoney

Part of the unwashed, middle-American horde
Jul 26, 2006
21,519
7,067
Colorado
I think Jeremy hit it on the head with the speed differences, but the east/west debate is moot. There are trails of all varieties, all over the country. Due to some of that local traits of those locales, local riders get more specialized at different types of terrain.

Socal is *generally* drier, and forces riders to be comfortable sliding on sand. I've also noticed that the Socal trails tend to be faster. However there are outliers such as Santa Barbara, which are generally rockier.

Norcal has an even split of PNW-like conditions in Santa Cruz and surrounding areas, and drier clay/sand based soils. It is an 'in-between' to the PNW and Socal, if you will. However there are still outliers like Tahoe which is loose pumice on boulders. Outside of Tahoe I have ridden nothing like it. Riders here tend to be more comfortable sliding on the loose, dry stuff, but can handle wet conditions. High speeds are still a mainstay.

PNW? You have defaults like Whistler and the trails in BC/Seattle area, but just over the Mtns it's much more similar to the mountain states with huge elevation losses (2000+ft per trail) and a dry climate with a dusty, big rock trail base.

Mtn States: Big, sky county. Huge elevation drops, high speeds - because there is room, dry and dusty normally, but when wet the dirt is tacky and loamy. Riders are generally very fit, living at elevation acclimates you to the air. Taking this group down to sea-level, they will do better fitness-wise, as they are acclimated to less oxygen.

Northeast: Rocky as all hell, but where there is dirt it's tacky. However, when it's wet it's slime.

...

I don't need to keep going. Each region of the country has primary type of riding due to climate and geological features. While this might specialize each regions riders to a certain extent, there is no way to test this "theory". Riders in the top echelon will always be fast, and weekend warriors will be 'better' as their local terrain.

The East-West, who is better debate is a joke.
 

freeridefool

Monkey
Jun 17, 2006
647
0
medford, or
Outside of southern oregon Im not all that good. But Ive heard alot of pro racers compare the Hood race course to a WC level course. If you look at all the WC courses they tend to be very fast and very tech. The east coast tends to lack the very fast part.

To the question who is faster... west coast guys. The east coast cant match the speed the guys west of the rockies have. East coast is tough as hell and is all "gnar this and that" but just lacks speed.

I know windam is hosting a WC and Ill fly there to watch, but look at the americans who are fast right now, Gwinn, Strobel, Strait, Riffle, all west coast.

As a generalization, I think west guys going east do better than east guys going west.
 

EM-EFER

Monkey
May 29, 2007
311
0
Outside of southern oregon Im not all that good. But Ive heard alot of pro racers compare the Hood race course to a WC level course. If you look at all the WC courses they tend to be very fast and very tech. The east coast tends to lack the very fast part.

To the question who is faster... west coast guys. The east coast cant match the speed the guys west of the rockies have. East coast is tough as hell and is all "gnar this and that" but just lacks speed.

I know windam is hosting a WC and Ill fly there to watch, but look at the americans who are fast right now, Gwinn, Strobel, Strait, Riffle, all west coast.

As a generalization, I think west guys going east do better than east guys going west.
You don't think year round riding affects that? Just like BMX, the majority of fast riders would come from Florida and California because of riding year round.

You don't consider last years national champ fast?

I agree we lack fast mountains. We do have two race venues that compare to outwest speed..Mt. Snow and Whiteface.
 

freeridefool

Monkey
Jun 17, 2006
647
0
medford, or
You don't think year round riding affects that? Just like BMX, the majority of fast riders would come from Florida and California because of riding year round.

You don't consider last years national champ fast?

I agree we lack fast mountains. We do have two race venues that compare to outwest speed..Mt. Snow and Whiteface.
I never said that east coast wasnt fast. Just not west coast fast. And I dont know where you think there is all this year round downhill in the pnw. Even in southern oregon all the dh trails are covered in snow for the winter months. To ride dh year round you have to be in so cal. Granted the WC guys are from the south generally but thats talking about the top one percent of racers. Im not gunna e-argue, Im just stating what I have seen.
 

Summit

Monkey
Sep 23, 2001
369
0
here 'n there
How did you like the Utah trails? I'm a Bountiful local. Those trails are pretty fun. They're perfect in the fall and spring when it's raining.

Brian Head is a blast too. Just way too damn hard to breathe up there.

Hahahahah this thread is hilarious. All in good fun ribbing each other eh?

Lepp - I've actually lived in the western US (Western, not just 'West Coast'...ahem) for the better part of 16 years, from CA to CO to UT, so no surprises for me in terms of the trails back west. I love it. I love the trails, the views, actually going somewhere as opposed to trails in the forest doubling back on themselves every 20 feet like in the east...etc. I lived in Columbus OH - rode in PA, WV, all around OH, etc...for the past 3 years and just moved back to our old house in SLC this spring.

Bountiful is probably the ultimate example of being terrified by speed. I know a bunch of local UT pros who HATE that race b/c they always get hurt there...not b/c it's crazy tech but because you are maching at 45mph down an ATV track with loose babyheads everywhere. Sketchy! I've raced there the past two seasons, this season it sucked with the rain - the course was a river and I was blind b/c I forgot my fender and didn't bring the mud tires out to play. But that was just a learning experience...funny thing is it wasn't even raining at my house in SLC.

Brian Head rules - and yes it sucks trying to pedal and suck wind up there.
 
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