[amateur]

"I said, 'What is this about? I want your name and your badge number,'" Gates said.

"He wouldn't answer me and he just stood and stared at me. I said, 'Are you doing this because I am a black man in America? Are you doing this because you're a white police officer and I am a black man?'"

According to the police report, Crowley repeatedly tried to answer Gates, but was interrupted when Gates started yelling at him and making threats.

Did anyone else read this part? Seems as though he's admitting to antagonizing the officer. A PhD should have enough common sense to know that can't end well.

 

[ohio]

Seriously, have none of you ever waited tables? Uppity patrons are rude, inconsiderate, unreasonable, loud, disruptive, insulting, etc. You know what the waiter does? Apologizes and retreats (then jerks off in their sammich).

 

[ohio]

A PhD should have enough common sense to know that can't end well.

The subtlety that seems lost on you and many others is the difference between what IS and what SHOULD BE.

We all know it's a bad idea to be an asshole to cops, and it may end up in our arrest. However, it shouldn't end up with our arrest. The problem is that cops don't understand that and all of you are far too quick to give them the extra-legal leeway to keep making that mistake because "that's the way it is."

 

[trailhacker]

For a person that has never been a defender of the police I sure seem to keep coming to there defense lately...

A break-in was reported.

The cops came to investigate.

Cops found a person that fit the description of the person in the house.

Cops asked for his ID. Person imediately accused officer of racial profiling (by accounts from both the cops and Gates).

Gates refused to provide identification when asked to show he did in fact live there. Yes he EVENTUALLY did provide ID. But not until the officer asked to see it multiple times.
And I am a little fuzzy on this, but from what I understood he only supplied his Harvard ID at first and later his State ID (license?). Would the Harvard ID have had his address on it?

Gates says the cop followed him into the house uninvited when he went to get his ID. But at this point the cop still didn't know he was who he said he was??? Could you imagine if a cop let an unidentified person (suspect at this point) walk into the house, out of site (Gates says he closed the kitchen door) and then disappeared out the back door or worse, came out shooting!?!?!

From Gates own words, the officer left the house and and he followed him out onto the porch demanding to know his name and badge number.
Where he was arrested.
Nothing I have read has said that they were intending on arresting him had he not come out onto the porch. The impression I got from everything I read was the police were set to leave until Gates made a commotion on the porch.

Did Gates deserve to get arrested? I was not there but from what I have read (from legal and/or police commentators) is that he was with in his rights to do so. Maybe overkill for the situation but was legal to do.


The comments I see come up the most (here and in other forums/blogs):
How could his neighbor (who lived "down the street" - is that two house or ten houses?) have not recognized him, she had to be racist; I have lived in the same house for eight years. I couldn't pick the people on the corner out of a line-up. The only reason I might recognize the lady two doors down is she is disabled (and quite large) and asked me one day if I could grab her mail for her as I was getting our mail.

He was a well dressed older person; but how would the cops know he wasn't an ex-BF/husband breaking into a house to harm people. How would they know he wasn't some crazy dude off his meds?

He isn't required to show ID just because the police asked; maybe true. But the police are telling you they are investigating the report of a break-in at your house. All you have to do is show your ID to prove you live there and the episode would be over.

The charges were dropped because the cop was wrong; or maybe they just want this to go away. Could you imagine trying to charge a guy with something that has the implicit backign of the mayor and governor? And his friends are all lawyers??? People say OJ had the dream team...

Gates says he didn't like the way he was treated on the porch but how was he treated? He was asked, as a black person, to prove he did in fact live in the house that coincidently was reported to being broken into at that very moment???

BTW, if you have read Gates article on The Root (in which he is and editor or something) and can't see his attitude that lead to the "escalation" of this incident than I can't help you.

 

[sanjuro]

"I said, 'What is this about? I want your name and your badge number,'" Gates said.

"He wouldn't answer me and he just stood and stared at me. I said, 'Are you doing this because I am a black man in America? Are you doing this because you're a white police officer and I am a black man?'"

According to the police report, Crowley repeatedly tried to answer Gates, but was interrupted when Gates started yelling at him and making threats.

Did anyone else read this part? Seems as though he's admitting to antagonizing the officer. A PhD should have enough common sense to know that can't end well.

I think there are several aspects to this:

Ever come back from a long trip, like to China? All you want to do is get into your home, take off your shoes and shutdown for 12-16 hours.

Ever black friend (and I mean every black friend) has a story about police harassment. One friend mentioned he wished it was still the 70's because every time he gets pulled over in his suburb, the officer has to give him a ticket or it is a case of racial profiling.

On the other hand, a famous Harvard African-American studies professor might have a chip on his shoulder, particularly when it comes to police harassment.

I think both parties are at fault. I think you see someone prying a door open, yeah, I want the police to investigate, race be damned.

Could Gates been nicer? Sure. Could the officer establish it was Gates' house and been thicker skinned about being accused of racism? Yep.

Ultimately, a case like this is ridiculous. I think this is about hurt feelings than injustice, so the longer it goes on, the less of think of both parties.

 

[Sandwich]

I think there are several aspects to this:

Ever come back from a long trip, like to China? All you want to do is get into your home, take off your shoes and shutdown for 12-16 hours.

I'd just like to call absolute f.cking bullsh.t on this. Gates went around to the back door, opened it and went inside, tried to unlock the front but was unable, so he came around back to the front to break it open. Nobody who is exhausted after a 12 hour flight wants to deal with breaking down a damn door so they can get back into their house, which they are already able to enter. He could have called the maintenance crew, put it off, or just forgot about it, but he didn't.

 

[trailhacker]

PS; after having our house broken into somewhat recently (the insurance check for $14,000 didn't even come close to what we lost including my Mt. bike and my GF's road bike), in the middle of the day, I would be happy to know that my neighbors cared enough to call the cops.
And that they would actually come to investigate!?!

For once they seem to be doing their job. But this guys blows it WAY OUT of proportion.

Read Gates own article. If you can't see him being the problem that led to his own arrest than...

 

[sanjuro]

I read more about this case.

The officer, James Crowley, teaches a class at the Lowell Police Academy about racial profiling.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2009/07/23/national/a120303D17.DTL

This is from Gates' account on The Root: http://www.theroot.com/print/19236

I’m saying ‘You need to send someone to fix my lock.’ All of a sudden, there was a policeman on my porch. And I thought, ‘This is strange.’ So I went over to the front porch still holding the phone, and I said ‘Officer, can I help you?’ And he said, ‘Would you step outside onto the porch.’ And the way he said it, I knew he wasn’t canvassing for the police benevolent association. All the hairs stood up on the back of my neck, and I realized that I was in danger. And I said to him no, out of instinct. I said, ‘No, I will not.’

My lawyers later told me that that was a good move and had I walked out onto the porch he could have arrested me for breaking and entering. He said ‘I’m here to investigate a 911 call for breaking and entering into this house.’ And I said ‘That’s ridiculous because this happens to be my house. And I’m a Harvard professor.’ He says ‘Can you prove that you’re a Harvard professor?’ I said yes, I turned and closed the front door to the kitchen where I’d left my wallet, and I got out my Harvard ID and my Massachusetts driver’s license which includes my address and I handed them to him. And he’s sitting there looking at them.

Now it’s clear that he had a narrative in his head: A black man was inside someone’s house, probably a white person’s house, and this black man had broken and entered, and this black man was me.

So he’s looking at my ID, he asked me another question, which I refused to answer. And I said I want your name and your badge number because I want to file a complaint because of the way he had treated me at the front door. He didn’t say, ‘Excuse me, sir, is there a disturbance here, is this your house?’—he demanded that I step out on the porch, and I don’t think he would have done that if I was a white person.

But at that point, I realized that I was in danger. And so I said to him that I want your name, and I want your badge number and I said it repeatedly.

It sounds like Gates made all the assumptions...

 

[X3pilot]

He said ‘I’m here to investigate a 911 call for breaking and entering into this house.’ And I said ‘That’s ridiculous because this happens to be my house. And I’m a Harvard professor.’

He says ‘Can you prove that you’re a Harvard professor?’

I said no, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night. And he’s sitting there looking at me, ROFL.

Fixed...literally fixed. No arrest, no controversy..

 

[Sandwich]

+0, you must spread rep before giving it to dr. funnypants again.

 

[ohio]

Here's how the cop would asked the question if Gates were white:

"I'm sorry, sir, but because we were called out, I have to ask to see some ID to prove this is your home. I'm sure you understand."

That's all it would have taken, and that is how cops treat a white person in a sweater vest and blazer standing in their own entryway.

 

[dante]

Here's how the cop would asked the question if Gates were white:

"I'm sorry, sir, but because we were called out, I have to ask to see some ID to prove this is your home. There's a report of some darkies running around causing trouble, I'm sure you understand."

That's all it would have taken, and that is how cops treat a white person in a sweater vest and blazer standing in their own entryway.

fixed.

 

[trailhacker]

Here's how the cop would asked the question if Gates were white:

"I'm sorry, sir, but because we were called out, I have to ask to see some ID to prove this is your home. I'm sure you understand."

That's all it would have taken, and that is how cops treat a white person in a sweater vest and blazer standing in their own entryway.

No, I don't think so.
You try and be belligerent with a cop that is asking you simple requests and see how "good day sir, if it's not to much inconvienience, can I please see some ID" he is.

Gates was being belligerent (read his own version of events!) and brought this all upon himself.

 

[trailhacker]

From the smoking gun, supposedly a copy of the report filed by the cop.
Even if this is only 75% accurate Gates is a class A a$$h0le.

 

[ohio]

And the distinction between "is" and "should be" goes flying over trailhacker's head as well.

 

[dante]

^^^^^ Last I heard you couldn't be arrested just for being an asshole, either...

 

[Silver]

^^^^^ Last I heard you couldn't be arrested just for being an asshole, either...

Fortunately, in America we have a professional police force that respects the constitution at all times...

 

[Westy]

Isn't it rather telling that the charges were dropped?

 

[Sandwich]

Only thing that tells me is that somebody else doesn't want Al Sharpton and the "hey me too" parade in town.

 

[trailhacker]

And the distinction between "is" and "should be" goes flying over trailhacker's head as well.

It must have because I am not getting your point?

^^^^^ Last I heard you couldn't be arrested just for being an asshole, either...

Which is cool because he wasn't arrested for that. Which isn't to say he isn't a farging icehole.
He was arrested for disorderly conduct (or whatever the charge was) after being warned not once, not twice, but three times he was going to be arrested if he didn't calm down. He just couldn't let it go.

Isn't it rather telling that the charges were dropped?

If by telling you mean the pressure that was put on the prosecutor to drop the charges by a governor that came out and backed the "victim" or by the mayor that came out and not only backed him but apologized for the behavior of the police department before all the facts came to light? Or maybe they know something that hasn't been published which makes all this moot?


I am certainly no defender of the police. I watched and had to testify in court after watching three cops beat up a guy across the street from my house when I was 13. All because they asked for his registration and he kept saying "tell me why you pulled me over". The guy certainly didn't deserve to be "searched for weapons" with a night-stick to the crotch (what the officer that jammed said club numerous times into his crotch testified in court). But I guess my testimony helped because they dropped the resisting arrest but still charged him with destruction of property for denting the hood of the cop car when they slammed him into it.
But if the guy would have just given the cop his registration it might not have happened?

Was arresting Gates a bit over the top? I would say so.
But that doesn't change the fact that all this could have been avoided if he wouldn't have copped an attitude and just shown the cop his ID when he asked for it.
Or letting it go and not following the cop out into his front yard, as they were leaving, and continuing to make an issue of it?

 

[SDH]

Here's how the cop would asked the question if Gates were white:

"I'm sorry, sir, but because we were called out, I have to ask to see some ID to prove this is your home. I'm sure you understand."

That's all it would have taken, and that is how cops treat a white person in a sweater vest and blazer standing in their own entryway.

This whole deal reminds me of story years ago in Queens, NYC. I left my keys in the car and was doing the hanger thing to get the door open with a buddy of mine. Cops pull up. Knowing I am doing nothing wrong, I do not really worry too much plus I know most NYPD have slim jims in the car. Cops get out split me and my buddy apart one to the front of the car one to the rear of the car and ask us questions. Drawing on the education my father gave me which is "DON"T BE A D1CK TO A COP HE IS ONLY DOING HIS JOB" Yeah, the cop started out very accusatory but I answered his questions calmly, gave him what wanted ensured I posed no threat and at the end of it his partner ended up opening up my car and me thanking them so I did not have to go to a lock smith and spend 100 bucks.

Being D1ck b/c I was in the right would have made things much more complicated..........

 

[dante]

Which is cool because he wasn't arrested for that. Which isn't to say he isn't a farging icehole.
He was arrested for disorderly conduct (or whatever the charge was) after being warned not once, not twice, but three times he was going to be arrested if he didn't calm down. He just couldn't let it go.

Not saying this wasn't already gone through, but it was...

So I'll ask again: "what part about Gates' actions or words were "violent or sexually obscene"?" Disorderly Conduct is used WAY too often as a catch-all for not being appropriately submissive to a cop.

 

[Sandwich]

What states that disorderly conduct must be violent or sexually obscene?

 

[dante]

What states that disorderly conduct must be violent or sexually obscene?

The US Supreme Court has determined that the freedom of speech does not cover Violent or Sexually Obscene speech:

http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Protected+speech

Laws that limit inciting or provocative speech, often called fighting words, or offensive expressions such as Pornography, are subject to Strict Scrutiny.

For MA's specific statute, here's a link to a law firm:

Massachusetts appellate courts have held that acts or language that implicate fighting or threatening, or behavior that is riotous or violent, or behavior that creates a hazardous or offensive condition for no legitimate purpose can satisfy the elements of the disorderly person statute.

Using vulgar or profane words alone or offensive speech does not amount to disorderly conduct. Nor does the use of obscenities in public places suffice for a conviction under this statute.

And some more light reading on the right to free speech, along with some very applicable court cases:
http://www.fac.org/news.aspx?id=21071

In later decisions — Gooding v. Wilson (1972) and Lewis v. New Orleans (1974) — the Court invalidated convictions of individuals who cursed police officers, finding that the ordinances in question were unconstitutionally overbroad.

From the Lewis v. New Orleans US Supreme Court decision:

On remand from this Court for reconsideration in light of Gooding v. Wilson, 405 U. S. 518, appellant's conviction of violating a New Orleans ordinance making it unlawful "to curse or revile or to use obscene or opprobrious language toward or with reference to" a police officer while in performance of his duties was again sustained by the Louisiana Supreme Court, which did not narrow or refine the words of the ordinance, although stating that it was limited to "fighting words" uttered to specific persons at a specific time.

Held: The ordinance, as thus construed, is susceptible of application to protected speech, and therefore is overbroad in violation of the First and Fourteenth Amendments and facially invalid. The ordinance plainly has a broader sweep than the constitutional definition of "fighting words" as being words "which, by their very utterance inflict injury or tend to incite an immediate breach of the peace."

How's that?

Edit: Maybe if they actually had police officers go through a preliminary law course for a semester on what is and what is not illegal (and the various court cases which decided that) there might be fewer of these incidents? Manimal, if you're reading this post and staying quiet (which if so I don't blame you), is there anything in the training which goes through the exact nuances in the law such as this? I noticed that the arrest sheet noted that 7 passersby had stopped and noticed the commotion, since I found a case last night that stated that disturbances against the general populace were a lot different than disturbances against the police; in the case, it was a guy on his own property in the middle of the woods screaming and yelling, and the only other people there were police officers. It was found that since the only people there were the cops, he wasn't inciting or disturbing the populace (ie, the police officers didn't count). So I'm wondering exactly how much legal training these cops have, as I wouldn't expect them to be lawyers, but I'd hope that they have some official guidelines as to what is specifically legal and what isn't. Or is it just "arrest them if you have any doubt and we'll drop the charges later if it wasn't actually illegal?"

 

[Sandwich]

behavior that creates a hazardous or offensive condition for no legitimate purpose can satisfy the elements of the disorderly person statute.

Huh. Interesting. Sadly, this isn't a case of free speech but of disorderly conduct, which is unfortunately very vague. I'm anxious to see what happens as the witnesses come forward and the tapes are released.

 

[sanjuro]

I might as well expect Il-Jong Kim to come over for dinner at Lisa Ling's house, but I hope the police and Gates can work it out.

Both are being impossible. Gates was being a douche and the cop arrested him because he can.

But if they work it out, maybe police relations can improve that much.

 

[dante]

Huh. Interesting. Sadly, this isn't a case of free speech but of disorderly conduct, which is unfortunately very vague. I'm anxious to see what happens as the witnesses come forward and the tapes are released.

True, but if the court finds that the Disorderly Conduct charge violates the Free Speech clause in the 1st Amendment, the law can either be narrowed down (specify exactly what should and should not be covered) or thrown out. In the Gooding v. Wilson case of 1972, the Georgian statute read:

"any person who shall, without provocation, use to or of another, and in his presence . . . opprobrious words or abusive language, tending to cause a breach of the peace . . . shall be guilty of a misdemeanor,"

In particular, the accused in the Gooding case said the following to a police officer:

"White son of a bitch, I'll kill you." "You son of a bitch, I'll choke you to death."' Count 4 alleged that the defendant 'did without provocation use to and of T. L. Raborn and in his presence, the following abusive language and opprobrious words, tending to cause a breach of the peace: "You son of a bitch, if you ever put your hands on me again, I'll cut you all to pieces.'"

The court found that fighting words only constituted:

"No words were forbidden except such as have a direct tendency to cause acts of violence by the person to whom, individually, the remark is addressed. . . . * * *
"The test is what men of common intelligence would understand would be words likely to cause an average addressee to fight. . . . Derisive and annoying words can be taken as coming within the purview of the statute . . . only when they have this characteristic of plainly tending to excite the addressee to a breach of the peace. . . .

"The statute, as construed, does no more than prohibit the face-to-face words plainly likely to cause a breach of the peace by the addressee. . . ."

So since the Georgian law was overly broad and encroached upon rights guaranteed by the 1st Amendment, the law was ruled unconstitutional.

What gets me is that so much has been spoken (and argued) about the attitude of the police officer and Gates, but no one is actually debating the statute and conditions under which he was arrested. I guess that's left up to us scholars here on RM to do?

 

[Sandwich]

I'm hardly a scholar when it comes to law, so please excuse my ignorance. I'm still under the impression that "Tumultuous and Disorderly conduct" is a catch all that includes being loud and obnoxious, knowing that you're doing so, and continuing to do so despite being asked to stop. I'm sure white and black people have been arrested for less.

The core issue here goes back to race, and I think you'd be hard pressed to find that any profiling or racism occurred. Seems like one guy was being a jerk, and the other guy found a way to arrest him for it. The only profiling that occurred may have been from the lady that called it in, but regardless of the color of one's skin, a possible break-in is a possible break in, and should be investigated.

 

[BikeMike]

I don't understand how people can be so decisive in passing judgment on the motivations of the officer. None of us really know jack about the details of the situation. When in doubt...play the race card? Shoot, I must be falling behind the times (or lead an incredibly sheltered life).

If Dr. Gates thinks being a minority in America is a hard lot, he ought to be darn glad he's not of Aboriginal descent and in Australia. You want to talk about jaw-dropping, mind-boggling, ubiquitous stereotyping and racism...a large part of society here considers people of Aboriginal descent to be somewhat sub-human. Seriously, WTF?

 

[Sandwich]

Seriously. I follow a friggin' orsm australian humor website and they sh.t on aboriginals all the time...it genuinely strikes me as accepted and the norm.

 

[trailhacker]

So I'll ask again: "what part about Gates' actions or words were "violent or sexually obscene"?" Disorderly Conduct is used WAY too often as a catch-all for not being appropriately submissive to a cop.

Quote:For MA's specific statute, here's a link to a law firm:


Massachusetts appellate courts have held that acts or language that implicate fighting or threatening, or behavior that is riotous or violent, or behavior that creates a hazardous or offensive condition for no legitimate purpose can satisfy the elements of the disorderly person statute.

Using vulgar or profane words alone or offensive speech does not amount to disorderly conduct. Nor does the use of obscenities in public places suffice for a conviction under this statute.

I don't claim to be a lawyer and have never claimed to be the sharpest tool in the shed, but doesn't that back the cop?

Did Gates not threaten the cop:

"Gates then turned to me and told me I had no idea who I was "messing" with and that I had not heard the last of it."

"...and leveling threats that he wasn't someone to mess with."

I find this telling:

"...I radioed my findings to ECC on channel two and prepared to leave."

This was after Gates had finally produced his Harvard ID (which I am still curious if it contained an address showing it to be his residence?) and before the cop retreated outside to the front yard.

"I told Gates I was leaving his residence and that if he had any other questions regading this matter, I would speak with him outside his residence."

Cops entice him out onto his porch, ...

Is this the enticing you were referring to?

Do cops lie on reports sometimes? Undoubtedly
Did the cop pick and choose the words he used on his report for maximum effect? Absolutely

Could this have been avoided if he would have provided his ID when asked? Yep
Would this have been over had he just let the officer leave? Yep, yep.
Does Gates have anyone to blame for this but himself? Nope

All the hairs stood up on the back of my neck, and I realized that I was in danger.

And yet, when the danger was leaving he followed supposed "danger" out into the front yard and antagonized it? Hell, he antogonized it from almost the first words out of his mouth???

My lawyers later told me that that was a good move and had I walked out onto the porch he could have arrested me for breaking and entering.

Again, not a lawyer, but if he provided his ID establishing his residence, how could he have been arrested. Unless of course he was beligerent and displaying disorderly conduct...

 

[dante]

I don't claim to be a lawyer and have never claimed to be the sharpest tool in the shed, but doesn't that back the cop?

Did Gates not threaten the cop:

Dunno, I'm not a lawyer either. Since threaten is in relation to the "fighting words" that are not protected free speech, I'd assume that there'd have to be a violent portion of that threat for it to be considered unprotected by the 1st amendment.

And yes, Gates could have ended this whole mess without incident by being submissive, contrite and respectful, but that shouldn't have been necessary to avoid going to jail. The cop could have ended this whole mess as well by being more submissive, contrite and respectful, realized he was the *cause* of the emotional outburst by Gates and just left after he confirmed that that *was* Gate's house and that there wasn't a burglary. My whole point is that the courts have ruled that you *can* be disrespectful to a cop, that you don't have to be meek and submissive, and the cop can't use that to haul you off to jail.

 

[BurlyShirley]

How come when cops tazed grannie it wasn't because she was white?

 

[Secret Squirrel]

How come when cops tazed grannie it wasn't because she was white?

Because there's something perversely satisfying about shocking the f*ck out of a geriatric.

 

[manimal]

Geeze guys, a little knee jerk reaction here eh? I know this story has taken off throughout the country, but unfortunately I think you are missing out on alot of info that has been neglected for the sake of selling newspapers.

You guys do realize that Gate's refused to step outside of his house? You do realize that there was a second person (his livery driver) that was trying to enter through the rear of the house, that he told the officer that he'll come outside when "his momma does", that he was yelling at the cop (according to witnesses and even through photo) for his badge number as the cop was going to leave, that this cop has attended 3 racial profiling/sensitivity seminars for training? As far as I can tell this, guy was being a pompous ass who could have easily averted all of this had he just stepped outside and answered the cops questions and explained what was going on.

Could the cop had handled this differently? Maybe, but understand that he has to look out for himself, and if he is going to a scene where there may possibly be a break-in, I would expect him to be thorough in trying to figure out what is going on. Obviously Gates took exception to this and so far has been the only person to drag out the "race card" He was behaving in manner that required the officer to tell Gates that he had "Three strikes" because he was being disorderly. Gates pushed the officer's buttons to that point where he reached "three strikes", and the officer got put in a bad situation where he needed to do something. Unfortunately for the officer, that decision may be really hurt his career.

This is one of the instances where I'm going to tend to lean in favor of the officer.

at least we have a prez who understands the facts of the case before he makes a blanket statement about LEO's (and money grubbing doctors to boot)

http://www.examiner.com/x-17827-Anne-Arundel-County-Conservative-Examiner~y2009m7d24-Obama-maligns-doctors-and-police-officers-instead-of-explaining-health-care

After acknowledging that he was unaware of the facts in the case, the president could not resist the temptation to make a judgment based on assumptions and stereotypes. He not only berated Cambridge police officers for acting "stupidly" but suggested that this one incident was somehow part of a pattern of racial profiling. Although the president said the arrest of Gates is separate and apart from a "long history in this country of African Americans and Latinos being stopped by law enforcement disproportionately," he continued to assert that what happened in Cambridge is merely a symptom of a larger problem. Again, no one denies that racism exists in this country or that racial profiling does not occur, but to incite racial tensions by characterizing white police officers as inherently racist is reprehensible.

 

[trailhacker]

at least we have a prez who understands the facts of the case before he makes a blanket statement about LEO's (and money grubbing doctors to boot)

http://www.examiner.com/x-17827-Anne-Arundel-County-Conservative-Examiner~y2009m7d24-Obama-maligns-doctors-and-police-officers-instead-of-explaining-health-care

You did see that this morning he back-pedaled and called and talked to the officer right?
But yeah, it did kind of suck that he said what he said. I would think that as a "diplomat" he would have taken a more diplomatic stance?

 

[BurlyShirley]

Good work Manimal. You've managed to cite an opinion piece as a source, and highlight a non-quote from it as evidence Obama is a .... what is it this week? Socialist? Terrorist? Communist? Kenyan?

 

[sanjuro]

at least we have a prez who understands the facts of the case before he makes a blanket statement about LEO's (and money grubbing doctors to boot)

http://www.examiner.com/x-17827-Anne-Arundel-County-Conservative-Examiner~y2009m7d24-Obama-maligns-doctors-and-police-officers-instead-of-explaining-health-care

Is that why he talked with the officer today?

 

[manimal]

Good work Manimal. You've managed to cite an opinion piece as a source, and highlight a non-quote from it as evidence Obama is a .... what is it this week? Socialist? Terrorist? Communist? Kenyan?

here...is this better mr. 4341? says the same thing but from a source your professors might prefer

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/32092715/ns/us_news-race_and_ethnicity/

“I support the president of the United States 110 percent. I think he was way off base wading into a local issue without knowing all the facts as he himself stated before he made that comment

NATICK, Mass. - The Cambridge police commissioner said Thursday that his department is "deeply pained" by President Barack Obama's statement that his officers "acted stupidly" when they arrested a renowned black scholar in his home.

Crowley responded to Gates’ home near Harvard University last week to investigate a report of a burglary and demanded Gates show him identification. Police say Gates at first refused, flew into a rage and accused the officer of racism.

how dare the officer demand ID when he's investigating a possible FELONY. i have personally answered burglary calls where someone inside claims to be the resident only to be proven otherwise after an ID check. Gates should be glad that the officers were being so thorough in their job and understand that anyone breaking into his house would receive the same demands for ID.

so there, now you have an "opinion of fact" from both sides of the fence that say exactly the same thing.
he flew off the handle with an uncalled for comment and admitted that he didn't have all the facts.

and when is Toshi going to chime in about the comments he made that doctors choose procedures for patients based on how much profit they can make and not on the patients best interest? i know that my brother is pretty livid about being painted with that brush.

 

[dante]

Good work Manimal. You've managed to cite an opinion piece as a source, and highlight a non-quote from it as evidence Obama is a .... what is it this week? Socialist? Terrorist? Communist? Kenyan?

Oh c'mon, is this the face of someone who would lie or be blatantly partisan?