[jonKranked]

http://mediamatters.org/blog/200909290042

Conservative groups are now advocating a military coup. Does this constitute treason? Or do they have to actually say "we are going to have a coup"?

 

[Silver]

Actually, I think that is sedition and not treason.

And wait, a coup is Constitutional now?

I've said it before: Death camps.

 

[Westy]

I'm still trying to find out what it is about Obama that these idiots think is so radical?

 

[jonKranked]

I'm still trying to find out what it is about Obama that these idiots think is so radical?

(he's black)

 

[Andyman_1970]

He not the same color as us white's down her in the souf.

 

[stevew]

free speech....pesky thing.

 

[jimmydean]

Wow, some people are seriously crazy.

 

[jonKranked]

free speech....pesky thing.

I had a discussion about this the other day, in regards to things that free speech doesn't cover. I stumbled across this:

http://www.fas.org/irp/crs/95-815.pdf

Things NOT covered by the 1st amendment:

-obscene speech (the use of vulgar words is not banned)
-child pornography
-defamation (libel and slander)
-speech harmful to children


It doesn't mention sedition/treason specifically, but I found some info on it here:

http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/United_States_Statutes_at_Large/Volume_1/5th_Congress/2nd_Session/Chapter_74

So my question still stands, at what point does it cross the line from free speech to seditious or treasonous speech?

 

[jimmydean]

If you make a direct threat to the President, it is no longer free speech. Example: "I will kill the President" = jailhouse beatdown.

 

[stevew]

So my question still stands, at what point does it cross the line from free speech to seditious or treasonous speech?

does the movie that fantasized about the assassination of gwb fall into this territory for you?

 

[jonKranked]

does the movie that fantasized about the assassination of gwb fall into this territory for you?

what movie?

 

[stevew]

what movie?

Death of a President (2006)

 

[jonKranked]

Death of a President (2006)

First I've heard of it, but a quick googlar indicates that it is British made, and US laws therefore are not applicable.

 

[stevew]

First I've heard of it, but a quick googlar indicates that it is British made, and US laws therefore are not applicable.

didn't know it was british.....

 

[MikeD]

He not the same color as us white's down her in the souf.

I think you mean "the same color as blonde Jesus."

 

[MikeD]

So my question still stands, at what point does it cross the line from free speech to seditious or treasonous speech?

There's also the question of "at what point do you let people say what they want, since prosecuting them for saying it is likely to exacerbate a situation and draw them attention and sympathy?"

It'd be funny to see the ACLU defending them, though.

 

[jonKranked]

I think you mean "the same color as blonde Jesus."

come on Mike, we all know...

 

[jonKranked]

There's also the question of "at what point do you let people say what they want, since prosecuting them for saying it is likely to exacerbate a situation and draw them attention and sympathy?"

It'd be funny to see the ACLU defending them, though.

US media is already giving them the attention they want. Which in turn is generating more support by exposing them to other like minded individuals, subsequently strengthening them (if you want to call it that).

At some point, someone, somewhere, will cross the line out of free speech territory. Who will be there to hold them accountable (and prosecute them)?

 

[Silver]

Is seditious speech actually illegal? I don't think it is.

Having said that, this is definitely seditious speech, no matter that the author says it isn't. Just like saying, "I'm not a racist, but I don't believe that a nigra should be president."

Wow, just went over to check out the whole Newsmax site. Again, I must reiterate the need for death camps. We cannot build those things fast enough.

 

[jonKranked]

Is seditious speech actually illegal? I don't think it is.

I'm leaning towards yes: The Smith Act.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sedition#United_States

and

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smith_Act

The Alien Registration Act or Smith Act (18 U.S.C. § 2385) of 1940 is a United States federal statute that makes it a criminal offense for anyone to
“knowingly or willfully advocate, abet, advise or teach the duty, necessity, desirability or propriety of overthrowing the Government of the United States or of any State by force or violence, or for anyone to organize any association which teaches, advises or encourages such an overthrow, or for anyone to become a member of or to affiliate with any such association.

It's only been used a few times since it went into law, and a number of these rulings were thrown out by the Supreme Court, but its still part of Federal Law.

 

[jimmydean]

Is seditious speech actually illegal? I don't think it is.

Having said that, this is definitely seditious speech, no matter that the author says it isn't. Just like saying, "I'm not a racist, but I don't believe that a nigra should be president."

Is that like prefixing a statement with "no disrespect, but"? That clears me, right?

 

[jonKranked]

Is that like prefixing a statement with "no disrespect, but"? That clears me, right?

you mean like this?

 

[Silver]

It's only been used a few times since it went into law, and a number of these rulings were thrown out by the Supreme Court, but its still part of Federal Law.

Part of the law and constitutional are different.

I meant the second and not the first, I should have defined my term better, sorry.

You know who's going to get in trouble with this? Some stupid ass soldier is going to read this, get all excited, and start sending it off to his military friends.

 

[jonKranked]

Part of the law and constitutional are different.

I meant the second and not the first, I should have defined my term better, sorry.

huh?

If you meant to be asking if seditious speech is unconstitutional, then I would lean towards saying no. But it IS illegal (under federal law) and you can be legally prosecuted for it, and punished if found guilty.

 

[Silver]

huh?

If you meant to be asking if seditious speech is unconstitutional, then I would lean towards saying no. But it IS illegal (under federal law) and you can be legally prosecuted for it, and punished if found guilty.

Yeah, I know. I said illegal, and I meant unconstitutional. My fault, not yours.

 

[jonKranked]

Yeah, I know. I said illegal, and I meant unconstitutional. My fault, not yours.

No worries.

The point is there are still legal consequences for seditious speech.

 

[rockofullr]

I hope it goes down like XXX: State of the Union. I'm gonna be so stoked when Ice Cube saves us all!!!

 

[JohnE]

http://mediamatters.org/blog/200909290042

Conservative groups are now advocating a military coup. Does this constitute treason? Or do they have to actually say "we are going to have a coup"?

As a military member, I have heard nothing about this. But I did take Monday off to ride. I better check my email...it has gotten pretty bad in this country lately. And by lately, I mean in the past 8 years...

 

[jonKranked]

As a military member, I have heard nothing about this. But I did take Monday off to ride. I better check my email...it has gotten pretty bad in this country lately. And by lately, I mean in the past 8 years...

Well don't go getting any crazy ideas alright?

But I agree. Things are getting nutso. Both ends of the political spectrum are starting to get weird.

And when the going gets weird, the weird go to New Jersey.

 

[jimmydean]

It's sort of like getting mad about being hung over when you should be mad about the copious amounts of alcohol you consumed the night before. Everybody (on the right at least) remembers the party we had for 8 years when everything was rainbows and free blowjobs. But now the tab has been brought to the table and people are saying "Who the f@ck drank all this?"

 

[MikeD]

In any case, lots of protective intelligence agents going to be hard at work nationwide. Or at least in the middle and southeast of the country.

 

[chicodude]

Seriously, WHERE THE **** have these people been for the last 8 years?

I don't really like obama that much (He is still a politician after all) But COME ON, He didn't rape and pilage the consitution/environment like good ol' bushy.


These people are so delusional it scares me.


They took the oringinal aritcle down too.

 

[Pesqueeb]

I first noticed this kind of talk in the comments section of an article that Dante posted about the economy. While I'm of the opinion that the sedition/treason talk is a matter of semantics there is no doubt either way, some way scary talk is happening out there. I live in a town thats only reason to exist is to serve the military, and as right leaning as it is here I have yet to hear this 'coup' talk. I really think that this sort of rhetoric is fringe loony talk. Which is why its so dangerous, were talking about people that have seriously gone round the bend and are probably capable of anything.

We have a President whose political background is Socialistic and neo Communistic. His character is such that even in the face of failure he is determined to push his agenda - at any cost and will continue to do so. We have no real alternatives in the Republican or Independent parties maybe except for Joe Wilson and his "liar" accusation to the President.
We are inolved in a losing war of attrition in Afghanistan with no end in sight and according to this article our position in the world and our economic strength are both waning, while our rivals' powers are gaining.
In the face of this a direct military take over seems the best alternative. This would allow the Generals to conduct the war in Afghanistan in a manner that is favorable to us. It will put a military face in our foreing affairs and change the paradigm of a "meek America" that is jeered and should be feared. It will finally deal with our insecure borders in a common sense manner and cut nepotism within our rank and file politicians. Remember our first President George Washington was a General before he became a President.

 

[MikeD]

Yeah, nepotism. It's been SO on the rise since the new administration. Where's Brownie when you need him? (Samoa, perhaps?)

 

[jonKranked]

Yeah, nepotism. It's been SO on the rise since the new administration. Where's Brownie when you need him? (Samoa, perhaps?)

I find myself wondering if these people even understand the meanings of some of the words they use.

 

[jonKranked]

They took the oringinal aritcle down too.

Saw this:

http://tpmlivewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/09/newsmax-columnist-military-coup-may-be-needed-to-resolve-the-obama-problem.php

In regards to it.

 

[JohnE]

...for 8 years when everything was rainbows and free blowjobs.

Dangit! Thats what I get for being overseas...you miss the damnedest things...

 

[JohnE]

I had a brief talk with a kid last night regarding this same thing. He actually seemed to think it was a possibility. I just cant see it...what General would lead it? From what base? Logistical support? Troops?
Although, it would certainly make for some upward mobility within the ranks if a coup attempt occued...but I really cant see it happening. Maybe I am over simplifying it, but I dont want to end up standing up against a wall in front of a firing squad. I like my benefits, and am enjoying the thought of my impending retirement...so I dont see it happening.

 

[BurlyShirley]

I had a brief talk with a kid last night regarding this same thing. He actually seemed to think it was a possibility. I just cant see it...what General would lead it? From what base? Logistical support? Troops?
Although, it would certainly make for some upward mobility within the ranks if a coup attempt occued...but I really cant see it happening. Maybe I am over simplifying it, but I dont want to end up standing up against a wall in front of a firing squad. I like my benefits, and am enjoying the thought of my impending retirement...so I dont see it happening.

I've often wondered about what it might be like to still be on active duty with Obama now in office.
Are there people who actually like the guy, or is it a Bachman-Palin Overdrive?

 

[Secret Squirrel]

Bachman-Palin Overdrive?

Ba-dum-tsssss....


booooo...