[Emission]

Newbie to the board, not to biking!

OK, I am brand-new to "modern" mountain biking after taking the last decade off to start a family. Now, I need your advice. I’ve been searching the forums, but I can’t seem to get the answer to this one…and I’ve searched the Internet for weeks turning up nothing that sways me one way or the other.

I want to buy a new mountain bike in the $2,500 price range - and today's technology has me stumped (my price is based on the concept I will have this bike another decade, like my last one).

To help you help me, here is some background.

My current bike is about 13-years-old. It is a "ParkPre" (Chro-moly) hardtail with a "Mach 5" front shock - old school - XT components (Rapidfire, I think they call them). Great bike when I was in my 20’s, but a harsh ride (and technically dated) these days for my now 38-year-old body.

My riding style:

I ride on fire roads, single-track, and trails in Southern California. No real downhill. No pavenment. I like climbing. I am not hard on my bike (no jumping off anything taller than 24"). I am 6’2” and weigh 195 lbs.

Where I am at:

My local bike store is suggesting the Gary Fisher Cake 2 DLX. Retail price is $2,149. It’s nice, but I’d like all XT components (I broke all my STX and LX parts on my last bike) so I’d ask him for an upgrade (front derailleur and shifters) before I purchase. The Gary Fisher Cake 1 is all XT, yet it has less suspension travel (I have no idea why).

Is the Gary Fisher Cake a good bike? What about Cannondale? What else should I be looking at in that price range?

I understand asking about bikes is like asking about shoes - everyone has a personal preference. I still would appreciate some suggestions.

Thanks in advance, really.

 

[Wumpus]

You need to go more bike shops and ride as many bikes as you can.

Specialized Enduro, Jamis Dakar or XLT, Kona, Giant, IronHorse MKIII

Just a little above your price range -- Yeti 575 w/enduro build kit would be my choice. --> http://www.jensonusa.com/store/product/BI503B00-Yeti+575+Enduro+Complete+Bike+2006.aspx



I wouldn't worry about a front deraileur. The rear is the one that matters some. You probably won't be able to tell any difference between LX(deore) and XT.

 

[Wumpus]

You'll get more responses if you post your question here. --> http://www.ridemonkey.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=78

What you really need to decide is whether you want a Hardtail, a 3 to 4" Full suspension -- more of a XCish bike, or something in the 5 to 6" travel range -- what are now being referred to as all mountain rigs.

 

[slein]

I agree. Try as many bikes in your price range and go for the one that feels the best.

Don't worry about breaking components - they wear out anyway or break by "just riding along..." If something breaks, then it is the perfect opportunity to upgrade that part to make it feel like a new bike - considering you want to keep it for the rest of your days...

I wouldn't feel comfortable recommending a brand to you though. I always go full custom, because I'm stupid

 

[maxyedor]

Yeti 575 for sure, but buy it from Adrenaline Bikes they are Yeti's biggest dealer and will be able to cut you a better deal then Jenson. Ask for Gabe, and tell him Max Yedor sent him, also tell him that the 1973 Lincoln Continental is the greatest car ever built, you'll get a deal for sure.

 

[Matt H]

Take the Giant Trance for a test ride and see if you like it. I ride a Giant Reign, it's beefier than what you want but the fundamental suspension and frame design is the same as the Trance, and it has been a great bike so far.

Cannondale Prophet is another one to take a good look at.

 

[Emission]

OK, I have now ridden the Gary Fisher Cake 2 DLX, Specialized Stumpjumper FSR Expert, Cannondale Prophet 1000, and a Giant (something or other). I have looked at countless others (Kona, etc...).

For the retail price ($2149 before discount), the Gary Fisher is still my favorite. The Yeti ASR-575 is listed at $2529 (plus, plus), and I won't have local dealer support.

If I buy the Gary Fisher with cash, I can knock some $$$ off the price, and have plenty left for upgrades over the summer... My local dealer is pretty cool and helpful.

Oh, the Giant isn't bad, but since it is made overseas, it should be 1/2 price with the same components as the others (I manufacture products in China for a living - I should know). I can't pay full American labor prices for Chinese labor - it's not right. No offense intended, of course.

 

[bjanga]

Thought about a hardtail any?

 

[GotMyGED]

I've got some advice for you as an Gary Fisher salesperson. The Cake bikes are great bang for the buck as far as component specs go. However, they have some design flaws. They have major issues with chain suck, and the nuts and bolts on the swingarm/rear shock seem to have problems with coming loose during rides.

Gary Fisher bikes, in my opinion, offer some great deals. If you like the line of bikes, you should try the Sugar 292/293 models.

After reading where you like to ride, i would also suggest considering a hardtail. The efficiency will be better than any full suspension, and far less expensive. You could get an extremely sweet hartail for 2500 dollars. You may even consider a Titanium hard tail with an LX build.

 

[Emission]

I've got some advice for you as an Gary Fisher salesperson. The Cake bikes are great bang for the buck as far as component specs go. However, they have some design flaws. They have major issues with chain suck, and the nuts and bolts on the swingarm/rear shock seem to have problems with coming loose during rides.

Gary Fisher bikes, in my opinion, offer some great deals. If you like the line of bikes, you should try the Sugar 292/293 models.

After reading where you like to ride, i would also suggest considering a hardtail. The efficiency will be better than any full suspension, and far less expensive. You could get an extremely sweet hartail for 2500 dollars. You may even consider a Titanium hard tail with an LX build.

Interesting point - you aren't the first person to mention that. You are planting doubt in my mind...

I already have an older hard tail, so I never really considered one. What is a good hard tail for that money?

 

[GotMyGED]

Interesting point - you aren't the first person to mention that. You are planting doubt in my mind...

I already have an older hard tail, so I never really considered one. What is a good hard tail for that money?

As for other full suspension bikes, I reccomend trying the following:
Gary Fisher SuperCaliber $2300
Gary Fisher Sugar 29" Bikes $2000-$2900
Rocky Mountain Element Series $2300 and up

I am sure there are many other great full suspension bikes, these are the ones i have ridden and been very impressed with. Also note that i have not included anything with more than 4 or 5 inches of travel due to the fact that you will probably not enjoy climbing with a longer travel bike.

As for hardtails:
Titanium will provide a great ride quality and will last forever if cared for, but look to spend at least $2300 for an xt/lx build. You may want to look at Litespeed in order to stay within your budget.
Everyone makes a reliable aluminum hardtail with a great spec for $2000-$2500.

 

[Emission]

Titanium will provide a great ride quality and will last forever if cared for, but look to spend at least $2300 for an xt/lx build. You may want to look at Litespeed in order to stay within your budget.
Everyone makes a reliable aluminum hardtail with a great spec for $2000-$2500.

Back to the Gary Fisher chain suck issue... is this a problem with the new external bottom brackets? My local bike shop guru said this eliminated it. He also says the problem is mud/gunk related - not an issue in sunny/dusty So Ca... Comments?

 

[noname]

OK, I have now ridden the Gary Fisher Cake 2 DLX, Specialized Stumpjumper FSR Expert, Cannondale Prophet 1000, and a Giant (something or other). I have looked at countless others (Kona, etc...).

For the retail price ($2149 before discount), the Gary Fisher is still my favorite. The Yeti ASR-575 is listed at $2529 (plus, plus), and I won't have local dealer support.

If I buy the Gary Fisher with cash, I can knock some $$$ off the price, and have plenty left for upgrades over the summer... My local dealer is pretty cool and helpful.

Oh, the Giant isn't bad, but since it is made overseas, it should be 1/2 price with the same components as the others (I manufacture products in China for a living - I should know). I can't pay full American labor prices for Chinese labor - it's not right. No offense intended, of course.

Last year I found myself in the same spot, trying to get back into the sport after 8 years off the bike. My last rig was a 97 fat chance yo eddie. I thought I would want another hardtail like that but after riding the Fisher Sugar 293 for a weekend I was hooked. The Sram components are spot on, on par or better than the XTR of my last bike, and the 29 in wheels allow me to run my suspension rates much higher for better efficiency and still have a very compliant ride.
I still have an old 26in hardtail that has been relegated to commuter/urban status and I don't think I'll ever put it back on the trail, the fisher rides that nice. I've never had any problems with anything breaking (other than the top tube, but that was my fault).

 

[GotMyGED]

Back to the Gary Fisher chain suck issue... is this a problem with the new external bottom brackets? My local bike shop guru said this eliminated it. He also says the problem is mud/gunk related - not an issue in sunny/dusty So Ca... Comments?

My Trek/Fisher sales Rep has tried to tell me the same thing, but i have a hard time believing this. They still dont put external bearings on many of their Cake bikes, so does this mean they dont care about chain suck on these models?

The reply above this one speaks highly of the sugar 29er series, and i agree with him/her. I was very impressed by this bike.

If you decide to get the Cake, i can tell you some quick fixes to help the chainsuck problem, but many mechanics dont agree with my practices.

 

[Emission]

I wrote Fisher (Trek) directly:

"I am really close to buying a Gary Fisher Cake 2 DLX from my local shop (********* in Newbury Park, CA) - but I keep hearing reports about chain suck from riders on the trails that, quite frankly, concern me. I want to buy the Cake, but I don't want to regret it. What changes have been made to prevent chain suck, and does GF stand behind the purchase if I have the issue? Thanks."

Their reply (within an hour):

"Here are some things that are focused at causing chain suck. Its never really been the bike itself, but some of the conditions the bike is in.

Chain suck is very elusive and in some cases impossible to solve.
However, it can be controlled and minimized. Before we can solve chain suck we must first identify what type(s) of chain suck you're having.
Outlined below are some of the more common causes of chain suck:

1). Shifting the ft. derailleur under heavy loads or while out of the saddle. What happens here is the chain will wedge itself on to the two rings so tightly that it won't release from either chain ring. The only way I know to solve this type of chain suck is by educating the rider, and explain how and why it's happening. Once you know how or why it happens you can take steps to adjust your riding style to avoid chain suck.

2). Dirty or worn out chains, chain rings or derailleurs. Maintenance and replacing any suspect component.

3). Inadvertent chain slap; this is where the lower horizontal section of chain will bounce up and down hitting the chain stay. If the chain slides off the chain stay to the outside it can be caught up by the chain rings and get sucked up between the chain stay and the chain rings. The best solution I've found for this type of chain suck is a simple tip tie. Place the zip tie on the chain stay just behind the middle and large chain rings. The zip tie knuckle should be positioned under and to the out side of the chain stay. The zip tie acts as an anti-chain suck device keeping the chain out of the space between the chain rings and chain stay.

4). Bent or warped chain rings, a chain ring can get bent for any number of reasons. Inspect them on a regular basis, and replace them when necessary.

5). Chain drop or over shifting due to ft. derailleur adjustment and or maintenance. Chain drop isn't really chain suck but it can be seen as chain suck because the end result is the same, the chain gets picked up and jambs between the stay and the crank set.

6). Chain drop or over shifting due to frame alignment. Not really chain suck but the end result is the same. Your retailer can measure and evaluate the frame alignment and the solution would be to either align the frame or have it replaced. A shorter bottom bracket may help but it not the best solution for the long term.

**** *****
Gary Fisher/Trek Bicycle Tech Support
*****@trekbikes.com"

Obviously, a template e-mail.

Let me look at the Sugar today.

 

[Wumpus]

I wouldn't get a bike that has known issues. There is nothing worst than plunking down that much money and having problems. I have heard of a lot of fishers breaking, and I think you are pushing the edge with your weight. Personally, I would look at some other bikes.

I have a Jamis Dakar, and I can not recommend it since they seem to have a problem with cracking chainstays. It sat for over two months while I got the chainstay warrantied. I knew it had issues when I got it, but it was cheap so I did it anyway. Good thing I have another bike or two to ride.

 

[Emission]

The Sugar 292 looks pretty sweet - I am going to ride one today. I can splurge to $2850 for it...

Each time I research a bike, I find issues with that particular model. Somebody, somewhere, says "...oh, that bike is a piece of crap." They complain about geometry, chain suck, shifting issues, broken frames, etc... I don't think anyone is immune.

I really like my LBS, and he has been great to me for more than a decade. For this reason, I am leaning toward the Fisher line (he also carries Kona).

Another good LBS carries Cannondale and Giant. I just don't think you get decent components on the Cannondale for $2500.

 

[noname]

The Sugar 292 looks pretty sweet - I am going to ride one today. I can splurge to $2850 for it... Awesome, too bad it's not black thoughneaky:

Each time I research a bike, I find issues with that particular model. Somebody, somewhere, says "...oh, that bike is a piece of crap." They complain about geometry, chain suck, shifting issues, broken frames, etc... I don't think anyone is immune. Everyone is an armchair expert(even me! ). I did break my Fisher, but I was doing things on that bike that it definately wasn't designed for.

I really like my LBS, and he has been great to me for more than a decade. For this reason, I am leaning toward the Fisher line (he also carries Kona).

Another good LBS carries Cannondale and Giant. I just don't think you get decent components on the Cannondale for $2500.

I say get the Fisher and flog the crap out of it. I let a friend of mine ride mine last night, and he said the thing tracked on the ground like a downhill bike(we were doing a drop into a ravine at the time). he seemed to have been very impressed with the bike. ' said it was much better than he expected it to be, and he already rides a 29er.

 

[Emission]

You guys have been a big help (believe it or not). I went from the 26" Cake 2 DLX, to the 29" Sugar 292... which I will be ordering tomorrow!

 

[noname]

A preemptive congrats on the Fisher 29er. I hope you're happy with it, I personally can't say enough about mine. Good luck and Happy Trails etc, etc.

 

[Emission]

A preemptive congrats on the Fisher 29er. I hope you're happy with it, I personally can't say enough about mine. Good luck and Happy Trails etc, etc.

Thanks.

It is shipping out and will be at my LBS ready for pick-up on Thursday. I can't wait.

I started with a 5" travel GF Cake 2 with 26" wheels... and ended up with a 4" travel GF Sugar with 29" wheels. I think the Sugar will better suit my riding needs, as many have pointed out.