[UiUiUiUi]

ok i know there's plenty of topics still i open my own, because it needs a slight twist.

I'd like to have some opinions on a few forks.
these should be based on REAL world experience!

ok here's the selection of forks i am considering:
in no particular order.

Avalanche DHF8 ti version setup for a mixture from racing and freeriding.
(i own a regular 02 DHF8 does it feel different?)

Whitbrothers DH 2.0 maybe with that "special tuning kit"
(Violet Volante you have any input on this one)

8" Marzocchi 888 with Go-ride or Risse crowns.

Manitou Slider +

Manitou Dorado (no X works! it seems it won't be around for 05, at least according to my newest info from answer)

Foes Curnutt XTD
anybody rode that one?


ah and please don't suggest other forks like the Fox or the new boxxer.
I don't want to buy into a first year product anymore (big Mistake with my X works) and i really don't like the german RS distributor.


Thanks any help is greatly appreciated!


EDIT:
anybody knows the axle to crown length of the Foes and the White Brothers fork?

 

[spoke80]

2005 Slider+
http://www.ridemonkey.com/forums/showthread.php?t=99444&highlight=slider

 

[Jesus]

Foes Curnutt XTD
anybody rode that one?

This is one fork i'd like to know more about myself. But I have never known anyone who owned one.

Hopefully there is a monkey out there wanting to kiss and tell.

 

[Acadian]

I saw this guy at Big Bear (National) this year that had one (Curnutt XTD) on his Foes. He raced in the same category as me, so I got to chat quite a bit with him - he had a Doraodo before getting the Curnutt XTD and he said the Curnutt was much better. Sure looked pretty damn beefy.

 

[vitox]

ui


axle to crown on the WB is anything you want, unless your headtube is microscopic, youll be able to set the tire clearance to exactly what you want, bear in mind however that all 2.0`s ive seen, have more travel than 200mm, actually last time i checked it was like 208mm.
all in all the 2.0 is the lowest for a given amount of travel there can be.

as for the boxxer, i would really not call it a first year product, not saying that you should consider it but dont discard it on those grounds, they just extended it, just expect stiffness to be a bit worse (not much based on the testing we had done here with 04`s modded to 8") and spring rate lower in stock form.

 

[UiUiUiUi]

thanks vitox for the head upon the boxxer.
still i am not interested in one. just not my fork

 

[OGRipper]

Uh, I think he was talking about the fox dh as a first year product.

Ui, of the forks you list, the only one I can tell you about is the 888 with go-ride crowns. You can find plenty of threads about the 888, but my quick $.02 is that if you get one, read the go-ride article on tuning, those guys really did a service for everybody. If you follow their instructions closely the fork is pretty easy to work on. Most important thing for me was dialing in the oil level, it took a few tries but now I've got it where I just get full travel on the biggest hits. (If the level is not right for you, you will either bottom easy or not get full travel.) And depending on your frame, you should definitely check out some lowrider crowns. I've got the go-ride crowns and ended up with a full degree steeper head angle, close to an inch lower bar height, and 1/2 inch lower bb height and shorter wheelbase.

You might tell us a little bit about the kind of riding you do, how big you are, what frame, that kind of thing. And you know you can find more info by searching, "what fork to buy" is probably the most frequent topic here...well that and what color to get, and whether you can freeride it.

 

[Fulton]

I've owned 888's with risse crowns, a older 03 dorado, and a white brothers dh2.0. Never really been on an avalanche, and i've never seen a foes, outside of interbike. The 2.0 is the best fork i've ever ridden, though the 888 is a very close second. Stiff, super plush, amazing quality and construction. For 05, the 2.0 get added bushing overlap, so they will be even stiffer. Also, they use 120mm hub spacing, instead of using the 10mm bushing they supply, i'd recommend getting the 120mm risse racing hub. Builds a dishless wheel.

 

[UiUiUiUi]

Uh, I think he was talking about the fox dh as a first year product.

Ui, of the forks you list, the only one I can tell you about is the 888 with go-ride crowns. You can find plenty of threads about the 888, but my quick $.02 is that if you get one, read the go-ride article on tuning, those guys really did a service for everybody. If you follow their instructions closely the fork is pretty easy to work on. Most important thing for me was dialing in the oil level, it took a few tries but now I've got it where I just get full travel on the biggest hits. (If the level is not right for you, you will either bottom easy or not get full travel.) And depending on your frame, you should definitely check out some lowrider crowns. I've got the go-ride crowns and ended up with a full degree steeper head angle, close to an inch lower bar height, and 1/2 inch lower bb height and shorter wheelbase.

You might tell us a little bit about the kind of riding you do, how big you are, what frame, that kind of thing. And you know you can find more info by searching, "what fork to buy" is probably the most frequent topic here...well that and what color to get, and whether you can freeride it.

hehe i know (and read a lot of these threads) still i hoped for a few people who can compare the forks in my first post to forks i have or had.

this new fork will find its home on my canfield F1.
right now there is a not properly working Dorado X works installed on it. (a long story i will tell as soon as this problem is solved one way or the other)
intended use is mostly dh riding/racing and some "light" freeriding

i will have a look at the tuning article on go-ride

my stats
6'3" about 190lbs right now (need to loose some weight)

 

[Lumpy_Gravy]

I don't want to buy into a first year product anymore.

I feel exactly the same about every first year product

 

[OGRipper]

Ui, sounds good. FWIW I'm 6' 1" and about 195, but I like to think it's all muscle (yeah right). I've got a vp-free and use it mostly for dh, park riding, jumping and general hucksterishness. 888 works great for me and almost seems like a bargain compared to the others you're looking at, 'cept maybe the slider. Like a lot of others have said, it's low maintenence, super plush, and stiff. You can probably get a deal on an '04 but if you get an '05 I understand they tweaked the compression rod a bit to address the low speed compression issue some people had with the '04 forks. Again, check out the go-ride article for the full skinny.

BTW, I've heard that Manitou fixed the issues with the x-works and will have kits available for you and the other '04 guniea pigs, so if you like the platform you might not give up just yet...but it sounds like you are ready to be done with it.

 

[flymybike]

Ui the WB 2.0 is 22"-22 5/8" tall with a 5" head tube, 6.5" stack height, your F1 is a 5"HT. I ride that exact setup (Canfield F1 & WB 2.0)and it is pefect angles IMO. I'm 1/8" shy of the heighest setting and it is a semi-slack setup so I would only go lower in a race situation for a bit quicker steering. Anyway it's a good range of adjustment for the angles I like.
Fulton is right, over 100% overlap vs travel makes the 2005 WB fork steering stiff as h*ll and the air ramping feature makes it easy to get the right bottomout and a butter smooth and soft top of the travel. I would pick this fork over any fork on the market, just be sure you get the 2005.
Durability - I rode the prototype of this since before the Rampage and Interbike last year and have had zero issues or complants. Easy to tune in 6 different ways. Just SICK! I'll be riding the WB fork at the Rampage again this year.
LC

 

[vitox]

Ui the WB 2.0 is 22"-22 5/8" tall with a 5" head tube, 6.5" stack height, your F1 is a 5"HT. I ride that exact setup (Canfield F1 & WB 2.0)and it is pefect angles IMO. I'm 1/8" shy of the heighest setting and it is a semi-slack setup so I would only go lower in a race situation for a bit quicker steering. Anyway it's a good range of adjustment for the angles I like.
Fulton is right, over 100% overlap vs travel makes the 2005 WB fork steering stiff as h*ll and the air ramping feature makes it easy to get the right bottomout and a butter smooth and soft top of the travel. I would pick this fork over any fork on the market, just be sure you get the 2005.
Durability - I rode the prototype of this since before the Rampage and Interbike last year and have had zero issues or complants. Easy to tune in 6 different ways. Just SICK! I'll be riding the WB fork at the Rampage again this year.
LC

hey man im really intrigued by that, what is new with the wb forks for 05?

how did they get more overlap, does it extend up or down more?

new damper?

 

[flymybike]

hey man im really intrigued by that, what is new with the wb forks for 05?

how did they get more overlap, does it extend up or down more?

new damper?

Not a new damper but more oil volume because of the increased overlap. External compression, rebound and nitrogen pressure to tune sag.

Spring leg is a dual spring with a air seal that can be arranged 3 different ways to get 3 progression rate. Comes stock with the most progressive setting. The three spring adjustments are air chamber size for progression, two springs to tune top of travel and main-bottom of travel rates and a air assist to boost bottom out pressure and give it a more progressive ramping. I run mine with ambiant air, zero pressure, so the top stays supple and the air commpression ramps deeper in the travel.

New upper and lower crowns that are 30% stiffer and stronger than previous years with a larger clamping area to resist twisting. I twisted my stem on a crash but have yet to twist the clamps.

 

[Village Idiot]

I know you dont want first gen products, but as far as overpriced USD forks go, the new Mojo X1 looks sweet. This http://www.mojo.co.uk/x1.swf is and this http://www.descent-world.co.uk/html/products/august2004_2nd.htm is the only online info I can find on them though. You could email them for details about the fork etc. And its only £1599 with Ti internals!

 

[partsbara]

i still call the XTD as the S I C K E S T dh fork i ve ever seen / parkin lot tested... it is fvckin awesome (and that is an understatement)

parts

 

[mack]

Violant Volante is selling a sweet set of white brothers that are tricked out for cheap, ive riden them before and there the so hot, cant say ive ridden the avalanche though.

 

[snowskilz]

I own a avy dh ti, super stiff fairly light, bottomless travel

i had an 888r before the avy, great, stiff, light, lowers felt cheap and i rode a chopper bc of the head tube angle(never bought lower crowns bc i was buying the avy)

dorados suck, they are great if your race. i twisted mine and my friends doing small drops(5 ft) compared to an any and the 888r the manipoo was in a much lower class

my bud who sold me the avy bought a curnutt xtd. Well all he can say about the fork is how great it is. super stiff plush and great in rock gardens. He still offers to buy my avy if i want to get rid of it as a "back up" he's got way too much money.

If ya got the $$$ go for the avy or xtd

 

[partsbara]

If ya got the $$$ go for the avy or xtd

yeah no doubt... uiuiuiui has the money... he s a rich german land lord .... the xtd is so awesome... i ll sell my first born for one...

either that of visit the sperm bank 45423 times

 

[Curb Hucker]

Ui, ill give you a good write-up tomorrow, im way too tired for anything right now.

 

[SCARY]

I have the Foes XTD fork.It really depends on what you want in a fork .If you want all super plush and go through half your travel while sitting on it, get a 888.The XTD was VERY sticky until you get past the break in period of 2-4 hrs of actual DH runs.After that,it'll change your life.No more diving in corners,no more bobbing 4" of travel during a sprint ,no more bottoming.If you are a racer it's THEE fork.The thing I notice right off the bat was the lack of dive in braking or in corners,and I could now keep my head up and look where I was going and not have to compensate my body positioning for the fork.It's a little less supple on the smaller stuff because of the Curnutt,but the benefits quickly won me over .This is coming from somebody previously would run my settings SUPER soft. It's definitely a fork that feels like no other,but once you figure out that you are going faster with more control and less effort it's worth the extra denero.The faster you go the better it works(really,no kidding).And Brent was very interested and helpful in making sure I got it setup right and understood the how's and why' of it.Oh,yeah,8.5" of travel.30 mil through axle.22.25 from center of axle to underside of lower crown.Only negative would be narrow turning radius,but hasen't been as much of a problem as I thought it would've. Just for reference ,previous forks were:04' 888,02 Dorado and 00'Boxxer. ~Sorry ,for not being funny.But this a serious topic,I hold close to my heart.There are people's lives at stake here.

 

[SCARY]

I hope this works.I'm compu- stupid,but I can..BR-AAAAAP!

 

[Curb Hucker]

WB DH2.0 Write-Up

Hmm where to start? Well the first thing you will notice about any WB is that the quality of the product is much higher than almost any other fork out there, Avy being the only one at the same level. Everything is CNC machined and looks very good, the Ano job on the uppers is top notch, and these fork guards kick ass becuse theyre much more flexable than the shiver ones, which will break if ya get the right hit at em. I have a 2004 fork, its got 4 bushings per leg which is more than most forks, and it has tons of overlap too, by far one of, if not the most stiffest inverted fork ive ever tried. The damping/travel feels by far better than any other fork ive ever ridden. The fork has Preload adj. using internal shims (aka. 888) The fork has external Rebound adj. on the top of the leg. The rebound adjuster on this fork acutally does a whole lot, it can take you from pogo stick to slow sucking noise in about 10 turns, with plenty of in-between settings. The Compression adjuster is located on the bottom of the leg. It is high speed compression and you can really tell a difference between every 1/2 turn. There is also a Nitrogen/Air piggyback on the damper leg as well. This controls your bottom our resistance. a pressure range of 50-120psi gives you alot of settings you can use. Unlike any other fork on the market, the WB has a customizable springstack. You can do mods and adjust the stack to get the different rate springs to engage at different lenghts into the travel. This in addition to the Nitro piggyback lets you set the fork up for 10ft drops to flat that you wont come close to bottoming on, super super plush for full on DH race, or you can set it up anywhere inbetween like I have mine. By far the best fork I have ever owned, and ive had alot of forks. As vitox said this fork has the lowest C-A height of any 200mm fork on the market right now. Basically it can take abuse like a monster or fly like a boxxer thats why i love it so much. For 05 they increased stanction overlap to 8.5" at 0"sag and added one bushing per leg. There is also a new air-assist feature on the 05s that lets you pump air in to raise your spring rate.

[Spam]Buy my 2004 so I can get an 05 [/Spam]

 

[Sherpa]

WB DH2.0 Write-Up

Hmm where to start? Well the first thing you will notice about any WB is that the quality of the product is much higher than almost any other fork out there, Avy being the only one at the same level. Everything is CNC machined and looks very good, the Ano job on the uppers is top notch, and these fork guards kick ass becuse theyre much more flexable than the shiver ones, which will break if ya get the right hit at em. I have a 2004 fork, its got 4 bushings per leg which is more than most forks, and it has tons of overlap too, by far one of, if not the most stiffest inverted fork ive ever tried. The damping/travel feels by far better than any other fork ive ever ridden. The fork has Preload adj. using internal shims (aka. 888) The fork has external Rebound adj. on the top of the leg. The rebound adjuster on this fork acutally does a whole lot, it can take you from pogo stick to slow sucking noise in about 10 turns, with plenty of in-between settings. The Compression adjuster is located on the bottom of the leg. It is high speed compression and you can really tell a difference between every 1/2 turn. There is also a Nitrogen/Air piggyback on the damper leg as well. This controls your bottom our resistance. a pressure range of 50-120psi gives you alot of settings you can use. Unlike any other fork on the market, the WB has a customizable springstack. You can do mods and adjust the stack to get the different rate springs to engage at different lenghts into the travel. This in addition to the Nitro piggyback lets you set the fork up for 10ft drops to flat that you wont come close to bottoming on, super super plush for full on DH race, or you can set it up anywhere inbetween like I have mine. By far the best fork I have ever owned, and ive had alot of forks. As vitox said this fork has the lowest C-A height of any 200mm fork on the market right now. Basically it can take abuse like a monster or fly like a boxxer thats why i love it so much. For 05 they increased stanction overlap to 8.5" at 0"sag and added one bushing per leg. There is also a new air-assist feature on the 05s that lets you pump air in to raise your spring rate.

[Spam]Buy my 2004 so I can get an 05 [/Spam]

Are '05's available already? Also, with more oil volume and bushings won't they be heavier? I just may get a DH 1.8 for my new V-10...Does the 1.8 have the same features as the 2.0 ala nitro resy and the likes?

 

[Curb Hucker]

Are '05's available already? Also, with more oil volume and bushings won't they be heavier? I just may get a DH 1.8 for my new V-10...Does the 1.8 have the same features as the 2.0 ala nitro resy and the likes?

05s are like 04s. They are closed cartridge forks like the 02 dorados. all of the damping parts and oil are sealed into the lower leg, the upper part of the left leg is hollow. The right leg has all of the springs. You can put just a tiny bit of 10-20 weight fork oil in the legs to keep everythign slick, or put slick honey or my favorite Bel-Ray spring grease on the outsides of the stanctions every week and everything stays running very smooth. DH 1.8s lack the compression ajd and has the nitro-res inside of the leg instead of piggyback form, and feel more 888ish than moto-fork ish like the DH 2.0 does

 

[Espen]

I have owned TPC Dorado, WBDH3, 888 and Ava DHF8Ti.

My experience:
The Ava is the best fork, period! It's stiff, insane build quality, smooth, lowest maintainance in the biz and it got awsome damping. Like you know, the crowns gives you longer wheelbase than other forks. I think it's a bit heavy.
A tuned 888 matches WB forks. It depends on what you want. The WB's gives you shorter wheelbase than the others. 888 is stiff, but the damping is slightly better on the WB. Dorado's are smooth and works great, but they are wery short and needs too much maintainance IMO.

I am running a 888 now, with G-R crowns and the comp sleeve.

E

 

[RD3]

I know you dont want first gen products, but as far as overpriced USD forks go, the new Mojo X1 looks sweet. This http://www.mojo.co.uk/x1.swf is and this http://www.descent-world.co.uk/html/products/august2004_2nd.htm is the only online info I can find on them though. You could email them for details about the fork etc. And its only £1599 with Ti internals!

This is the new version of the Mr Dirt Fork. Bob Barnett (mr dirt) is making most of the parts for mojo for this fork. Same basis as the original, just with lots of improvements, better dampening, etc. The old mr dirt forks are still better than a lot of new DH forks (imo), so the new version should be great.

 

[seismic]

I have tried the piggyback version of the WB fork and it seems very nice. Light, nimble, good quality and very "race-like". The adjustability of the fork seems great. I run an Avy myself and I have to say that even it is not that light I like it better. The smoothness and reliability of the Avy is awesome. I think the build quality of both WB and Avy is very high and I doubt that you will go wrong either way. Maybe because I have not tried it yet I think the Foes seems as a godo bet for a "perfect" race fork. Otherwise, - biased as I am, - I would go for one of the Avy models. I simply like the way they work very much !

 

[Brad23]

I hope this works.I'm compu- stupid,but I can..BR-AAAAAP!

Nice pic, you have me talked into the Curnut if it'll make me look like that!!!

 

[UiUiUiUi]

thanks everybody, your replies have been very helpful.

anybody got some real world weights for the DHF8ti, the ehite and the foes?

 

[Jm_]

I have the Foes XTD fork.It really depends on what you want in a fork .If you want all super plush and go through half your travel while sitting on it, get a 888.

Or, if you want your fork to perform correctly, get the correct springs for it.

 

[Espen]

And a properly tuned 888 is a wery good fork. Half the price of the Foes too.

The DHF8TI weights 3900-3950g depends on the spring setup. The softest setup weights more than the stiffest.

E

 

[vitox]

up to 04 the WB forks are around 3,6 kilos

thats 0,4lbs more than a 888.

 

[binary visions]

Or, if you want your fork to perform correctly, get the correct springs for it.

Ahh, the infamous "MY FORX BOTTOMS OUT ALL TEH TIME IT SUXORS"...

There was a thread either on MTBR or here, but I believe it was MTBR, where someone with a DHX was complaining that the technology obviously sucked since their clearly undersprung shock was bottoming out and no amount of "ramp up" adjustment would fix it.

Come on, people... An undersprung fork or rear shock will perform poorly - period. No adjustment in the world will make up for a bad spring rate.

 

[seismic]

Ahh, the infamous "MY FORX BOTTOMS OUT ALL TEH TIME IT SUXORS"...

There was a thread either on MTBR or here, but I believe it was MTBR, where someone with a DHX was complaining that the technology obviously sucked since their clearly undersprung shock was bottoming out and no amount of "ramp up" adjustment would fix it.

Come on, people... An undersprung fork or rear shock will perform poorly - period. No adjustment in the world will make up for a bad spring rate.

That is right. And for some reason, even though people told him to change the spring he seemed unwilling to do so. Like he had already setup his mind on that the DHX sucked....

 

[JRogers]

The softest setup weights more than the stiffest.

E

How?

 

[ohio]

How?

You make a spring softer by either reducing the diameter of the wire, or by increasing the number of coils. Increased coils at the same wire diameter equals more weight.

 

[ioscope]

Maybe he's dyslexic

 

[Espen]

The spring stack contains 1pc alu tube spacer, 1 pc titanium main spring and 0pc, 1pc or 2pc short steelsprings.

The softest setup uses a short aluspacer and 2pc. small steelsprings, the firmest uses no small steel springs and a long alutube spacer.

e

 

[SCARY]

No,dumbasses.The 888's dive.period.The Boxxer wasn't bad about it.And the Dorado was a bit better even.The XTD dosent do it,and there are reasons for it.But since you geniuses can get a fork perfect by getting stiffer springs,you can't be told anything.And I'm sure you'all have done plenty of runs on the XTD so you know it has specific adjustments for anti dive/anti bottoming.And tell me the 888 was the perfect race/ride height too.~~~stiffer springs....duuhher.