Best brakes for DH
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Renthal Fat Bars
Shimano Saint M820
formula RO
Shimano Saint M820
formula RO
Haven't tried saints. Formulas are excelent!
But they are really picky about fluid volume and use real dot 3,4 or 5.1 fluid. (dont use 5)
The pads don't fit at first till you ride it for a bit (or maybe that's just mine they say prototype where the serial number goes)
with a big disc and oem not ebc pads they are insanely strong but have great feel.
But they are really picky about fluid volume and use real dot 3,4 or 5.1 fluid. (dont use 5)
The pads don't fit at first till you ride it for a bit (or maybe that's just mine they say prototype where the serial number goes)
with a big disc and oem not ebc pads they are insanely strong but have great feel.
Ianjenn
I have seen tons of people with hopes recently. They seem really good. I would love to try some.
NEW V2's. That's an important distiction. Old v2s were as most old hopes - you hoped they would work. If you buy the current gen with tech levers though people seem to be having no problems.
I too, also recommend renthal. Shimano saints are the benchmark imho. The 2013s with the finned pads and icetech rotors areunbeatable
Saints brakes
Bars chromags
Bars chromags
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Formula ones or ro and some motul 660 fluid.
Agread with the renthal bars...I run pro tapers but will be trying some renthals...
Agread with the renthal bars...I run pro tapers but will be trying some renthals...
Do eeet. The Fatbar just feels right. My fave atm...
Hmmm wonder how much better they are than the old one? The blurb sounds promising.
I still peferred the first moto over whatever the last tech was called, if I get Hopes again I'll tear em down when I get them and put caliper grease on the internal moving bits.
I've had no issues with my Formula The Ones.
New Saints sound good though.
I've heard of sticky pistons with The Ones, but had no issues.
Also heard of leaking Saints, I guess my XTR levers have leaked a touch as there's oily dirt on them, but sweet FA.
New Saints sound good though.
I've heard of sticky pistons with The Ones, but had no issues.
Also heard of leaking Saints, I guess my XTR levers have leaked a touch as there's oily dirt on them, but sweet FA.
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Here for Renthal too.
Won a war against an upper crown and the direct stem on a Boxxer while the bike was landing tripple frontflip on the left grip.
The crown and stem were done. The bar is still riding.
Not sure about the new Saints. Maybe ask Gwin before pulling the trigger.
We have a huge thread that deals with Formula The One problems over at mtb-news.de. Not that they are bad brakes but with age a membrane gets leaking in the lever and the system gets air. Mine worked well but when things got really steep and long in the alps they developed an inconsistent feel. I now ride codes. I liked the instant power of the formulas better but the code has advantages modulation- and durability-wise.
NOT prototype Shimano DH brakes.
m820 saint. best ever.
shimano saint.
Shimano Zee? Don't buy them with a derailleur, though
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I had that derailleur in my hands and it was heavier and felt burlier than my x0 dh so I think this guy claiming that it bent while not touching anything did miss something.
Have not tried the 2013 SAINT as of yet. Not sure how much modulation it will have. The other 2 sets I have ridden felt the same as my Hayes MAGs from 2001 and most people do not have the brake control of Nico keeping this things from breaking looses was sometimes tricky. The V2's you can set up to go to the bar and just be 100% sponge if you like. Pretty adjustable so that is huge. One finger braking the entire time is nice also.
Is this a recent problem? My 2009s were faultless for over 3 years - I've just got some 2012s, I hope I won't regret it!
saints. 810s were pretty much without fault for me.
Could you please post a link to the thread, as I don't read German. So I can put the thread through Google Translator.
Cheers
Cheers mate.
Which year?
I've had the production 2011 The Ones for 2 years now, including a full season in the Alps and a full season in Whistler and have not had a single issue. They've surprisingly been the most reliable brakes I have owned, and I ran Saints / Codes etc previously which all needed bleeding and maintenance much more often. Personally I found every Avid brake I owned to range between inconsistent and dangerous and would probably not try them again, Shimano I liked however they seem to have dropped the ball with reliability compared to their original (circa M800) offerings in the later M810 and M820 units - excessively long lever throw and some leaks.
Not sure if I just got lucky, but I'd happily buy the Formulas again. I bought them expecting very little (Italians!), but two seasons and many sets of pads later, I'm thoroughly impressed.
Really? Where are they leaking?
Is the lever throw that far off the xt/slx/zee levers?
The saints weren't available here at the beginning of the season so I ordered some zee levers and bled them to my 810 calipers after being blown away by some xts I put on my trail bike. I love'em. Are the saint levers different?
Without really thinking about it too much until now, I do think I know what you're talking about. After a few days of riding my dh bike and going back to my trail bike, the xts don't really feel stronger, just 'snappier'. I think that's lever throw. Makes sense when thinking about the fluid displacement between the two systems.
The last gen levers did have a weird kind of inconsistent behavior where the throw to engagement would vary. I could tighten up by (like you said) adding more fluid. But my weird zee/last year's saint calipers don't do that. Not at all. But like you said, that should be the calipers not the levers themselves...... Odd.
I've still got a set of last year's xts with the funny shaped levers on a slopestyle/4x bike. They never change....ever. But that's a two piston caliper, so consistent with what you're saying.
Why would my current dh setup NOT be doing that though?
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It depends how you mate them - the 4 pot caliper results in a longer lever throw because it has a greater total slave piston area for the same master cylinder area as the other Shimano brakes. After a careful bleed you can get the throw sitting further out but eventually they'll work their way closer to the bar. Few guys here are just pumping them with more fluid regularly to keep the lever throw reasonable but that's a pain.
Noticed this on the M820s and M810 with XTR lever combo. My M810s did the same thing with the stock levers but I've noticed the XTR lever with the M810 caliper is no better, possibly worse.
As for the leaking, that seems to be a random occurrence, seen it from M810 and M988 (XTR trail) which from what I can see isn't very different from the new M820 lever, hopefully it's fixed but I'm dubious.
I haven't seen the throw issue in the regular XT brakes, and I don't think it would occur because the master / slave ratio is more reasonable on these - they have less throw and seem to be more consistent.
Noticed this on the M820s and M810 with XTR lever combo. My M810s did the same thing with the stock levers but I've noticed the XTR lever with the M810 caliper is no better, possibly worse.
As for the leaking, that seems to be a random occurrence, seen it from M810 and M988 (XTR trail) which from what I can see isn't very different from the new M820 lever, hopefully it's fixed but I'm dubious.
I haven't seen the throw issue in the regular XT brakes, and I don't think it would occur because the master / slave ratio is more reasonable on these - they have less throw and seem to be more consistent.
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Sorry I deleted and reposted my post worded a bit better but it's the same.
To be honest I was really hoping the new brakes wouldn't do this because it's the only reason I ditched my old ones, but I think mathematically it's just how it works... using more slave piston area for a given master piston area means greater hydraulic leverage which = more power. Unfortunately it also means greater throw, and it seems no one has really found a way around this yet. The only way to not have the levers engaging right near the grip seems to be to set the reach adjuster further out.
Theoretically there is no reason why your new Zee levers would be any different unfortunately (assuming piston size is the same as others), but there seems to be enough variance that you get a decent set every now and then - question is if they stay that way long term. My 810's would take a month after a good bleed to slowly work their way closer to the bar.
To be honest I was really hoping the new brakes wouldn't do this because it's the only reason I ditched my old ones, but I think mathematically it's just how it works... using more slave piston area for a given master piston area means greater hydraulic leverage which = more power. Unfortunately it also means greater throw, and it seems no one has really found a way around this yet. The only way to not have the levers engaging right near the grip seems to be to set the reach adjuster further out.
Theoretically there is no reason why your new Zee levers would be any different unfortunately (assuming piston size is the same as others), but there seems to be enough variance that you get a decent set every now and then - question is if they stay that way long term. My 810's would take a month after a good bleed to slowly work their way closer to the bar.
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Haha...
As said above, that combo I've got going right now eliminated the problem. I can't be JUST the calipers because I'm using the same ones.
As said above, that combo I've got going right now eliminated the problem. I can't be JUST the calipers because I'm using the same ones.
Has anyone been using the Formula RO's? How are they modulation/power wise in comparison the the m810 Saint brakes? Are they reliable? Is there any noticeable brake fade on long descents? I can't seem to find to much info on these guys.Thinking of picking up a set, but after reading that some people have had issues with The One's I'm hesitant, even though I know quite a few people that love them.
My only guess is that they've eliminated the problem for now rather than forever, because unless the Zee lever uses a different piston size mathematically it should behave the same as the M820/M988 etc levers.
I'm open to correction here as I haven't tried that particular combination, but I've squeezed on plenty of similar ones.
I'm open to correction here as I haven't tried that particular combination, but I've squeezed on plenty of similar ones.
I would get in touch with buckow on here, he does testing for Formula.
I've found MY11 The Ones to be very consistent and reliable, and would recommend them, however have no real experience with the RO.
No what you're saying makes total sense. My saint levers from last year did it. These zee levers on the same calipers don't. That's just weird.
edit: I'm talking about the varying contact point though, not just the longer lever throw.
And I'd know because the lever adjustment on the zees requires a wrench, with no thumb screw. I run my levers so that they almost hit the bar. I'd know
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Just chiming in here: A while ago I mated up some XT 785 levers to my old 810 Saint calipers.
They've been really good. Much better than the original 810 lever/caliper pairing. The lever throw is still a lot, but they're more direct than the orignal levers. I believe a big part of it's due to the pivot location of Shimano's newer design of lever. (Never been a fan of levers that pivoted far away from the grip like the last gen. stuff.)
I changed pads out on the rear yesterday and the lever has almost no throw at the moment. Prying the pistons all the way back would've sent mineral oil spraying all over my garage, so I just let a small amount piss itself out and shoved the new pads in there. I'm guessing the pressure will equalize and I'll be back to having the normal amount of throw in the lever after a ride or 2...
Not feeling the need to get an 820 setup until I see how they feel. These work great!