Bolivia Nationalizes Natural Gas
- Thread starter DRB
- Start date
Bush should use the military to take over Exxon-Mobil. Hell he's sent troops damn near everyplace else that has oil.
It's mainly Brazil & Spain he's pissing off, not the US. So he may get away with it.
Well it's their gas. *shrugs* let them do with it what they want.
I'm predicting an assasination soon or a CIA backed coup. Poor guy. He is an awesome guy, but he won't be around for much longer with the US in North America.
Sounds more like he's upping the ante for contract negotiation purposes.DRB said:
It'll be interesting to see what happens. It's tough to be a populist when you actually win an election.
i was watching on the news today. an according to a peruvian ex mines minister. he has nationalized "commerce" of the pump of the stuff.
he hasnt nationalized the ownership of the actual wells, but everything they pump out. and in one well were the calculation has been made, is supposed to pay 18% of the retail value (which will be asigned later by the gvmt) to the well owner. the distrbution, price fixing, etc, etc is up to the gvmt.
now, putting the troops and stuff. that is just a media hit in latin america. a very similar nationalization happened in peru in the 70s by a douchebag named velasco, with the troops, the tanks breaking into the wells..... thats a southamerican icon.
he hasnt nationalized the ownership of the actual wells, but everything they pump out. and in one well were the calculation has been made, is supposed to pay 18% of the retail value (which will be asigned later by the gvmt) to the well owner. the distrbution, price fixing, etc, etc is up to the gvmt.
now, putting the troops and stuff. that is just a media hit in latin america. a very similar nationalization happened in peru in the 70s by a douchebag named velasco, with the troops, the tanks breaking into the wells..... thats a southamerican icon.
i dont think there will be much negotiation. according to the law recently passed, the fuel companies have 6 months to leave bolivia if they dont sign a new contract.Silver said:
pretty much is a take what you are offered, or get kicked out but your stuff stays here.
Bolivia doesn't have the capacity to produce the gas, or to export it (being land locked and all.)ALEXIS_DH said:
If Morales kicks out all the foreign gas companies and scares away all foreign investment, he's going to have trouble domestically. That gas doesn't do Bolivians any good in the ground.
i agree on that, but i dont agree on assuming morales will make rational choices. he is more prone to media coups, and chest thumping for self-validation of the poor bolivians. like the "free trade" treaty he´s made with cuba to rival the US backed free trade treaties in SA. for gods sake, bolivia exports to cuba were $5500 in the last whole year!!!!!!!!Silver said:
i saw a couple minutes of a live speech today. he said railroads, mines and couple other things i dont recall will also be nationalized. i think he sees what you see, but will try to control everything he thinks necesary for the distribution. how long will the chain run? ive got no clue on that.
now, i believe brazil and spain will push for sanctions. argentina might join if this hits them fard enough, even with kirschner being another pinko douche.
brazil and argentina are huge markets for bolivian prodcuts.. probably chavez will step up and subsidize bolivia for a while.
Well, he appears to have pulled it off for the moment. Just as well the US is not a big customer/investor.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/4974710.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/4974710.stm
i´m not very convinced yet, since no relevant bolivian has talked prices yet.fluff said:
kirschner and lula might be sympathetic to morales cause, out of ideological proximity.
but i´d consider the deal stable only after prices have been set, and the argentinean and brazillian markets stabilize around them. that is, assuming supply and efficiency remains the same thru the next years. the later being impossible in my opinion of banana republic owned corporations.
So Brazil says yeah we will play along on what's there now, pulling out would be economically stupid. However long term with18% capped return is going to get exactly zero new investment. And even if they negotiate those percentages up, no company is going to trust him as far as they can throw him and isn't going to put themselves too much at risk.fluff said:
Though Morales might be just dumb enough to try and cut Brazil off to prove a point. In the end that would end up hurting himself more.
And Brazil might suffer from reduced natural gas supplies from Bolivia in the short term but long term they'll be fine. They are basically self sufficient in regards to oil right now and the potential from off-shore natural gas fields is such that a lot of Bolivian gas could become unnecessary by 2009. And that 2009 date was based on investment models BEFORE Morales' opened his mouth. Now with money earmarked for Bolivia freed up, I suspect that 2009 date will move in.
I think that Chavez might have encouraged Morales into this action to see what the reaction would be.
I said a dangerous move, I should have said a dumb and dangerous move.
Yet we expect people to invest in Iraq.DRB said:
i saw on the news today, there were comments bolivia wants to increase the price of exported gas by more than 100%...
they had given brazil and argentina a promise of supply.. but is just now they are gonna set prices, i dont know how will the brazillians and argentineans take the new prices and how is that gonna affect their position.
tough probably chavez might be leverage argentina and brazil.....
they had given brazil and argentina a promise of supply.. but is just now they are gonna set prices, i dont know how will the brazillians and argentineans take the new prices and how is that gonna affect their position.
tough probably chavez might be leverage argentina and brazil.....