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BOOOOOO E-BIKES

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
16,629
7,592
AK
What I don't get is this:

"In the suit, Kaye and Jonathan Steinsapir, the parents of Molly Steinsapir, who died last year at age 12, claim flaws in the bike’s design made it difficult for riders to slow down and stop as the bike gained speed while going downhill.

The suit, filed in Los Angeles County Superior Court, also argues Rad Power Bikes engaged in “inappropriate marketing of e-bikes to children,” adding the company failed to “adequately warn about the dangers of children operating e-bikes.”"

"Molly was a passenger on a RadRunner bike, made by Rad Power, when she had her accident. On page 49 of the 57-page owner’s manual for the model, a warning says that “the RadRunner is designed for use by persons 18 years old and older.""

Soooo, who was operating the bike? Clearly not Molly.
They have multiple pictures in their advertising of young kids riding the thing as a passenger.
 

Gary

"S" is for "neo-luddite"
Aug 27, 2002
5,495
3,603
UK
Molly and an 11-year-old friend climbed aboard a RadRunner e-bike that belonged to the friend’s 13-year-old sister, the lawsuit says. The friend was operating the bike as Molly rode atop a flat rack over its back wheel, a feature that “invites a passenger to sit in tandem,” according to the complaint.

The two girls, who were wearing helmets, rode to the top of a hill that they most likely would not have been able to climb without the bike’s electric boost, the lawsuit says. After the friend turned the bike around to head back down the hill, the bike “began to rapidly pick up speed, and it began shaking,” according to the complaint. The friend “applied the rear brake, but the bicycle did not slow. She then pulled the front brake, but the bike did not stop, and the front wheel began to wobble.” She lost control, and the girls were thrown.

Source: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/01/style/team-molly-rad-power-bikes-lawsuit.html
That's a horrible read!

RIP kids and condolences to the families
 

iRider

Turbo Monkey
Apr 5, 2008
5,094
2,526
They have multiple pictures in their advertising of young kids riding the thing as a passenger.
Which is different from "operating" the bike. Most likely an adult rider would have had the strength to keep the bike upright with a kid on the back. It is horrible that this has happened, but somehow I fail to see the fault of the bike company or helmet manufacturer. If this would be true, you could sue each and every gun company after every shooting ever.
 

rideit

Bob the Builder
Aug 24, 2004
19,162
8,599
In the cleavage of the Tetons
Ok, so I did a ridiculously, stupidly fun ebike ride today at the West Hartford Res. 3,666 feet of climbing, lots of it ledgy, chunky, some basically impossible on regular bikes. The verdict? So, so, so fun. Made trails that usually kind of bore me into a whole other thing, sessioning technical uphills and bursts of power up little (and not so little) walls. Couple time with my heart absolutely exploding out of my chest, at (probably) 160-170 bpms. Rode almost 4 hours and almost ran out of juice. Quite a bit on eco. (it was a full size, full power Levo comp. ).
Definitely made me realize how disappointed I would be with one of the lighter styles, I wanted to ride longer. (But I was whooped from upper body wrangling).
More experimentation is in order. I can definitely go faster (and bunny hop higher) on the Analog bike, and I prefer the flickability of the lighter bikes.
I still don’t feel they belong everywhere, as it is just so easy to ‘accidentally’ be a bit of a dick if you aren’t being totally slow and courteous around other people. (You get used to the faster speeds). Easy to manage personally, but hard as a large group of riders with different maturity levels.

FTR, I saw two other mountain bikers in 32 miles, so no panties were bunched. (Ebike legal trails, mostly)
 
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SylentK

Turbo Monkey
Feb 25, 2004
1,786
580
coloRADo
Ok, so I did a ridiculously, stupidly fun ebike ride today at the West Hartford Res. 3,666 feet of climbing, lots of it ledgy, chunky, some basically impossible on regular bikes. The verdict? So, so, so fun. Made trails that usually kind of bore me into a whole other thing, sessioning technical uphills and bursts of power up little (and not so little) walls. Couple time with my heart absolutely exploding out of my chest, at (probably) 160-170 bpms. Rode almost 4 hours and almost ran out of juice. Quite a bit on eco. (it was a full size, full power Levo comp. ).
Definitely made me realize how disappointed I would be with one of the lighter styles, I wanted to ride longer. (But I was whooped from upper body wrangling).
More experimentation is in order. I can definitely go faster (and bunny hop higher) on the Analog bike, and I prefer the flickability of the lighter bikes.
I still don’t feel they belong everywhere, as it is just so easy to ‘accidentally’ be a bit of a dick if you aren’t being totally slow and courteous around other people. (You get used to the faster speeds). Easy to manage personally, but hard as a large group of riders with different maturity levels.

FTR, I saw two other mountain bikers in 32 miles, so no panties were bunched. (Ebike legal trails, mostly)
So ebikes definitely don't suck?

Welcome to the dark side.

Did you buy?
 

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
50,059
15,488
Sleazattle
I wish we could get my buddy Little Larry in here. He is 75, riding 12-18 miles of tech singletrack 5 days a week. On average I'd say he is climbing 1k-1500ft. He LOVES to talk shit about ebikes. It's glorious.

I got one for my dad when he couldn't walk up the hills in his neighborhood anymore
 

DaveW

Space Monkey
Jul 2, 2001
10,322
1,908
The bunker at parliament
Definitely made me realize how disappointed I would be with one of the lighter styles, I wanted to ride longer. (But I was whooped from upper body wrangling).
More experimentation is in order. I can definitely go faster (and bunny hop higher) on the Analog bike, and I prefer the flickability of the lighter bikes.

Yes and no to that having had an Orbea Rise..... Crazy fun to chuck around on tech stuff.
The new Orbea Wild I have coming has more fun factor however on grade 5-6 trails due to more aggressive geo and more travel which was the limiting factor on the Rise.
I think a Rise with a slacker head angle and another 10-20mm travel would actually be bang on..... But that is almost what the wild is (heavier by 5kg).
The other reason I have for changing is that if the Bosch motor fails I can have it fixed or replaced in a week.
Shimano fails (& I saw a lot do so at the shop) you have a 6-7 month wait because Shimano are utter shit at having any stock of anything in NZ.
 

boostindoubles

Nacho Libre
Mar 16, 2004
6,716
4,591
Yakistan
I love to talk shit about ebikes!
It’s just now I can with a degree of experience.
You'd like Larry then, he is full of opinions and not afraid to tell you how dumb he thinks you are for riding ebikes.

When he was going through cancer he was using adult diapers as shammies. Brilliant if you ask me.
 

slimshady

¡Mira, una ardilla!
I did 33 km today of tech singletrack on my 15 kg Enduro bike, at 34° Celsius, 85% humidity. Peak speed for me was 33 km/h. I was riding with several buddies on 10 kg XC machines. I had to stop when I ran out of water.

At about 75% of my ride, I got this 30-something d-bag on a brown motor Santa Cruz who tire buzzed me twice in less than 60 meters, right before a nice 1.5 meter drop on a slightly upward trail. I was accelerating to hit the drop as fast as I could, and the asshole got me out of my rhythm. Twice. I stopped dead on the trail and yelled at him "If you're such a man, throw the battery away and then try to catch me, you fucker!".

Maybe it was my semi-psycho gaze, maybe he ran out of douchebaggery, maybe it was the look my riding buddies gave him, but the guy turned around his moped and rode away as fast as the electric assist helped him.

I'm not blaming the ebikes. I'm just saying they enable the d-bags to be the best d-bags they can be. And that's plainly horrible.
 
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slimshady

¡Mira, una ardilla!
Yup, I totally alluded to that in my description. You have to be ultra, ultra aware and courteous.

Pretty, pretty please, can you translate this to exactly how you would say this in colloquial Spanish?
My phrase to the asshat? I literally said "LA CONCHA DE TU MADRE, SI TENÉS TANTOS HUEVOS TIRÁ A LA MIERDA LA BATERÍA Y TRATÁ DE SEGUIRME, A VER SI SOS TAN MACHO!!"

EDIT: And that's colloquial Argentinian, not Spanish ;-).
 

SylentK

Turbo Monkey
Feb 25, 2004
1,786
580
coloRADo
Got this for $7k out the door.
Made it a Mullet, and some other upgrades.
Couldn’t turn down the offer.
View attachment 185436

The one I rode today was a Turbo Levo, definitely not as dialed.
Looks solid! Congrats!

Yeah, the weight takes some getting used to. Def gotta plan a bit more in advance on the trail moves. But climbs are way more fun.

A technique I've discovered: You can conquer crazy techy climbs by dabbing and turning the cranks at the same time. For me, I have clips/spd's. So I can pull up and complete the crank turn while the other foot is keeping me up right with a dab.

I've got a trail that we'd usually push up. Now I try to ride up. And instead of crashing on the down, I crash going uphill, which is quite embarrassing, especially if I roll my body over cactus, high siding it. I now have the momentum, but the trail is just that narrow and techy, I loose it off the wrong side.

But it's still fun! And I enjoy the challenge and keeps me riding!
 

sethimus

scroll all you want!
Feb 5, 2006
3,715
1,289
not in Whistler anymore :/
Yes and no to that having had an Orbea Rise..... Crazy fun to chuck around on tech stuff.
The new Orbea Wild I have coming has more fun factor however on grade 5-6 trails due to more aggressive geo and more travel which was the limiting factor on the Rise.
I think a Rise with a slacker head angle and another 10-20mm travel would actually be bang on..... But that is almost what the wild is (heavier by 5kg).
The other reason I have for changing is that if the Bosch motor fails I can have it fixed or replaced in a week.
Shimano fails (& I saw a lot do so at the shop) you have a 6-7 month wait because Shimano are utter shit at having any stock of anything in NZ.
216x63 shock with offset bushings and a 170mm air shaft is used by some. öhlins 210x60 shock another option to get more travel out of a rise. i tried a norco sight with a 900wh battery before buying, didn’t like the extra weight


descending with the range extender attached already feels off with the extra weight up high
 
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Gary

"S" is for "neo-luddite"
Aug 27, 2002
5,495
3,603
UK
Shimano fails (& I saw a lot do so at the shop) you have a 6-7 month wait because Shimano are utter shit at having any stock of anything in NZ.
During the height of covid a 3 month wait for restock was the case here ONCE. generally it takes 5 working days to receive a new motor. I should know. I'm into double figures on mine.
I'm not sure I'd have an Ebike at all if I had supply issues similar to yours to deal with. I just don't like how bosch motors power delivery feels.
 

Andeh

Customer Title
Mar 3, 2020
699
699
Got this for $7k out the door.
Made it a Mullet, and some other upgrades.
Couldn’t turn down the offer.


The one I rode today was a Turbo Levo, definitely not as dialed.
That's a hell of a deal. I was really interested in the Rocky, but am going with a Turbo Levo because there's lots of dealers near here for the seemingly inevitable warranty motor swaps that come with all ebikes, and I've ridden my friend's Levo 25k-30k feet and like how it rides. I'm getting the Comp build on sale for 6750 but basically stripping most of the parts.
No way I'd want one of the lightweight ones. I've ridden with friends on them, and basically their range is the same as my meat powered range (~4k) and they can't go much faster than my climbing speed without killing the range. A 42lb bike is still going to feel way different than a 35lb bike, so I'd rather get more range.
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
34,332
5,493
I’ve cracked my front and rear triangles on my crabon Pivot Shuttle but no issues with the E8000 motor setup

(I did break a battery casing mount and get a warranty battery replacement.)
 

sethimus

scroll all you want!
Feb 5, 2006
3,715
1,289
not in Whistler anymore :/
That's a hell of a deal. I was really interested in the Rocky, but am going with a Turbo Levo because there's lots of dealers near here for the seemingly inevitable warranty motor swaps that come with all ebikes, and I've ridden my friend's Levo 25k-30k feet and like how it rides. I'm getting the Comp build on sale for 6750 but basically stripping most of the parts.
No way I'd want one of the lightweight ones. I've ridden with friends on them, and basically their range is the same as my meat powered range (~4k) and they can't go much faster than my climbing speed without killing the range. A 42lb bike is still going to feel way different than a 35lb bike, so I'd rather get more range.
i can put on range on the way up and still have all the advantages on the way down while the range extender is in the backpack
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
34,332
5,493
How long have you had it?
I've fucked the main bearings in them in as little a 5 weeks.
2018? 1,250 Strava-tagged miles with it so maybe you just ride more? We also don’t have mud here.
 

toodles

ridiculously corgi proportioned
Aug 24, 2004
4,659
3,557
Australia
I'm not sure I'd have an Ebike at all if I had supply issues similar to yours to deal with. I just don't like how bosch motors power delivery feels.
Have you tried the new CX Race Bosch motor at all? It sounds pretty wild. 400% assistance rate is claimed, with customisable power curve.
 

Gary

"S" is for "neo-luddite"
Aug 27, 2002
5,495
3,603
UK
Same. but over 20000 miles. But that's obviously accumulative over many motors.
I've never had any motor get to 1000 miles without some main axle bearing play. Even if I've mainly used the bike to commute on. Our weather obviously gives them a harder time but being a floating axle the real killer for me has always been side loads/side landings. Every hard side load is basically acting like a slide hammer on those bearing races. I now just put up with them creaking not bothering to warranty them until they die completely.
 

Gary

"S" is for "neo-luddite"
Aug 27, 2002
5,495
3,603
UK
Have you tried the new CX Race Bosch motor at all? It sounds pretty wild. 400% assistance rate is claimed, with customisable power curve.
No. but funnily enough I serviced an ECargo bike with some cargobike deriviative bosch CX that also had 400% assistance. Pretty sure max torque is still 90Nm tho.
assist % (alone) seems about as meaningful as is it in massive cassette marketing.

Ps. Fuck Ebike racing until someone sees sense and drops uphill stages making it multi stage DH racing with motor assisted uplift.
FUCK YOU EWS!
 

Gary

"S" is for "neo-luddite"
Aug 27, 2002
5,495
3,603
UK
Nah. Simply taking the piss out of your grammatical mistake .
Blame my Scottish education.