[ibismojo]

So the boxxer race that came on the IH SGS DH Pro is an utter piece of crap. Now that might be saying the sky is blue, but jesus christ, how could this fork be this bad. It's gone through many runs, 2 days on short step rocky dh trails (probably around 12 runs 2 minutes long) along with several runs at Big Bear. If it takes more than this to break-in the fork, what a piece of ****. So the rebound adjustment doesn't do squat, there's no noticable difference, plus the range of adjustment is a joke and I think I'm beginning to strip the allen bolt head that "adjusts" the rebound, dunno why they did away with the finger adjuster in the 04 race. I'm not even getting 6" or 7" or whatever ****in' travel it's set at cause halfway through it, on hard hits (not even drops mind you), it feels like it's either bottomed out or it just locks out. Go ahead and tell me to be a smoother rider, I say **** that, if i wanted to be smooth, I'll go pratcie on my single speed hardtail. I've got a DH bike and I want to plow through ****, instead, I've got a piece of **** fork that's drags its ****ty self.

Now I'm all for trying different forks, tell me some of things I can look into. I've looked at the black box upgrade, but I've been told the 04's already came with it, I dunno. I've put a softer spring in there, a white instead of yellow spring. Change the oil? Change the oil height? Sell it get something else. If so, what else, I don't want to spend anymore at the moment. I guess I got what I paid for. And if that's the case, The SGS DH Pro would be badass if it wasn't for the boxxer.

 

[bigshred]

I agree, I just bought that same bike and the fork seems to be the only thing holding it back. I actually tweeked it pretty good tonight, was unable to straighten it on the trail- we'll check it out tommorow. Damn dude, ... your getting my hopes down- I have been waiting for the moment my boxxer race will be broken in. I have done two days in whistler and tons of local shat, still feels like day one with the initial squeek after its been sitting. Help us out guys... I think we are both on budgets!

 

[axlvid23]

ok, I have one of these and they really aren't that bad after you know the problems and how to fix them.

you NEED to rebuild it before you ride it the first time, there's NO other way.

CHANGE the oil levels TO the RIGHT amount....mine had too much in it when it came and it would lock half way through its travel.

Another thing to watch for is the destruction of the bottom out bumper....when that thing falls apart it gets stuck in the spring and causes a ruckus inside the fork....mine wouldnt move more than 2 inches when this happened.

AND PUT 5WT oil in!!!!!, this made worlds of difference....it supposedly comes with 5 wt...but I'm not sure if i believe it....I know it made a huge difference after I changed the crud that was in there to the nice 5wt from the moto store.

But if you've got the funds....get the mojo upgrade(air assist) replaces all internals.

Otherwise what i just described works super.

Hope that helps

 

[Jm_]

dunno why they did away with the finger adjuster in the 04 race. .

cause the adjuster tended to fall out...

you could put a compression cartridge in your fork...

this wasn't a huge improvement to mine though

 

[ibismojo]

what does the mojo upgrade do? does it affect compression? rebound? bottom resistance? how much is this upgrade? i want to try everything before i give up on the boxxer.

 

[DIRTWRKS]

Just get a 888 or a Dorado, I struggled for quite some time to get a Boxxer
to work well and reliably for any length of time, just got fustrated more and more.
Got a Dorado two years ago and all is bliss great performance and little to no maintence in two years and still works like new.

 

[Jm_]

what does the mojo upgrade do? does it affect compression? rebound? bottom resistance? how much is this upgrade? i want to try everything before i give up on the boxxer.

The mojo replaces your internals with a cartridge damper, the same type of damper that fox, white brotheres and marzocchi forks have, and manitou isn't too far off of that either because they use shimmed pistons as well.

Push is also planning to have a boxxer-cartridge upgrade soon as well.

 

[ibismojo]

i'm already financing the sgs. and i'm pretty much at the limits. now i want to have fun on this bike, but it's bull**** that i have to slow down in sections i shouldn't have to think twice just so i don't get that dead feeling halfway through the travel.

 

[axlvid23]

what does the mojo upgrade do? does it affect compression? rebound? bottom resistance? how much is this upgrade? i want to try everything before i give up on the boxxer.

I found this review on descent world....i think you might find it helpful.

go to

http://www.descent-world.co.uk/html/products/mojofoxxers.htm


btw i think it costs around 300 bucks...I think....

 

[Jm_]

i'm already financing the sgs. and i'm pretty much at the limits. now i want to have fun on this bike, but it's bull**** that i have to slow down in sections i shouldn't have to think twice just so i don't get that dead feeling halfway through the travel.

just sell the fork new when you get the bike, or nearly-new if you've just had it for a little while.

then put the money towards a real fork.

this is what I did.

 

[Rik]

Has the fork been rebuilt and set up for your weight and style? That's the first thing you'd want to do to any fork when you buy it.

 

[Greyhound]

Man......they really aren't bad forks. You might just have gotten a lemon. My '03 was really nice once I spent a little time playing with it. 180mm of 5 wt. in the legs, the proper spring weight, and 2 preload discs under each spring, and it felt great to me. I can't speak for the '04 models, but I know the '03's were notoriously fast with the rebound, so I had to really get into the dial a bit to find the right feel. I hate you're having such a bad experience with it though. That's a really sweet bike you got that on, and I know you're bummed, but spend a bit of time with the internals, cause they're super easy to work on.

 

[ibismojo]

i don't think i would have bought a boxxer had i had a choice as to the kind of fork that would have come on my bike. in other words, the boxxer came on the SGS DH. i'll try rebuilding the rebound side, put in spectro 5 wt, maybe that'll loosen up the stichion and weak ass damping.

 

[lovebunny]

id sell it and put the money towards a shiver. i have an 02 and i love it. best fork ive ever ridden

 

[narlus]

make sure you've got the right springs in it, 1st off. afaik, they come stock w/ the yellow (heavy) springs, which are suited for something like 200-220 lb riders.

find out which ones are best suited for you:

http://www.tftunedshox.com/rockshox/rsfaq.htm#q4.1

and while yr on tim's site, take a look around. some good hints there.

 

[soulfly]

i've had bad experience with my '03 race.
blackbox: this thing is for the compression damping unit, and the race doesn't have that feature (dummy left leg).
5wt oil and the right spring: i'm ~ 145 lbs, and used my race with no preload discs and the originally 2 yellow springs, and 7.5 wt oil. (+10 ml in the right leg to avoid bottoming) it worked.
but: this fork never was a good fork. poor rebound damping performance, specifically in the high speed sections, not adjustable compression damping (because this fork doesn't have that feature) and even with the 2 yellow springs, i've bottomed it several times. (ok, i ride not in a great style, but...)
and not to forget: i killed the allen bolt head (it's plastic!) which adjust the rebound after 3-4 adjusting... i was really careful, but that doesn't helped. after it, i was only able to adjust the rebound, when i took it apart.

so i selled it and bought a used '02 elecric red "boxxer pro".
now i can feel the difference. it isn't good yet, but still better than the race......

 

[dw]

Just quickly, it sounds like you need some heavier springs and a little more oil in the fork.

How much do you weigh? Boxxers come with medium/ medium springs. You can upgrads to stiffer springs, that should help your ride height problem. Also, you may be able to add some preload on your fork springs. Screwing around with preload on those forks will make a HUGE difference.

If your damping is too soft in the beginning/ middle of the travel, then you can switch to a 7.5 wt oil. That can help.

Using more oil will help to resist botoming.

The alternative is to get cartridges from someone, that may be a really nice option if they will tune them to your weight.

The race is not the top of the line Boxxer, but it is tunable, just have to play with it.

Hope this helps.

Dave

 

[mental]

I'm with dw here, the BoXXer can be a great fork if you take the time to play with it. IMHO, any shop selling a mid to high end bike should take the time to properly tune a bike's suspension for each consumer, this really doesn't happen more often than not. When you get the bike home, go over it, make sure everything is as it should be. Fork oil, heights, suspension sag etc. Get it right, the time you take will be well spent!

 

[James | Go-Ride]

The mojo replaces your internals with a cartridge damper, the same type of damper that fox, white brotheres and marzocchi forks have, and manitou isn't too far off of that either because they use shimmed pistons as well.

Push is also planning to have a boxxer-cartridge upgrade soon as well.

JM, you know White Brothers use a totally different damping system than the Fox and Marzocchi forks use, right? They're a lot more comparable to the damper assmebly in the Dorado, only WB forks are made of metal instead of plastic.

That aside, Boxxers have always been a royal pain to work on, or to have them work right, the seals are horrible, the rebound assembly is built in a way so that oil eventually is not present in the intake port and your rebound damping disappears . . . bottom line, the Boxxer is a pretty poor fork out of the box. The Mojo kit seems to make a difference, but it doesn't fix the seal problem.

 

[Juano]

Hey Check out gamutusa.com They have made a cartridge system for the boxxer that's pretty dope. Check it out don't want to spam but it's worth enquiring about.

 

[Jm_]

JM, you know White Brothers use a totally different damping system than the Fox and Marzocchi forks use, right? They're a lot more comparable to the damper assmebly in the Dorado, only WB forks are made of metal instead of plastic.

That aside, Boxxers have always been a royal pain to work on, or to have them work right, the seals are horrible, the rebound assembly is built in a way so that oil eventually is not present in the intake port and your rebound damping disappears . . . bottom line, the Boxxer is a pretty poor fork out of the box. The Mojo kit seems to make a difference, but it doesn't fix the seal problem.

I'm really referring to the shimmed pistons here, which they all use, although the manitou and WBs use them in somewhat different ways, they are still present though...

 

[vitox]

Just quickly, it sounds like you need some heavier springs and a little more oil in the fork.

How much do you weigh? Boxxers come with medium/ medium springs. You can upgrads to stiffer springs, that should help your ride height problem. Also, you may be able to add some preload on your fork springs. Screwing around with preload on those forks will make a HUGE difference.

If your damping is too soft in the beginning/ middle of the travel, then you can switch to a 7.5 wt oil. That can help.

Using more oil will help to resist botoming.

The alternative is to get cartridges from someone, that may be a really nice option if they will tune them to your weight.

The race is not the top of the line Boxxer, but it is tunable, just have to play with it.

Hope this helps.

Dave

they come stock with firm/firm (yellow) springs, but on a race you might think of them a bit more as medium springs because there is no comp cartridge to help with brake dive and ride height overall.

if youre over 85 kilos you might want a red (xfirm) spring.

overall i think the oriignal poster might benefit a lot from having a good mechanic set the fork up, its a simple fork and all but as all the others have pointed out, it can gain a lot from proper setup.

 

[bigkonarider]

try other forks--ride other bikes around to compare..
My Monster T feels like a Factory racing product compared to a friends BOXXER Race !
It's just to stiff n not plush w/ real fast rebound.....Seems like a great fork though if you can tune it right--if that's even possible.....
good luck..Better than forks in the past !
Buy a heavy Monster-T !!!!!!!!!

 

[Jm_]

they come stock with firm/firm (yellow) springs, but on a race you might think of them a bit more as medium springs because there is no comp cartridge to help with brake dive and ride height overall.

if youre over 85 kilos you might want a red (xfirm) spring.

overall i think the oriignal poster might benefit a lot from having a good mechanic set the fork up, its a simple fork and all but as all the others have pointed out, it can gain a lot from proper setup.

There's really not a whole lot you can do. Can you adjust the compression by changing the oil weight? no.

Can you adjust the progressiveness? no.

How effective is the rebound adjuster?

As a bike mechanic...what can I really do with it? I abhor boxxers in general just like James and other posters here, but at least with the team there are some more knobs to turn (high/low compression) that might help with bottoming or activeness. A Jr T is a crap fork in a nice chassi. The boxxer race is a crap fork in what would be a nice chassi if it was sealed better...

The reason the boxxer came on that bike is because it costs 200-something bucks bought in wholesale bulk...

 

[vitox]

theres a lot you can do if it comes in with incorrect springs, too little oil and a jammed rebound adjuster something which ive seen happen a lot and cause the expectable crap performance.

btw oil height can do wonders for progressiveness you know that.

btw2 when the cartridge is functioning properly the adjustment range is too big on these forks with the stock oil, plus its only a quarter turn, but the range is definitely there.

 

[vitox]

The reason the boxxer came on that bike is because it costs 200-something bucks bought in wholesale bulk...

that would be importer-size-bulk and w/o the crown, but at that level all forks are pretty cheap.

 

[Wingnut]

Rebuild it as said above. Mine had the same old crappy feel at first, of course, it was low on oil(Typical of any fork from factory). I ran into the bottom out bumper issue the other day, hard to beleive the bumper could fit between the dummy rod and it's guide ring!

Now, I've givin' it a complete overhaul and it rides realy nice. The rebound works well on mine, fast, super slow and inbetween are all available(mine is a 03 by the way). It would be nice to have the compression cartrige for some more tuning. I'm about 145lbs, use the factory springs, have it set for 7" travel and run 5wt oil.

The Black box kit replaces the REBOUND base valve assembly with a metal base-valve, and some new washers. My buddy said it made a world of differance on his World Cup(Romic techs found that drilling out the comp. side oil port to 2.5mm stopped the cavitation issues on the Team and World Cup series).

Sorry to hear your having these issues, give 'er a rebuild an another chance.....

 

[Jm_]

btw oil height can do wonders for progressiveness you know that.

On a fork that is designed for this, which a boxxer is not. Say goodbye to the seals.

 

[ibismojo]

can you put the compression cartridge from a team/wc into a race?

 

[thaflyinfatman]

On a fork that is designed for this, which a boxxer is not. Say goodbye to the seals.

Goodbye, o seals of mine, which have lasted ~ a year with no cleaning, lubing or servicing whatsoever, despite me being a fat bastard (~210lbs) and using oil height to prevent bottoming because I cbf buying heavy enough springs for my weight... oh wait, they're still fine. How could this be? It is only a lowly Boxxer, after all. Could this be the infamous Jm_ Shït Talk On Products He Doesn't Like?

 

[thaflyinfatman]

can you put the compression cartridge from a team/wc into a race?

Yes. Might be easier to just buy a Mojo kit though, they're cheapISH and IMO slightly better than stock Boxxer compression dampers (unless you get the damper modded, as I have done).

 

[vitox]

can you put the compression cartridge from a team/wc into a race?

big yes

i made a pictorial thread a long time ago but i cant find it, anyway, if you get a 03+ compression cartridge it should be really easy to upgrade that race.

 

[vitox]

On a fork that is designed for this, which a boxxer is not. Say goodbye to the seals.

no pasa nada man

what do you mean with "not designed for this"?

we set those things up with neumatic bottom out all the time, and i cant really find a correlation between seal life and oil height, not if you use that adjustment properly ie: not trying to compensate for totally wrong spring rate.

actually i would say terrain (sand, dust, mud) hast to do with seal wear rather than oil height, with fine, light sand/dust being the main offender.

maybe you are thinking too much about old boxxer which i found to wear out seals quicker, and i cant really find a reason for it other than maybe manufacturing tolerances because we`ve always put the 1usd variety seals in the forks.

 

[soulfly]

you can buy aftermarket oil seals 42*32*7 mm - outer/inner/height, instead of the factory 42*32*6 mm. the height difference doesn't make anything, there is enough room for them. and those are cheaper and better.

 

[ibismojo]

does anyone know if the Sherman Slider is wider than the boxxer? i'm thinking about swapping out forks.

 

[thaflyinfatman]

does anyone know if the Sherman Slider is wider than the boxxer? i'm thinking about swapping out forks.

Not 100% sure, but I think it's actually narrower - the turning radius is 3/5ths of fück all, and the tyre clearance is surprisingly low, 2.5" tyres or so max.