[jonKranked]

https://www.bicycleretailer.com/industry-news/2018/12/19/chain-reaction-cycles-says-it-will-stop-sales-shimano-us-canada#.XBv5IFxKiUk

worth a reminder - they did this with SRAM several years ago.

 

[slyfink]

 

[StiHacka]

I hope the new Magura brakes are as good as everyone says because Shimano brake levers are ATM the only product I like better than the alternatives.

 

[6thElement]

freedum!

 

[mykel]

Yup the whole region thing sucks.
I have been looking at zee German sites.
Pricing is nuts in a good way for quite a lot of things.
Figured it was a good place to look for my new drivetrain parts when a set of crabon cranks can be almost 800 monopoly monies here and about 450-500 there.
Saw that SRAM does not ship to Canukistan, but looks like some Shimano still does.
Seems strange, that within a manufacturer some things are ok to ship and other are not, saw this with more than one company - Item A no problem shipping, Item B, marked as unable to ship to that location....????

I just love how we are sold a bill of goods that says that a global economy is a good thing, it allows a competitive environment that enables a manufacturer to produce a product at a better price. Strange that it ok for them to have a wide open world to manufacture, but we are held to a captive market when we want to purchase said product.

 

[xy9ine]

I have been looking at zee German sites.
Pricing is nuts in a good way for quite a lot of things.

bike discount (.de) is silly cheap on most items (home of the $40 magic marys). most shimano is priced similarly to CRC. no free shipping, however.

 

[FlipSide]

People have been saying for years that bike shops will need to adapt if they want to be able to compete with the online stores. Cutting off the distributors was such an obvious and perfect solution, I guess few people thought they could successfully prevent CRC and others to sell stuff at a reduced price on the interwebz... Seems like they did!

"Surprise", it's the consumer that gets the raw end of the deal.

 

[mykel]

bike discount (.de) is silly cheap on most items (home of the $40 magic marys). most shimano is priced similarly to CRC. no free shipping, however.

Yup, have not bought a Schwalbe domestically for years when I can buy two shipped for the same as one at the local.

 

[FlipSide]

I just love how we are sold a bill of goods that says that a global economy is a good thing, it allows a competitive environment that enables a manufacturer to produce a product at a better price. Strange that it ok for them to have a wide open world to manufacture, but we are held to a captive market when we want to purchase said product.

But but but... I thought outsourcing the manufacturing was done mainly to produce a product at a better price in order to pass the savings to the customer?

I am beginning to think they lied to us... Let's hope the forthcoming savings from all the obsolete jobs that will be cut with AI technology will be passed to us this time along. Can't fool us twice!

 

[mykel]

But but but... I thought outsourcing the manufacturing was done mainly to produce a product at a better price in order to pass the savings to the customer?

I am beginning to think they lied to us... Let's hope the forthcoming savings from all the obsolete jobs that will be cut with AI technology will be passed to us this time along. Can't fool us twice!

Yup, I'm starting to think that there be Shenanigans....

 

[Jm_]

People have been saying for years that bike shops will need to adapt if they want to be able to compete with the online stores. Cutting off the distributors was such an obvious and perfect solution, I guess few people thought they could successfully prevent CRC and others to sell stuff at a reduced price on the interwebz... Seems like they did!

"Surprise", it's the consumer that gets the raw end of the deal.

The only constant of business is change, new markets, new processes, more efficiency, faster, etc.

For the last few weeks, I've been thinking that the model of online bike stores is going to outlive it's usefulness and companies like Shimano and SRAM will sell direct. I don't necessarily think they will be the first two to do it, but I bet once someone bigger does it, they'll start following suit. It may be hard to get all the small players to do so and may not be cost efficient for them, meaning there'll still be online stores, but as we transition to direct-bike sales and not just the crappy catalog-frame stuff anymore, I have to think that larger component companies will follow suit. Maximize profit, cut out the middle man. Further (years) down the road, same thing with QBP and BTI.

 

[kidwoo]

what's a shimano?

 

[jonKranked]

The only constant of business is change, new markets, new processes, more efficiency, faster, etc.

For the last few weeks, I've been thinking that the model of online bike stores is going to outlive it's usefulness and companies like Shimano and SRAM will sell direct. I don't necessarily think they will be the first two to do it, but I bet once someone bigger does it, they'll start following suit. It may be hard to get all the small players to do so and may not be cost efficient for them, meaning there'll still be online stores, but as we transition to direct-bike sales and not just the crappy catalog-frame stuff anymore, I have to think that larger component companies will follow suit. Maximize profit, cut out the middle man. Further (years) down the road, same thing with QBP and BTI.

For companies like Sram/shimano, i don't think the pressure is going to be there as much for shifting towards a consumer direct business model. The bulk of their business is OEM, not aftermarket, so it's not gonna be a big shift for them. besides, having to sell consumer direct means not only having to inventory all the parts (and the warehousing required to store them), but also having to staff up to manage that kind of order fulfillment. That's overhead, and that eats into their bottom line. I'm not saying they don't do a lot of aftermarket sales, but if they had to take on consumer direct sales for aftermarket, they'd have to increase prices to offset the overhead costs.

smaller companies it's easier and makes more sense to shift consumer direct because the volumes are lower.

re: QBP- whether or not the consumer direct business model really takes off, they seem to be hedging their bets. they not only do distribution for LBS sales, they also outright own a number of the own brands, including Surly, Salsa, and 45NRTH.

 

[jonKranked]

on another note, based on this thread 2 of my bikes are being upgraded to 11spd. merry christmas to my bikes!

 

[HardtailHack]

Aside from cranks and mechs they don't make anything noteworthy anyway.

 

[toodles]

Aside from cranks, chains and brake pads they don't make anything noteworthy anyway.

Just IMO. Fuck I love Shimano cranks though.

 

[HardtailHack]

Just IMO. Fuck I love Shimano cranks though.

Just IMO, I wish someone would make new indexed plates for 9spd X0 shifters so I could run them forever.

I hate shimano shifters but I hate Sram mechs more, however I have ordered some bits and will try to make a 10spd single paddle shifter in the next few weeks. Cartridge loss and lig damage has left me with pretty average thumbs so anything I can do to reduce awkward movements is good.

 

[StiHacka]

Cartridge loss and lig damage has left me with pretty average thumbs so anything I can do to reduce awkward movements is good.

https://www.archercomponents.com/

 

[Happymtb.fr]

But but but... I thought outsourcing the manufacturing was done mainly to produce a product at a better price in order to pass the savings to the customer?

Sorry, you've been trumped!

 

[SylentK]

I just bought some seXTR 4 pot brakes from bike-components.de. The "other" CRC, I suppose. Was around $250 cheaper than what our local mail order shops were pricing them for (they're still not in stock yet over here for some reason). We'll see after taxes and import duties if it's any cheaper. Merry XTRmas to me!

Lots of comments on the pb machine around CRC's shady practice of buying OEM parts in mass quantities from other places and selling them as new. I know I benefited from that many years ago when I bought some Saint brakes and cranks for super cheap from CRC that were just in plastic bags.

Some other comments about how there's Shimano EU and Shimano NA being different "companies" with different rules they have to abide by? Something like that. My take away being Shimano NA is crying that Shimano EU is cheating making so much money from the CRC dealio. If so, then why doesn't Shimano NA do the same thing with the NA Online Juggernauts? I suppose that'd be too easy and there's lizards to be fed.

 

[Dogboy]

Some other comments about how there's Shimano EU and Shimano NA being different "companies" with different rules they have to abide by? Something like that. My take away being Shimano NA is crying that Shimano EU is cheating making so much money from the CRC dealio. If so, then why doesn't Shimano NA do the same thing with the NA Online Juggernauts? I suppose that'd be too easy and there's lizards to be fed.

My understanding (which isn't 100% clear) is that it has to do with corporate structure laws. Basically CRC can be setup as a wholesale parts distributor (like QBP, BTI, HLC, etc. in the US) as well as a retailer. That isn't allowed over here so there's a layer between Shimano and the consumer that is eliminated in the CRC model. It totally isn't a level playing field and it does hurt Shimano NA.

 

[Jm_]

The only shimano parts I plan to buy in the future are...chains. If my brakes give out again I'm just mailing that shit back to them.

 

[jonKranked]

I just bought some seXTR 4 pot brakes from bike-components.de. The "other" CRC, I suppose. Was around $250 cheaper than what our local mail order shops were pricing them for (they're still not in stock yet over here for some reason). We'll see after taxes and import duties if it's any cheaper. Merry XTRmas to me!

Lots of comments on the pb machine around CRC's shady practice of buying OEM parts in mass quantities from other places and selling them as new. I know I benefited from that many years ago when I bought some Saint brakes and cranks for super cheap from CRC that were just in plastic bags.

Some other comments about how there's Shimano EU and Shimano NA being different "companies" with different rules they have to abide by? Something like that. My take away being Shimano NA is crying that Shimano EU is cheating making so much money from the CRC dealio. If so, then why doesn't Shimano NA do the same thing with the NA Online Juggernauts? I suppose that'd be too easy and there's lizards to be fed.

NA and EU have different commerce regulations.

and TBH - i was looking yesterday, Jenson's prices on shimano aren't that far off from CRC.

 

[Electric_City]

and TBH - i was looking yesterday, Jenson's prices on shimano aren't that far off from CRC.

Until January 1st, 2019

 

[Tantrum Cycles]

NA and EU have different commerce regulations.

and TBH - i was looking yesterday, Jenson's prices on shimano aren't that far off from CRC.

I can buy shimano stuff from Jenson for less than QBP. Speaking of why dealers go out of biz......

i'm letting this sink in to myself....as a small OE, some of the parts (rear axles) were purchased at a retail level for inclusion on my customer builds. Because it's cheaper than "wholesale"

 

[canadmos]

Yup the whole region thing sucks.
I have been looking at zee German sites.
Pricing is nuts in a good way for quite a lot of things.
Figured it was a good place to look for my new drivetrain parts when a set of crabon cranks can be almost 800 monopoly monies here and about 450-500 there.
Saw that SRAM does not ship to Canukistan, but looks like some Shimano still does.
Seems strange, that within a manufacturer some things are ok to ship and other are not, saw this with more than one company - Item A no problem shipping, Item B, marked as unable to ship to that location....????

I just love how we are sold a bill of goods that says that a global economy is a good thing, it allows a competitive environment that enables a manufacturer to produce a product at a better price. Strange that it ok for them to have a wide open world to manufacture, but we are held to a captive market when we want to purchase said product.

Its strange.

For example go on Jenson and try to order an Easton and Race Face 30mm bottom bracket. They are the exact same part, under the same company, but one cant br shipped here.

My only experience with ordering from mainland Europe was a "bad" one. The stuff took longer to arrive (vs CRC which is almost next day in some cases), but worse is that I got hosed on duties.

 

[SylentK]

How does the saying go?

If you want to lose a million dollars, open a bike shop or start a bike company?

 

[mtg]

How does the saying go?

If you want to lose a million dollars, open a bike shop or start a bike company?

How does the saying go?

If you want to lose a million dollars, open a bike shop or start a bike company?

If done poorly, yes

 

[DaveW]

what's a shimano?

Japanese mass produced in asia shit > American mass produced in asia shit.

 

[vinny4130]

I will never understand why Shimano took so long to address this problem. The “ blank lbs is price gouging me I can get it so much cheaper online” -some consumer
Shimano is making a part of their business model look bad. The lbs is not what makes all the money for Shimano but making part of you distrabutation chain seem like they are trying to fuck the customer sucks no one wins in that circumstance. QBP is a good example. A Shimano bb in a google search brings up 5 options at 5$ more than cost. Shipping isn’t factored into this but more on that in a sec. I’m supposed to have the bb in the store for 55$ (the invoice says says so per Shimano thou shall not sell online cheap) or something like that. Ok so maybe I should stop middle manning the the part and go direct from the big S, nope is only a few dollars less but for free shipping it’s a lot more than 50-90$ which most of the e-commerce stores do for their customers. The only AH in this is Shimano because if they weren’t making money selling the parts it wouldn’t be out there at the prices they are at.

TLDR Shimano for years made part of their distribution chain look like greedy jerks. Let’s see what happens after the 1st. I’m not going to hold my breath.

 

[kidwoo]

Japanese mass produced in asia shit > American mass produced in asia shit.

I beg to differ

 

[mykel]

I beg to differ

In my experience, it works both ways.